[David S]

from what i understand no agency or military uses the Walther p99 as a standard issue weapon. Why is that?

[Wildalaska]

I think some german police agencies use it?

[modifiedbrowning]

I believe I saw a post at TFL from a US LEO that said his dept used the P99. I thought some German Police agencies used the P99 as well.

[JimC]

I seem to recall an LEO from FL posting on TFL, saying his agency was switching over to the P99 and in .40S&W I think.

Good pistols like the P99 don't get a chance in the LE circle until a larger agency, state or federal, buys them and they have no problems with them.

Many of the smaller agencies let the larger ones do all the testing and ground work and then they make their decisions.

[David S]

my local sherriff dept uses the Hk usp..................and i have shot the usp, i know they are reliable guns that have been around a while, but the P99 has been around for some years now and i have yet to hear many negetive things about it, mainly people who just arnt used to it...........Even the HK p2000 that just came out this year is already supposed to be used by the German police. My friend , who is very skeptical of the P99, use the fact that the P99 is not a widely used service gun, as a point to say that the HK is far superior.......Sure HK has a wider range in the polymer market, and they are REALLY good guns, but would not consider the P99 inferior...

[Handy]

Doesn't her Majesty's MI-6 issue it to their "00" agents? Does that count for nothing?

But seriously folks, the P99 and sister pistol SW99 have had their teething problems. Whether right or wrong, there are a lot of pistols out there for LEOs to choose from, and you don't win your men's trust by issuing a pistol with any stigma. The HKs don't have a "history", so it's easy to assume that the new P2000 will have the same reliability as the USPs.

The P99 is pretty nice, but I think it is bizarre that a European pistol company could make a $600 9mm that jams with 115 grain ball, even initially.

[762x51]

Sure HK has a wider range in the polymer market, and they are REALLY good guns, but would not consider the P99 inferior...

Especially since that new P2000 looks to me like they basically copied the P99 and are trying to sell it for 200 bucks more because it says HK. :rolleyes:

[Kobun]

I was one of the first to buy a P99, and I had a big problem with it.
The firing pin broke after 340 rounds.
I got a new pin, but after dropping it in, I couldn't pull the trigger. Had to use TWO fingers. Thats how hard the pull got!
I returned the gun and bought a Glock 34 instead.

Now, this was when the P99 was brand new. I guess they had some problems in the beginning, and that those have been fixed.
I have sold P99 later, and have not heard anything negative.

If I were to get a P99 today, I would go for the P99 QA, because the pull is wery good. If you use a Wolff Glock redused power striker spring in it, the trigger pull becomes wery wery smooth and light, while giving good reliability.
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=43854

[CZF]

Some British Police Armed Units use the P99. Guess they bought
them at low bid.

They had the CZ-100 designed to their specs, then backed out
of the contract with CZ. DAO guns seem to be the norm with
the police in the UK.

i do know a guy who spends every vacation in England.,
he tells me that the Glock is a fave with the armed response
teams there.

[David S]

Im trying to convince my friend that the P99 is NOT inferior to he USPs..............any arguements in that favor?

[Handy]

The ergonomics of the P99 are superior in some respects, but the strength and reliability aspects are probably in the USPs favor.

[David S]

Well, i have seen photos of the P99 submerged in water, in sand.....frozen ect...............it can do it.............why would you rate the USP more durable?

[Handy]

For the full size USP, it has a recoil system that the Walther doesn't. That and the general appearence of massiveness on the UPSs part.

Also, the USP was designed around .40. It appears that Walther did a professional job changing their 9mm pistol into a .40 (with S&Ws help), but that is less confidence inspiring than the route HK took.

Finally, as stated earlier, HK in general does a very good job of releasing well tested weapons appropriate for submission to government and military evalutions. They have few teething issues and require no break-in for reliable functioning. They have done this repeatedly, even with radically new designs. The old P9S is the only pistol of it's kind, but is STILL in use with some special operations groups, years out of production.

Walther, by contrast, is not an innovator. The P88 and P99 were the first combat handguns in decades not based on either the PP or P-38. The 88 and 99 are good, but broke no new ground. At least the P99 is cheaper, now.

I think the shape, trigger and decocking system of the P99 all real plusses. If I had to choose just between it and a USP for combat, the USP gives me more of a warm and fuzzy. But there are other pistols that I might pick before that, like a 226.

[Extremist]

Ahem :rolleyes:
The 88 and 99 are good, but broke no new ground.
I beg to differ. I offer:

P99:
1) First striker fired pistol to offer traditional DA/SA trigger as well as DAO and new QA trigger action.
2) First polymer pistol with replaceable backstraps to adjust to user's preferred grip size (Sig and HK have copied this feature).
3) First polymer defense pistol with grip designed by target pistol grip designer (Morini)

New ground was indeed broken. :D

Lesssee, how many P99s do I have? 1-2-3-4-5-6-7, yes 7. Awesome pistols. Carry one every day in my Isuzu
:p

Regards,
James

[David S]

Excellant,i was to hear more from each side of the arguement

[Handy]

1. SECOND polymer striker DAO. First DA/SA, but does it matter? Most people consider hammers more reliable.
2. A replaceable back strap is a half of a replaceable grip. Most people only use the standard back strap anyway.
3. Golly!

The last two points rest entirely on how you like your grip. Plenty of people even like the Glock 2X4 grip. It is a good grip. But so are many others.

Seeing everyone else making huge profits with injection molding, Walther got on the band wagon. As I said earlier, they did a good job ergonomically, and the decocker is novell. Everything else is a fresh rehash of basic stuff. They even copied HK's excellent mag release.

[David S]

the p99 has the nice feature of (when its chambered) u pull the slide back less than a half and inch and it cocks it , so you have a nice short trigger pull................ does the USP have that?

[Extremist]

:rolleyes:
1. SECOND polymer striker DAO. First DA/SA, but does it matter? Most people consider hammers more reliable.

My post was misunderstood. I didn't mean to imply it was the first DAO polymer striker fired pistol. I meant: FIRST DA/SA Striker fired pistol IN ADDITION TO OFFERING the DAO and QA triggers. Of course the first DAO Polymer pistol was the --- HK VP70 (Ha, you thought it was the Glock) :D

2. A replaceable back strap is a half of a replaceable grip. Most people only use the standard back strap anyway.

Maybe so, but at least you get a choice. I do know some people that like the smaller backstrap better. If it was not such an innovation, then why did Sig and HK copy it? ;)

3. Golly!

Well, yes, by Golly!

And Yes, Walther borrowed the HK innovation of the mag release.

But you can hardly say it was a rehash.

The P99 is more accurate in the majority of accuracy tests in gun magazine reviews in both 9mm and .40S&W. When I get my webpage back up (:cuss: directvinternet!), you can look at my P99 vs USP page.

Now don't get me wrong, the USP Compacts are great pistols, I have one of each (9mm, .40/.357 and .45). ONE of each.

P99s are my favorite (next to P7s).

Regards,
James

[David S]

well, said, I think USPs are way better than Glocks but the P99s put the asthetics party into the equation...............as well as taking care of the other parts........

[Handy]

David,

The usp has a nice feature that allows you to cock it with the thumb of the firing hand.

Ex,

1. Understood your post. Didn't see the value of a striker for that application. Strikers, like polymer, are usually a cost saver. Of course I was speaking of the VP70.
2. Easy way to add a cheap feature to a plastic frame.
3. Again, I'm in support of the outside of the P99.

[PATH]

In the end the Walther P99 is the clear favorite of discerning shooters!:D

[David S]

there is no real NEED to slightly pull the slide on the p99, it just gives it a short trigger pull, in an emergency, u still have a long trigger pull and can still fire..................yes the P99 is a elegant weapon

[Handy]

Of course, there is no need to cock any DA/SA weapon before firing. But if you do want to cock it, you can. Guns with exposed hammers are nice because the cocking can be done with the shooting hand as opposed to a two hand operation.

But if two hands is more "elegant", so be it.

[David S]

point is, there is no need to cock it if the situation is so hostile that you cant spare your other hand..

[Handy]

David, you brought up the slide cocking thing, and then boasted that the USP doesn't have it. I was just pointing out (since you wanted both sides) that the USP and all DA guns with hammers are even easier to cock.

So I wouldn't use that arguement with your friend.

[HTN]

The usp has a nice feature that allows you to cock it with the thumb of the firing hand.

This is the best point in this thread...on so many levels.

[Island Beretta]

It has been a disappointment after promising so much!! Maybe it promised too much??? I have seen them hang up on hollow-points and 115 grains.. They surprisingly muzzle flip significantly and I have seen Glocks outshoot them both in speed and accuracy on the range.. Of course once I step in with the Beretta they are both left trailing in my wake:D