DA revolver pulls ... an exercise and a little research

[pax]

Please forgive me for posting this in general rather than in the revolver forum. For the research I'm doing, I really want a cross-section of shooters from different disciplines, not just people who are revolver fans.


Equipment needed: safe backstop, unloaded DA revolver, piece of notebook paper folded in half to make an approximate square, timer or stopwatch or clock with a second hand.

Check, double check, triple check that revolver is unloaded.

(If at home & backstop is mobile, place backstop at standard target height.)

Lock out in your standard, comfortable shooting stance.

Set gun down, place your paper over the spot where your muzzle was pointed in your normal shooting stance. Pick the gun back up (double check for unloaded).

Lock out in your stance again, so that the muzzle is roughly six inches or so away from your target.

Keeping the muzzle aligned with the paper, set the timer for 30 seconds and start pulling the DA trigger as fast as you can, pulling it as many times as you can within 30 seconds without allowing the muzzle to move away from the paper.

Report back here, please!

What I want to know:

Male or Female?
Age
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds.


(Please be honest, folks. If you think your score is really embarrassing, just PM me rather than posting here & telling a less-embarrassing untruth. I'm not tracking names, just M/F, Age, & # of pulls.)

Thanks,

pax

ps I'll tell you all what exactly I'm researching once I have enough data to begin drawing some conclusions. Can't tell you right now since I don't want to skew the results...

[BlindJustice]

Interesting exercise

You might also consider
How many DA pulls in 10 sec, 20 sec, & 30 sec to get
a rate per timed amount. SHooter fatigue, eh?

& on the lines of shooter Fatigue consider also
asking for the platform. My example here
would be I have a S&W in N, L, K, and J frame
from large to small each has it's own amount of
reciprocating mass.

My N-frame has had the S&W Perf. Center Master
Revolver Action job, the L-frame is stock, but the K-frame
is a .22 LR and I wouldn't dry fire it unless it had 10 empties
i.e. fired cases in the chambers. The J-frame smallest but
has the coil spring. I think my 617 10 shooter K frame as the
best DA pull out of the box, but the big N-frame with the MRAJ
is smoothest now

JUst some thoughts on your 'survey'

Randall - I'll wait til a friend is over to say
"start" and "stop"

[LightningMan]

Ok, I'll be a test subject. I took my J frame S&W model 60 (factory springs) and held it about six inches from a 5 x 7 card on the wall, at a comfortable height. I used my Competition Electronies timer, using the delay start with a second beep set at 30 seconds. At the first beep, I started pulling the trigger while maintaining a two hand hold on the target. I tried to keep an accurate count, but it could be off a few, anyway I counted 79 pulls of the trigger before the 30 second beep went off. You can count the 80th pull if you want to include the beep. Hope this works for you. LM
PS. if you can't tell by my alias, "LightningMan" I'm male.

[pax]

BlindJustice ~

Good post. :) I don't want to add anything else to this one, though.

pax

[sm]

Male
Age : 53
Timer: Wall Clock

1. Kel-Tec P-11
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 77

2. Smith & Wesson Model 64, 3" RB HB with a buttery smooth action.
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 81



Weak-Handed.

1. Kel-Tec P-11
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 71

2. Model 64
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 77

[Chuck Dye]

Male

57 years old

76 DA pulls in 30 seconds

S&W Model 63, factory springs.

I post the model and that it has factory springs as I plan to run the drill again with a Ruger Redhawk with a Wolff spring kit and, for fun if not the research project, a SIG-Sauer P226, also with lighter Wolff springs. Given the fatigue factor (I'm glad this is typed, not hand written!) the additional tests will come at fairly large intervals. Given the fatigue factor, I have also located and dusted off the GripMaster (http://www.amazon.com/s.html?ie=UTF8&node=3375301&brand=Gripmaster).

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51M3hcCejYL._SL160_AA160_.jpg

[Chuck Dye]

A quick search for "countdown timer" brought both web resident and downloadable timers.

I used www.online-stopwatch.com.

[Brian Williams]

male 52

S&W 13
strong hand 90
weak hand 78
I dry fire about 100 to ?? daily

[Chuck Dye]

P226 w/ spring kit

Strong hand: 81

Weak hand: 70

Still male.

Still 57 years old.

Now even more grateful this is typed, not handwritten. (grrrrrrr!)

[Chuck Dye]

Ruger Redhawk

Strong hand: 71

Weak hand: 68

Lost some to the weight of the scoped hunter model and a few short reset strokes.

[pax]

Thanks, guys. Keep 'em coming -- the dataset isn't large enough yet!

Also, if any of you are able to get a female to do the same test, it would really help provide a wider baseline.

Thanks,

pax

[sm]

Still a 53 year old male
Still ain't good sense...


Ruger SP101 (new gun)
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 77


1929 Colt Detective Special
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 85

H&R ".22 Special" , break top 7 shot
Snap caps used.
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 81

-
Kel-Tec P-11
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 93

Note:
I re-did this test with grit and determination as if someone was stealing my fried apple pies!
I have to wait on this trigger and this was my best run.

[Brian Williams]

Still 52, but wellness check says 55.
S&W 36 3"
85 strong hand with 5 short strokes
85 weak hand
This one has a weak trigger return spring.

[Chuck Dye]

pax,

I am sorry I did not ask these questions before posting four times. Hope late is better than never.

Is it useful to you to have one individual test multiple firearms?

Is it useful to have separate strong hand and weak hand reports?

Are data gathered from double action semi-autos such as my P226, which operates in the same fashion as a DA revolver, of any value?

[pax]

Chuck ~

Yes, provided you let your trigger finger recover adequately between them.

Yes.

Yes, provided each and every pull is DA.

And before it comes up: one finger on the trigger only, even if you ordinarily 'cheat' by using both index fingers in DA mode.

(Thank you to everyone who's jumped in with this. It's a big help. Keep em coming!)

pax

[the naked prophet]

Placeholder for results once my wife wakes up and we can both do this.

[Brian Williams]

still 52
19.1 % body fat
S&W 581
Right hand 87
Left hand 85

[Drgong]

Ok, slightly embarrassed with this.. though the nagant DA pull is not great.

Nagant - 1933 Tula
Male or Female? Male
Age 28
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds. 42

can do 20 in 10 seconds, but my finger wants to fall off.

[sm]

Model 64 3" RB, HB with buttery smooth action was used by all the ladies.

Original Stocks were used on this gun, as some of the ladies prefer and actually use different stocks on this gun, or one exactly like it.

Strong hand only.


Age: 11
Number of DA pulls within 30 seconds: 19

Age: 17
Pulls: 51

Age: 19
Pulls: 51

Age: 36
Pulls: 67.

Age: 39
Pulls: 43

Age: 39
Pulls: 24

Age: 42
Pulls: 69

Age: 42
Pulls: 27


Age: 46
Pulls: 71

Age: 51
Pulls: 81


Age 62
Pulls: 40

Age: 79
Pulls: 27

[pax]

sm ~

Thank you. :)

pax

[MT GUNNY]

I have a felling this isn't about fatigue,
Cuz, after 6 rounds you would have to reload anyway.
I'm thinking it has to do with the amount of force it takes to pull a double action trigger.
Defiantly interesting thou.

[jobu07]

Age - 25
Pulls - 87

If you need weapon data later I can add that.

[Drgong]

Jobu07, I think the weapon is important, as I know I can do twice the pulls with a GP100 then my Nagant.

[sm]

Well....
I know where Kathy is coming from and I am just tickled to death she is researching this Art & Science if you will.

This is actually a very serious and important research she is doing, and something a lot of folks will benefit from.


Seriously, she needs more input.

Double action revolvers both strong and weak hand.
Double action semi-autos input would be a great benefit to this research as well.

Follow the Rules of Dry Fire of course.

Now even non-shooters per se' in the family need to assist in this research.
So your teenagers, wife, sister, mom, dad, , grandparents input is needed.

Now if a person has had a injury, or surgery , or is on any meds for arthritis, I am going to suggest they let pax know this as well.

She does not want anyone to hurt themselves, still this research has some really great reasons for being conducted.

[Lbys]

Male
31
S&W 625
Strong: 66
Weak: 64

[Brian Williams]

S&W 642
Strong hand
me 92
My 52 yo wife 45
my 17 yo daughter 43, BTW she only has a strong hand and is still a good shooter with one hand and a short arm.




S&W 65
me 86

[Drgong]

Jeez...will someone do another nagant so I don't feel horriable that 80 year old women are beating me ;)

[sm]

Jeez...will someone do another nagant so I don't feel horrible that 80 year old women are beating me

*lol*

Oh phooey! Just eat about 3 pcs of triple chocolate fudge , and wash it down with some Turkish coffee and you and the Nagant will be blow everyone else's record.

*grin*

[The Wiry Irishman]

Placeholder so I remember to do this when I get home.

[Drgong]

thanks sm..... :D:neener:

[Geronimo45]

Male/22

4" S&W 65-2

Strong hand - 76
Weak hand - 70

[rainbowbob]

I used www.online-stopwatch.com.

Chuck:
That is a cool and useful site for an online stopwatch. I tried the "clock countdown" version and it even has an alarm when time is up. I'll try this later when I have some time (and my wife isn't running in and out wondering why the heck I'm dry-firing a weapon in the office).

[Drgong]

I tried again...

52 with the nagant in 30 seconds (ok, 25 seconds, finger was too tired...

My finger is at risk of falling off...

[loneviking]

Don't feel too bad, Dr. Gong. I didn't do all that well either:

Male, 47

Colt Peacekeeper/Trooper Mk V, .357 and 6" barrel

Left hand: 65
Right hand: 70

I'm ambidextrous, so I'm not sure which hand is my 'strong' hand.

[rainbowbob]

Male
57 years old
S&W M36 snub

I normally shoot right handed - even though I'm left handed.

Right hand: 60
Left hand: 72

Now I'm re-thinking which hand to shoot with. My right hand got really tired and kind of crapped out on me. (Does it matter that I did a couple of hours of pruning yesterday and was sore to begin with?)

[Trebor]

My wife and I are our of town for a week. Normally, I could just have both of use my carry gun, a S&W M 65, for this test, but since we are in Chicago you can understand why that isn't going to happen...

I'll check back when I get back to see if you are still collecting info. I might be able to draft a few of my students as well.

[gismored79]

male
29
rossi 58 stock
two handed 49

[GVMan]

Male
41 years old
64 pulls

[The Wiry Irishman]

Male
23

FNP-45
72

S&W 617-1
59

I think the data on the 617 might be a little off, though, yanking back that beast of a DA trigger on the FNP made my finger very sore. The 617 actually has a much lighter and smoother trigger. I guess shooting .5-2# single action target guns has made me soft.

[The Wiry Irishman]

I let my finger rest for a bit and managed 83 with the 617

Both this and the above were done with a two-handed grip.

[kludge]

bump... curious about the result and why.

[rainbowbob]

Yeah, Pax...what did you find out from this excercise?

[Chuck Dye]

Pax,

Have you any results to report? Curious folk want to know...

Full on statistical analysis would be great.

Chuck

[gunseller2]

I haven't waddled down to the safe yet, but wasn't this drill part of the entry PT test for the FBI a while back?