Question on probation/Firearm purchase


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commited a crime
July 23, 2008, 09:20 PM
I realize the internet isn't the best place to ask for legal advice but I was directed here by a friend and I guess I'm just looking for a pointer in the right direction?


Here's the picture:

Entered a business, during operating hours

Initial charge: 3 felony counts
1. grand theft
2. grand theft (again)
3. burglary (tool was found in possession but not used in the actual crime)

Charges reduced to 1 misdemeanor of the 2nd degree

Informal probation: 3 years

Resident of CA (not sure whether this matters)


1. With the above information, does it seem possible to purchase either a hand gun or long gun during informal probation?

2. Is there anything on the form for either a hand gun or long gun that will need to be checked YES concerning misdemeanor criminal history? (I wouldn't know what is on the forms for firearm purchases as I'm not a previous gun owner.)


The true specifics aren't there, I realize, of which I am not exceedingly privy to myself.

Therefore I'm not sure whether there is enough information here to go on but I thought it wouldn't hurt to ask.

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ilbob
July 23, 2008, 09:31 PM
what is informal probation?

usually the terms of probation would dictate this kind of thing.

Aguila Blanca
July 23, 2008, 09:35 PM
I realize the internet isn't the best place to ask for legal advice but I was directed here by a friend and I guess I'm just looking for a pointer in the right direction?
Pointer: ==> Ask an attorney in the jurisdiction in which you are on probation.

GigaBuist
July 23, 2008, 09:40 PM
Is there anything on the form for either a hand gun or long gun that will need to be checked YES concerning misdemeanor criminal history?

The only misdemeanors that will disqualify you are domestic violence charges.

insidious_calm
July 23, 2008, 09:59 PM
A couple things....


1) It will say in your probation paperwork that you were given by the court and/or your attorney and/or your probation officer exactly what the conditions of your probation are.

2) From the limited information you posted, it is not clear the exact legal mechanism by which your "charges" were reduced to a misdemeanor. If the charge was originally a felony, or multiple felonies in this case, and was reduced to a misdemeanor as a condition of your successful completion of parole/probation then you are likely a prohibited person.

3) If the "misdemeanor" you were convicted of *could* have resulted in incarceration for longer than one year, even though you weren't, you are likely a prohibited person.


I am not a lawyer, but there are a lot serious consequences if you get this wrong. You need to consult a lawyer in your area familiar with firearms law and discuss the specifics of your situation. If you are are a prohibited person and get caught with a gun it could get you 5 years for the felony. Not worth risking on internet advice. TALK TO A LAWYER.



I.C.

divemedic
July 23, 2008, 10:17 PM
Generally, firearm possession during probation will get your probation violated.

Frog48
July 23, 2008, 10:43 PM
Generally, firearm possession during probation will get your probation violated.

Depends... the terms of probation will be spelled out explicitly in the judgement document. As long as firearms possession is not specifically mentioned and prohibited in the terms of probation, you're good to go.

bogie
July 23, 2008, 11:01 PM
How old were you when you got busted?

How long ago was it?

Jim K
July 23, 2008, 11:13 PM
The law reads "convicted in any court of a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year." Generally, that is the line between a felony and a misdemeanor, so a misdemeanor conviction shouldn't keep you from buying/owning a gun.

By pleading guilty and accepting probation, you were convicted. The term of probation doesn't matter, nor does your age at the time or how long ago the incident took place.

But I strongly agree that the advice of an attorney in that jurisdiction would be better than asking on the intenet.

Jim

Trebor
July 23, 2008, 11:24 PM
You really need to check with an attorney before you buy or handle any firearms. If you think you can possess a firearm, and it turns out you are wrong and are caught with a firearm, that's a felony right there and would also possibly affect your existing probation.

Granted, you might be able to tell for sure that you CAN'T possess firearms by asking here. But, I'd check with an attorney before you presume that you can legally possess a firearm.

Pilgrim
July 24, 2008, 12:04 AM
Look at the 'minute order' you signed when you left court. The terms of probation should be listed there.

Pilgrim

mp510
July 24, 2008, 12:05 AM
1st. Check the terms of your probation that you agreed to- often times, not possessing weapons during the term of your probation is one of the things that you have to agree to. It would also be a good to check with your probation officer to see if he is going to violate you for it. (if either of those is answered in the comes up against your favor, stop thinking about buying a gun until your probation is over).

THEN (when your probation is ovre, or if your probation doesn't prohibit you from possessing a gun and your PO doesn't have a problem with it) the CA DOJ haas a service where you can verify your eligibility for a nominal fee. Fill out and send in the following form:
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/pfecapp.pdf

Good luck.

Zoogster
July 24, 2008, 12:16 AM
It depends on the conditions of the probation.

It is a routine condition for many things even unrelated to firearms to not allow the possession of weapons.

In CA it qualifies the person as a prohibited person, and if found in possession of a firearm it is the same as if a felon was in possession.


So any probation can make you a prohibited person if included as a condition of probation. Many probation departments make no weapons a standard condition of probation in general irregardless of the offense.
It would definately be a violation of probation in that case, but I believe it may qualify for a felony charge as well.


2. Is there anything on the form for either a hand gun or long gun that will need to be checked YES concerning misdemeanor criminal history?
I do not believe so. It may still be a felony to possess while prohibited under state law though even if legal federaly.

Prohibited classes in CA include:

• Any person who is convicted of a felony, or any offense enumerated in Section 12021.1 of the PenalCode
• Any person who is ordered to not possess firearms as a condition of probation or other court order


"(d) (1) Any person who, as an express condition of probation, is
prohibited or restricted from owning, possessing, controlling,
receiving, or purchasing a firearm and who owns, purchases, receives,
or has in his or her possession or under his or her custody or
control, any firearm but who is not subject to subdivision (a) or (c)
is guilty of a public offense, which shall be punishable by
imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or in the state
prison, by a fine not exceeding one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by
both that imprisonment and fine. The court, on forms provided by the
Department of Justice, shall notify the department of persons subject
to this subdivision. The notice shall include a copy of the order of
probation and a copy of any minute order or abstract reflecting the
order and conditions of probation."



That is often how things that are felonies, or can be charged as felonies are worded in CA law.




So essentialy any crime which results in probation can make you a prohibited person in the state of CA if that is a condition of probation. That is a standard condition of probation many places, put in place by policy.
When I was younger I had a couple friends on probation, and even informal probation resulted in a no weapons condition of probation. One was on informal probation for shoplifting from a dollar type store for a couple years and we used to make fun of her for it, as any of us could have easily purchased anything there without a second thought, yet she had stolen something.

So even if it is not one of the misdemeanors under state law that prohibit you from possessing firearms you can be a prohibited person. There is also those, most of which usualy result in 10 year prohibitions. Then of course there is the federal misdemeanor prohibition of domestic violence which is for life.

But usualy unknown is that absolutely any offense whatsoever can result in prohibition for the duration of probation if that is made a condition, and it usualy is for any criminal probation.

Another irony is an offense punishable by only a few months maximum sentence can be suspended and result in probation lasting years, essentialy making you a prohibited person for far longer than you could even be put behind bars for the offense.

It clearly sounds unconstitutional, but it is CA law.

commited a crime
July 26, 2008, 02:50 AM
Wow, you were all.... Gentle. I did not expect that. I was braced and ready before reading what you all had to say. So thank you very kindly for that.

As soon as I posted this I started thinking exactly what you all in turn said; look-over-the-terms-of-your-probation. I'm a dummy, as you can tell. Why else would I have done what I did?

Thanks again for your time and understanding.

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