Full length guide rod on my 1911 discovery.


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SureThing
September 12, 2008, 09:01 PM
My Charles Daly 1911 came with a Ed Brown full lenght guide rod. I put the stock guide rod back in, and noticed the slide to frame fit seemed a bit more loose. So it appears the full length guide rod gives the appearance of a tighter slide to frame fit.

Anyone else notice this.

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NonConformist
September 12, 2008, 09:17 PM
Makes sense!

Black Majik
September 12, 2008, 09:36 PM
Same applies to my Kimber Classic Royal. It's nice and tight with a FLGR, without it there's a bit of rattle.

SureThing
September 12, 2008, 09:38 PM
Here is the question. Do you think that some of the tight custom guns, that have had problems cycling would benefit from a standard guide rod.

If AK'a and Glocks have taught us anything, it is that loose is more dependable.

kcshooter
September 12, 2008, 09:50 PM
I won't use a FLGR. I see no benefit, I like old-school press checks, and another part rubbing and adding friction to the equation is something I can do without. 1911 recoil springs don't bind, and all of my 1911's are tuned and tight enough, yet still loose enough.

SureThing
September 12, 2008, 10:00 PM
I think I need a stiffer recoil spring, it is throwing the brass 10+ feet. Should I move up to a 18lb?

TexasRifleman
September 12, 2008, 10:13 PM
I think I need a stiffer recoil spring, it is throwing the brass 10+ feet. Should I move up to a 18lb?

Tuning that with the spring is a recipe for problems. The slower you let the slide go back the faster it's gonna slam forward.

Tuning ejection with the spring just means your magazine has to be in better shape to keep up and increases the chance you won't get a slidelock on the last round.

Would you slam the slide home on an empty chamber? No, because it beats up the gun. Changing to a heavier recoil spring when it's not necessary does exactly the same thing over time.

In the extreme a too heavy recoil spring can destroy the extractor by going so fast that new rounds, rather than sliding up under the extractor, get into position so fast that the extractor has to snap over the rim of the cartridge.

The 1911 recoil spring exists to keep the frame from being battered, and to chamber a new round.

Tune the ejection with the ejector, not the spring. They are cheap and easy to replace, so you can grind away on them til you get it just like you want, with no harm done.

But, if your brass is leaving with the exact same trajectory every time that's a very good thing, even 10 feet away.

That said, in a full size 1911 an 18lb spring really won't hurt much, it's when you get to the extremes that you need to be careful. But if you are seeing reliable feeding and slidelock with a 16 pound spring I'd really think hard about changing that.

I run 15 or 16 in my full size 1911's. Some throw the brass to next week some drop them at your feet, depending on the shape of the ejector.

A good write up on extractors and ejectors:

http://www.brazoscustom.com/magart/ejection%20perfection.htm


As for the FLGR's, that's religion not technology :)

steelyblue
September 12, 2008, 10:16 PM
My Dan Wesson is dang tight with the Gi configuration. My Kimbers outshoot it, though.

kcshooter
September 12, 2008, 10:38 PM
Tune the ejection with the ejector, not the spring.That said, in a full size 1911 an 18lb spring really won't hurt much, it's when you get to the extremes that you need to be careful. Agreed on both counts. Heavy springs also beat up on the lugs and other critical parts. Maybe not too badly at 18lbs but I prefer to avoid any undue wear without a good reason. Also, how old is the spring in it now? It could be that you need to replace it due to round count or age. You said it came with an Ed Brown FLGR but you put it back to factory, if you bought it used, don't trust the original owners round count. Order a new 16lb spring from Wolff if you aren't sure. There's no reason to increase the spring weight. My Dan Wesson is dang tight with the Gi configuration. My Kimbers outshoot it, though.That ain't due to the FLGR, no matter what the box it came in says.

SureThing
September 12, 2008, 10:52 PM
Thanks for the info, any other good 1911 websites other than 1911.org?

TexasRifleman
September 12, 2008, 10:55 PM
That ain't due to the FLGR, no matter what the box it came in says.

Probably true. I happen to like the FLGRs because I sense, and it may just be mental, that the little extra weight forward helps me get back on target quicker during recoil.

I've run FLGR's in every 1911 I own and nothing else. Never caused any reliability problems but I can't say that it ever prevented any either.

Like I say, religion :)

Now, the 2 pieces suck! If you do want to go full length get a 1 piece.
The 2 pieces will come unscrewed, and usually at the worst possible moment.

hags
September 13, 2008, 12:57 AM
Here is the question. Do you think that some of the tight custom guns, that have had problems cycling would benefit from a standard guide rod.

If AK'a and Glocks have taught us anything, it is that loose is more dependable.

Uh, what "custom" guns are these? My Baer doesn't have a FLGR and it's fine. Nice and tight and cycles anything. I have not had any problems with it.
My "home" built Caspian is also super tight and has had no issues.

If you can change the slide to frame fit by changing guide rods from full length to standard then the fit is crap to start with.

I won't not bump the recoil spring up in weight due to the problems you're having. I put an 18 pound in my Kimber and the bottom lug started to peen.

hags
September 13, 2008, 01:08 AM
Where's the range report and pictures of your new EAA Witness EM?

You didn't sell it already did you?

SureThing
September 13, 2008, 10:00 AM
Hags,

I finally got to shoot it yesterday, I was on vacation all last week at Myrtle Beach. I will post a full review later.

Do you know if the grips for a CZ 97 will fit the Match? Being it is large framed, I don't have the grip options my 75's have.

hags
September 13, 2008, 10:11 AM
Vacation, what's that? Don't have time for such luxuries.


No, I don't. You can order full length checkered wood grips from EAA.

The Bushmaster
September 13, 2008, 10:51 AM
kcshooter. My Colt 1911 has a Wilson FLGR and I'm able to press check it. And my Kimber Ultra Crimson Carry II came with a FLGR and I can press check it too...

Will you be at the Missouri Carry picnic on Oct 4th?

hags
September 13, 2008, 10:59 AM
To check chamber condition with a FLGR, grap the top of the slide with your left hand, put your thumb through the trigger guard, squeeze.
Works really well once you get the hang of it.
;)

kcshooter
September 13, 2008, 04:27 PM
Now, the 2 pieces suck! If you do want to go full length get a 1 piece.
The 2 pieces will come unscrewed, and usually at the worst possible moment.Although my religion strictly forbids FLGR's, if you do go to this route, I agree completely with the one-piece.

My Colt 1911 has a Wilson FLGR and I'm able to press check it. And my Kimber Ultra Crimson Carry II came with a FLGR and I can press check it tooOld skool press checks: right thumb retaining hammer, left thumb in front edge or trigger guard, middle or index finger over recoil spring plug, slide gets moved back just enough to visually see round (or in the dark, get index finger into breach area to feel for chambered round). FLGR's won't allow you to push on the plug if they don't have one, and while there are other ways, this is my personal prefered method. YMMV.

If you like the FLGR, that's fine, but with no benefit to it, I avoid them. If there was a purpose served, I'd consider it, but there just isn't, so I'll stick with GI's.

Will you be at the Missouri Carry picnic on Oct 4thGot a link? I know nothing about it.

SureThing
September 13, 2008, 06:57 PM
I have no opinion as of yet. But the standard does make field stripping easier.

Walkalong
September 13, 2008, 09:20 PM
Now, the 2 pieces suck! If you do want to go full length get a 1 piece.
The 2 pieces will come unscrewed, and usually at the worst possible moment.
Huge plus 1



Not all full length guide rods stop you from press checking your weapon. They are not quite all the same. ;)

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