Legal Means of SD?


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The_Sheriff
August 15, 2008, 08:54 PM
Hi THR members,

I just got done being lectured by a THR member about how terrible of a person I am because I asked about ways of CCW and now I know that legally I cannot carry a gun (underaged). Anyways I was curious to what other options are out there. I didn't put this in the non weapons section becuase I thought maybe there was someway somehow that I could have one say in arms reach or whatever.


Thanks

BTW I am in Phoenix, AZ if it makes a difference.

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Justin
August 15, 2008, 08:58 PM
I just got done being lectured by a THR member about how terrible of a person I am because I asked about ways of CCW and now I know that legally I cannot carry a gun (underaged).

For the sake of clarity, you were lectured because you claimed to already possess a concealed carry permit despite the fact that you're only 15. (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=4438112#post4438112)

You have also claimed that both you and your father have had "adult handgun classe's (sic) and law enforcement training" (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=4572695#post4572695) but that despite this, you don't know your local or state laws with regard to carrying a firearm in public. Anyone who's been to even a rudimentary defensive pistol course should have learned how the laws apply to them, or at least have been made aware of resources for finding out the legalities of personal defense and firearms.

It's clear that you don't have nearly the experience that you claim. We're all here to learn, but if you don't drop the wannabe facade and start listening to what others with more experience have to say it's likely to do you no good and result in many people being angry with you.

The_Sheriff
August 15, 2008, 09:01 PM
haha once again I DO NOT have a permit. My dad does but does not CCW. Also you would understand the rest if you read some of the PM's he sent. Moving on ---- any comments on legal means???

Mot45acp
August 15, 2008, 09:03 PM
Makes me wonder about the rest of the posts?

BTW if you edit it it will show the true nature of your character.

Everyone here has done and said some stupid stuff at the age of 15. That doesnt make them bad people. It is not how bad you screw up, it is how you learn and recover from said screw up. Unless you repeat said screw ups.

Man up, you said it, (I checked) apologize and get on with life. Its not the end of the world.

This is coming from someone who has gone a round or 2 with a moderator or 3.:o

This is a private forum (someone else's house) respect their wishes on how they expect their guests to behave.

Huddog
August 15, 2008, 09:03 PM
At 15 you have no known way of carrying a gun or having one within reach. Unfortunately for you the only way to measure maturity level on a grand scale is by age. I happen to know a young man (my son) who I would have trusted to obtain his ccw at the age of 16 because of his maturity. However, I also know many 30+ year olds whose maturity level would preclude them obtaining a permit but their age allows them to do so. Don't try to grow up too fast. Your day will come. Go shooting with adults, learn safety and chose wisely.

Huddog
August 15, 2008, 09:05 PM
I expect the lock will come soon and rightly so.

Justin
August 15, 2008, 09:07 PM
haha once again I DO NOT have a permit.

Then why did you claim to have one? The record of your statement is available to anyone willing to click on the first link in my post.

The_Sheriff
August 15, 2008, 09:10 PM
Is there anyway that I can change it? Please let me know or can you just close the thread completely?


Thanks

Justin
August 15, 2008, 09:17 PM
You can go back and edit the post as you wish, and since I'm about to log off for the weekend, it's unlikely that I would be able to restore the original from backup until Monday.

But that is neither here nor there.

The bottom line is that you lied to everyone on this forum, and when caught and confronted with your lie, you offered neither a reason nor an apology.

In fact, all of your actions have shown that you don't quite understand the depth of your transgression, and that rather than making with the contrition you simply wish to pretend as if your lies were never spoken in the first place.

While you're certainly not the first, nor will you be the last liar to post on this forum, you've easily marked yourself as either one of the most brazen or clueless.

FCFC
August 15, 2008, 09:18 PM
Questions from 15-year olds about self defense are....difficult to consider.

The_Sheriff
August 15, 2008, 09:20 PM
I understand, but you never know. Why do you have the right to self defense but I don't? Isn't that what we stand up against? Let me guess, it's different!

Crunker1337
August 15, 2008, 09:21 PM
IIRC, in Vermont, some 16 year olds may be allowed to concealed carry, but as for Arizona... well, it's a fairly free state, so you may be able to openly carry at the age of 18. Check AZ state gun laws at the NRA's site.

Justin
August 15, 2008, 09:26 PM
I understand, but you never know. Why do you have the right to self defense but I don't? Isn't that what we stand up against? Let me guess, it's different!

I've said nothing of the sort, and you're attempting to obfuscate the matter. Nowhere have I claimed that you do not have a right to self defense. Or even self defense with a firearm.

However, given your conduct on this forum, at this point I'm hard pressed to see how you could possibly possess the maturity to properly handle lethal force.

Had you appeared on the board, representing yourself as you truly are (a fifteen year old with an interest in shooting and learning about self defense) we wouldn't be having this discussion right now.

SCKimberFan
August 15, 2008, 09:32 PM
Why questions can only be answered by those who create the laws.

My presumption is that most 15/16 year olds are not mature enough to make a life & death decision in a split second. Shoot many who are a lot older don't have that level of maturity.

I am sure that in AZ you are not legal to do much of anything, ie: drive, vote, serve in the military and certainly not able to purchase alcohol.

You are under the charge of an adult, who has been given the job of protecting you.

You have the right to self defense, just not with a firearm (outside of the home).

goon
August 15, 2008, 09:34 PM
Is there anyway that I can change it? Please let me know or can you just close the thread completely?

You mean this thread or the other one?


Hello everyone!
I am a CCW holder and need to find a way to conceal my glock m-22 .40 S&W wearing cowboy clothing i.e - tucked in button down shirt, wrangler jeans, boots etc. any suggestions?

Or maybe this...

Thanks for the help everyone! I have decided on wearing my Glock in the winter on my waistband and putting my taurus 85 snub nose in a pocket holster or inside my boot during the summer.

I'm entirely in agreement with Justin on this one.
You lied to everyone about being a CCW holder.
I and others on this board have given you advice and shared our experiences with you a number of times. In return for that, you lie to us and then ask us to help you figure out ways that you can get around the law and carry a gun.
What you're doing is not the conduct of a responsible adult. It's not even the conduct of a responsible teenager. Even if I did know of some way for you to be able to legally keep a gun within arm's reach, I wouldn't tell you.
You ARE NOT responsible enough to handle a firearm in that capacity.

Actually, I hope the Mods leave this thread open forever. I'd bet money that a lot of guys on here are going to want to take you for the internet version of a trip to the woodshed.
And you deserve it.

SCKimberFan
August 15, 2008, 09:39 PM
I'm wondering...

are you related to Gecko45?

markk
August 15, 2008, 09:57 PM
And you claim to be 28 in your profile...

kingpin008
August 15, 2008, 10:05 PM
Wow. Epic Fail for The Sherriff. :D

Brought it on yourself, kid. We would have been more than happy to help, had you not tried to play us for suckers. Heck, even if you did, you could have owned up to it and apologized, and we probably would have given you a break.

Now..

Well, perhaps you oughta come back when you're a little older, or know how to conduct yourself.

Treo
August 15, 2008, 10:10 PM
Hey guys I think he's got the idea. Just how long will the beatings continue?

bogie
August 15, 2008, 10:18 PM
You can get a permit at age 15, but only after you complete your Navy Seel training.

Huddog
August 15, 2008, 10:21 PM
He's got he idea but only time will tell if the idea creates a change in behavior.

markk
August 15, 2008, 10:26 PM
Actually, his non-answers to Justin's posts tell me that he doesn't really "get it" and he just feels that if we would all stop talking about it, it would just go away.

Jeff White
August 15, 2008, 11:13 PM
A while back there was a thread in S&T about a home invasion in Orlando. http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=376628

Several members suggested routinely arming young teens and preteens and expecting them to engage in a gunfight with the intruders.

I hope after reading this thread everyone who recommended that rethinks their position. It takes a certain level of maturity to handle firearms and self defense situations. I think we have a perfect example of why early teens and preteens might not possess that maturity.

Jeff

kingpin008
August 15, 2008, 11:19 PM
Hey guys I think he's got the idea. Just how long will the beatings continue?

I dunno. How long was he lying to us?

guntotinguy
August 15, 2008, 11:22 PM
I fully agree with Jeffs statement here,being a father of those who have already 'left the nest' and on with their lives,I might mention that I wouldnt let my kids,under the legal age 'handle a firearm' unless it was with me there or under a person who was a 'proven instructor'.

Responsibility and truth often walk hand in hand...it 'shows character' and the ability,with maturity,to handle a gun safely...I cant comment on a legality since not in the legal field.

FCFC
August 15, 2008, 11:37 PM
I hope after reading this thread everyone who recommended that rethinks their position. It takes a certain level of maturity to handle firearms and self defense situations. I think we have a perfect example of why early teens and preteens might not possess that maturity.
I agree except I'd change that to probably.

I'm reminded of the recent THR thread where some kid had his guns taken away from him by his grandmother who he was living with and had discovered them somehow. At grandma's insistance, the guns were secured by his dad, who apparently got them in the first place.

Anyway, the kid reported that he managed to hide out a Bersa .380 and asked for help on what to do.

Sadly, several THRers advised him on keeping the Bersa. :uhoh:

Ahh, here it is:

:mad:Guns got taken away!
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=379117

Here's what one THRer said:

Should I keep the Bersa?

And your mouth shut. As long as it's legal for you to be in possession I'd keep very quiet about it and keep it well hidden from grandma.

If you're 15 you might want to make sure your state is OK with you having a handgun. Don't want to get into trouble over something minor that could haunt you your whole life.

Crunker1337
August 15, 2008, 11:39 PM
Yeah, because gun confiscation is bad, unless it happens to a kid by an older family member...

markk
August 15, 2008, 11:40 PM
I'm reminded of the recent THR thread where some kid had his guns taken away from him by his grandmother who he was living with. The guns were secured by his dad, who apparently got them in the first place.

Anyway, the kid reported that he managed to hide out a Bersa .380 and asked for help on what to do.

Sadly, several THRers advised him on keeping the Bersa.

Would you be surprised to learn that that person and the OP of this thread are one and the same?

FCFC
August 15, 2008, 11:53 PM
I would be shocked, shocked I tell you...

;)

bogie
August 16, 2008, 12:12 AM
The person, the advisor, and maybe some guy sitting in a cube farm, collecting tidbits of completely and utterly stupid advice from the internet, which will then end up in some sort of Brady-sponsored documentary.

I mean, I can't hardly believe some of the stupid questions and statements I've seen lately, but some of the advice and answers is on the far side of -sheesh-.

goon
August 16, 2008, 12:22 AM
Oddly enough, many of us advised him to tell the truth then too.
Little good that did anyone...

But at least now we understand why the guns were taken away.
Gotta say, now I don't blame his grandma at all for spearheading the effort to disarm him.

The_Sheriff
August 16, 2008, 12:25 AM
Hi everyone,

It's me again, I appologize for my remarks earlier. I see that you guys saw the thread of my guns being taken away. Well some THR members suggested that I hide my guns, I decided that it was not wise and gave the gun to my dad. He locked it up with his guns and later I got my rifles back so I could go hunting. Please guys! You only took a few words out of that story. I advise you to read through and see what I really did. I even PM'd a few people afterwards and let them know. Say what you want to say, please look at the date of that thread, it was a while ago!

Anyways I consider myself to be very responsible, I volunteered for a 7 day 12 hours I beleive in total hunters education course, I am an NRA member and hunting and guns are my passion. Please let me be!

Everyone is getting all hyped up like a pack of liberal anti gun activists becuase of me puting that I had a CCW permit in a post about 3 months ago when I didn't know what the law is and was just starting to get active on THR, my dad DOES have a permit I DO NOT. I have never broken the law EVER!

FCFC
August 16, 2008, 12:28 AM
Oddly enough, many of us advised him to tell the truth then too.
Little good that did anyone...
It did me good, goon. I just reread the thread and was happy that so many THRers were practical and reasonable about their adivice. That advice offset the questionable stuff from the gun first/gun always crowd.


But at least now we understand why the guns were taken away.
Gotta say, now I don't blame his grandma at all for spearheading the effort to disarm him.
LOTS of posters in the prior thread dissed the grandma....

The_Sheriff
August 16, 2008, 12:30 AM
Like I said, I did the good and honest thing.

markk
August 16, 2008, 12:33 AM
How are we to know what you did.

You've already proven yourself to be a liar, and, when confronted with this fact you continue to dance around it and attempt to minimize it.

The_Sheriff
August 16, 2008, 12:34 AM
Ok, well obviously I can't win so beleive whatever you want. I am just telling you what I did.

Mot45acp
August 16, 2008, 01:17 AM
FCFC said:

Sadly, several THRers advised him on keeping the Bersa.
then
It did me good, goon. I just reread the thread and was happy that so many THRers were practical and reasonable about their adivice. That advice offset the questionable stuff from the gun first/gun always crowd.


Then why focus on the negative? Then leave the positive out till called on it? (reversing yourself)

After reading the thread TexasRifleman's quote had a disclaimer:


If you're 15 you might want to make sure your state is OK with you having a handgun. Don't want to get into trouble over something minor that could haunt you your whole life.

Then after receiving more details TexasRifleman said:


If that's not the case then no, don't hide it.

But, if dad gave him the Bersa but hasn't asked for it back specifically, that says a lot in my opinion.

Sheriff just needs to be really careful here, one wrong move could impact his ability to own firearms for the rest of his life, as well as other things.

So a disclaimer, then reiterating the disclaimer and advising against it.

TexasRifleman has been a longtime member who has contributed to this forum on several levels.

I am basing this strictly on his post. I have never met or had a conversation with him. I just consider him a valued member of this community.

Matt G
August 16, 2008, 01:29 AM
Closed for thread drift and personal attacks.

Those who made the attacks might actually be correct, but this isn't the place for it.

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