I was seduced by the LEO discount on a Glock 26 for a CCW piece.
I do like it (can't beat the size, power, and reliability), but find myself wanting to tweak it to make it better for me. If I had a do-over, I might buy something else, but for now I'm considering a grip reduction to improve the feel and grip angle.
If I point shoot with no sights, I hit a foot high at 21' - I know I could practice that away, but I have other guns too, I would prefer to make the Glock more like the others.
Has anyone done one of these? How does it change the feel and natural point of aim of the gun? I'd really appreciate any thoughts - I did try to search, but didn't find anything (even went to GT to look!).
Here's a pic of what I'm talking about, from the place I'm considering using (it's a Glock 19 instead of a 26, and I'm not talking about the beavertail, or slidework, just the grip - best pic I could find):
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May 22, 2008, 03:48 PM
I personally haven't, but held one at a gun show and it felt AWESOME!!!
The guy pretty much spent hours using a soldering iron.
This may help you: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=254088&highlight=grip+reduc%2A
Go for it!
May 22, 2008, 04:38 PM
The picture of the weapon above looks very simular to the work done by David Bowie at www.bowietacticalconcepts.com. Not sure if that is where the weapon in the picture was actually done, but it looks a lot like his work.
My G23 is with him right now having the grip reduction, stipiling, reduce the size under the trigger guard and mag well cut outs done.
I've held the sample weapons he has out at TDI and they felt great. I have tiny little hands and the glocks he had felt much more comfortable than the standards.
I'll give you a full report when I get mine back in a (hopefully) few weeks or so.
May 22, 2008, 04:47 PM
If I point shoot with no sights, I hit a foot high at 21'...
This is due to the unnatural grip angle of a Glock. With your eyes closed try pointing another gun at something (safely!) with what feels like a natural position. When you open eyes you'll probably be fairly on target.
Do the same thing with a Glock. You'll notice the muzzle is pointed slightly up.
I've never heard of anybody changing the grip angle of a Glock.
May 22, 2008, 04:52 PM
Ltlabner - I should have mentioned - that is exactly where I plan to go (and the pic is from his site). I'm not from around there, but will be travelling to Cincinnati in June, and thought I'd drop it off, just pay shipping one way...
I hadn't thought about the trigger guard or mag cut-outs, I'll have to think about those. Honestly, the Glock fits my hand perfectly in terms of comfort - it just points up into the sky!
It's quite possible I won't like the feel of it quite as well when I get it back (I kind of like the palm swell), but if it points where it's supposed to without me having to take valuable time acquiring a sight picture, I'll take it!
I'll be watching for your report (or PM me)! Sounds like I might be dropping mine off before you get yours back, but maybe not...
Thurnlund - I've done that, and you hit the nail right on the head. I doubt I'll buy another one - seems silly to buy one knowing it will need to be changed, although with the $100 discount, I can almost buy it and have it altered still cheaper than many other guns... :)
I'll certainly post how it works out...
May 22, 2008, 05:17 PM
This is due to the unnatural grip angle of a Glock.
When I do the "eyes closed pointing" bit with my Hi Power, it points low.
The grip is not "unnatural," I'm just very used to the Glock.
Maybe it's my hands, but it's more likely just practice.
May 22, 2008, 06:51 PM
Before spending money and time fitting the G26 to you, you should try an M&P compact. I think you'll find it points well for you.
The grip reduction and shipping will run close to $200. That's money you'll never get back. Grip reduced glocks, at best, don't resell for a premium. The only payback would be longterm use. Maybe that's enough to justify it.
Another possibility is a G19. I've noticed they point more like most pistols (not angled up to the sky). You might trade the 26 for a 19. I found they concealed about the same. I'm sure that varies depending on your build and how/where you carry.
Good luck on the project.
May 22, 2008, 09:39 PM
I own a G32 done by Robar,I bought it that way,and a G27 that I bought cheap and sent to Arizona Response Systems.I can't shoot an unmodified Glock worth a crap.I carry the G27,with a G33 barrel in it,every day...;)
May 22, 2008, 10:26 PM
My M& P 9 has been at Bowie tactical for over 5.5 months. Talked to him today, and was told 2 more weeks. Getting the full meal deal done on my M& P9, not sure anything is worth waiting almost 6 months though. Will decide that after I get it back.
That photo has to be a bowie job IMO. His work is great, but oh my 6 months. almost like having a baby..
May 22, 2008, 11:12 PM
waiting almost 6 months
Wow - I don't really need the gun (j-frame is my go-to for carry right now), but you are right, that is a long, long time. I'd rather pay completely up front, then have him tell ME when he is ready to work on the gun - obviously he's not working on it for the whole 6 months!
Before spending money and time fitting the G26 to you...
It may be too late - I ended up adding a thumb safety soon after I got it. I don't think I'd like the M&P either until they finish adding manual safeties to their lineup (the M&P45 Compact and Mid with safeties are shipping!) - something about striker fired 1/2 pre-cocked guns make me personally too nervous for civilian CCW. DAO revolver, no problem, DA/SA gun, no problem. Wouldn't try to convince anyone else, but if I'm going to have a Glock, I like it this way better. So, I may already spent too much on it... $200 is about right for the grip, including re-doing the texture...
That's money you'll never get back.
I totally agree - I think I could possibly get out of it now to the right buyer, buying it new with LEO discount, then adding $125 safety - have about $525 in it... If I spend $200 on the grip, I fully recognize I'll own it forever... I think that's why I'm really thinking about it long and hard... Although - heck - I spent $77 RENTING HKs today to see if I'd like to buy one - one more day like that and I could have already fixed the grip!
I appreciate the thoughtful replies!!
May 23, 2008, 03:51 AM
Franklytodd, where did you get the thumb safety added to the Glock? When I first read your post I thought, why would anyone want a thumb safety on a Glock? I personally see no need for one but there are a few officers I work with that I would pay to have it installed on their guns. I also think it could be good if you ever had your gun taken away. With the popularity of Glocks, everyone pretty much knows you just pull the trigger and they go bang. You could have time to pull a BUG or get away before they figured the safety out. Still don't want one on my G21, just think its a neat idea.
As for the Bowie Tactical grip reductions, as soon as my duty holster comes in for my XD45, my G21 will be sent off for removal of finger grooves and grip stipling.
I also think it could be good if you ever had your gun taken away.
You are correct - the Ayoob articles emphasize this. Although I admit, that exact reason played little part in my decision.
I personally see no need for one
I totally agree! I'm no safety nazi - Glocks are fine without one. Everything I shot for 20 years was either a revolver, or had a thumb safety. I wanted one for me - Glock "safe action" trigger w/ light, short pull was not acceptable for me in civilian concealed carry. Two other reasons - weak CCW law in Ohio - many silly administrative handlings as you go in and out of prohibited carry spots, so arming, disarming, arming... Also I SmartCarry sometimes - stock Glock in a SmartCarry should be safe, but if I were to carry w/one chambered with no safety, I'd at least insist on a holster with leather or kydex completely covering the trigger guard, rather than cloth!
This has been debated at length elsewhere. Most say: if you want a safety, buy a gun with one, don't alter a Glock. However, in the subcompact world, such an animal is tough to find.
Here's two pics. Safe:
Ready to fire:
May 23, 2008, 08:03 AM
I'm not a big Glock fan myself, intellectually I get why they are successful but they just don't float my boat. The XDs are now available with a thumb safety, but only the full-size model AFAIK. Nothing really comes to mind in a compact, polymer-frame double-action pistol with a thumb safety. There's the Charles Daly M-5 1911s with Israeli polymer frames, now in .45 with 9mm coming soon, but that's single action.
May 23, 2008, 10:28 AM
look up the SIDERLOCK.COM. I have this on my sons g19 and it is super fast ultra quality, no frame modification needed either. left or right and IMO right where it should bel glock SAS still is intact 100%. Best damn safety I ever seen-if you think you need one.
May 23, 2008, 10:34 AM
agree on the 6 month wait thing. I will never do that again. I recently had my Kahr PM9 customized by cylinder and slide. Their policy is a 7 month wait to get in but all one needs to do is send them a couple hundred bucks up front and get on the list. Exactly 7 months to the day, they called me and said send the gun we are ready for it. 30 days later, it was back in my hands with alot more custom work done to it that I am ever getting done on my M& P from Bowie. His work is great but as I write this, i still do not have it back yet . I am not sure I would want the responsibility of having maybe 50 to 100 guns in my shop waiting to be worked on, not sure if there was fire or theft, that there would be coverage for the original owner either. oh well we live and we learn... I didn't like waiting 7 months to get my gun into cylinder and slide either but at least I had the gun to shoot and play with and to actually decide to exactly what I wanted to have done to it..
May 23, 2008, 11:17 AM
I tried the safe-t-block before deciding to add the Cominolli - the plastic block is nowhere near as nice as the siderlock, but has the same basic function, in the same location. For $15, I thought it was worth trying. http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=17097&title=SAF-T-BLOK%20for%20GLOCK~
I have nothing against either for others, but for me personally, after 2 decades of shooting with frame-mounted thumb safeties I decided I did not want to learn a new motion.
The frame modification for the Cominolli is very minor - the internals are not altered in any way - it's a drop in replacement part - I could take it back off and the gun would be 100% stock save for the 1/4" cut in the frame.
The one huge positive about a Glock is that they are so tough and ugly! :p I don't know what exactly the "opposite" of a collector's item is, but whatever it is, that's what a Glock is. It's like the difference between a 24k gold letter opener one leaves on a desk but never uses to open a letter, and a Craftsman hammer that you beat the stars out of things with. It's actually nice, for a carry gun, to NOT have the slightest worry about scratches, holster wear, it beating around in a glove compartment, etc. Don't get me wrong, I maintain it meticulously, but cosmetically - who gives a rip! :neener:
May 23, 2008, 05:42 PM
the safety block is a one time, then reinstall thing. The siderlock acts like a safety on most shotguns, push one way or the other way to fire. Big difference, not exactly the same location either. I personally have no issues with the siderlock. When I put my finger in that trigger area the sider lock safety is felt right away. Big price difference to, but onis quality, the other???
Not a salesman for either, takes no more IMO to get used to on a glock that the commolli one and for me being a lefty, I am not cutting the grip to install something that only fits a lefty. Not even sure the commolli will adapt for a lefty even. They work gret but never impressed me, again possably something to cause an issue insdie the handgun that one cannot see until it happens.
May 23, 2008, 06:14 PM
I have a Robar-reduction on a G30. I like it a lot. Stock Blockglocks point high for me also. I can adapt (I have a G23 also) but the reduced ones feel more natural.
May 23, 2008, 07:49 PM
takes no more IMO to get used to on a glock that the commolli one ... . Not even sure the commolli will adapt for a lefty even.
I'm not attacking siderlock - I'm sure they are great. You are missing my point about getting used to it - for me, there was NO getting used to the Cominolli, because it places a thumb safety in the identical place as the billions of 1911s out there, and more importantly for me personally, the frame mounted safety on the Taurus PT92, which I have had as my main handgun for 20 years.
When I put my finger in that trigger area
Here's where others will slam the sider, you kind of have to break one of the four rules to turn it off - I never thought this was a dealbreaker, but as I said, these threads are as old as THR itself!
I think with the blok and the sider, you are poking around behind the trigger to deactivate the safety, right? That's all I meant about being similar in function - I know the siderlock is a metal trigger replacement, and the blok is a chunk of plastic that goes behind the stock trigger. "Quality" meaning both work as advertised is I guess the same, but I know the sider has more to it.
And you are correct, there is no such animal as a Cominolli for lefties.
I've never argued the type of safety to put on a Glock before, usually it's a bunch of maniacs screaming that adding a safety on a Glock is some form of blasphemy! :cuss: :banghead: :fire:
Take care, be safe!
May 24, 2008, 06:33 PM
I've done grip reductions on two G19s, they turned out pretty well and improve the feel so much I cannot 9imagine carrying anything else. I now plan on taking some of the hump off a G26, plus eliminate the finger grooves, extend the index finger grooves into the trigger guard and cut up into the bottom rear of the trigger guard to get my second finger up higher. I've done all these to the two G19s with good effect, except for the hump removal, which requires more work in prep, cure time, etc. I have found that some "custom" shaping makes the Glock "the" most reliable carry gun around.
email me at: firstname.lastname@example.org for pics of one G19 I have worked on. It is easy to do if you are careful. Stippling is easy too with a wood burning pen.
Craig in Clarksville, TN
May 24, 2008, 11:47 PM
about how much does robar or bowie charge for grip strippiling?
the only real thing i dont like about glocks is the grip gets slippery if your hands are sweaty, or its raining or there is oil on the grip.
May 25, 2008, 05:04 AM
May 25, 2008, 08:40 AM
I had a Model 19 Glock I purchased from a Law Enforcement person. He had the grip custom slimmed, stippled, trigger re-worked. I purchased it as a bed side pistol for my wife when I'm away. I did not think any of it was an improvement over a regular Model 19. It increased recoil a tad, was so grippy and "sharp" it hurt my wife's hands to fire it. I traded it off for a standard Model 19. I could have used it, however in my opinion it was not an improvement. I suspect that it cost a few hundred dollars to do all that was done. The net result was nil. Spend the money on ammo, a custom holster, a great knife etc.etc. Just my opinion, but I think you'll be better off spending the money elsewhere. Glocks are pretty good just the way they come. I pretty much feel "dick with a Glock" and you invariably end up with a lesser pistol.
May 25, 2008, 10:04 AM
First time I've ever heard of a grip reduction like this.
Although I have been curious about the CCF race frames with the 1911 grip angle for a while.
The grip reduction might be a less expensive choice if/when I get a Glock (which, in all likelyhood would be a Glock 34).
May 25, 2008, 10:32 AM
The best way to make an ugly gun uglier: get a Glock grip reduction. It might be functional, but it is gods awful looking.
May 25, 2008, 10:34 AM
'Form follows function'... at least that's what I constantly tell myself considering I own some of the ugliest firearms in the country. :D
May 25, 2008, 02:03 PM
I don't get why people heavily modify Glocks. I've always been perfectly happy shooting mine stock. Mall Ninja complex?
May 25, 2008, 03:30 PM
The best way to make an ugly gun uglier: get a Glock grip reduction. It might be functional, but it is gods awful looking.
If you say so... *shrugs*
May 25, 2008, 03:35 PM
I personally don't think that glock is ugly at all, just compare it to Hillary and you will never make such a stupid statement again. And oh yes, you can keep scewing with that glock until it looks good. She is just stuck with "ugly"
May 25, 2008, 03:38 PM
same way people put different wheels on their cars. THEY WANT THEIR CAR TO LOOK DIFFERENT. Rides the same, yadda yadda yadda. Probably the same thing with the glock reductions, gives the owner a chance to even puff his chest out alittle further...
Personally I kinda like um:evil:
May 26, 2008, 01:08 AM
if you get out of your glock, you could put it back on the orig and have no trouble selling the raceframe, wouldn't sink so much money into an irreversable mod.
May 26, 2008, 02:31 AM
1Kperday, I loved the G19 I had, and the compact Glocks fit me fine as is. I just think the reductions look (subjective) bad.
May 26, 2008, 01:11 PM
I've had some work done to mine, and did a little myself.
Mine was a third gen 17, and I had the grip chopped to take 19 magazines. It was then stippled, and some other stuff done. I still hated the finger grooves, and that goofy hump on the back... so I took matters into my own hands. Finger grooves were ground off, and the backstrap was heated and rolled a tad to help flatten it.
Made all the difference in the world. I surmise that a grip reduction would accomplish the same thing, but as easy as these mods were to do, I'd do them myself. It's only plastic.
May 26, 2008, 02:31 PM
Brownells has a pdf tutorial on the Glock grip reduction,for those who are more mechanically/artistically inclined...