2nd XCR joins the family. **pics**


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variablebinary
June 3, 2008, 02:42 AM
I picked up my 2nd XCR today. It's much improved over the model I got a year ago

It has a medium contour barrel with Gen. 2 gas block, which has a very slick tool-less gas adjust system

It also has MI sights, which seem to fit better.

I regard the XCR as the best carbine to come out of American think tank in a long time

http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/ra2.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/ra3.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/ra1.jpg

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FireArmFan
June 3, 2008, 02:45 AM
great looking rifle. congratulations on your new XCR.

blitzen
June 3, 2008, 03:28 AM
I have one and love it. Don't know if I've seen better. It shoots good and is easy to shoot well. A better all around gun than an AR IMHO.

tacweapon
June 3, 2008, 08:00 AM
You should have waited just a few weeks and got the 7.62 version of it. Very nice XCR, I have one to and love it.

Joseph85
June 3, 2008, 08:45 AM
Folding stocks are cool.

Ergonomics of an AR with a gas piston. I wish more gas piston rifles with AR ergonomics would come out on the market. Yours looks like a nice one.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
June 3, 2008, 09:23 AM
I hate you. J/K - very nice! :)

variablebinary
June 3, 2008, 11:27 AM
You should have waited just a few weeks and got the 7.62 version of it. Very nice XCR, I have one to and love it.

Personally I would prefer a 5.45x39 version, but a 7.62x39 kit is on the radar

The XCR is pretty dang cool...

Deer Hunter
June 3, 2008, 11:29 AM
That's really cool. Looks like an updated AK-47 top melted into an AR-15 bottom.

tacweapon
June 3, 2008, 01:22 PM
I too look forward to the 5.45 x39 kit for my XCR, I also hope that they will get around to the .22LR Conversion Kit

ar154life
June 3, 2008, 01:23 PM
nice, i like it.

Nolo
June 3, 2008, 01:29 PM
So can anyone tell me why this or the ACR is not the standard rifle for the US Military?
Stupid top brass.

everallm
June 3, 2008, 01:29 PM
I'm waiting for Alex to bring out the 7.62x51 to buy my second XCR....just got to work out some way to hide the purchase from "she who must be obeyed".

Tyris
June 3, 2008, 01:46 PM
Anyone try one with a silencer yet? Im curious to see if they vent gas like a FAL does, or if they're quieter like a piston-op AR.

-T

tacweapon
June 3, 2008, 03:28 PM
I have not tried any with a silencer yet jus waiting to be 21, but I know some people over on the XCR Forum has

www.xcrforum.com

LoadedDrum
June 3, 2008, 09:52 PM
I like the fact that they have also switched from YHM to MI sights. I would hope for a switch to Troy one day but that would probably add too much to the price.

Coronach
June 3, 2008, 10:06 PM
So can anyone tell me why this or the ACR is not the standard rifle for the US Military?because the ACR doesn't exist yet and Robarm could not prove that they could meet the SCAR production requirements, let alone be able to rearm the entire .mil establishment, for two reasons.

Mike

Nolo
June 3, 2008, 10:34 PM
I know that, I was referring to the fact that there are great designs out there and no one will run with them.

variablebinary
June 4, 2008, 01:44 AM
I know that, I was referring to the fact that there are great designs out there and no one will run with them.

I dont give it much thought. The product is solid, innovative and I'm well supported by the XCR community and Robarm.

So while the SCAR is choking under testing, and the ACR is stuck in no mans land, I'm having a dandy time shooting my XCR.

Even after they are out, I dont think I'll be trading up. I only want the ACR in 5.45 and who the hell knows if that will happen in our lifetime. Will the SCAR be better than the XCR overall...probably not to be honest.

PercyShelley
June 4, 2008, 03:31 AM
How well do those flashy new lancer L5s work?

variablebinary
June 4, 2008, 10:19 PM
How well do those flashy new lancer L5s work?

So far, they are awesome. Very durable and feed perfectly. I've tested them in a XCR, 556 and AR15. ZERO issues.

The metal feedlips and rubber baseplate make them a better value compared to PMAGs

PercyShelley
June 5, 2008, 04:16 AM
The metal feedlips and rubber baseplate make them a better value compared to PMAGs


Wow! :what:

Apparently driving over ar-15 compatible magazines is now a standardized test of durability:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=FzIoYipDBQE

Nolo
June 5, 2008, 05:09 AM
Percy, running over magazines has been a standard test of durability since the SMLE.
Yeah, a lot of mags will resist being carefully run over like that. But will the Lancer resist the Magpul "speedbump" and "grind" tests? I found those especially impressive, and the P-Mag was empty. For reference, the HK mag failed both.

PercyShelley
June 5, 2008, 05:22 AM
I noticed that the lancer popped rounds loose when it got squished. When I was fondling an AUG magazine it seemed like the translucent plastics are a little more flexible than the opaque ones.

Really though, you only need to see the round count from the sides and back of the magazine. I wonder if a steel reinforcing rib could be run down the front?

Nolo
June 5, 2008, 11:23 AM
Probably, but from the Magpul tests, which really impressed me, all-polymer mags that are just built tough are a better solution.
Needless to say, I'm really impressed with the P-Mag, though I find it hideously ugly.

variablebinary
June 5, 2008, 04:22 PM
I noticed that the lancer popped rounds loose when it got squished. When I was fondling an AUG magazine it seemed like the translucent plastics are a little more flexible than the opaque ones.


I'm guessing there are two ways to skin a cat when it comes to making durable plastic mags...

1: Outright rigidity
2: flexibility

I like the L5's over the PMAG's, but I do in fact own both...

variablebinary
June 5, 2008, 09:39 PM
Okay, new pics, and shots of the internals for those that have never seen an XCR before



Standard carbine. This is the way it is 90% of the time
http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/XCRcarbine.jpg

XCR in RECCE mode. Based upon my old XCR, it's up to the job
http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/XCRRECCE.jpg

See here how AK47 like the action is
http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/BCGarxcr.jpg

The XCR oprod is much beefier than what is found in typical piston AR15's. It could probably be used as a stabbing weapon when mags run dry
http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/BCGarxcr2.jpg

The Bolt carrier has far less parts. No keys to stake, nothing to break. It is solid
http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/BCxcar.jpg

No chance of XCR lugs shearing, or snapping under stress. The chances of a broken bolt are slim to none.
http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/boltarxcr.jpg

Once again, view the simplicity and robust nature of the bolt design. I have a gen2 firing pin when has a cap on the base to protect it from stress and reduce the chance of a break
http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/boltarxcrtopview.jpg

PercyShelley
June 6, 2008, 12:41 AM
I'm guessing there are two ways to skin a cat when it comes to making durable plastic mags...

1: Outright rigidity
2: flexibility

Very true. I wouldn't be surprised if the force it takes to deform a lancer to the point that it would pop rounds out would outright trash an aluminum magazine body. The polymer will just spring right back.


Edit:


Holy British Columbian Logjams Batman! Look at how overbuilt that bolt is!

Nolo
June 6, 2008, 12:44 AM
I'm assuming the top one is an AR?
Yah. Overbuilt.
A lot. I like it, though.
Can it take .300 Win Mag?

everallm
June 6, 2008, 08:36 AM
Currently the XCR and conversion kits are available in 5.56 and 6.8SPC

7.62x39 and 6.5 are close to shipping

The next model in the development pipeline is the XCR-M in 7.62x51 (.308)

One of the main restrictions on caliber variations has been the physical constraints of the magwell/magazine size.

The 5.56/6.8/6.5/7.62x39 all can use the same form factor of the magwell.

I'm not sure of the OAL of the 300 Win Mag cartridge, if it can fit in the same form factor as a DPMS LR-308 magazine then it would be doable.

Pilot
June 6, 2008, 08:54 AM
Nice rifle. This may replace my CAR-15.

tacweapon
June 6, 2008, 10:46 AM
These Rifles are very nice I have one in 5.56 and I am going to be ordering a 7.62x39 in about a month.

The 7.62 x 39 ships on the 15 of June.

Deer Hunter
June 6, 2008, 10:56 AM
Looks like one hell of a rifle.

Too bad I am broke. :(

Tarvis
June 6, 2008, 10:56 AM
I'm not sure of the OAL of the 300 Win Mag cartridge, if it can fit in the same form factor as a DPMS LR-308 magazine then it would be doable.
I don't think so. 308 is a medium length action, 300 win mag, like 30-06, is a long action (in reference to bolt guns that is). If they did offer a 300 win mag variant, there would have to be some serious mods.

Chuck R.
June 6, 2008, 01:47 PM
Have you experienced any problems with yours?

Iím curious because Iíve read about quite a few issues on the XCR forum:

Triggers in general
Trigger reset
Extractors loosening
Broken FPs/pierced primers
Some chambers outs of spec

Also how have they been holding up in classes? Initial reports listed some failures.

Chuck

Nolo
June 6, 2008, 02:23 PM
See? Without smileys, you all didn't get that that was a joke on how overbuilt the bolt is!
:D:D:D:D:D:D
Use your smileys. Save the Internet.

everallm
June 6, 2008, 05:15 PM
I've had my XCR for a year now and like it a lot and have a great deal of confidence in the platform.

Remember it's a new design and doesn't have the 40 years of tweaks, alterations and amendments of say the AR15/M16.

So some early teething problems are to be expected and are acceptable if the manufacturer stands by their product and fixes stuff in a timely fashion

Triggers in general
The trigger is quite heavy out of the box, Robinson are working on an adjustable drop in replacement, most of the folks who don't like it (I like mine) send it for a $59 trigger job to Bill Springfield which people rave about

Trigger reset
Came up less than half a dozen time on the forum and seems to have mostly been a problem where the the trigger axis pin either bound up or came loose. One owner didn't seem to have this problem, sent it back to RA and they fixed and returned the rifle

Extractors loosening
A few early XCR's had not had the extractor bolts loctited properly and they had worked loose. This was fixed as part of reports to RA. The point to remember is the XCR is designed to have parts like the ejector be removable by the sort of tools you have in the drawer at home so you can swap it if you change from say 5.56 to 7.62x39.
Most folks as part of there normal maintenance seem to check this as part of their standard procedures I know I do

Broken FPs/pierced primers
RA have manufactured a new firing pin that appears to have addressed the few occassions this turned up

Some chambers outs of spec

Haven't heard of that at all.

RA did get a run of barrels that weren't up to QA and were not used, possibly that's the issue?

There were some historical reports of early adoptee XCR's failing during carbine/combat course but most folks with current or updated models seem to have had relatively few problems.

NOT no problems and as with any heavy usage course the hearty recommendation is to remember to take your spare part kits with you.

Currently the apparent consensus from users NOW seems to be that the XCR tends to be more reliable on these types of course when compared to the AR platform.

Take that with as large a degree of scepticism as warranted as obviously there are far fewer XCR's out there than AR's

LoadedDrum
June 6, 2008, 09:15 PM
Have you experienced any problems with yours?

I’m curious because I’ve read about quite a few issues on the XCR forum:

Triggers in general
Trigger reset
Extractors loosening
Broken FPs/pierced primers
Some chambers outs of spec

Also how have they been holding up in classes? Initial reports listed some failures.

Chuck


I have 3 XCRs and have had none of the problems listed.

ny32182
June 7, 2008, 12:28 AM
The *extractor* has had zero reported issues, ever, as far as I know.

The *ejector* (which people seem to easily confuse with the extractor) is held by two bolts that seemed to be somewhat prone to work loose on the early rifles. RA changed their locktite procedure/compound, and the problem seems to be a rarity with the new rifles. This is something that is easily fixable by the end user as well.

Overall, rifles with the new gas block (very nice adjustable gas system, btw) and new firing pin seem to be pretty damn solid. Very few reported issues by anyone at all with these, as far as I can remember. Mine has been 100% from day one, and the only screw I've adjusted from its factory setting is the one that controls the tension on the folding stock. It was loose for my taste, but not anymore.

variablebinary
June 7, 2008, 05:01 AM
My first XCR was well abused. Only issue was adjustable gas nut coming off. However this was with a gen1 gas block.

The Gen2 block is tool-less, so that nut isnt part of the design anymore, hence problem solved

The ejector is operator serviceable. Meaning, no armorer needed. If it breaks, you replace it in your home with regular tools, no trips back to the factory.

Keep in mind that I've never heard of an ejector breaking, only coming loose. Some have said that the XCR should use a fixed ejector like the AK47 and 556. However the XCR upper is extruded, not stamped steel, so this isnt possible. Going to a spring loaded ejector would be a step backwards.

It says right in the manual that the bolts should be checked, and apply loctite if needed.

Again, none of the ejector parts have ever been reported as breaking.

I applied loctite 242 the very first day I got my XCR. Never an issue.

The trigger has a heavy-ish 2nd stage. It works. I would say its on par with any mil-spec M16 FCG in terms of usability. I dont personally know of any other issues with the FCG. If there is, it is isolated

Extractors loosening: Never heard of it

Broken FPs/pierced primers. Gen2 firing pin was introduced awhile ago. Non-issue

Some chambers outs of spec: Never heard of it. It this was the case, its probably why Robinson started turning their own barrels in-house

Chuck R.
June 7, 2008, 08:39 AM
Guys,

Sorry about the ejector VS extractor thing, you're right it's the ejectors that can come loose.

As for the out of spec chamber, I thought I read on the board that that was the probable cause for the rifle that blew up, I could be mistaken, but the post is here:

http://xcrforum.com/index.php/topic,525.50.html

I believe the trigger reset issues are fairly well documented, here's a thread on them where a couple owners chime in with the same problem:

http://xcrforum.com/index.php/topic,554.0.html

I asked about the XCR in classes due to this thread:

http://xcrforum.com/index.php/topic,882.0.html

That and the broken FP during a class thread were the only reports I could find on XCRs in classes.

Thanks for the info,

Chuck

variablebinary
June 7, 2008, 06:17 PM
Chuck,

I would take a more thorough read on xcrforum. There are quite a few reports on how it performed in class and in training.

Off the top of my head, on that forum, Martens, Prizm and myself have all taken class with the XCR.

These shots were taken by Prizm

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/Prizm1/tdi1.jpg

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k5/Prizm1/tdi3.jpg

everallm
June 8, 2008, 12:07 AM
ChuckR

As for the out of spec chamber, I thought I read on the board that that was the probable cause for the rifle that blew up, I could be mistaken, but the post is here:

http://xcrforum.com/index.php/topic,525.50.html

As you read the issue from the beginning you will see that the issue appears to be related to the previously mentioned "primer cratering" issue. This is the concern I mentioned previously that has been apparently rectified with a new firing pin design

Also the end user states that he is "happy" that this occurred with the XCR as the monolithic design of the upper appeared to have limited Meat vs Metal interaction...:what:


I believe the trigger reset issues are fairly well documented, here's a thread on them where a couple owners chime in with the same problem:

http://xcrforum.com/index.php/topic,554.0.html

Again if you read the concerms from the beginning of the thread. the concern is predominately one regarding break in period and the "roughness" of the trigger.

The time on the board where the user had real issue with trigger reset were addressed with RA fixing the issue, see link below.

http://xcrforum.com/index.php/topic,259.0.html

I asked about the XCR in classes due to this thread:

http://xcrforum.com/index.php/topic,882.0.html

That and the broken FP during a class thread were the only reports I could find on XCRs in classes.

ChuckR,
Again I would like to point you to my original response, most of that thread relates to

a. Historic and Version 1.0 XCR's
b. These classes are extremely hard on ANY platform and if you take ANY weapon to them you need at the least a full spare parts set or a spare rifle.

I will emphasize and say the XCR is not a perfect platform....If I said that I would deserve a righteous slapping......:evil:

It is however one that is both evolving, based on end user feedback and starting from a fundamentally sounder mechanical base.

Chuck R.
June 9, 2008, 01:18 PM
Guys,

Thanks for the candid assessments; Iím still watching it closely to see what develops for the long term.

Chuck

kcmarine
June 9, 2008, 01:32 PM
Great... ANOTHER black rifle I want... :D

variablebinary
June 10, 2008, 06:30 PM
MI BUIS on my brand new HBAR XCR-L 5.56. I loaded 15 rounds in a PMAG (actually 16 rounds by mistake). I just used some targets I had laying around the house

Not a bad attempt after a 25 yard zero. I will try and tighten up next time.

http://home.comcast.net/~armandoc14/XCR target.jpg

<SLV>
August 18, 2008, 05:34 PM
Currently the XCR and conversion kits are available in 5.56 and 6.8SPC

7.62x39 and 6.5 are close to shipping

The next model in the development pipeline is the XCR-M in 7.62x51 (.308)

They've been saying that .308 is in development for a while now. I just called today and they are saying "check back in the spring of 2009". Great - they maybe illegal by then.

I love the design - I wish .308 would have been a bigger priority for them.

ny32182
August 19, 2008, 09:06 AM
They still have a a few "L" model related parts to release, presumably before finishing work on the .308 model:

-The fully adjustable factory stock (I really want this)
-The upgraded/match trigger (I probably want this as well, depending)
-6.5 Grendel parts (I think I want this too)

With all that on their plate, I personally doubt we will see a .308 model any time soon. That is, I would not advize "waiting for it" if you just want to buy a .308 "assault rifle" before any possible Obama-ban.

A .308 model would be nice though. Once again, it would be an entirely unique rifle matched by nothing else currently on the market.

By the end of the week, the first round of "upgrades" will be done to my XCR! :D Those being the Bill Springfield trigger job, and a TA11F. Its all in route to me now, so hopefully I can hit the range this weekend.

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