[The Tourist]

When we Razel owners talk about the service we get from these knives it often sounds like we're building log cabins or punching through automobile hoods. But the knife has uses for the regular-joe, and it's very useful for those average problems.

Now you may find this hard to believe, but there is a lot of leather at my house. We buy protectants like some folks buy breakfast cereal. The owner of Cecil's Sandal and Repair Shop knows my wife and I by our first names--even the sound of my bike.

One pair of my riding boots needed a spiff-up, so this morning I grabbed a can of saddle-soap. We foolishly keep it under the sink, next to the dishwasher, and with that moisture it appears that the lid did not seal properly.

I opened the can to a growth of fungus. And for those of you familiar with saddle-soap, it dries to a hard waxy puck. Now, I said to myself, "Myself, what I need is a strong, yet small and strong knife to carve off the fungus, but oh, my, what shall I use! I'm so frightened!"

Then I remembered *bing bonk head slap* I'm a Razel owner!

I made a few quick and certain slices with my smaller Stubby Razel, and within minutes I was a-soapin' the place up.

A minor problem to be sure, but a common one. The Razel was right there, handy, efficient and truly the correct tool.

So the next time there's a ruckus at your favorite Perkins and you see a biker standing over a fallen townie, don't be surprised to hear, "Oh, you've crushed my spleen, but those boots are beautiful..!"

Once again, the Razel to the rescue!

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb231/TheTourist_bucket/DSC00339.jpg

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb231/TheTourist_bucket/DSC00340.jpg

[Mongrel]

What biker is gonna carve a wittle bit 'o fungi off his saddle soap? :rolleyes:

What'd you say you ride a (edit: removed the word "Vespa") edit\insert: BMW?

:evil:

runs...

ducks...

hides...

ducks further...

(I can't believe I just typed this...:what:)

good report, now show us those boots when ur done!

[The Tourist]

Obviously you didn't see me spread it on my toast...

Actually, not knowing much about fungus, seriously, I didn't want it on my leather.

[Mongrel]

Probably 'athletes foot fungus' in the raw...

Just kidding with you man. I wouldn't want the stuff on my boots either.

Were you serious about wanting my address? :uhoh:

:neener:

(slow afternoon)

[bikerdoc]

Im convinced. My boots need work, and I hate fungus.
Gonna get two.
One for the wife since she decided to scrape and repaint the front door and tried to use, in this order, my randall, a mitre saw,(dont ask) 20 grit on a belt sander. (again dont ask), and a tourch.
New door coming tues.

[The Tourist]

Your address? Yikes, that's just what I need, another critic in a double-wide...:neener:

Bikerdoc, I don't do 'hype.' These knives have literally blown me away. Even the licensed copies from CRKT are sharp and tough. Yeah, a bit pricey. But hey, I went down to Harley this aft to price out one of those upgrade high performance oil pumps for a 2004. (Part number--25283-07). That costs 430 bucks. We pay that to save an engine. For that same price, a Razel can save your life.

Get one, blood. Then you come tell me.

Here are the shined boots. Fit me like a glove.

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb231/TheTourist_bucket/DSC00341.jpg

[bikerdoc]

Tourist I notice you dont have the ring ? Any advantage to getting one with the ring.

[Mongrel]

Quick question\suggestion...

Do the Graham Bros offer their Razels in a 'left hand' version?

Looking at your Razel as it is in the pic, I'm thinking I'd rather have it the reverse of what it is.

Also, do they offer it with an ambidextrous handle or only with the finger indents on one side?

The way your Razel looks, it seems that it would work better for a lefty. And I just realized why it has looked so awkward to me...it's 'upside down'...

Just thinking...

ps-looks like those boot are *almost* there...heheh

[Carl Levitian]

And just what is wrong with a Vespa, Mongrel? ( a little edgy here!)

Both my better half and I ride and love our PX150's, and love them. I've been a Vespa fan since I was a teenager in the 50's. I have very fond memories of a certain beat up old white 125 that got me around Washington D.C. to smoky coffee houses at the hight of the beatnik period. Now we just cruise country roads.

[Mongrel]

Now wait a minute Carl! :banghead:

The Vespa isn't the issue-it's the fungus! :scrutiny:

Let's see, what is a PC method of transportation that can be used as a friendly jab in the ribs of a Biker, but won't offend a scooter rider?

:confused:

hmmm....let's see...

I know...:p

be back in a flash have to edit my post above....

Is that better?

:D

[hso]

'left hand' version:scrutiny:

The Stubby (or any of the Razels) is not a "chisel" grind therefore there is no left or right hand version.

Want a ringed version?
http://www.grahamknives.com/stubby_ringed_small.jpg

I think about $210 from the Graham Brothers.

[Mongrel]

hso-

So that thing there on the 'front' of the 'tool' is not a chisel grind (single bevel)?

[Mongrel]

err...

Isn't the 'front' of the Razel a single-bevel and the 'bottom' or the Razel a regular double-bevel gind?

Isn't this why the Razel is so unique and offers much more utility than a 'normal' single edged tool?

And if it is...

Am I 'wrong' to have a preference for it to be configured the opposite way?

:confused:

[The Tourist]

Tourist I notice you dont have the ring ? Any advantage to getting one with the ring.

I actually have three of the things. Two full size with rings, and one Stubby without. I bought the Stubby just for times when it's easy to carry something smaller. Both of my Graham Brothers knives, big and small, are made from S30V, with a HT by Paul Bos. Strength, cut, edge retention, all the same.

Truth be told, I am getting Stubby with a ring. I'm thinking of some type of jacket carry or for when I have to sit for a long period--like three hours on Betty.

The way your Razel looks, it seems that it would work better for a lefty.

They are actually double bevel, not chisel ground. A duplicate on both sides.

As for the boots being *almost* there, trust me, the flash washed them out a bit. They are black and shiny. Like I tell my enemies, "They shine like brass, they show my class and they will kick your azz..."

http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb231/TheTourist_bucket/DSC00231.jpg

[wheelgunslinger]

Kawasaki anything.
Kawi is the worst (quality wise) make of Asian makers (still not bad though), but still an affront to hardcore H-D riders.

For example:
You: "Hey Tourist, I didn't know you rode a Vulcan 2000?"
Tourist: "What?" *punch*

No need to impune Vespa's good name. :neener:

Hey Tourist do they give you discount on those H-D logo boots? :)

[Mongrel]

They are actually double bevel, not chisel ground. A duplicate on both sides

ahhh...OK...my mistake.

All this time I'm thinking that the 'front' of the Razels is setup like a standard single bevel chisel, while the lower portion is like a flat ground blade.

Okey dokey...

Well I would -1 point for the lack of a chisel edge but +1 point because you can use it the same with either hand...

I am awaiting one of these to test drive. Perhaps it would be best for me to keep me ole mouth shut until I see it in person...

[hso]

not a "chisel" grind therefore there is no left or right hand version.

No chisel grinds on the Razels. Not on the belly, not on the back, not on the tip.

Am I 'wrong' to have a preference for it to be configured the opposite way?

Wrong? It's just a knife. There's not much "right" or "wrong" involved. It is only what it is. What do you mean by "opposite"?

I'm also not sure you could get a single bevel tip to work with a double bevel edge. They wouldn't exactly meet up. Even the interesting "Besh" doesn't attempt it.

[Dionysusigma]

Strange request...

Could someone show the other side of the Razel? :confused:

Every picture, everywhere, is of the same direction (handle right, edge down), or variation thereof.

[The Tourist]

Hey Tourist do they give you discount on those H-D logo boots?

Seriously, I like things that work. The woman at Sauk Prairie HD made certain I got a good fit. Thinner foot, wider calves and ankles from lifting. Took her 45 minutes to it right. (I now have three pairs of their boots.)

I live in their shirts. I cannot ever remember throwing one away.

People might thumb their noses at many of the "Chinese" tags, but HD makes sure the stuff works. Their T-shirts are thicker, their jeans are like we used to wear in the 1960s, their leather jackets wear forever.

Charge me if you must, but deliver.

How does this relate to this thread and knives? This is why I'm proud to say I carry the Razel. Josh builds it right. In fact, I just sent him an e-mail to buy another knife. And I have a perpetual order for his first folders.

I am a Strider client. I am an Emerson client. I will be a Valkman client.

Notice a pattern?

(A Vespa is a good product. I use one to run the lights on my Harley.)

[Mongrel]

Wrong? It's just a knife. There's not much "right" or "wrong" involved. It is only what it is. What do you mean by "opposite"?

Maybe Carl's post has made me a little too sensitive...:p

When I read your post to 'me' what I heard in my head was:

"Jackass, the Razel doesn't have a chisel grind". :cuss:

That's what triggered my little pondering...:confused:

Why did I think it did? Well, all the descriptions of it that I have read, including the one on the Graham Bros page use the word "chisel" in them when they describe it. Obvsiously looking at it, it certainly *looks* like it would be ground like a chisel up front.

As far a making both edges work, well, if you look at the grind lines it *could* work if you just don't try and get them to line up with each other. Just leave it flat in between on the back side. Easy to draw it on paper for me, but not so easy to describe it unfortunately.

Originally I was somewhat intrigued by the utility of having a true single-bevel chisel grind on the front. Now that I know that it's not a *true* single-bevel chisel, my interest has waned a bit.

A chisel (single-bevel that is) is designed the way it is so that you can control the cut. Having a double bevel just made it a knife-it is no longer a chisel if it is double ground. That's OK, but I think we should stop describing it as a 'chisel'.

Anyway, not trying to stir up the water, just asking questions and thinking out loud...

And-pictures would be great!

[hso]

I still can't "see" the chisel tip lining up to meet the double bevel forward at the tip to form a point. The chisel edge lies in a plane on the left or right of the original blank while the double bevel lies down the middle of the original blank. I can't see them meeting a the tip without taking an angle from the chisel to the end of the edge. That I can see in my head.

I just remembered that Blackjack did something just like that with a dive tool they made. Double bevel "edge" with a chisel tip. I think Ray Ennis makes something similar also. So, the concept of the Razel has existed before, but in much larger fixed blade knives that were focused on dive tools instead of pocket sheath knives.

[hso]

Here's Ray's knife.
http://www.ennis-entrekusa.com/images/diver3.JPG

Here's Ethan's knife.
http://www.fernknives.com/images/BK-BK3medium.gif

See how both of them had to put that "step" in the edge to get the chisel tip to "meet" the double bevel edge?

[The Tourist]

hso, actually think about it as two chisels, laying /| |\ atop one another, flat side to flat side.

When I scrape something, I am actually laying the knife on the bevel, like I would lay it on a stone to sharpen it. The leading edge is /_ just as a normal chisel would be positioned to scrape.

Personally, I cannot tell the difference between a Razel and a chisel when I scrape. I could probably use it as a putty knife. I once used it to spread butter at a restaurant using the chisel end and the spine. It worked just fine.

[wheelgunslinger]

Charge me if you must, but deliver.

I totally agree with your ethos. Which is why I like Hein Gericke jackets, and used to be a Firstgear customer before they were bought by another company a couple of years ago.

I used to sell bikes for a living and really had a hard time convincing people to buy quality gear. Lots of guys would buy junk gear that looked cool or say they could just go to a mall retailer like Wilson Leather and buy a moto-worthy jacket.

Me? I like quality stuff too and apply that ethos to all my hobbies and vocations.
And, I'm happy that you've talked so much here about the Razel, since I've been looking at them for a while now.
I work too hard for my money to buy cheap junk. Guess you do too.

ETA: If you're forking out big money for boots (and you should) you should be getting fitted. I'm a lifelong backpacker and motorcyclist and can't tell you how many people wear cheapo hi-techs until they find out how much better good boots are for you even if all you do is go to work and stand around in them. My feet are now 11.5 4E, so I have to have boots made, but it's worth it. (I started out at 17 as a 10 E but have hiked a lot o miles)

[Carl Levitian]

Stuff that that really works is nice. I've had a Schott bomber jacket for a bit over 20 years. Still going strong. Good design and good materials will show up over the test of time. A good knife made of good materials should last a lifetime barring misuse of loss.

It's nice to find something good these days of mediocrity that you can feel loyal to.

( side note; Since 1946, Piaggio has made more Vespa's than Harley has made motorcycles since 1903.:D)

[conwict]

When I see a man this enamored of a tool...:scrutiny:

I begin to worry that he'll have a horrible accident whilst fondling it in the bathroom.

It happens....don't ask how I know:uhoh:

:neener:

[hso]

TT,

I understand how to use the tip as a chisel even if it doesn't have a chisel grind. That's not at issue.

The geometry of a chisel "tip" with a double bevel "edge" perpendicular to it requires a step between the two to allow them to meet in anything other than an abrupt offset.

That's how Ethan and Ray dealt with it years ago with their bigger knives. The intermediate "step" between the chisel tip and the double bevel edge.

The Razels have no need to do this since they are not a true chisel grind on the tip.

[The Tourist]

hso, ahhh, a chisel is not to be confused with a chisel grind.

But consider this. If you continued to grind further back on one of the front planes which goes onto to become the double bevel, you would in fact have a chisel and straight grind lines--no step.

[CZ.22]

Motorcycles, scooters, when will you people realise that automobiles are the best way to get around.

(Ducks head as Tourist grabs his Razel and Carl grabs, well, whateverr Carl carries)

[hso]

If you continued to grind further back on one of the front planes which goes onto to become the double bevel, you would in fact have a chisel and straight grind lines--no step.

Chico, can't "see" it. All I see is that by creating a chisel ground tip by grinding the side away to meet the front edge on a Razel you end up with a chisel ground knife edge also. You essentially grind away the other bevel. I "see" a wire frame drawing in my mind's eye and every attempt I make to change it to a chisel ground tip with a double bevel knife edge requires that step between the edge and tip. Such are the limitations of the internet forum in the absence of cad drawings.

[The Tourist]

I was envisioning the knife is the sense that it is now. That is, the belly bevel is left as it is on a traditional knife.

Then Josh picks a side, and grinds on that plane until he creates a chisel profile simply by meeting the obverse side.

Now, having said that, I see no advantage. With a few minutes and a bit of paste, I can take the existing front chisel and give it a mirror finish.

However, the original design is to create a chisel and a razor, not a razor and a perpendicular razor.

A wood chisel should probably be razor sharp. But after seeing the clients who buy Josh's products and the uses, I have to believe that the design is meant to slice, and then scrape and pry.

[sm]

<Dr. Pepper, Popcorn, Marlboro Red, Zippo - I ready!>

The nth degree, is the nth degree, and while one chases this degree, they will never attain it, as humans simply cannot grasp the concept. If in theory they did, they would not know how to carry on with "life" as we humans define "life".

The reality is, everything has been discovered, just humans re-discover it.

The answer is in the question.

Why does a hand engraver not put a polished edge on a graver?

How come a butcher can break down more boxes in the freezer area than in the room temperature area with the same knife?

Why does a seasoned fisherman get more fish cut in the North Atlantic than he /she does in a Tropical setting?

How come the sharpest shave a barber gives, is that first shave, from a razor, that sat over the Sunday and Monday he was closed and that razor sat in a glass box with a Tuberculosis light, and he did not strop it before shaving with it ?

Diamonds have the greatest refraction of light of any gemstone, how are they cut and polished?
Which type of cut presents the best refraction of light and allows the diamond to give off what it does - to the best of "human" ability now.


Why does a scalpel stay sharper in a Operation Room Theatre, than if used in room temperature?


Hint: There ain't no nth, there are degrees for tools for tasks that work best .

Hint II.
Find a old seasoned hand engraver, and look at his/her gravers, sharpened by hand. Look at a 44 Flat, and ask yourself if it does not remind one of a Razel.

Do [U]not look at the 44 Flat sharpened using a Doo-Dad.
The key is in the 44 Flat sharpened by hand.


<eats popcorn, sips soda, grins>