Questions about S&W 45 ACP revolvers


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.38 Special
July 5, 2008, 05:07 PM
So I've taken delivery of one of the Model 22 Thunder Ranch guns. This is the first 45 ACP revolver I've had, and I need some advice about moon clips, etc.

1) Is there consensus as to the "best" moon clips?

2) Who makes the "best" demooning tool?

3) Are "re-mooners" useful, and if so, which style works well?

TIA!

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Just Jim
July 5, 2008, 05:12 PM
This is just my opinion, Ranch Products makes the best moon clips for all around use. There are several types of demooners and I like the one Ranch sells for traveling (Wear it around my neck when hunting) but there are better ones for the range.

I own a remooner and seldom use it.

jj

Ranch makes all the moonclips for Smith&Wesson.

Old School
July 5, 2008, 05:18 PM
Can acp revolvers be fired without the clip in a pinch?

bluetopper
July 5, 2008, 05:20 PM
Taurus's can........not sure about Smiths.

rcmodel
July 5, 2008, 05:21 PM
Yes, generally.

All the old ones with the hammer mounted firing pins worked perfectly without clips.

The new guns with the frame mounted firing pins may be iffy, if the FP is shorter then normal, or the headspace is excessive due to short brass, worn gun, etc.

rcmodel

.38 Special
July 5, 2008, 05:22 PM
Modern Smiths can. You just have to punch out the empties with a pencil or somesuch.

I have heard that some of the older Smiths and Colts (1917s) can fail to fire without the clips, but have no personal experience.

<edit> After having just read rcmodel's above post, all I can say is "Ain't the internet grand?" :p

Shade00
July 5, 2008, 05:23 PM
All I know is that I want one. Post some pictures and a range report when you get your gun!

.38 Special
July 5, 2008, 05:25 PM
The gun is in hand, but will be heading straight off to the gunsmith to fix the unbelievably bad DA pull. When it gets back I'll have some fake ivory grips and Tyler T-grip adapters for it. Then we'll see about pics!

xring44
July 5, 2008, 05:30 PM
You're going to love the ,45 ACP revolver, I have a S&W 25-2 that is superbly accurate, it can be fired without the moon clips, I lighten up on the crimp a tad and normally the emptys will fall out. I also have a .45 ACP in a Ruger Blackhawk, its also very accurate and requires little to no crimp or it will push the cartridge far enough forward to have failures to fire,

I have a home made de-mooner and have never owned a re-mooner, never thought it necessary.

Sistema1927
July 5, 2008, 05:37 PM
I like this tool (http://mooncliptool.com/).

rcmodel
July 5, 2008, 05:40 PM
I might have added, yes, a demooner is necessary for full-moon clips.
Not so much for half-moons because they have more "give" to them.

They can be easily made out of a short section of small tubing.
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=6727&title=MOON%20CLIP%20STRIPPER

No re-mooner.
I just snap them back in with a little pair of pocket pliers.

rcmodel

.38 Special
July 7, 2008, 09:08 PM
I thank you folks for your input. I did end up making a demooner out of some old tubing, and it works well.

I am still curious about the different brands of clips. I see steel and plastic, and I see ones with cutouts in the "fingers" and ones without.

Experiences?

Dave Markowitz
July 7, 2008, 09:12 PM
I use this demooner, made from a section of 1/2" copper water pipe I had leftover from a plumbing job at the house:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=3877827&postcount=48

ClemY
July 7, 2008, 10:17 PM
I have a 25-2 and a 625-8JM. I mostly use .45 AR loads in both. When I use .45 ACP, I don't usually use a clip. They work fine without. I did put in a C&S extended firing pin in the 625 to guarantee good ignition.

I taper crimp both the .45 ACP and AR. Works fine.

machinisttx
July 8, 2008, 01:53 AM
I have heard that some of the older Smiths and Colts (1917s) can fail to fire without the clips, but have no personal experience.

The very early Colt 1917's featured cylinders that were bored straight through. Colt was too cheap to use the correct chambering reamers. If you try dropping rounds into the cylinder, they will fall straight through. The S&W made guns never suffered from this problem.

S&W 1917's and their other .45 ACP revolvers will function just fine without moon clips.

Master Blaster
July 8, 2008, 08:58 AM
MY TR22 fires 100% with or without moon clips, the cylinder has a ledge just like the barrel of a semiauto, and thats where the casemouth stops to headspace the round.

I did have misfires when I tried RIMZ, which are plastic moonclips, it seems they were keeping the rounds from headspacing on the casemouth, and as a result were absorbing the firing pin blow.

I fixed that problem by throwing the rimz in the trash.

Stainz
July 8, 2008, 09:34 AM
Call Ranch Products - their blued S&W 22/25/625 'clips were ~$30/100 delivered. Get to Wally World - UMC brass cased 230gr FMJ ball ammo - $82/250. Get a .223 ammo box and cut some hardboard layer separators. You can easily get five layers of 21 loaded moonclips - see below. That's my 625JM this AM after 3.5yr & 8k+ rounds. Super fun big bore. Get the Brownell's nutdriver-style demooner - no scissors-style has held up long (2 wks!) in my use - or my range-mates', either. Be ready for a 'long' range trip!

http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u307/Stainz_2007/IMG_0585.jpg

Stainz

FEG
July 8, 2008, 11:08 AM
I have had great results with Rimz in both a 625 and 610 (10mm). Since they are made of plastic, you don't need any tools. I imagine they will eventually distort from the flexing, though. I have been using them for about a year now with no problems.

It really beats having to clip up a few boxes of ammo at a time, or having to keep fooling with tools at the range.

The only "bad" moonclips are the generic ones you see at gun shows, etc. They are thin and brittle.

When I used Ranch clips, I used the RCBS hex tool for demooning. I picked it up from the reloading bench, and it worked about as well as anything else I tried.

Sistema1927
July 8, 2008, 01:41 PM
Stainz,

Where are you getting Ranch Products moonclips for $30 per 100 delivered?

I just ordered 88 (11 packs of 8) from Midway USA last night, and even with my dealer discount (C&R) they were $51 including shipping and the NRA round-up. I was going to order 10 packs, but it took 11 to push me over the $40 minimum to avoid the additional $4 handling fee for small dealer orders.

Stainz
July 8, 2008, 01:47 PM
Ah, yes, Midway -where a sale price might be, say $15.99 on a product - dealer price - $15.89! Brownell's is cheaper.

Google 'Ranch Products' - and call them. They ship 100 for ~$30 - and bill you! Trusting old-time folks. Good product, too.

Stainz

General Geoff
July 8, 2008, 03:09 PM
I just ordered 30 Rimz 610 moon clips, as I don't like the prospect of needing a special tool to unclip empties. I'll report back when I get them, and function test them.

rcmodel
July 8, 2008, 03:11 PM
Rimz are great for range plinking.

Just don't drop them, or stuff one in your pocket cause all the rounds will fall out.

rcmodel

machinisttx
July 8, 2008, 03:27 PM
Sportsmans Guide(shudder) had moon clips cheap the last time I looked. I bought a whole bunch of them before they pulled some dumb stuff and lost me as a customer. They work fine in my 1917.

General Geoff
July 8, 2008, 03:32 PM
Rimz are great for range plinking.

Just don't drop them, or stuff one in your pocket cause all the rounds will fall out.

The Rimz site specifies that the 610 moon clips have been stiffened to the point where you can now hang them by one round out of your pocket or off your belt, without worrying about them falling out, due to popular demand by his customers. So they might be a bit sturdier than the 625 clips or older 610 clips. I'll certainly let you know, though, if you're interested.


edit; from their 610 faq page (http://www.ezmoonclip.com/new_page_2.htm):

-The cartridges seem to take more force to load and unload than the original RIMZ 625.
Yes, due to the requests of many of our customers, a stiffer material was selected for the RIMZ 610. Unlike the original RIMZ, the RIMZ 610 can be custom tuned by the owner to allow as much or as little force of entry as required.
-Can the RIMZ 610 be handled just like the metal clips?
Once again due to the requests of a number of our customers, you can hang loaded RIMZ 610 on your pants pockets or edges of moon clip holders.
-What happens if I drop a RIMZ 610 with loaded cartridges?
Typically, the cartridges will remain with the clip.

FEG
July 8, 2008, 05:06 PM
Mine Rimz are definitely the "new" style. I have only had them for a little over a year, and that FAQ was already posted when I bought them. It sounds like they must work a lot better than the ones people are complaining about here.

Like I said, the only ones I have had problems with were the no-name clips people sell at gunshows. They are made somewhere near here; I think it is Versailles, Kentucky.

Ranch moonclips are sort of the standard.

HenrySCTN
July 8, 2008, 05:54 PM
After reading this thread I called Ranch Products a few minutes ago and ordered 100 moonclips for my 625-8, $35/100. Thanks for the information.

Sistema1927
July 8, 2008, 06:05 PM
Oh well, live and learn. I just checked an Midway shipped my order out at 5:00 this morning.

.38 Special
July 8, 2008, 10:12 PM
I had a bunch of other .45 stuff to order for this gun, so I just tacked a packet of Ranch clips on to the Midway order. I'm unlikely to need thirty of them, so between the five that came with the gun and the eight that come in the Ranch packet, I should be good to go. At least until the IPSC bug bites, anyway. They should get a kick out of me and my fixed-sight revolver!

Thanks again for everyone's help. I'll post a pic either here or to the "revolver picture" thread, once the gun is dressed up.

Archer1945
July 9, 2008, 11:39 PM
Thanks for all the info on moonclips. I'm going to be needing some shortly as I am shortly going to be picking up a used 45LC Mountain Gun. I am then going to ship it off to Pinnacle firearms, http://www.pinnacle-guns.com, to have a moonclip conversion done so I can use one gun with both 45LC and 45acp.:)

FEG
July 9, 2008, 11:51 PM
Thanks for all the info on moonclips. I'm going to be needing some shortly as I am shortly going to be picking up a used 45LC Mountain Gun. I am then going to ship it off to Pinnacle firearms, http://www.pinnacle-guns.com, to have a moonclip conversion done so I can use one gun with both 45LC and 45acp.

I was thinking of buying a used Performance Center 625 as my next revolver, and then selling my current 625 (post-lock). A friend of the family has the PC, and he doesn't like it. (Go figure.)

After reading your post, I am thinking I should look at converting the 625 I already have to shoot .45 Colt. I like handloading the cartridge for friends, but I don't care much for a SAA (gateloading). That would just be a cylinder switch, provided I can get the cylinder. Anyone done this?

pinkymingeo
July 10, 2008, 05:52 AM
It's not just a cylinder switch. The 45Colt cylinder is much longer than the acp, and won't fit without trimming the barrel.

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