Gun misfires, kills man


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Oregon Street
July 31, 2008, 05:03 PM
Discharged while still in the holster ???

http://www.parkrecord.com/county/ci_10034905

Gun misfires, kills man
Weapon was still in its holster
Patrick Parkinson, Of the Record staff
Article Launched: 07/29/2008 05:34:41 PM MDT


A man was shot to death by his own gun in the Uinta Mountains when the pistol accidentally discharged, the authorities said.
The body of Salt Lake County resident Jon Klopfenstein, 55, was found in the Sulphur area of the forest July 12 at 7:29 p.m. He died from a single gunshot wound, investigators said.

"Initially, we thought it was a suicide," said Josh Wall, a spokesman for the Summit County Sheriff's Office. "The officers on scene, and the medical examiner from our office determined that this was actually an accidental discharge."

The 9 mm pistol involved in the shooting is a "cheap, junk gun" made in Israel, Wall explained.

The weapon discharged while strapped in its holster, he said.

"The gun gets hit on the hammer and discharges the round in the chamber," Wall said. "The bullet hit the guy in the belly from below."

The weapon might have struck the ground or exterior of the vehicle, Wall said.

"He fell outside the car, so we're thinking he is probably getting in or out of the car when this happens," he added. "The empty round was still in the chamber He could have been putting it in the car and it fell to the ground."

Nobody saw the shooting occur.

"Somebody just came across him laying there dead," Wall said, adding that officers do not suspect foul play. "This appears to be his gun and he was there alone, as far as we are aware."

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Guns and more
July 31, 2008, 05:06 PM
What?

Cosmoline
July 31, 2008, 05:08 PM
Weird. I wonder what the firearm was--an old Deagle maybe? Those are heavy, but should have standard features against discharge when dropped.

kingpin008
July 31, 2008, 05:16 PM
This sounds hinky to me. Possibly a bit of bad reporting coupled with less-than-stellar description of events by Mr. wall, but either way it doesn't sound right.

camslam
July 31, 2008, 05:18 PM
Kingpin: You should know, you never, ever let the truth get in the way of telling a good story. :D

General Geoff
July 31, 2008, 05:29 PM
Weird. I wonder what the firearm was--an old Deagle maybe?

Desert Eagles have never been chambered for 9mm, they've always been .357/.44/.50AE

OFT
July 31, 2008, 05:32 PM
If it misfired how did he get shot? To me a misfire is where the gun does not fire when supposed to.:confused:

rbernie
July 31, 2008, 05:33 PM
The 9 mm pistol involved in the shooting is a "cheap, junk gun" made in Israel, Wall explained.Is there such a thing?

Soap
July 31, 2008, 05:34 PM
No drop safety and a crappy holster is a bad combination.

rcmodel
July 31, 2008, 05:39 PM
No, carrying a loaded pistol cocked with the safety off is a bad combination.

rcmodel

TallPine
July 31, 2008, 06:07 PM
The empty round was still in the chamber

That doesn't make any sense at all, unless a retaining strap kept the slide from cycling.

bdickens
July 31, 2008, 06:25 PM
Something doesn't make sense.

Chipperman
July 31, 2008, 06:26 PM
I'm not aware of any junk handguns from Israel.

An Isreali 9mm... I'm thinking a Jericho.
Not particularly expensive, but not junk either.

Thernlund
July 31, 2008, 06:33 PM
I have a Jericho. Great gun.

Something is just off with this story. Clever murder maybe? :uhoh:


-T.

Rugerlvr
July 31, 2008, 06:38 PM
I've camped in the Sulphur area a lot. This is sad. Know your weapon, carry it safely, and don't buy junk.

wagoneer1019
July 31, 2008, 06:41 PM
this makes me wonder who on this forum does not keep a round chambered?

mejeepnut
July 31, 2008, 06:45 PM
Quote:
Weird. I wonder what the firearm was--an old Deagle maybe?

Desert Eagles have never been chambered for 9mm, they've always been .357/.44/.50AE


Desert Eagle Baby Eagles where/are made in 9mm

General Geoff
July 31, 2008, 07:11 PM
You mean the Jericho 941?

Thernlund
July 31, 2008, 07:13 PM
You mean the Jericho 941?

Originally. Now the Baby Eagle.


-T.

kingpin008
July 31, 2008, 07:21 PM
Kingpin: You should know, you never, ever let the truth get in the way of telling a good story.

Camslam - I'm not quite sure how to take that. Care to clarify for me?

bobotech
July 31, 2008, 07:23 PM
The Jericho/Baby Eagle are considered to be excellent reliable strong guns. They are basically CZ75s in different clothing and with refinements.


NOT cheap or junky at all.

Well maybe rather inexpensive compared to a Sig or an HK, but 400-500 is still not a cheap junky pistol by any means.

General Geoff
July 31, 2008, 07:23 PM
Originally. Now the Baby Eagle.

Well, it is still manufactured by IMI, so I guess it fits the description in the article.

Oregon Street
July 31, 2008, 08:06 PM
I should add the Park Record often displays poor journalism and reporting in their paper. I don't know about this writer, but overall the paper's record of fact checking and fairness is weak.

esq_stu
July 31, 2008, 08:12 PM
NO WAY.

Cheap Junk Israeli Guns? That is very poor journalism.

Jericho/Baby Eagle has a firing pin safety just like a new CZ75. A 1911 would AD before a Jericho.

mikitsubizunizu
July 31, 2008, 08:16 PM
I think by "junk gun" they mean a damaged one, maybe one that had some rust spots or corrosion. Some people out there just don't get it, you don't buy a $50 junker and expect it to work, if you do you're inviting trouble.

It had to have been fairly damaged if the weapon didn't cycle when the round was fired, unless of course it was a revolver. I wonder what it was, why can't they ever give more info as to what it is. :cuss:

SCKimberFan
July 31, 2008, 08:18 PM
How did it hit him in the belly if the gun what still holstered?

How was the empty round (?) still in the chamber?

This whole story leaves me with a great big: HUH?

lamazza
July 31, 2008, 08:19 PM
I call BS-I think this article is purposely vague.

Nate C.
July 31, 2008, 08:20 PM
Hmmm...

Two mysteries are upon us, it would seem. Chalk another one up to crappy reporting.

lions
July 31, 2008, 08:22 PM
The empty round was still in the chamber

That doesn't make any sense at all, unless a retaining strap kept the slide from cycling.

My guess is the pistol landed on the hammer and when the gun recoiled the slide hit the ground and didn't allow it to cycle properly. The fact that it fired up at him means he was taking the whole rig off/putting it on and dropped it. It said the gun was in the holster, not that the holster was on the belt. It makes sense that he was right next to his car and getting in or out.

Juna
July 31, 2008, 08:23 PM
There's definitely more to this story. It doesn't add up. The guy had to be negligent in some way in order to be carrying a firearm cocked with one in the chamber, but no safety. Either that, or it was a clever murder. It just doesn't all add up.

lions
July 31, 2008, 08:30 PM
Chalk another one up to crappy reporting.

+1
I think everything can add up it is just a very poorly written article.

wristtwister
July 31, 2008, 08:48 PM
It probably didn't fit the writer's agenda mindset... if he was an "anti", a $5000 pistol would qualify as a "Saturday night special"... if he was "pro", he wanted to make it seem that the skies opened and the fickle finger of fate reached in and pulled the trigger.

Could be the writer was just a "cub" reporter, and didn't know how to do the story well. We used to use the "rule of W's"... who, what, when, where, why... then, details of each. This article was written with the "Field of Dreams" method... "She was from Iowa, and I had once heard of Iowa"...

In fairness, nobody seems to know what happened, so the writer just recorded what he was told and kept on truckin'... This seems to be one of those situations where studying the forensic evidence would tell you... "yep, he's a dead guy..." (no disrespect intended).

Let's see... no facts... little evidence... no eyewitnesses... looks like a conspiracy theory to me...:what:

WT

yesit'sloaded
July 31, 2008, 09:18 PM
My ex-girlfriend carries a Jericho in .40SW. They are SA/DA with a decocker that also locks the firing pin. If he was carrying it cocked on a full chamber the only thing preventing it from going off was a light trigger. Could have happened.

HammerBite
July 31, 2008, 09:29 PM
The guy dropped his holstered gun, which hit the ground muzzle up and discharged, thereby shooting him in the belly from below. Since the gun hit the ground muzzle up, the slide's recoil stroke was interrupted when the slide recoiled into the ground; thus the failure to extract the empty case.

Rugerlvr
July 31, 2008, 10:10 PM
OH HELL! I was camping at a campground just off of that highway on the 12th right near the road, my wife just remembered that we saw rangers and an ambulance racing with lights and sirens in that direction just after that time! Wow. Interesting.

Eightball
July 31, 2008, 11:29 PM
The weapon discharged while strapped in its holster, he said.

"The bullet hit the guy in the belly from below."I'm still struggling to figure out what bizarre holster setup you'd be using to where it's in the holster, yet below your belly and pointed UP at you. Better yet, if the gun WAS a type that didn't have a FPS (doubtful at best), why he would carry it with one in the chamber WHILE it was pointed up at his stomach, is beyond me.

Either bad reporting, or a very very stupid guy.

yesit'sloaded
July 31, 2008, 11:45 PM
I think I might have it figured out. If it was cocked and loaded with the safe off (the safety must be off for the gun to be cocked because it is also a decocker) the gun could have been in a holster that merely clips onto the belt instead of the belt going through it. Holster with gun in condition 0 falls off of belt, rotates to orient the muzzle towards the guy, impacts the ground, and fires when the hammer hits the floor. Sounds crazy, but it's about the only thing I can think of.

Golden Hound
August 1, 2008, 12:10 AM
Are there other gun companies in Israel that we don't know about besides IMI? Maybe there are some small companies in Israel that make cheap "junk" guns. But I don't know about it if they are.

Thernlund
August 1, 2008, 12:16 AM
I'm still struggling to figure out what bizarre holster setup you'd be using to where it's in the holster, yet below your belly and pointed UP at you.

It was in the holster when he dropped it in front of him. He wasn't wearing the holster.


-T.

RobTzu
August 1, 2008, 12:51 AM
Perhaps the bullet ricocheted off the pavement?

hksw
August 1, 2008, 07:56 PM
Desert Eagles have never been chambered for 9mm, they've always been .357/.44/.50AE

And .41 mag.

Desert Eagle Baby Eagles where/are made in 9mm

The original poster stated "Deagle" which is implied to be Deseert Eagle, the gas op mag semi. "Baby Desert Eagle" or "Baby Deagle" was not state which is the CZ copy derivative.

lloydkristmas
August 2, 2008, 03:48 AM
Maybe it was a suicide being covered up? Like so many other "accidental death" reports...? Lots of those "he was cleaning his gun and it went off" stories are cover ups...

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