Fake Batman foiled by real hero


PDA






JackBurtonJr
August 10, 2008, 03:55 PM
:hattip Powerline

American Airlines mechanic Craig Stutzman was shopping in a Tulsa grocery story when an armed robber with a Batman mask entered the scene.

http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives2/2008/08/021211.php

If you enjoyed reading about "Fake Batman foiled by real hero" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Okee
August 10, 2008, 04:00 PM
Craig Stutzman is a hero!:what:

Fixxxer
August 10, 2008, 04:04 PM
I love how no one helped him till the end.
Bunch of cowards.

Phydeaux642
August 10, 2008, 04:06 PM
I love how no one helped him till the end.
Bunch of cowards.

I was kind of thinking the same thing.

Another knucklehead taken off of the streets (at least for a while).

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
August 10, 2008, 04:08 PM
Yes he is a hero- great job to him.

I view the other customers coming to help him as "too little, too late". When the one guy was on the phone (who later on did help by kicking the perp), he should have been wrestling with him, helping the hero, not talking on the damned phone. That perp could have overpowered our hero, got his gun working, and bad things happen - or at the least could have gotten away. The other guy didn't really do anything. They should have been wrestling, grappling, punching right along with our hero from the word go. Lesson is, if you take on a crook, don't count on anyone else helping you - likely they will just stand and watch, espec. if the bad guy get the better of you.

Prophet
August 10, 2008, 04:12 PM
It really ticks me off that everyone just stood about and watched while he struggled with the guy. He could have been saved that swollen jaw and stitches if everyone else hadn't just stood around with their teeth in their mouths.

Oh well, that's why they call them "heroes"! Worst thing is, that he could have become a dead hero too.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
August 10, 2008, 04:14 PM
Yep. And welcome. :)

Solo Flyer
August 10, 2008, 04:18 PM
Great to see this!Thanks for the post.

Avenger
August 10, 2008, 04:22 PM
I'm assuming that the guy on the phone was calling 911, which is TECHNICALLY the correct thing to do.....if you are a sheeple. He SHOULD have been piling onto the perp and doing some damage, but unfortunately that isn't how most people think today. The rest of the lookie-loos have no excuse whatsoever.

Doggy Daddy
August 10, 2008, 04:37 PM
It felt like the fight went on for quite a while, yet if you look at the clock the police came in less than 3 minutes. Four units. I'd call that a pretty good response by the police.

Goes to show how much can happen in the time between the start of an event and the eventual arrival of the police. Reinforces why we recognize the need to be prepared to defend ourselves.

tuckerdog1
August 10, 2008, 05:16 PM
Oklahoma is a pretty cool place. I hope we don't start seeing media condemning his actions with the usual BS about how he could have further endangered others & himself, by not just allowing the BG to flee.

Bravo for Mr. Stutzman & shame on the others that watched.

Tuckerdog1

rondog
August 10, 2008, 05:24 PM
How is it that these "surveillance camera" videos always seen to magically be able to pan and zoom with the action? Is there actually an operator somewhere running those things?

jad0110
August 10, 2008, 05:27 PM
Guess we know who the sheep dog was! Awesome.

When I watch the video and see the other people standing around, I can't help but also wonder what the heck they were thinking. When I see a car wreck occur right before me, I immediately (safely) pull to the side and see what I can do to help.

Then again, some people do have a valid reason for not jumping in. If any of those people are like my 89 yr old grandfather, the mind and heart would be willing, however he suffers from the effects of post-polio in his legs, so there would be very little he could do. He is tough and healthy otherwise, but he has a hard enough time standing up and walking as it is :(.

So though I'm sure some of those people did not have an excuse, it is difficult to pile on them without knowing them personally.

Titan6
August 10, 2008, 05:31 PM
Holey Batman, Batman!

Given the amazingly consistent number of posts in S&T from THR members that say you should hide or run out the back in exactly this situation is it no surprise that so few people were willing to help?

You can't have it both ways, you either cower or help.

camslam
August 10, 2008, 05:40 PM
That might be one of the most pathetic displays of just how cowardly and weak our nation has become.

Much like many things today, you had 1 courageous, brave, tough, soul battling, while others stood by and watched. Pathetic.

I give the guy props for hanging in there. The other wimps that stood by, should be ashamed. I'm sure they will be telling people how they subdued the guy though. :rolleyes:

The more people stand up to this kind of behavior the better off we'll all be.

Rustynuts
August 10, 2008, 05:41 PM
HArd to say, the first two guys that arrived after the fight started (phone gun and another who seemed to help a little) were probably store employees. The guy on the phone looked a little older and probably couldn't physically handle it. The other seemed to help at first then maybe got called off by the store manager? Probably a bunch of liability cr@p running through their heads, or store policy about fighting, etc. Mob psychology, always hard to determine what will happen.

Guns and more
August 10, 2008, 05:44 PM
Kudo's to the hero, good job. It looked to me that the guy on the phone kicked the gun out the door right to the fight! I'm also impressed how fast the cops showed up too, good job, LEO's!
The other two dudes seemed like they didn't want to help. Masked intruder loses his shirt and mask. Wow.
That mechanic can fix my plane anytime, he knows his sh*t!
I hope AA does something nice for him. Maybe we should all e-mail customer service at AA with a thanks. They do listen.


Follow up: I did e-mail AA. You can follow the path after you go to AA.com. I wanted to do something. Maybe he won't get laid off!

Cosmoline
August 10, 2008, 06:07 PM
I find it amazing how so many feel free to call others "cowards" from the safety of a keyboard. Put up, or shut up.

Titan6
August 10, 2008, 06:12 PM
Cosmo- Don't know if you are talking about me or not but the end of this keyboard ain't exactly safe.

Valkman
August 10, 2008, 06:13 PM
I find it amazing how so many feel free to call others "cowards" from the safety of a keyboard. Put up, or shut up.


Yep, you're a Rambo or a coward anymore. If you're young and feel you should jump into any situation then you also feel everyone else is able and willing to do the same and if not they are "cowards".

Too bad these guys who are always at their keyboards aren't at the scene of these crimes so they could stop them all.

Cosmoline
August 10, 2008, 07:48 PM
Don't know if you are talking about me or not but the end of this keyboard ain't exactly safe.

Then I trust you know the fine line between being brave and being really stupid. Internet chest thumping notwithstanding. I wasn't at this particular event, and AFAIK nobody else on this board was. If the man was making a last-ditch effort to save his life or the lives of others, then more power to him. If he was leaping on an armed man who was literally on his way out the door, then he may have crossed the brave/stupid line. Leaping on someone is the very last option. The thing you do EVERYTHING ELSE to avoid doing. If you can shoot him from safety with a rifle, you do that. If you can't do that you try to get him with a handgun from relative safety. If you can't do that you try to bushwhack him with something really heavy and ideally really sharp to the back of his head, like an axe from sporting goods. It's only if no other option is available and you MUST act to save a life that you leap in with your own body. That option is so fraught with risk and has ended in tragedy so often that we should do all we can to discourage it. I want people to be smart cowards, not brave fools. Do not make it a fair fight. Do not put yourself on the line. Hit the criminal from cover without warning, and by all means shoot him right in the brain. Sneak up behind him and drive an axe right down through his cranium. That's cowardly I suppose, but in the end you walk away and the armed criminal goes in the ground where he belongs. I call that a win. I call what's on the that tape LUCKY.

TO put it another way, life is like Rio Bravo, not High Noon. Shoot from cover and throw dynamite at them LOL

misANTHrope
August 10, 2008, 07:49 PM
About the "cowards"- what if some or all of them had no way of knowing which guy was the robber and which was the good guy?

Please note that I'm not commenting on the likelihood of this, merely pointing out that it's a possibility.

j_slagle
August 10, 2008, 08:16 PM
The guy took a shot at a customer and then his gun jammed.

From The Tulsa World (http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article.aspx?articleID=20080809_11_A1_spancl763864)


"When another customer tried to duck behind a counter, Cleveland fired at him, missing his head by inches, the arrest report states.

The gun then jammed, and Stutzman tackled Cleveland, police said. Store surveillance video shows Stutzman single-handedly fighting to keep a hold on him."

Fixxxer
August 10, 2008, 08:22 PM
I wouldn't of chased the guy, I'd shot him while he was still a threat.

BUT!

The good guy had the suspect on the ground.
Hard part is done, wouldn't take much more to secure the situation with some help.

camslam
August 10, 2008, 08:33 PM
I find it amazing how so many feel free to call others "cowards" from the safety of a keyboard. Put up, or shut up.

Cosmo: Every situation is different, but if you are ABLE to help out in that type of situation and you leave a guy to fight with a bad guy for almost 2 minutes by himself, something either isn't wired right in your brain, or you are a coward. Yes the internet makes plenty of people tough, and I am sure those of us that make these assertions, some have been there and had to do something and others may have not. I have been in situations where I had to step in and take action and it wasn't because I am a tough guy, or a vigilante, or a wanna be hero, or anything else. It is because it was the right thing to do.

Those that make the claim they would do something, may not when the time comes, but I'll take their verbal commitment for the time being, because that is better than nothing. Like I said, if you are ABLE to help in that situation and you don't, pathetic!

About the "cowards"- what if some or all of them had no way of knowing which guy was the robber and which was the good guy?

Please note that I'm not commenting on the likelihood of this, merely pointing out that it's a possibility.

Misanthrope: I hear what you are saying, but that is far from what happened here. The criminal was trying to run and do whatever he could to get away. Plus, the video shows that he was in the store in direct light, directing people to move in certain directions. This is just another case of cowardly inaction, which is becoming way, way too regular in our "great society". :uhoh:

The_Sheriff
August 10, 2008, 08:40 PM
I can't beleive that nobody helped him until the very end! That's why we need guns!

psyopspec
August 10, 2008, 08:52 PM
Reinforces why we recognize the need to be prepared to defend ourselves.

And the first key to that is mindset. Check out the original article quoted on www.powerlineblog.com (then put the site in your favorite, cause it's amazing). Had nothing to do with caliber, self defense style, or number of hours spend spreading machismo on the internet.

Guess we know who the sheep dog was!
This wasn't done in the interest of protecting a "flock." See the original article or the quotes in the blog cited above.

Nobody's_Hero
August 10, 2008, 09:48 PM
Regardless of whether or not the bystanders should have/could have helped, it is refreshing to see someone fight back from time to time.

Georgia Gunner
August 10, 2008, 10:16 PM
I love to see someone fight back!

Also does anyone know what gun the robber used?

Drgong
August 10, 2008, 11:10 PM
I will say one thing, when you have something happen like this, what you think you would do, and what you would do are may not be the same.

There was a case I was involved in where a drunk guy was in a dorm, being asked to leave, when he broke the bottle he had and cut a RA (Resident Assistant) across the face. There where a number of people there, many of them who one would expect was tough. Being a college campus of course we where unarmed as after all, a badguy would not use a weapon on campus....

anyways, when this happened, the smallest female ran to the phone to call 911, and the smallest guy tackled and beat the crap out of the guy who assaulted the RA. A number of guys, including one guy who was 6'5 and 300 pounds just stood there going "OMG".

It was kinda sad, the two smallest people did what was right, and the others just stood there.

(saddest thing was there was a school administrator who wanted to suspend the student who tackled the assailant... )

I will be the first to admit that most likely I would not have been the first to jump the guy, but once I saw someone tackle him, I would of tried to go after him till my back gave out. )

If you enjoyed reading about "Fake Batman foiled by real hero" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!