7.62x39 is .308?


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younganddumb
July 6, 2008, 10:47 PM
I am confused I tought a 7.62x39 was a .308 or is it just that a .308 bored rifle can shoot a 7.62x39

I need clarification please

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joop
July 6, 2008, 10:49 PM
.308 winchester is the same size as 7.61x51mm NOT 7.62x39mm.

more info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62%C3%9751_NATO
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62x39

kingjoey
July 6, 2008, 10:52 PM
7.62x39 is a '30 caliber' cartridge, but the Soviets used a .311" bore instead of the US standard .308" bore. The .308 Winchester also uses a heavier bullet, larger case, and more powder than the 7.62x39. The 7.62x39 is essentially a mid-powered carbine round whereas the .308 is a full-powered rifle round.

younganddumb
July 6, 2008, 11:12 PM
but a 7.62x51 is the same as a .308?

semper_fidelis
July 6, 2008, 11:14 PM
.308 is 7.62X51 you may be confusing it with 7.62X54R shot by most of the soviets in WWII. While technically they are the same size bullets the case is not. Which makes it impossible to shoot out of the same gun.

General Geoff
July 6, 2008, 11:14 PM
Not quite, but they're very, very similar, to the point where 7.62x51 can be fired from any .308 chambered rifle, and a tightly-chambered 7.62x51 rifle can safely fire .308 Winchester.

MCgunner
July 6, 2008, 11:14 PM
I have both and, trust me, the 7.62x39 is NO .308. ROFL! The xxx BY xxx caliber notation thing is a European deal and when NATO standardized the 7.62x51 NATO, they used the Euro designation, not Winchester's commercial designation of ".308 Winchester".

Can't remember the case length of the .30-06, 63 mm isn't it? That would make it a 7.62x63 in Eurospeak. The last number is case length in millimeters. I THINK (really should look this up before I type it) the .30-30 case is 53 mm or 55 mm, but lets just say for argument it's 53. That would make the .30-30 (or .30WCF) a 7.62x53R.....the R meaning it's a rimmed case.

So, to avoid all this BS, just don't be so tacticool and call the .308 a .308. It's the American way! :D

younganddumb
July 6, 2008, 11:22 PM
ok I think I got it know thanks and I am young and dumb but trying to learn thanks for the help

Hoppy590
July 6, 2008, 11:23 PM
Can't remember the case length of the .30-06, 63 mm isn't it? That would make it a 7.62x63 in Eurospeak. The last number is case length in millimeters. I THINK (really should look this up before I type it) the .30-30 case is 53 mm or 55 mm, but lets just say for argument it's 53. That would make the .30-30 (or .30WCF) a 7.62x53R.....the R meaning it's a rimmed case.


30-06 is 7.62X63
30-30 is 7.62X51R i believe

but as said. in NO WAY are 7.62X 39 and 7.62X51 (.308) the same, interchangeable, or otherwise compatible.

Hoppy590
July 6, 2008, 11:41 PM
matter of fact i believe
7.62X63 (30-06)
7.62X51
are both .308 diameter

where as
7.62X54R ( SVD & Mosin Nagant)
7.62X39 ( AK47)
7.62X25 ( TT33)
and probibly
7.62X38r ( Nagant revolver)
are actually .311 diameter

so even the bullet has limited interchangeability

dmazur
July 6, 2008, 11:47 PM
This isn't the caliber you were asking about, but it's more information about caliber interchangeability -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5.56x45mm_NATO

Specifically, this is about shooting .223 in a barrel marked 5.56 NATO, or 5.56 ammo in a barrel marked .223. As the two are similar but not identical, a dangerous condition can arise with 5.56 ammo in a .223 barrel, whereas the first combination can simply be inaccurate.

The safest thing to do is to match the ammo to the chambering exactly. There really isn't any "well that looks close" permitted.

Here's a link to an article written by M.L. McPherson which is a rather comprehensive list of what happens when you chamber the wrong ammo. I didn't see the 7.62x39, so I'm guessing it is too new to be considered with all the common hunting calibers.

http://www.levergun.com/articles/wrong.htm

Anyway, if you read up on reloading, you'll eventually encounter the term "headspace" and the reason why it's important. Excessive headspace can result in case head separation (and dangerous gas in your direction) even with the correct ammo in the chamber!

Think of caliber mismatches as really bad excessive headspace, and you'll be there.

R.W.Dale
July 6, 2008, 11:48 PM
matter of fact i believe
7.62X63 (30-06)
7.62X51
are both .308 diameter

AHHH!

But so are 7.5x54 MAS and 7.5x55 Swiss

And then there's .303 brit which is actually of the larger .311 variety of 30 cal OH and don't forget 7.7x58 Jap it also shoots these projectiles

Confused yet?

ArchAngelCD
July 7, 2008, 04:53 AM
AHHHH 7.5mm - 7.62mm - 30 Caliber >>> numbers numbers!!!:banghead:

Sorry, I feel better now.... I do understand your confusion but don't feel bad because a lot of rounds are named incorrectly anyway. Once you think you have it figured out you find something else that doesn't make sense. LOL

GunTech
July 7, 2008, 01:47 PM
It depends on how you measure. Some rounds are designated by the width across the grooves, others the width across the lands, and some measurements are just picked as being close enough.

Actual measurements

7.82mm = 0.308 inches
7.7mm = 0.303
7.62mm = 0.300
7.5mm = 0.295

younganddumb
July 7, 2008, 05:13 PM
why? why does it have to be so complicated

strat81
July 7, 2008, 05:17 PM
why? why does it have to be so complicated
It's not that bad. You can always get into cars and have fun dealing with engine codes.

Clipper
July 7, 2008, 05:29 PM
Keep in mind also, that the MM/inch math doesn't always work because some are measured at the lands, and others at the grooves...

Clear as mud, right?

Snapping Twig
July 7, 2008, 05:39 PM
FWIW, and to add to the confusion, my older Mini 30 is a 7.62x39 but it uses .308 bullets as it has a .308 bore.

strat81
July 7, 2008, 06:00 PM
Clear as mud, right?
Should we tell him about .38 Special and .357 Magnum? ;)

Seafarer12
July 7, 2008, 06:11 PM
Winchester came out with the commercial version of the 7.62x51 nato. They called it the 308 winchester. Thats why there might be some confusion. The same round that goes by 2 different names. The .308 is just the commercial version of the 7.62 nato. The 7.62x39 is a totally different animal.

younganddumb
July 7, 2008, 06:17 PM
seafarer12 thank you that helps answer my question at hand i'm just trying to get this straight before i get hurt thanks guys

J Star
July 7, 2008, 06:29 PM
I always find it helpful to equate things to rifles that shoot them.

7.62x51 = 7.62NATO = M14

7.62x54R = M44

7.62x39 = AK47

gtmerkley
July 7, 2008, 07:44 PM
they do make a adapter to shoot 7.62x39 in a rifle chambered for .308

esmith
July 7, 2008, 07:46 PM
The bullet diameter or caliber is .311/.312 instead of .308. Also.

they do make a adapter to shoot 7.62x39 in a rifle chambered for .308

Not that i have ever seen or heard about.

R.W.Dale
July 7, 2008, 08:41 PM
they do make a adapter to shoot 7.62x39 in a rifle chambered for .308

YES but beware contrary to what's advertised they're pretty much perminate

http://www.mcace.com/adapters.htm

Geronimo45
July 7, 2008, 09:31 PM
why? why does it have to be so complicated
Let's tell him about 9mm. :evil:

A rifle in .308 Winchester or 7.62x51 can't shoot 7.62x39.
.308 and 7.62x51 have some differences in pressures (IIRC), but are more or less identical.
The .303 British is not .303. It's .311-ish.
The .38 Special is not .38. It's .355.
So is the 9mm Luger/Parabellum/NATO.
And the .380.
The .44 Magnum is not .44.
Finally, the Colt .45 (popular name for either the SAA revolver or 1911 pistol) is not Colt 45 (the Billy Dee Williams variety) and neither is .45 Colt (cartridge).

mr_blove
July 7, 2008, 09:44 PM
Not quite, but they're very, very similar, to the point where 7.62x51 can be fired from any .308 chambered rifle, and a tightly-chambered 7.62x51 rifle can safely fire .308 Winchester.

I was told the exact opposite but I gunsmith that I know and trust very well, to paraphrase it he said you could shoot commercial ammo (.223, .308) in a NATO chambered firearm (5.56x45mm, 7.62x51mm) but not the other way around, he said you could have swelling of the case in the chamber, throat errosion, and some other things but I can't remember. It had something to do with NATO caseings having slightly thicker walls and a little bit longer case length, he was saying that you wouldn't notice these differences unless you had a micrometer.

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