S&W 625 accuracy issues


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Old School
July 19, 2008, 05:48 PM
I brought my 625-3 4" to the range today. It was not as accurate as I expected. I noticed a pattern of the point of impact running upward during firing. Specifically, the first two rounds would be dead on but the subsequent rounds would run up the target about 4 to 5 inches. This happened throughout the session today. I used several different inexpensive ammos including WWB, S&B, Fiocchi and A-Merc. The WWB was the most accurate then the Fiocchi then the S&B. The A-merc brass was so bad that most of the moon clips would not even allow the cylinder to rotate. That A-merc is literally good for nothing -pure garbage. But anyway, has anyone ever experienced this in a revolver? Are these 625s fussy about ammo?

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Jayhawker
July 19, 2008, 07:15 PM
My 5" has been so accurate that it's almost boring to shoot it. I've never shot anything but my reloads in it. I've shot primarily 200 LSWC, 230 LRN, 255 grainers and a variety of jacketed bullets. The 200 LSWC shoots the best but they've all been accurate. Get an experienced friend to shoot your gun with the same ammo you use.

DRYHUMOR
July 19, 2008, 07:19 PM
My 5" shoots better than I do most times, doesn't seem to care what goes through it.

earplug
July 19, 2008, 07:46 PM
My five inch 625-8 shoots better then my four inch JM 625-8.
I don't know if its my eyes 53 year old bifocals or the gun.
I don't recall a revolver stringing rounds being linked to a defect other then a lose rear sight that has been adjusted until the elevation screw is unscrewed.

moxie
July 19, 2008, 07:48 PM
Old School. See my comment under your other post. This may be a problem with your grip, in that it is different from what you are accustomed to with your autos.

ClarkEMyers
July 19, 2008, 08:05 PM
I doubt very much it is the revolver. Then again I have a Ransom Rest for times when I'm too tired to hold tight.

On the off chance that it is the revolver, or even just for interest in revolver accuracy, it might pay to mark each chanber - liquid paper, nail polish, felt tip what have you - and fire a small group using only one chamber for each of the 6 chambers. Often an old days bullseye shooter would eliminate the worst chamber - in terms of group size or a double group out of the main group issue - and always use the 5 that worked best together for 5 shot groups.

spwenger
July 19, 2008, 08:16 PM
...is a classic sign of inconsistent ignition. Assuming that your loads are not headspacing on the necks, this may be a sign of slightly bent moon clips absorbing a bit more of the energy of the falling hammer on some rounds than on others. I'd be very curious to know if you experience the same problem using Auto Rim brass.

Old School
July 19, 2008, 08:47 PM
Moxie says:
Old School. See my comment under your other post. This may be a problem with your grip, in that it is different from what you are accustomed to with your autos.
That is an interesting possibility. I have been shooting revolvers since Carter was President, but I have been shooting autos for the last 10 years. I very well may have changed my grip and habits. I will try a few different styles next time out.

spwenger says:
...is a classic sign of inconsistent ignition. Assuming that your loads are not headspacing on the necks, this may be a sign of slightly bent moon clips absorbing a bit more of the energy of the falling hammer on some rounds than on others. I'd be very curious to know if you experience the same problem using Auto Rim brass.
The moonies are in pretty good shape, but I was planning on ordering some extras anyway. I will also shoot a couple more cylinders clipless to see if it affects the results.

ClarkEMyers says:
I doubt very much it is the revolver. Then again I have a Ransom Rest for times when I'm too tired to hold tight.

On the off chance that it is the revolver, or even just for interest in revolver accuracy, it might pay to mark each chanber - liquid paper, nail polish, felt tip what have you - and fire a small group using only one chamber for each of the 6 chambers. Often an old days bullseye shooter would eliminate the worst chamber - in terms of group size or a double group out of the main group issue - and always use the 5 that worked best together for 5 shot groups.

I will make a note of chamber positions next time I am out.

Every Smith revolver I have ever fired has had stunning accuracy. From what I have read, I expected the same from this one. I was quite disappointed. You could see the glimpses of brilliance for a couple rounds, then bam, up they went. I will get some higher quality ammo and keep an eye on the possibilities suggested above. I hope to get this thing dialed in because it is a beautiful gun.

scott45b
July 19, 2008, 09:40 PM
We here at the RIMZ test facility will be glad to take what may be a terrible gun off your hands and put it to pasture at our testing range. We are allways looking to "wear out" another revolver.

mtngunr
July 19, 2008, 09:56 PM
My first thought with vertical stringing is inconsistant hold, allowing the gun to recoil to different degrees, and so throw shots higher or lower. No insult here, as I do this at times, too, particularly with a new gun. I'd just say give it time, shoot one type/brand of ammo, and you and your new friend get to know one another better. I also often find myself shooting a new gun, and when it starts off good, I start to relax and (see above 1st sentence).

Old School
July 19, 2008, 09:58 PM
scott45b says:
We here at the RIMZ test facility will be glad to take what may be a terrible gun off your hands and put it to pasture at our testing range. We are allways looking to "wear out" another revolver.
scott, you average 17 posts a year and you use one of them to try to get my 625? I am truly flattered!

mtngunr says:
My first thought with vertical stringing is inconsistant hold, allowing the gun to recoil to different degrees, and so throw shots higher or lower. No insult here, as I do this at times, too, particularly with a new gun. I'd just say give it time, shoot one type/brand of ammo, and you and your new friend get to know one another better. I also often find myself shooting a new gun, and when it starts off good, I start to relax and (see above 1st sentence).
Moxie also suggested it may be a grip thing. It is certainly possible I will try a couple different grips and try to keep the grip consistent. I will be quite thrilled if that is all it is.

S&Wfan
July 19, 2008, 11:26 PM
I agree. It is a mechanics/technique/grip issue.

As fun as those 625s are to shoot, you'll be shooting those "boring" single hole groups, at 10 yard out, in no time!

Old School
July 26, 2008, 05:36 PM
Well, I took the 625 down and gave it a heavy cleaning. I did see a little lead in the barrel and in the cylinder before the cleaning. After a major clean and light lube, I took the Gun back to the range today. The climb is gone and the accuracy was much better today. I payed extra attention to the grip as well. I think the grip is too large and too smooth to suit me. I will have to find some replacements.

The gun does perform substantially better with Federal Premium Personal Defense 230 grain Hydra Shock than any of the other ammos that were tried today. The worst for it today was the Winchester Ranger LE 230 grain SXT. The SXT felt hotter with a noticeably heavier recoil with a point of impact 3"-4" higher at 25 yards and about 2" larger groups.

Of the cheap practice ammos, both WWB and Remington UMC 230 grain JHP performed really well at 7 yards with the WWB grouping a couple inches tighter at 25 yards.

Overall the gun performs really well, It still does not group like the S&W 357s I have shot over the years, but it is far better than it was. Even with the early accuracy struggles, the gun is nice to shoot and very likeable peice. Even my teenage daughter enjoyed shooting the big bore stating: "the recoil does not bother me at all". Her first 6 shots were very well placed with all but one fitting in a 3" circle in or touching the x-ring at 7 yards.

Next, I will try a grip that suits me better.

Walkalong
July 26, 2008, 07:20 PM
If all you have is some vertical stringing, the revolver is trying to shoot. You just need to iron out the problem. All of the previous suggestions as to why can be the, or part of the, problem. You'll figure it out. I would not worry about the gun. :)

StrawHat
July 28, 2008, 11:41 AM
Old School,

Another cause of vertical stringing is sighting on the last shot fired and not on the target.

I saw that a lot when shooting PPC and after explaining it to the shooter I sometimes wish I would have stayed quiet!

Good Luck.

loplop
July 29, 2008, 10:15 AM
My Mod 22 is more accurate in my hands than my Mod 27. Love the gun! For me, the grip included does allow the gun to move a little, my hand creeps up higher and higher with the stout recoil. As long as I pay attention to get a very high grip initially, and readjust if it moves too much, my groups are scary tight.

I don't have this problem with the Mod 27, even when firing full house loads, same grips. Must be the big 45 "push."

Old School
August 16, 2008, 03:53 PM
Turns out, I just needed to "get a grip".:D
After installing a Hogue Monogrip, this gun went from the being the least accurate 45 that I owned to the most accurate 45 I own when firing in single action. I can now put all 6 shots in a 5" circle firing from the free standing position at 25 yards using Remington UMC 230 grain FMJ from Wally World. From seven yards it will chew 2" hole out of the center of the bullseye. All is right with the world.

Stainz
August 17, 2008, 09:05 AM
Wow - another fairly reasonable 'fix'! I knew it had to be something simple.

You folks with a 625JM and poor accuracy, it must be that JM grip... just send it to me, I'll replace it with a rubber Hogue... yeah, that's the ticket!

Actually, that JM grip is an 'acquired' taste - one I've acquired! Some folks literally hate them... wish I knew one - I love those grips. I actually ordered one a while back for my PC 627 V-Comp, a Jerry Miculek model the original owner replaced those grips with Hogues years ago. He insists he tossed the Miculeks. We are all different. Glad you are a happy 625-shooter - they are fun.

Stainz

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