How is the Stoeger Cougar for CCW? Vs. Beretta PX4 Subcompact?


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Macchina
July 24, 2008, 11:47 PM
I am looking a buying a small pistol for carry next year. I would go with the Ruger LCP in a heartbeat, but too may people are having FTF's with them that I've shied away from it. It looks like I'm moving up in size a bit to get a more reliable gun. I would like to carry a gun as small as possible that will get the job done. A 9mm or .40 would be nice. The new Beretta PX4 looks awesome, and the reviews have been great, but for even cheaper I can get the Stoeger Cougar. I have no experience with either, and would like your input. In this picture (cougar on bottom, PX4 on top) it appears they are the same size except for barrel length. How does the Cougar carry? For reference, I have a CZ 40B and it is far too big for me to carry.
http://px4sc.com/img/PX4-SC-8000L-a.jpg

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DawgFvr
July 25, 2008, 12:40 AM
The Stoeger Cougar is a beautiful weapon. Unfortunately, Beretta made such a huge grip that it just does not conceal well in the CCW mode. I love it...but...the Glock is the CCW and the Cougar remains a range/home side arm.

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e61/DawgFvr/Stoeger/StoegerCougar1.jpg

Also, I am not a huge fan of the DA/SA either. Shorten the grip...change to a good/smooth DAO and I would carry it. It is highly accurate and, now that I think about it, I've never had a malfunction with this pistol.

bmitchell
July 25, 2008, 10:12 AM
I've got a pretty skinny friend who deep conceals a Cougar and you wouldn't know it was there. Seems to be a pretty good gun if you can get used to greasing your barrel lugs. Every time I shoot it I find I like it more.
Comparable in size to my Astra A-100.

FieroCDSP
July 25, 2008, 10:19 AM
I don't have a proper holster for it, but the Cougar isn't any bigger than my other full-sized guns. I could probably conceal it IWB, but I usually carry either my M&P or SW990.

I found the DA trigger to be smooth enough, if a bit stiff.

Macchina
July 25, 2008, 10:59 AM
I like small guns, and it sounds like the Cougar is a little smaller than a full size gun that can be concealed if you work at it. I have a gun like that already, and would never carry it unless I had a coat on. I guess I'm looking into the subcompact arena again. If Ruger works out the bugs in the LCP in the next year, it could go back on my list...

mr.72
July 25, 2008, 11:46 AM
Kahr CW9 might be something for you to check into.

researchdoc
July 25, 2008, 11:47 AM
IWB or Smart Carry works fine with the Cougar for me.
It is a fine weapon.. especially for the price.

Jeeps1
July 25, 2008, 02:10 PM
I carry my Cougar everyday in a Crossbreed Supertuck IWB. No problems at all. It hides as well as my Colt Detective Special does in it's Crossbreed Supertuck. I have never had a failure with the Stoeger after hundreds and hundreds of rounds of all types of ammo.

DawgFvr
July 25, 2008, 07:38 PM
The Cougar is a very good weapon...small it isn't and the grip is downright large making it "bottom heavy" when fully loaded. It is a Commander size weapon:

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e61/DawgFvr/Stoeger/Coug1911.jpg

Can it be carried? Sure it can. Is there more concealable, better balanced weapons with better triggers? you betcha.

GZOh
July 25, 2008, 08:30 PM
Own a Cougar and it is an excellent gun! Heavy-all metal feel, very well made, very accurate shoot and with 1000+rnds, FLAWLESS!!
Ditto and totally agree with DawgFvr... the Cougar is NOT a small gun. Could you use it for carry?... Sure, guys use 1911s for carry... your call! The handle is long and heavy when loaded (Dawg), but not a problem for ME... Hold One, you'll quickly see!
Aside, it's a great gun... and as I've ALWAYS said, if you can get a NIB 8000 for UNDER $400, jump-on-it!!!

BTW: IMHO that Beretta Sub-Compact is one of the ugliest guns on the planet!... again, IMHO.
Also, beautiful pic of that handle on your Cougar, Dawg!!

240SX
July 26, 2008, 01:29 AM
Get yourself a HK USP Compact .45 APC (also comes in .40S&W or 9mm). I have the .45 ACP and carry it everyday. You wouldn't even know I had it on me if you didn't know me. When I get my CZP-06 (.40S&W), it might also be one of my carry guns when it hot as hell outside because of its size! HK and CZ are both awesome gun companies...HK just a little on the expensive side.

Macchina
July 26, 2008, 11:26 AM
The CZ P-06 was on my list as well. The P-06 is one nice gun, is it smaller than the Cougar?

steelyblue
July 26, 2008, 12:06 PM
I conceal my full size 1911 way easier that my Stoeger. The stoeger is short, but it is fat and uncomfortable. It is a good range gun and a great truck gun.

WC145
July 26, 2008, 12:10 PM
I carry a Beretta Mini Cougar in 9mm, it is the DAO model. It's the same as the regular Cougar except the grip is quite short and it comes with short 10 rd mags, I purchased some full size 15rd mags from Beretta along with the little sleeves to fill the gap between the end of the grip and the bottom of the mag so with the larger mag in place the dimensions are the same as a full size model. I like it alot, very nice gun, well made, accurate, reliable. In fact I know where there is a full size DAO model that I might buy just to have another one.

For those of you that own 9mm Cougars, Beretta has the 15rd mags on sale for $19.95. They are new, factory original, marked "LE Only". I ordered mine through the store on their website.

Also, I used to own a HK USPc in 357sig, very nice weapon, top quality, but I replaced it with a Beretta and haven't been disappointed.

GZOh
July 26, 2008, 12:50 PM
michaelmcgo... alot also depends on your BUDGET!... If you can swing the difference in $$, go for the P-06. I have a P-01(basically same size as 06) and it's my favorite gun... great, great shooter!!

steelyblue kinda hit it pretty well... it's a short, hefty gun, not quite uncomfortable, but the 'fit' takes some gettin used to... great range gun, great 'truck gun.'

If you can do the P-06, you and 240sx will be singin some sweet tunes for the next couple of years!!

Macchina
July 26, 2008, 01:23 PM
I can get a P-06 for around $550, about the same as a Berreta PX4. Would the P-06 be considered a compact carry weapon? What I mean is, would I be able to comfortably carry it a few days a week, or would it print with jeans and a t-shirt when IWB? BTW, I am 5'8" 175 Lbs.

GZOh
July 26, 2008, 01:53 PM
Not sure what state you're in but...GHOST PRODUCTS (Mesa, AZ) had them for $515 (shipping included to an FFL), if you want to go that mail-net route... No State Tax but you'll pay an FFL transfer fee. Sometimes this works, sometimes it's a 'wash'...

So your $550 isn't a bad price if it INCLUDES Tax.

Scratchshooter40
July 26, 2008, 09:22 PM
Try an S.O.B. holster which places the grip in vertical alignment with your spine. The recess in your back will hide the Cougar very well and the draw with it is sudden due to the shortness of the slide/barrel. Never had any issue carrying it although my main carry is a Beretta 96. Can't really carry the 92FS with the Knight Suppressor without a shoulder rig and vertical carry. Local holster make made a nice rig for my Galco harness that works very well. Don't carry the suppressed weapon for CCW though, just the 96 or the Cougar. Sig 2340 is BUG in ankle holster.

oneounceload
July 26, 2008, 10:34 PM
the smallest 9mm is the Rohrbaugh........not cheap, but......

Gas Operated
July 26, 2008, 11:35 PM
For those of you that own 9mm Cougars, Beretta has the 15rd mags on sale for $19.95. They are new, factory original, marked "LE Only". I ordered mine through the store on their website.
Where did you find these? All I found were $45 magazines.

Guns and more
July 26, 2008, 11:45 PM
I'm sure this will open a can of worms, but if you want a 9mm. to carry, consider the Kahr PM-9. I have one and with a IWB holster at 4pm, I forget I have it on. Pretty snappy to shoot, everythings' a compromise.

WC145
July 27, 2008, 11:44 AM
Quote:
For those of you that own 9mm Cougars, Beretta has the 15rd mags on sale for $19.95. They are new, factory original, marked "LE Only". I ordered mine through the store on their website.

Where did you find these? All I found were $45 magazines.

Here's a link to the page-
http://www.shopberetta.com/e2wItemMain.aspx?functionId=009000008&parentID=019007538

I bought 5 but should probably order some more for myself while they still have them!

gb6491
July 27, 2008, 12:26 PM
I looked at a PX4 Sub Compact yesterday. It is quite thick through the slide and grip; considerably thicker than a Kel-Tec P-11 I compared it. However, the trigger is fairly easy to reach in the DA position; much better than my SIG P229 (with the short trigger). Trigger pull felt pretty good in both modes. The grip is kind of cramped for three fingers with the magazine extension closed and quite adequate with it open. The gun points well.The polymer used for the frame is finished much more smoothly and shiny than many other of the polymer guns out there. I don't care for the finish very much. The slide is done in Beretta's spray on finish and was well done for the most part (a few little bumps/depressions evident). Bottom line for me is that it is just seems too thick for IWB carry (at least on my part). I think I would consider other options for a concealed carry 9mm or .40. That said, I would give it more consideration if they make it in 45ACP.
Regards,
Greg

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