[hso]

Of the following inexpensive milsurp/clone semiauto rifles which would you consider the most accurate at 300 yards out of the box. Feel free to include any other semiautos with removable magazines that "retail" below $600.

FAL
CETME
Ar
Ak

[Redlg155]

The AR of course! It's not uncommon to have one shoot MOA better.

I have heard that the .223 AKs are also extremely accurate, but I still give the nod to the AR.

Your standard FAL and Cetme clones can't touch an AR in the accuracy department.


Good Shooting
Red

[Dave R]

Well, I have a CETME and a .223 AK...

The .223 AK (SAR-3) will shoot 1.5" to 2" at 100 yards with a cold barrel, and the right ammo. With a hot barrel and Wolf ammo its more like 5". That's typical of most AKs.

The CETME OTOH, shoots 2MOA just about any time I pull the trigger.

Little experience with FAL, but from what I read on the Internet (so it must be true :rolleyes: ), the CETME seems to have a slight edge in accuracy.

I think the AR will be the most accurate.

[Sir Galahad]

I think the definitions here are overlapping where they ought not, and this is going to skew the data.

1.) Milsurp rifle---This is a previously used military issue rifle. It could be war surplus (as in your Mosin Nagants) or peacetime military surplus (as in your Swiss straight-pulls.) But in either case, at some point, some soldier in some army was carrying this weapon or it was in a military-controlled arsenal. There are no milsurp AKs or M-16s available unless you have a Class 3 automatics weapons license and find one that was issue, because those are selective fire weapons. With milsurp rifles, they don't need to do the limbo rock under the limbo bar because they're already legal to import. In most cases they're bolt actions

2.) Clone---This is a reasonable facsimile of a military issue rifle otherwise unobtainable due to AWB or Class 3 regs. This is your Bushmaster and your SAR. They delete the flash supressor and bayonet lug and do other things to do the limbo rock under the limbo bar for both manufacture for sale to public and/or import.

3.) Frankensemis----This is my own category. These are the CETMEs, G3s and FALs that Century is bringing in. They are not properly milsurp and not properly clones either. They are both. They are milsurp parts assembled on to a clone receiver. This is to do the limbo rock under the limbo bar much cheaper than building a total clone like a Bushmaster. They can limbo some parts in that probably cost less than a penny a pound and limbo the receiver made here and limbo them on to the sales floor under the limbo bar.

So, we see here, three distinct categories of weapon. Why can we not compare all? Because all are simply not in the same league. If you could get a HK-91 for, say, $600 and a Century G3 for $400, you'd spend the extra $200 duckets for the HK, right? Of course you would. But there's the tsetse fly in the ointment---you CAN'T get a new HK because the government, frankly, doesn't trust you with one. They will trust you with a Century G3, for now, but it's still not a HK, now is it? See my point? You can buy crates of Mosins and the government is cool with that. But to daily handle a real M-16A2 without a Class 3, you have to sign here, initial there, sign here, initial this and raise your right hand, repeat after me, I, state you name, do solemnly swear blah blah blah and you're in the army now. Because the government doesn't trust you to sell their surplus issue M-16s to. They'd rather sell them to such stalwart folks as the Palestinian police. They are more trustworthy than you. You can see that on TV. And if we could buy Soviet surplus AK, well, the SAR 1 would have to be something like $100 for us to buy one over a real loooook for!! that Soviet Union laaaabel!! AKM. But the government won't trust us with their own selective-fire surplus, they sure won't trust us with the other guy's selective-fire surplus. So, we see once again, that we simply cannot compare all these rifles. They are too different. You can really only make ballpark comparisons, but it's too easily skewed by who got a good Century CETME versus who got a stinker, who got a Bushmaster made with all new parts versus who got a G3 made with some used, some new parts versus who said to heck with it and bought a Lee Enfield. See what I mean? The comparisons are not really comparing apples to apples. It's comparing apples to pineapples and bananas to artichokes.

[Will Fennell]

Mikie[hso],
Get an AR buddy....they are easy to shoot, easy on the shoulder, and easy to feed. You DO have to clean them occasionally, but you ARE used to cleaning up messes, aren't you?;)

Of the above choices, Anthony and I both got AR's....I got a Bushmaster parts gun, he got a RRA and a Knight's.

By a Bushmaster or a RRA and don't look back......

[hso]

Will,

Of course I'm used to cleaning up other peoples' messes, I'm married to Gwen aren't I?:rolleyes:

Got a SP1 "leggo gun" set up like an M4 with a reflex sight and a flip up rear already, but I was looking at heavier semis and wanted some opinions. One buddy if a FAL fiend, another is into HKs, and yet a 3rd is AK friendly. I think an AR-type with a couple of uppers is good (gotta get that new CZ dedicated upper). Everyone has different reasons to support their pet pellet pooter.