Anyone seen a DNR park ranger with an asp? I did...


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Kitchen_Duty
August 5, 2008, 01:51 AM
A little background:

My family was at the Wupatki national park near Flagstaff, AZ. We were at some ruins and my brother decided that he was not going to follow the signs that said stay on the path and check out a room at a ruin. Well he checks it out and gets back on the trail. About 5 minutes later Park Urban Ninja Ranger comes up.

The thing that really caught my attention by the backpack toting park ranger was his utility belt. Granted I was too worried defending my brother because I didn't remember a sign that said stay on the path, just not walk on the walls (which, he didn't). On his belt, he had: a radio, a flashlight, handcuffs, a polymer pistol, and an ASP!!! An maybe some pepper spray/stun gun/taser, not sure about that though.

Is the ASP a common tool for DNR to carry? I felt like asking why he carried it and challenge his authority a little bit. I'm just not sure what kind of training park rangers go through. I know in the Navy we have to go through a course because the asp is considered a deadly weapon. It really bugged me. So, anyone else see something similar. Thanks in advance. Oh, I will be flying all day tuesday so I won't be able to answer any questions and no I didn't get his name/ badge number.

-Kitchen

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Ron James
August 5, 2008, 02:02 AM
I'm not sure what you are referring to , however I live in Arizona and your attitude of " the rules don't apply to me" and " challenge his authority" sucks. How about you and your brother growing up. Just because you're in or were in the service does not give you any special rights. Yes I spent my time in and I follow the rules of society:mad::mad:

Pilgrim
August 5, 2008, 02:18 AM
Certain park rangers in national parks are federal peace officers.

If you feel like challenging his/her authority, you may end up with a few bruises and in front of a federal magistrate.

Pilgrim

rondog
August 5, 2008, 02:21 AM
Uh, what's an "asp"?

Pilgrim
August 5, 2008, 02:25 AM
A telescoping baton (http://www.asp-net.com/batons.html).

Pilgrim

bogie
August 5, 2008, 02:28 AM
If they say "stay outta the ruins," they mean "stay outta the ruins so you don't mess stuff up for ME when I come to see them."

Stay outta the ruins. Your brother needs an adjustment.

FourNineFoxtrot
August 5, 2008, 02:31 AM
Nothing too special about an ASP. Hell, I was (briefly) licensed to carry one, and I was a security guard. It's just a telescoping baton, unless you're talking about a different kind of ASP. Like the snake. I don't think I'd carry a live asp on my belt... even if it was telescoping.

Maybe our understanding of the ASP differs because, in the military, the tactics you're taught are more... decisive... than those methods we are taught in Mall Ninja school.

GarandOwner
August 5, 2008, 02:35 AM
All of the cops I have seen in Chesterfield, Virginia carry asp's I dont know about rangers, but since they are cops, I would assume its no biggie that one had an asp

Kitchen_Duty
August 5, 2008, 02:40 AM
Well as far as telling me about my brother about his attitude, thanks /end sarcasm. But other than that. I just thought it was odd. Thanks guys. And I doubt that our telescoping batons (asps) are any different than what anyone else can buy, we probably have cheaper versions... Thanks guys.

American_Pit_Bull
August 5, 2008, 02:45 AM
Depending on the scenario, the DNR official can overrule the police... So yes, he has a great deal of authority.

Steve in PA
August 5, 2008, 03:01 AM
So what makes you think he didn't have training with the ASP?

What strikes you as odd as to him carrying an ASP?

Why didn't you "challenge his authority" about carrying a pistol?

kingpin008
August 5, 2008, 04:45 AM
That's what I'm wondering as well - truth be told, the OP's story doesn't quite make sense in a lot of ways.

We were at some ruins and my brother decided that he was not going to follow the signs that said stay on the path and check out a room at a ruin. Well he checks it out and gets back on the trail. About 5 minutes later Park Urban Ninja Ranger comes up.

So he decides to disobey the rules... Great plan. :rolleyes:

I was too worried defending my brother

From a park ranger? It seems exceedingly odd that you'd feel the need to defend yourself or your brother from a park ranger, unless you were doing something you shouldn't have been.

Oh wait...

my brother decided that he was not going to follow the signs that said stay on the path


On his belt, he had: a radio, a flashlight, handcuffs, a polymer pistol, and an ASP!!! An maybe some pepper spray/stun gun/taser, not sure about that though.

OH NOES, AN ASP!!1!

Seriously - you see that the guy has handcuffs, a flashlight, a GUN and what may be pepper-spray, and you're worried/concerned about a collapsible baton? That's some crazy sense of priorities you've got there, buddy.

Oh but wait - you're probably peeved because the ranger was, like, totally hassling you, right? Because maybe, just maybe when he asked you both what you had been doing, you said this:

I didn't remember a sign that said stay on the path, just not walk on the walls (which, he didn't)

but really meant this:

my brother decided that he was not going to follow the signs that said stay on the path

And he caught you in a lie and yelled at you. So you come here and post about nonsense.

Just a thought. :rolleyes:

M203Sniper
August 5, 2008, 05:38 AM
Park Rangers are Law Enforcement. :rolleyes: I thought that was common knowledge.

Double Naught Spy
August 5, 2008, 07:38 AM
because I didn't remember a sign that said stay on the path

You probably only passed 6 or 8 of them, but maybe only 4 or 5 if you didn't go to the visitor's center. So much for situational awareness.

MaterDei
August 5, 2008, 07:43 AM
The guy has an asp and a pistol and you're concerned about the asp? If he has a pistol why would you think an asp is overboard?

rc109a
August 5, 2008, 08:15 AM
In the navy the ASP is classified as "less then lethal" weapon. Yes you need training to use it, but so does any other law enforcment agency. I think you need to get your brother and yourself in check before you start worrying about people who are trying to do their jobs and protect some of our vanishing heritage. Give the Ranger a break and read the signs and follow the rules. this way you will not have to "defend" your brother...

doc2rn
August 5, 2008, 08:38 AM
A.lternate
S.ecurity
P.rotection
device

I think that was what they called in riot training I got with the 22 MEU.

P.S. If you are gonna swim in someone else's pool you should abide by their rules and regualtions.

Kharn
August 5, 2008, 08:46 AM
Its been years since I saw a guy in uniform with a badge but no Asp.

Grow up, follow the rules and dont challenge a federal officer's authority unless you want a free room for the night, a visit to the magistrate and a fun conversation with your CO that will be detrimental to your career.

Kharn

SCKimberFan
August 5, 2008, 08:47 AM
I disobey the rules then want to challenge the one charged with enforcing the rules. DOH! :banghead:

bogie
August 5, 2008, 09:10 AM
Guys, guys... Dontcha know...

The asp is colored black.

The asp is TACTICAL!

That makes is more dangerousimus than the average other thingie... Be scared. Be quakin' in your better-damn-sure-be-on-the-trail-so-you-don't-bleep-up-priceless-artifacts boots over the thing!

Heck, I bet he uses it more than the gun. They make dandy attitude adjusters for drunks.

kevindsingleton
August 5, 2008, 09:29 AM
You know, what worries me, is that there's a slim chance that the OP is both a scofflaw and a pilot!

Oh, I will be flying all day tuesday so I won't be able to answer any questions and no I didn't get his name/ badge number.

GRB
August 5, 2008, 10:03 AM
Are you kidding me? You have the nerve to critisize the park ranger because he responded to your brother violating the rules in the park? Then you also have the nerve to indicate the ranger is basically a buff because you note that he had an ASP, in addition to which you note that it upset you. Furthermore you go onto state your training with an ASP. Are you trying to say it is okay for someone in the Navy but not in civilian law enforcement to carry this weapon?

Then you go onto mention no you did not get his badge number! Why on earth would you even consider taking his badge number, or even bring it up here? The officer is carrying what probably is standard issued equipment. I too am a federal LEO. I carry an ASP, pepper spray, a Glock 19, at least 2 extra magazines, a pocket knife, sometimes a belt knife, a flashlight and even handcuffs. Now does that make me an urban mall ninja? Does it mean I am in trouble because maybe you think I am not authorized to carry this stuff.

Anti law enforcement talk like this just amazes me especially when it comes about due to law enforcement responding to a violator who was in the wrong, and the LEO aparently did nothing wrong.

Best regards,
Glenn B

bogie
August 5, 2008, 10:36 AM
I wear black socks occasionally.

GarandOwner
August 5, 2008, 11:40 AM
That's what I'm wondering as well - truth be told, the OP's story doesn't quite make sense in a lot of ways.

Quote:
We were at some ruins and my brother decided that he was not going to follow the signs that said stay on the path and check out a room at a ruin. Well he checks it out and gets back on the trail. About 5 minutes later Park Urban Ninja Ranger comes up.
So he decides to disobey the rules... Great plan.

Quote:
I was too worried defending my brother
From a park ranger? It seems exceedingly odd that you'd feel the need to defend yourself or your brother from a park ranger, unless you were doing something you shouldn't have been.

Oh wait...

Quote:
my brother decided that he was not going to follow the signs that said stay on the path

Quote:
On his belt, he had: a radio, a flashlight, handcuffs, a polymer pistol, and an ASP!!! An maybe some pepper spray/stun gun/taser, not sure about that though.
OH NOES, AN ASP!!1!

Seriously - you see that the guy has handcuffs, a flashlight, a GUN and what may be pepper-spray, and you're worried/concerned about a collapsible baton? That's some crazy sense of priorities you've got there, buddy.

Oh but wait - you're probably peeved because the ranger was, like, totally hassling you, right? Because maybe, just maybe when he asked you both what you had been doing, you said this:

Quote:
I didn't remember a sign that said stay on the path, just not walk on the walls (which, he didn't)
but really meant this:

Quote:
my brother decided that he was not going to follow the signs that said stay on the path
And he caught you in a lie and yelled at you. So you come here and post about nonsense.

Just a thought.

I love it

Double Naught Spy, based on your pictures, I think the Wupatki park services need to reread rule number 4.....

jackdanson
August 5, 2008, 12:14 PM
Park rangers are LEO, just like police. I read somewhere that they are actually assualted MORE often than police due to the fact that people don't have the same respect/attitude for them. Not sure that fact is true, but it is believable. I was considering becoming a MO PR, the qualifications/requirements are the same as the highway patrol.

GRB
August 5, 2008, 01:28 PM
I read somewhere that they are actually assualted MORE often than police due to the fact that people don't have the same respect/attitude for them. If the stat is true it is probably not as much a comparitive lack of respect thing for them as opposed to other LEOs, but rather more likely due to the faact they encounter drunks and stoners more often, and because they encounter large groups of them more often. Just my guess.

SCGirl
August 5, 2008, 01:32 PM
some of these responses really cracked me up!! thanks for laughs, I am having a rough day!

TimboKhan
August 5, 2008, 01:41 PM
So, let me sum up this thread:

1. The OP's brother knowing ignored the rules at a national park.

2. The OP thought it odd that the ranger was carrying an asp, despite his carrying a gun.

3. The OP evidently felt that he somehow needed to "defend" his brother from the park ranger, despite the fact that they were, by his own admission, breaking the rules of the park. In the process, the park ranger has become an urban ninja, regardless of the fact that he is likely a federal officer.

I think that pretty well encapsulates the entire thread. Not to be the high-horse man here, but I triangled this thread for closure.

ArfinGreebly
August 5, 2008, 02:18 PM
Now, there's an idea.

Seems there's little else (besides blood pressure) to be raised here.

We've established that park rangers are LEO, that an ASP is not unusual equipment for an LEO, and that therefore it's probably not out of line for a park ranger to have an ASP.

So, we're all done being surprised by that.

Closing time.

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