.45ACP Brass Question - TZZ


September 14, 2008, 10:05 PM
I reload .45ACP for plinking. I found some Brass with the headstamp "TZZ 86" at the range last week. I looked it up and believe that it is Israli Mil Surp made in 1986. It looked pretty good so I picked it up.

I used RCBC dies and a Rock Chucker. I cleaned up the TZZ Brass, resized it and expanded the case mouths just enough to accept my Rainier bullets.

When I went to set my bullets abouut 33% of the case mouths were too loose. I could push the bullets in with my thumb. I usually set the bullets and then apply a small taper crimp in separate steps. I apply just enough crimp to take the bell out of the casemouths and have the cartridge drop smoothly in the barrel of my Sig 220. I know that's an extra step but I get a good feel of setting the bullet and crimping that way.

Anyway.......I pulled those bullets (all good .451) and will fire off the primers and scrap those cartridges. But.......I can''t figure out how the case mouth can be TOO BIG after going thru the Resizing Die? Anybody have experience with this problem?


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September 14, 2008, 10:24 PM
I have some nickel-plated remington and peters brass (mostly .38spl) that is always too loose after resizing. The only thing holding my cast bullets in is the roll crimp. I just use them for light target rounds so it doesn't bother me much.

I think that the brass is very thin on this brand brass for some reason. I've seen that as an explanation on other threads. Never bothered to measure, and I just shoot them until the case splits and toss them.

I'd probably be a bit more cautious in an auto than in a revolver. In the revolver the forces tend to pull the bullets out, but in the auto it tends to push the bullets back, which is more dangerous.

Anyway if the sizer is the right size, and the bullet is the right size, and the bullet doesn't fit right then there must not be enough material in the case mouth. Either that or the brass is springing back somehow after sizing.


Jim Watson
September 14, 2008, 10:58 PM
I have a large stock of TZZ (Israeli) .45 ACP and it loads just fine with all jacketed and cast bullets tried. On the other hand, I never could get satisfactory performance out of the Rainier plated bullets in that or any other brass.

Does other brass have adequate bullet pull with those bullets?

September 14, 2008, 11:44 PM
Your TZZ brass was made by Isreali Military Industries in 1986. IMI won quite a few U.S. military contracts for ammunition during this time, so your brass was probably part of that.

I've had no issues with either IMI or TZZ brass in any caliber, and certainly not in .45 acp. I would look at your expander plug and see what the diameter is. I've found TZZ brass to usually be on the thicker side as far as wall thickness is concerned.

Hope this helps.


Steve C
September 15, 2008, 12:34 AM
Happens some times with thin brass, just crimp them a bit tighter than simply removing the case mouth belling.

evan price
September 15, 2008, 01:00 AM
I had a similar problem with .45 hardball bullets from military surplus. I just adjusted my taper crimp down a bit tighter and the problem went away.
Your TZZ brass is Israeli, and it's good stuff. I have TZZ Match brass in lots somewhere, never had any trouble with it.

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