[Bob Locke]

Didn't see this posted yet.

Prosecutor drops charges in shooting of 4 officers (http://www.sunspot.net/news/local/bal-charges0107,0,5724516.story?coll=bal%2)

[Blackhawk]

Homeowner: 5 hits for 6 shots.

Police: 0 hits for ? shots.

Cauthorne's lawyer, Warren A. Brown, said the decision by prosecutors to drop charges against Cauthorne sends a message that the criminal justice system can be fair. Yes, and Clinton can tell the truth.

Life would be so much simpler if everybody would just follow the rules.

[Tamara]

While the law requires them to identify themselves, police are often hesitant to knock and tell residents that they are police officers.

Well, ya know, I hate that for you, buddy. I hear you don't have to do that in North Korea...

[rock jock]

Investigators concluded detectives did not announce that they were police just before smashing down Cauthorne's door with a battering ram and rushing in to look for drugs
And yelling the word "Police!" would have made it allright? I feel much better.

Acting Police Commissioner John McEntee said today he opposed the decision by prosecutors.
Of course, his officers are obviously infallible.

The bullets hit Robert J. Adams in the right thigh and arm, Officer Michael H. Smith in the right leg, Officer James S. Guzie in the left shin and Officer Steven Henson in the left hand.
Mr. Cauthorne needs to work on his aim.

[pax]

Legal documents also point out other problems that were identified in connection with the raid. For instance, crime lab technicians were told not to take photographs of the drugs, and there is no record of where the drugs were recovered in the house.
Well, now, that gives me a lot of confidence in their professionalism. Did someone just drop a dime bag somewhere? Or were the items truly recovered from the scene and neither photographed nor recorded in any other way?

As I said before on the other no-knock thread, I know it distresses some of my LEO friends to hear that good citizens would shoot back at anyone who crashes through the front door. The LEOs are always quick to stress how incredibly, unbelievably, unfreakingbelievably rare this sort of thing is.

If that's the case, why's it bother them to know that some of us would shoot back?

I tell you: it's because it's not rare enough.

pax

What sane person could live in this world and not be crazy? -- Ursula K. LeGuin

[joeislove]

Mr. Cauthorne needs to work on his aim.
The article said they only saw his arm reaching around a wall, so it appears he was firing blind from cover. If true, I'd say his aim was pretty good. Must have been using the Force.

I've heard a lot of stories about criminals invading a home and yelling "Police!" to confuse the victims.

Shouldn't you be allowed to ask for ID before someone barges into your home? Doesn't this kind of thing fall into the category of "unlawful search" somehow?

[Sergeant Bob]

Police raided the house at 8:55 p.m. with a search warrant after they were told by an anonymous source that drugs were being sold out of the home, in the 1000 block of Cameron Road.
No knock raid on an anonymous tip?
The raid yielded six bags with trace amounts of marijuana, empty vials, a razor with cocaine residue and two scales, documents show.
Cauthorne, who had no arrest record, was not charged with any drug crimes.
At least the Prosecutor has some smarts. He would have ended up looking like a complete fool had he decided to pursue this one.
As it is, only the cops look like idiots. Keystone Cops?

[DadOfThree]

The article said they only saw his arm reaching around a wall, so it appears he was firing blind from cover
New category for competition.. Zen Target Shooting.

Doesn't this kind of thing fall into the category of "unlawful search" somehow?
No. You see if you pass a law that says it's legal, it's no longer "unlawful search" :banghead:

[JPM70535]

AFAIK, the only authorized "NO KNOCK" entry to a residence can be made by Bail Enforcement Agents in the execution of a broken contract (Fail to appear,violating bail contract). Police must announce their presence even during the execution of a No Knock warrant.

I can't imagine any LEO breaking down the door of a suspected drug dealers residence without first announcing their bonifides.
Officer safety should clearly dictate this. It is not unheard of for rival drug dealers to rip off the competition, and just as any law abiding citizen would do, the homeowner (suspect) shoots the B&E participants. Not a problem as I see it.


From the other side of the coin, Police put their life on the line every time they conduct a drug raid. Drug dealers are notoriously protective of their investment, and quite often respond with violence when their livelihood is threatened. It is in the best interest of the raid team to execute the warrant as rapidly as possible to minimize the time available to the suspect(s) to react.
If in fact, the raid team failed to announce their presence as POLICE, then the shootings were justified, but if the announcement was made concurrent with the entry then the shootings may not be so rightous. The detectives were foolish not to have been wearing RAID JACKETS with their agency , POLICE, FBI, DEA, etc prominantly displayed.

Honestly, I don't know how I would have reacted to this situation, but I strongly suspect that if I did not hear the words "POLICE-SEARCH WARRANT" and see POLICE jackets,I would have reacted the same as the homeowner only I suspect there would been several fatalities involved.

JMHO

[shootist2121]

JPM70535....Anyone ...AND I MEAN ANYONE can purchase the so call jackets or vests that say "Police, FBI, Etc." from numerous catalogs. No questions asked...Even badges that in the dark of night with fear running through your soul would look legit.

This whole nija turtle thing and plain clothes raids will eventually get more officers killed by civilians who have been beaten to death by the media to fear the night and every breathing soul who approaches their property. So what if the Bad guy has a few more seconds to flush his crap..He ain't going to be shooting at you if he's doing that...Second if you show up with uniform police with flashing lights and cars...What does message does that send to them and their costumers.

During Prohabition..After several Chicago undercover officers were shot by local uniform police officers for assuming they were the bad guys...The Fed's insisted that they have uniform officers always participate and be highly visible..Even the bad guys slowed down on their shooting back...

To the LEO's ...We civilians are the "The PEOPLE"..., We give you the power by being law abiding...If we choose otherwise ..You have no power...Worse you don't even have our support...So think about it the next time you feel the need to exercise you image.


:banghead:

[rock jock]

Minimum criteria I deem acceptable for executing a warrant:

- presence of several uniformed officers
- marked police cars
- police ID (not badge)

Barring the above, one can reasonably assume they are BG's and fire away.

[Cal4D4]

Sounds like someone is holding the candle up to LEO conduct. PD statements not held as gospel truth. Charges dropped. Maybe a bit of pendulum swinging based on track record? We all gotta play by the rules.

[bogie]

A few years back in St. Louis, they had more cops shot by cops than by crooks... They kept shooting each other (usually black on white, or white on black) during drug raids...

[moa]

For one thing, I like to know how an informant's comments can be enough to gain a legal search warrant in the first place? That could be pretty flimsy evidence endangering the welfare of both the raiders and the raidees.

Even if the informant made a buy at the house, the evidence appears it was probably a small one.

Also, apparently the citizen worked in store, and I would imagine it would have been easy to arrest him outside of the house, an then executed the search.

I think those "dynamic entry" raids could probably be avoided in many instances.

[wingman]

No knock entries are like high speed
car chase in a busy street, dangerous to
all and unnecessary.

Too many toys, and many who want to use them.:scrutiny:

[DeltaElite]

Dynamic entry raids are rarely needed, but frequently used.
Sighhhhhhhhhhhhh

Our dept requires the presence of two uniformed officers and two squad cars to be visible from the front of the residence that is being entered.
This allows for both neighbors and perps to see it is really the police.
All team members making the entry yell "police" in English and Spanish, or any other language appropriate at the time, while making entry.

I don't care for drug raids, but then I am a weirdo. :neener:

[TallPine]

Detectives are often worried about giving drug dealers time to flush drugs down toilets or get weapons and attack officers rushing into the house.

1) If they could flush all the evidence down the toliet, then they're just little fish to begin with. No-knock for a few ounces? No evidence other than an anonymous tip? Come on, please!

2) After this little episode, the police should be more worried about their officers getting hurt when they barge in unannounced, then when they give the "dealers" warning.

[BlackArrow]

Bust my door, you get busted!:evil: