Woman Has gun blow up in Face


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Sheldon J
August 30, 2008, 11:41 AM
I'm not familiar with a Talon T-200 9 MM but this gal had it blow up in her face (http://kdka.com/local/Pistol.exploded.Finleyville.2.806575.html) while target shooting, video link in the RH corner.

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Drgong
August 30, 2008, 11:47 AM
this brand was owned by Davis Inc. It was there polymer brand if I recall.

Nuff said ;)

the Davis/Jennings/cobra type design has major question marks as it grew out of the .25 round it was designed for.

These are one of the few "Sat. Night speicals/Junk guns" that have documentation that they go BOOM in the wrong way when people use them.

I googled and found a number of other people who showed there blown up gun and stitches.

SCKimberFan
August 30, 2008, 11:50 AM
Holy Crap. Here is a link to another forum with the same gun and same results.

http://shootersforum.com/showthread.htm?t=43768

Looks to me to be a dangerous gun. Yes I said it was a dangerous gun.

It was prob designed for basic 9mm and she put in a 9+p round,

Conjecture Drgong, unless you have verification.

Loomis
August 30, 2008, 11:52 AM
Jeeze, the damage to her face is extremely minimal. I'd call her lucky.

SCKimberFan
August 30, 2008, 11:55 AM
Here are some photos of another Talon T-200. Scary.

Eric F
August 30, 2008, 11:55 AM
we had no luck in contacting any one at tallon industries
And nor will you. I have heard of these things a year or so ago I thought they were out of business but havnt looked into it yet.

Looks like a case of modern "old school" hi-point

Leecz
August 30, 2008, 12:03 PM
It's just like any other low-end polymer firearm... you get what you pay for. It's terrible that it happened, but it doesn't really surprise me all that much. She's very lucky.

230RN
August 30, 2008, 12:04 PM
Holy cow, it looks like exactly the same design as the Kel Tec PF9, which I have in hand right now.

Stripped it, and except for minor internals, and the fact that my Kel-Tec slide is definitely steel, it looks the same. The fact that it was (and my PF-9 is) a polymer frame had nothing to do with the slide cracking.

I think maybe the extractor is different, but it's hard to tell from the photo in the link.

Glad that guy had no worse injuries than that.

That's a highly-stressed area in "ejection-port-locked" guns. The breech is forced back by the cartridge head, and the pressure forces the front ledge of the barrel against the front edge of the slide port cutout, resulting in high tensional stresses in the area of the ejection port on the slide.

You will note that in the 1911 design, the locking takes place in the front of the ejection port, and in several grooves, and not just against a ledge in the ejection port. I guess the Saint of Utah had it right.

I believe Beretta originally had troubles with that slide cutout for their locking block in the 92 series at first, but bettered their metallurgy. These do not lock on the ejection port (obviously), but the point is that the slide is not just there to run back and forth on the frame, but really does take a lot of stresses and it's worth thinking about that before a designer starts designing cuts in slides.

Drgong
August 30, 2008, 12:08 PM
Eric F - the Hi Point might be Ugly as Sin, but they don't blow up in your face - and people who buy them say they are reliable big ugly guns.

The Talon however, is a gun that Can and will blow up on yourself. Davis owned it, and it was basicly the same raven/jennings/jamerez/davis type mouse pistol with a polymer frame. They went out of bussiness in about two years when there guns started to blow up in people faces.

Many people have heard of a friend of a friend who had a jennings blow up on them, but there never proof. The Talon has many documented cases of it exploding. Might be worth it to turn it in at a "buyback" but that is about it.

They went out of business in around 2001 if my google-foo is correct.

SCKimberFan
August 30, 2008, 12:12 PM
Might be worth it to turn it in at a "buyback" but that is about it.

That would be the only way to get your money back. With the company out of business, these folks are just SOL.

Geno
August 30, 2008, 12:14 PM
Great post! Such happenings ought always be brought to shootists' attention ASAP. I admire her calm presentation as she expresses in sum, guns are safe, but this one isn't. Good conduct by the commentators who also were objective and professional, "...dangers of that particular handgun...". :) Very objective!

Doc2005

Eric F
August 30, 2008, 12:16 PM
Eric F - the Hi Point might be Ugly as Sin, but they don't blow up in your face - and people who buy them say they are reliable big ugly guns.
ok I admit that even the first hipoints didnt blow up but they did have batches go out with problems, I know first hand. My point was cheap gun....broke.

Drgong
August 30, 2008, 12:18 PM
ok I admit that even the first hipoints didnt blow up but they did have batches go out with problems, I know first hand. My point was cheap gun....broke.

Fair enough, but they have a great CS, you can send it back and get a new gun no questions asked.

Eric F
August 30, 2008, 12:24 PM
Fair enough, but they have a great CS, you can send it back and get a new gun no questions asked.
yes now they do in the begining it was not too great.

scrat
August 30, 2008, 12:31 PM
Wow i guess i will put that on the do not buy list

Kentucky-roughrider
August 30, 2008, 12:36 PM
This is a gun that should be no a ban list, market pressure will or did do nicely.

Don Gwinn
August 30, 2008, 12:39 PM
The guy above who mentioned "Nuff said" and the "Davis polymer line" wasn't knocking on polymer guns. He was pointing out that every gun product associated with Davis is a piece of junk.

theotherwaldo
August 30, 2008, 12:40 PM
This should be a lesson to manufacturers and gun-tinkers: don't apply blow-back level metallurgy to a locked-breech firearm!

Drgong
August 30, 2008, 12:42 PM
The guy above who mentioned "Nuff said" and the "Davis polymer line" wasn't knocking on polymer guns. He was pointing out that every gun product associated with Davis is a piece of junk.

As that poster who said that, just wanted to clarify that while I do not currently own a polymer gun, I have nothing vs. using Nylon 6 for guns, and the XD is a rather nice gun. :)

the Davis line is a brand that has a terrible reputation, and that is what I was referring to.

GRB
August 30, 2008, 12:47 PM
It was prob designed for basic 9mm and she put in a 9+p round, Any evidence of this or just a guess?

4v50 Gary
August 30, 2008, 12:49 PM
The poor woman's injury was on the left side of her face. Same with the other fellow who had his ka-boom on him. It seems that the ejection port side (right side) allowed pressure to vent and it left the port side (left side) to take the pressure. After overloaded ammo, I'll put my money either on the foundry that did the casting or the steel (?) used by the foundry are at fault. Either way, the entire industry suffers from it.

Drgong
August 30, 2008, 12:52 PM
Any evidence of this or just a guess?

Totally a guess, and actually I think I need to retract that as I do more research it appears to be a common-designed/production based problem.

Changed the post as you are right in questioning that.

jrfoxx
August 30, 2008, 01:05 PM
Jeeze, the damage to her face is extremely minimal. I'd call her lucky.
That's what I was thinking. While I'm sure 50 stitches in the lip is REAL painful, all things considered, she did get pretty dar lucky. Could have easily had lots of shrapnel all over her face at a minimun, and a decent sized chunk that hits just the right spot in the skull like an eye or sinus cavity or soething where it may be able to get in and cause serious damage or even death. It's hard to look at a gun blowing up in your face as being "lucky", but considering the possibilities, she really was.

I hope anyone who owns one of these guns hears about this and gets thier's checked out in detail by a good gunsmith, or better yet, find a place that does NDI inspections to get it x-rayed so no internal (not visible to the naked eye due to size, or because there is nothing showing on the surface, but visible underneath) flaws get missed. Sometines a crack can be almost all the way through something, except for the very outermost surfaces. It will look fine to the eye, since you cant see the crack, but can be held together by little more than a very thin coat of paint or metal. Saw some intersting, scary, very dangerous internal cracks just like that in the Navy getting NDI's done on the hardware that suspended out multi-hundred ton vans I worked in, from the ceiling of the hanger bay. They all looked fine, until you saw the xrays.....

May not be easy to find such a place, but they are out there. In fact, that may not be a bad businees idea for someone with the skill and means to start up. If you could keep costs reasonable (which may not be easy doing just guns, may have to subsidize with doing inspections on other small industrial itms too), a gunny NDI service with people who know specifically about guns, could be a good, hopefully profitable, service to help people detect flaws, wear, ect that may go unnoticed until something breaks or stops working right. Might even get some contracts from manufactureres to sample lots for them to increase QC (unless they all already do that, no idea really, but some smaller mfg.'s may find it better to farm out to a third party than buying thier own equipment, hiring tech.'s, etc)

TexasRifleman
August 30, 2008, 02:06 PM
Well to be fair one of the incidents contains this jewel:

The slide broke right in half. I was shooting handloads.

It may very well be the gun but as soon as you say handloads the possibility increases greatly that it was a boo boo of ammo.

Zedo
August 30, 2008, 02:21 PM
Slide break at the junction of the ejection port and the "bolt/striker" area. This is the point where a blow-back design gets hammered by the ejecting case during the cycling of the action.

In a locked breech design, the action opens a millisecond after the discharge and so the working pressure in the action drops significantly.

But mostly, the Jennings / Davis guns have cast metal slides. Cast metal lacks the molecular structure necessary to provide structural integrity to the part. Some frames on modern handguns like Ruger are "investment cast" -- but that's a different, more sophisticated process. AND, the frame is not a crucial component in the cycling of the action.

I personally know of three slide failures in Jennings J-22's, a 22 cal. blow back design with a cast slide.

BOOM! :what:

If you're going to spend the $$$ to have the gun cryrogenically examined, may as well toss this junk and buy a firearm. Structural failure is not visible to examination without some very sophisticated equipment.

Elza
August 30, 2008, 03:13 PM
She’s lucky. It appears to be a glancing blow to her lip/cheek. Notice that when she demonstrates in the film she is shooting right handed but appears left eye dominate. Had she been sighting with her right eye it could have hit her square on and done even more damage.

contenderman
August 30, 2008, 05:08 PM
Talon went out of business fairly quickly. The guns were "PoC", very poor quality. Davis then Cobra had some involvement after Talon closed down.

Hand loads or factory loads ... after a few rounds something was going to give in the slide.

When it comes to a device that operates on exploding/hot gas principles that you are holding close to your face ... bargains are not what you should focus on.

See a piece you've never heard of at a good price ... check it out before you lay down your cash ... else the results may be something that you don't want.

Rustynuts
August 30, 2008, 05:21 PM
Why is everyone dissing polymer? It wasn't the polymer that exploded it was the poorly made METAL slide! Are all metal guns bad now too? I don't think a metal frame would have held that slide together.

Drgong
August 30, 2008, 05:31 PM
Rusty, who was dissing polymer?

Eric F
August 30, 2008, 05:36 PM
isnt this the "polly gun" that is an aluminium liner with carbon fiber/polly filler over it for the whole gun including the slide?

Josh Aston
August 30, 2008, 06:00 PM
isnt this the "polly gun" that is an aluminium liner with carbon fiber/polly filler over it for the whole gun including the slide?

Nope.

I'm surprised at them actually reporting this accurately, rather than trying to turn it into "guns are bad". This isn't the only piece of reporting we've seen lately that isn't painting guns in a bad light. Maybe it's a new trend in journalism! Report what actually happened instead of emotional tear jerkers.

Drgong
August 30, 2008, 06:02 PM
who knows, perhaps now after heller the media instead of saying "GUNS ARE BAD!!!" are going more of the consumer advocate saying Gun X is not a good gun.

Perhaps someone should write a book "Unsafe at any pressure?" ;)

Artiz
August 30, 2008, 06:51 PM
She is lucky, but what I say when a low-end gun blow up in someone's face is: ah, you deserved it, if you don't have the money to buy a reputated company's gun, don't buy any gun, or you'll regret it, in a potentially deadly way.

Drgong
August 30, 2008, 06:54 PM
She is lucky, but what I say when a low-end gun blow up in someone's face is: ah, you deserved it, if you don't have the money to buy a reputated company's gun, don't buy any gun, or you'll regret it, in a potentially deadly way.

There are PLENTY of handguns that are under $200 that won't blow up in your face.

Just off the top of my head I can name three autoloaders.

Hi-points
Pa-63
P64

CWL
August 30, 2008, 07:08 PM
IFAIK, these gun companies are all owned by the same family. They manufacture cheaply made, unreliable pistols. After the heat builds up from customer complaints (lawsuits), they declare bankruptcy, shut down and just sets-up again under another name.

Drgong
August 30, 2008, 07:14 PM
CWL - that is correct, the Jennings family has put food on the table for years from the Raven onwards on variations of the same design, mostly cast Zinc designs. The Talon Brand was a attempt to make a polymer gun and it failed badly, as the company didn't last for more then two years before running down and the design has not been repeated agian.

Funny thing is I shot a friends Raven (actual raven which is not too common these days) and it was not a BAD gun, but the design was for .25 ACP, not 9mm Luger rounds, and the techonology matched with the production cost was pushing the limits at the .25 ACP round.

Catherine
August 30, 2008, 09:08 PM
Holy moly!

I never heard of that brand of gun before but there are a bunch of guns that have been mentioned here and elsewhere that I do not know about.

Catherine

novaDAK
August 31, 2008, 01:40 AM
Pittsburgh is an area that normally views guns in a positive light from my experience.

PILMAN
August 31, 2008, 01:51 AM
Is that slide plastic?!

Clipper
August 31, 2008, 08:40 AM
That's a highly-stressed area in "ejection-port-locked" guns. The breech is forced back by the cartridge head, and the pressure forces the front ledge of the barrel against the front edge of the slide port cutout, resulting in high tensional stresses in the area of the ejection port on the slide.

So what? the Savage 99 uses the ejection port to lock up, and is renowned for it's strength. good design can't make up for poor metallurgy though. A Savage 99 made of recycled beercans or whatever would be a POS now, wouldn't it?

Ash
August 31, 2008, 08:48 AM
Except he is correct. That is indeed a highly-stressed area on ejection port lockup designs. The Savage has a whole lot more beef in its lock up, backed up by a stock which is then pressed against the shoulder. In SIGs, Glocks, and others, there is no sock resting against the rear of the slide (could not be as they would not work). If this Talon had a stock attached to the slide, it would not have failed because the force would have been absorbed by the shoulder, not the sides of the slide, preventing the rear from separating from the front and going ballistic.

That does not make the design inherently bad. But it is a fact. What the fact that the sides of the slide about the ejection port suffer high stresses demonstrate is that the slide cannot be made in a hap-hazard way or without due consideration towards this area. In other words, since this is a high-stress area, the slide has to be made well enough to endure that stress (like SIGs, Glocks, CZ's, Rugers, etc. are). Evidently, the Talon is not made well enough to endure that stress.

Ash

Clipper
August 31, 2008, 09:11 AM
...the slide cannot be made in a hap-hazard way or without due consideration towards this area.


I'm sorry...I kinda thought I said just that in my last sentence... :rolleyes:

Ash
August 31, 2008, 03:10 PM
Roll your eyes all you like. I frankly don't care.

Ash

hopelessjoe
August 31, 2008, 09:07 PM
I have owned two "cheap" POS guns and I will never own another one again. You do get what you pay for.

She got lucky.

She knew she cheaped out and she paid the price.

At least the media gave people a heads up when it comes to shoddy American guns.

The gun industry isn't subject to regulations, maybe it is time that proof standards become the bare minimum before any gun hits the market.

There are too many cheap guns that are more likely to do harm the honest owner. All because they can't afford a high dollar gun and dishonest companies will sacrifice safety for profit.

Ash
August 31, 2008, 10:41 PM
Yeah, but there are legions of Belgian and Spanish-proofed revolvers from the 1880's through 1920 that are not any better. (Of course, there are many Belgian and Spanish revolvers and pistols that are good, so this is not a blanket condemnation). Also, there are the West German-proofed western-style revolvers as well as the RG revolvers (and others) that were no good. Being proofed does not mean it will last, only that it won't explode on the first shot.

Ash

230RN
August 31, 2008, 10:47 PM
Clipper:

Quote:
That's a highly-stressed area in "ejection-port-locked" guns. The breech is forced back by the cartridge head, and the pressure forces the front ledge of the barrel against the front edge of the slide port cutout, resulting in high tensional stresses in the area of the ejection port on the slide. (Ref: Post 8)

So what? the Savage 99 uses the ejection port to lock up, and is renowned for it's strength. good design can't make up for poor metallurgy though. A Savage 99 made of recycled beercans or whatever would be a POS now, wouldn't it?

Just explaining why you don't want crappy or shaved metal in this area.

Thanks, Ash. Can't figure out why there was a negative flavor to Clipper's remark above, when all I was doing was pointing out why you don't chintz out in this area.

Savage didn't.

Beretta did.

And so did Talon.

XDKingslayer
August 31, 2008, 10:52 PM
Everyone seems to be blaming the gun. This was at a private range. Don't most now require that you use their ammo, most likely reloads?

Any info on it possibly being a double charge?

JohnBT
September 1, 2008, 12:03 AM
Frame & slide = "alloy metal"

Does that mean pot metal? Zinc? I wonder what the barrels are made of?

"New from Talon Industries, the T200 9mm double-action-only features a lock breach, load indicator and a 10-round magazine capacity. The T200 weighs 20 ounces, measures 6 inches long and 1 inch wide. The hammer, firing pin and component parts are made from heat treated 416 stainless steal. The frame and slide are an alloy metal and the grip is glass-filled polymer.

COPYRIGHT 2000 Publishers' Development Corporation
COPYRIGHT 2000 Gale Group"

230RN
September 1, 2008, 03:04 AM
Thanks, JohnBT:

"The hammer, firing pin and component parts are made from heat treated 416 stainless steal (sic). The frame and slide are an alloy metal and the grip is glass-filled polymer."

And there you have it.

Braggin' about the internals made of heat treated 416 stainless steel, but saying the slide is an "alloy metal."

I think I'm going to forward a link to this thread to Kel-Tec and see how they comment, since the Talon gun in question seems to be almost exactly the same design as their PF-9.

JohnBT
September 1, 2008, 08:17 AM
I haven't checked the design similarities, but the materials are substantially different.

"The P-32 has six main component groups: barrel, slide, firing mechanism, grip, and magazine. The barrel is made of SAE 4140 ordnance steel, heat treated to 48 HRC. The slide is also 4140 steel, and contains the firing pin and the extractor. The rectangular frame is machined from solid 7075-T6 aluminum and houses the firing mechanism." - KT site

Cannonball888
September 1, 2008, 09:34 AM
the Jennings family has put food on the table for years from the Raven onwards
Yeah, the Jennings-22 and Raven-25 were my main deer pistols. :rolleyes:

Hot brass
September 1, 2008, 01:54 PM
WOW! That is horrible. The younglady spoke very well.

230RN
September 1, 2008, 02:22 PM
"The P-32 has six main component groups: barrel, slide, firing mechanism, grip, and magazine. The barrel is made of SAE 4140 ordnance steel, heat treated to 48 HRC. The slide is also 4140 steel, and contains the firing pin and the extractor. The rectangular frame is machined from solid 7075-T6 aluminum and houses the firing mechanism." - Kel Tec site

Thanks yet again, JohnBT !

Saves me the trouble of writing to them or doing any more research. I'll take that as a positive indication that their P3T is made from HTG* steel. The manual also says it "will accept +P ammuniton, however, not with continuous use."

My slide seems quite dense, unlike "pot metal" or sintered steel, and "rings" appropriately when tapped with a hunk of steel. (230RN's El-Cheapo Non-Destructive Testing Laboratory technique --this beats weighing it, then immersing it in water and weighing it again to establish its actual specific gravity*.)

10e6 TNX!

-------
* "Honest-To-Gawd"

** Google Archimede's principle.

Harley Quinn
September 1, 2008, 04:01 PM
With those little inexpensive pistols it is best to stay with 22 or 25 I believe, no talon ammo either :uhoh:

The total distruction of the slide :confused:is really something... The chamber is the item that contains the pressures. Must have been using some real hot loads, no matter what is mentioned, I would think:eek:

kingjoey
September 1, 2008, 05:09 PM
I would suspect that the slide is made from some sort of cheap zinc alloy

melissam
September 1, 2008, 05:45 PM
no they were not reloads..they were Winchester 9mm luger 115gr full metal jacket.. my friend had just picked them up from the store like 4 days ago.. and i said private range because im not going to give the name out. and i DID NOt buy the gun..it was my friends gun.. 2 people shot it before me and then i shot it 2 times and the second time is when it exploded.

230RN
September 1, 2008, 09:03 PM
"The chamber is the item that contains the pressures."

The chamber only contains the sidewise (radial) pressure. Those two thin rails at each side of the ejection port contain the longitudinal pressure.

They are stretched (put in tension) by the force of the pressure on the breech face being transferred to the locking surface on the front of the ejection port through those two thin pieces of metal around the ejection port.

That's what broke that gun --because the crappy material in those two thin portions of the slide could not take that tension.

Hello, Melissa and welcome! I hope you are feeling better and have a complete recovery.

I also hope this does not discourage you from more shooting. Bear in mind that billions and billions of rounds are fired every year in this country without mishap.

Falling off horses and getting back on and all that stuff.

Just don't get back on a horse named Talon.

Or Lorca, etc.

Drgong
September 1, 2008, 10:59 PM
Yeah, the Jennings-22 and Raven-25 were my main deer pistols.

Not that they put food on the table for the buyers, they earned the jennings family millions.

Sheldon J
September 1, 2008, 11:08 PM
N glad U R on the mend.

Drgong
September 1, 2008, 11:10 PM
Glad your doing better Melissa...

esmith
September 1, 2008, 11:11 PM
Even though what happened was awful and obviously very painful, it could have been worse. Be glad no shrapnel had hit your eyes, you could be missing something much worse. Im going to assume you were wearing safety eyeglasses though.

SamG.
September 1, 2008, 11:17 PM
I smell a lawsuit. And a REALLY crappy handgun that no one should buy.

esmith
September 1, 2008, 11:18 PM
I smell a lawsuit. And a REALLY crappy handgun that no one should buy.


A lawsuit on a company that doesn't exist. Why do you think they don't exist anymore?

BigStick
September 2, 2008, 02:15 AM
Is there a website that has a list of firearms with known safety problems? A list of manufacturer recalls would also be helpful when purchasing used firearms. If not, someone should create one. This is something I would prefer to be proactive about instead of waiting until a gun blows up in my face.

billdeserthills
September 2, 2008, 02:46 AM
Jimenez is back in business, they are owned by Shining Star Industries
Still making Saturday Night Specials, have a very inexpensive deal currently as all of their fine? weapons are coming with a second magazine at no extra charge. You don't really want to check out their website though, too many broken guns in need of repair there!

billdeserthills
September 2, 2008, 02:49 AM
Tell you something Sam G., most any gun will explode if you feed it incorrectly or how about a squib load? Saw a guy at a gun show last year, his Kahr PM-9 blew up. He was supposedly shooting winchester white box at the time, he had pics and all the evidence too. That work "Handload" is the end of any proposed lawsuit against any entity.
Just read your post Melissa, sounds to me like Winchester White Box has struck again!

230RN
September 2, 2008, 02:56 AM
^
Melissa herself has said it was not a handload.

She also did not report any abnormality with the first shot, so apparently it was not a squib load.

I would like to see the ejected case on the second shot, if it's still available (doubtful, of course), to determine who is at fault. If the case showed evidence of high pressure, I'd offer that the ammo manufacturer should be liable. If not, then it was clearly the gun manufacturer.

Right now, I'm thinking of the Ford Pinto gas tank and the Chevy pickup truck side-saddle tanks.

Too bad the principals of that company are starting up again, according to one of the above posts.

Too bad corporations like this exist.

As a famous American Jurist (Learned Hand?) once said, "The trouble with corporations is they have neither a soul to damn nor an ass to kick."

ArfinGreebly
September 2, 2008, 03:19 AM
Well, howdy, Melissa, and welcome to The High Road.

Can you tell us any more about the actual gun and the type of ammo? (No, I don't think it was the ammo, as this gun's design seems to be a "surprise" waiting to happen.)

There's plenty of 9mm target ammo out there, and it might be interesting to have a feel for what brand was in play.

What do you normally shoot?

Oh, and one last question, from the video, it looked like you were shooting right-handed and sighting with your left eye (kind of like what my daughter does), am I seeing that correctly?

Thanks for joining us. Hope you'll stick around.

yongxingfreesty
September 2, 2008, 03:33 AM
glad you are okay and looks like you have already recovered.

stay safe and practive safe shooting

bogie
September 2, 2008, 03:50 AM
e was pointing out that every gun product associated with Davis is a piece of junk.

Gwinch, et al... I'll have to differ...

I wouldn't carry one of Davis' little semis, but their deringers from a few years back really weren't half bad.

I'm suspect that the problem in this case wasn't in the frame, but was in the lockup - maybe the thing wasn't lubed, something caught, over-pressure, catastrophic fail?

IMHO, with as much metal as one can put in the frames, that really shouldn't be the part one would expect to fail.

bogie
September 2, 2008, 05:50 AM
oops - squib, then a kaboom...

Ash
September 2, 2008, 09:31 AM
The frame did not fail but the slide which broke into two pieces, the rear doing the damage. This is always possible on any pistol which reaches the end of its recoil and suddenly stops. That it does not happen with other pistols is the use of proper materials. Even when slides fail on quality pistols, the failure is in the form of a crack. I can't say I have ever heard of another design having the slide break in half (even after double-charged loads or other failures where the pistol literally breaks into pieces).

Ash

XDKingslayer
September 2, 2008, 11:40 AM
Thank you for clearing that up Melissa. Hope you heal up and continue shooting.

melissam
September 2, 2008, 04:02 PM
yea i am right handed and i use my left eye..its just something ive always done...

and i think i know what i was shooting..i was there.. they were NOT reloads or anything like that my friend got the brand new at the store.. they were Winchester 9mm luger 115gr full metal jacket they came in a box of 100 and says made in the usa...


yea im doing alot better..my lip is almost to size..i get the stitches out tomorrow and talk to him about plastic surgery...

melissam
September 2, 2008, 04:05 PM
i cant get the pictures to load on here or else i would show you everything..i got pictures.. that way no one can tell me i was using reloads.

Headless
September 2, 2008, 04:17 PM
E-mail them to me, and I will post them for you, if you'd like. I am sending you a private message with my address now. click on 'USER CP' on the top right corner of your forum screen, then choose 'private messages' to find my message.

Edit:

Freakin OWWW. Doesn't look like hand loads to me...

Headless
September 2, 2008, 04:32 PM
Aaand, second batch of pics...

melissam
September 2, 2008, 04:38 PM
btw it doesnt matter if they are still around or not..there always can be a case.. but i found when talon went under as you guys know davis took over then they went under but what i found out is that Cobra industries took over... that is what i found and i was told..idk anyone else found that??

TX1911fan
September 2, 2008, 04:39 PM
Ouch! Glad you are healing up. I'm also glad this hasn't caused you to give up shooting.

Looking at the barrel and chamber, it doesn't look like a squib to me. No bulging or other damage that I can see. Looks to me like a crappy slide.

melissam
September 2, 2008, 04:39 PM
thank you for putting them on here for me..

melissam
September 2, 2008, 04:42 PM
ill try to put up a picture after i come back from getting my top stitches out tomorrow..no i havent giving up im just staying away from ones that have a slide on them just for a little bit..do you blame me....

Headless
September 2, 2008, 04:47 PM
LOL, no. I like revolvers too :) No problem on the pics. If you have trouble with the other when you get back, send it to the same place and i'll put that up too.

XDKingslayer
September 2, 2008, 05:20 PM
ill try to put up a picture after i come back from getting my top stitches out tomorrow..no i havent giving up im just staying away from ones that have a slide on them just for a little bit..do you blame me....

Well, if you're almost killed in a Dodge Neon would you swear off cars all together and drive nothing but trucks, or would you buy a better car?

Shame to pass up an oppertunity to drive a Cadillac like a 1911 because your Neon almost did you in...

Ash
September 2, 2008, 05:30 PM
Well, if I'd had my lip eviscerated like that, I would be leery, too. The Talon isn't a Neon, it's not even a Yugo. It's a dangerous, poorly-designed product. Neither the Neon nor Yugo explode when they are started up using normal gasoline under normal conditions.

Ash

rswartsell
September 2, 2008, 07:13 PM
Just glad you are OK Melissa. If you are thinking about suing maybe you should get legal advice about how to handle posts on the internet.

To be clear I am not implying that you are doing anything wrong, just that your attorney should guide you about every facet of this unfortunate incident.

.cheese.
September 2, 2008, 07:29 PM
wow.... thanks for the heads up Melissa and good luck on any surgery you have.

Anybody know if Cobra is marketing the same or a similarly built gun under their name? I certainly want to be sure to stay away from it if it exists.

Have you spoken to the plastic surgeon about the possibility of keloid scars developing and how to deal with them? If not, it might be a good time to do so.

SCKimberFan
September 2, 2008, 07:42 PM
I think there are a few folks confused about the post I added. The one I posted was another person (in this case a guy) who may have used handloaded ammo. However, same gun, same result.

Two different posts about the same model of gun.

Welcome Melissa, sorry about all the confusion.

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