[deerhunter61]

I just started reloading this past December and as with most things the more I get into it the more I realize how much I do not know. That being the case I was wondering what brass plays into the accuracy I am getting with each of my guns?

I am using Remington, Winchester, and Hornady brass. Are these good? Are there any better? If I use the better brass I am assuming they cost more...is it worth paying more for them?

The only rifles I own and shoot are hunting rifles. I have managed to find loads for each where I can get 3 shot groups of less than an inch. I am wondering what all of you strive to achieve in accuracy when you reload for hunting rifles? If you find a load that will get you less than an inch do you continue to try to find a load that will get you a 1/2 inch group? I have been doing this a little and realized this weekend it is costing me quite a lot...did not realize I had went through so much powder and bullets...had to restock.

So I am also wondering when you all say enough is enough for your hunting rounds?

Thanks,

[achildofthesky]

I think any of the brass you have is fine. I sort by headstamp and log my loads on paper for a backup hard copy... Once a decent load is found, stock up on (100+ rounds worth) components for hunting loads and call it good and practice shooting rather than loading.

I am very pleased and feel lucky to work up a couple loads in different weights or bullet styles 1" or less moa and that is way plenty good enough. Truth be told 2-3 moa is decent enough for deer and the like at moderate ranges. Most people in feild positions can't hold any better.

Be safe and enjoy the reloading

Patty

[Walkalong]

For an off the shelf hunting rifle buy any name brand brass that you can get the cheapest. You will never see a difference. Bullets will make the biggest difference. Try a couple of good hunting bullets, Remington Core-Lokt, Nosler Partitions, etc. Your rifle will be sure to like one of them. Then stick with that one. Then if you want you can play with powder selection and seating depth a bit.

[cdrt]

The brass you're using is just fine and of more than acceptable quality. I've used Winchester, Remington and Norma brass. The Norma is much more expensive (I got it on a trade), but I really did not see a difference in quality over the Winchester or Remington, especially when we're talking hunting loads.
Some guys use Lapua brass for their target rifles and I suppose it's okay, but again very very expensive.
In my M1, I use LC brass, but that's because I have a couple ammo cans of it leftover from my active duty days.
I am more than happy with one inch groups from my two deer rifles (.243 Win and .280 Rem). Once I find a good load, that's what I stick with. And I hate to admit it, but there are some years I don't even sight-in before deer season. I just check the scope alignment with my Bushnell bore sight and call it good.
I spend a lot more time shooting the M1 for practice before Highpower matches and consequently, load for it more than the other two rifles combined.
And a big second on what Walkalong said about bullets. I use CoreLokts for the deer here in Texas. When I was hunting elk in Montana, I used Nosler partitions in the .280.

[dakotasin]

I am using Remington, Winchester, and Hornady brass. Are these good?


yep.


Are there any better?


of course.


If I use the better brass I am assuming they cost more...is it worth paying more for them?


yes they do, and no it is not.



I have managed to find loads for each where I can get 3 shot groups of less than an inch. I am wondering what all of you strive to achieve in accuracy when you reload for hunting rifles?


you're doing fine. i strive for accuracy that i think the rifle is capable of getting. an off the shelf remington 700 w/ no custom work or light modification is held to a different standard than a savage 99, which has a different standard than a custom bolt gun, which has a different standard than an open-sighted marlin 336...


If you find a load that will get you less than an inch do you continue to try to find a load that will get you a 1/2 inch group?


depends on the rifle, chambering, and load specifics.

if my remington 700 in 7 rum turns in consistent groups of less than an inch, but velocity is only 2800 f/s, then yes, i will continue load development. i set out to develop loads with an accuracy and velocity window. so, in the remington 7 rum example, i will target 3200 f/s w/ a 160-ish grain bullet for an average of 1.25 - 1.5" at 200 yards. once i reach that goal, i will decide if the rifle is capable of better or not.

as a general rule, a rifle that will, on demand, shoot under an inch at 100 yards is ready to hunt w/ no further development.

don't drive yourself nuts. in the accuracy quest, i have weighed cases, deburred flash holes, drilled flash holes, uniformed primer pockets, turned case necks, varied trim length, made false shoulders, lubed cases before firing, jammed bullets, and just about anything else you can think that is possible to do w/ a case and the end result for an off-the-shelf factory rifle was always the same - not worth the time or effort in the accuracy department.

my last experiment was w/ a 7-08. i bought 500 cases and sorted them meticulously, and prepped them to the nth degree. the most glaring example was 2 groups of brass - one that the cases were absolutely identical to the next one (less than .1 grains weight difference, necks turned, etc), and a group that i intentionally had as wide of a distribution in case weights as possible, and only set to a consistent trim length. no other prep work was done w/ the cases. average accuracy at 300 yards over 3 years of shooting came out to be almost a quarter inch.

one thing i have found to affect accuracy is headstamps. i took a 257 roberts and used hornady and remington brass, same powder charge and bullet seating. over a year, i found the hornady brass grouped differently than the remington brass, and had higher velocity numbers, so the point of impact was actually quite a bit different. when i get a rifle ready to hunt now, i make sure the headstamp of my sighting and development loads is the same as the hunting loads.

you're doing great - don't worry too much over things that won't make a difference.

[243winxb]

I have managed to find loads for each where I can get 3 shot groups of less than an inch Looks like your doing fine with the brass your using. http://www.chuckhawks.com/practical_accuracy.htm Accuracy is important, but not all important. Especially on the Internet, accuracy has taken on an almost mythical status. No one seems willing to admit to shooting groups larger than 1 minute of angle (MOA).

[kennedy]

I sort by manufactor, I found out in .308, that win, rem and federal cases have a differant volume, so the same amount of powder will give you differant results. To get the same results I had to vary the amount of powder in porportion to the volume of the case, and it worked.

[jeepmor]

I honestly can't tell the difference in my 223 and 300WSM reloads no matter what brass I use. I've used Federal, Lake City, S&B, Remington and so on, and all shoot well.

On the WSM reloads, I found a weight skew that produced 1 MOA groups, illustrating the optimum charge weight for that bullet on my platform. Bullet is a 165 Nosler Accubond in my Ruger Hunting rifle. Now I need to revisit that loading more keenly for this deer and elk season and see if I can dial it in even tighter for the possible long shot.

On the 223, subMOA was had with Varget and VMax bullets, forget the weight, 52 grains I think.

My thinking is that until I'm trying to hit flies, 0.7-0.9 inch groups out of mixed brass is good. I expend my energies elsewhere once I get this type of grouping consistently. Once I use all that powder up, chances are the next bottle is a different lot and may need some skewing from the original anyhow. The cycle continues pursuing a good load, I think the iterations decrease as you find the components your firearms like.

If you want to see a good example of how meticulous you can be to reloading, check out snipercentral.com. Great reloading pages in there for those squeezing every second of angle out of their shooting hobby.

Hope this helps.

[scrat]

i think it all depends on what your shooting and what your shooting at. if your want to put the second bullet in the same exact hole as the first on. then alot of it depends on the gun, the caliber, then the ammo. If you need a good hunting rounds Where you can be off a few inches in either direction. Or if you just shooting steel then anything. Now if you want low budget. But good stuff. then you will need to not only make sure your using an ok brass but more important your case prep. they need to be sized the exact way, trimmed chamfered de bured, flash hole cleaned primer pocket clean exact size all matched. Maybe even exact weight. then you need to have the exact weight powder and good bullets that weigh the same. Now if you want the best. you need to spend money on top quality bras and your prep work needs to be perfect but also needs to match the gun your shooting it out of.

[NCsmitty]

I'm not sure how some can mix their brass and still shoot consistent groups. It's been my experience that case capacities can vary by quite a bit between manufacturers. That usually equates to different velocities due to the inconsistent pressures between different brands of brass using the same powder charge. Remington brass generally is heavier and has less capacity than Winchester. Remington is my brass of choice in standard rounds but I do use Norma in my 6.5x55. I would never consider shooting mixed brass.

NCsmitty

[scrat]

OOHHHH that norma is some good stuff. Just kinda pricey

[Walkalong]

I don't think anyone advised him to mix brass. We have made the point that his hunting rifle is not going to be able to tell the difference in any name brand brass. He can work up a good load in any of the brand cases he listed. If you want a gun that will shoot them all through one hole, it ain't at Wal-Mart.(or any of the gun sellers for that matter) It will take a custom gun.

The better your rifle, the bigger a difference everything makes. All the prep and fuss we do can gain a little if we have a great action and a good match barrel properly installed, but it does precious little in an off the shelf rifle. It is the bullet, powder, charge amount, and seating depth that will make the biggest differences there. Trying to get it to shoot bug holes in an exercise in futility.

[ranger335v]

"I am wondering what all of you strive to achieve in accuracy when you reload for hunting rifles? If you find a load that will get you less than an inch do you continue to try to find a load that will get you a 1/2 inch group?"

For most hunters, MOA is great, twice that isn't bad. Consider that a 2" rifle/ammo will only miss the aim point by 1 inch at 100 yds, or 2" at 200 yards. I doubt that ever caused the loss of a big game animal!

One inch sporters are hard to find. In spite of common brags about grouping 1/2" or less, take most of the claims of near BR accuracy from hunting bullets fired in a light factory sporting rifle with a 3-9x scope, shot off a shakey bench or over the hood of their truck with large grains of salt.

Lightening can hit anywhere, once. So, anyone can get a random 3 shot 1/2" group - once. The question is, what would be the size of a 20 shot group? I mean, we should only count on the dependable accuracy as the measure of our rigs. I'd bet that not more than 1 in 100 claiming 1/2" accuracy from their hunting rifles actually get it. Maybe 1 in 20 who claim 1" accuracy can actually achieve that with any consistantly.

If you are getting 1", on average, you are doing well. Very well.