[baxter007]

Hello all. I'm brand new to this forum. I'm interested in pricing and maybe selling my 1931 Colt 38 "Fitzgerald Special" Detective Special. Any ideas? I know a little about guns but I'm no expert. I do know that this is a pretty rare gun. It's in pretty good shape. Only problem is that my dad engraved his drivers license in the metal in two places.

[The Lone Haranguer]

From a collector's standpoint, its value will only be as a shooter unless there is a factory letter or some other proof that J.H. FitzGerald ("Fitz") personally performed the work. Anyone could have cut away the front section of trigger guard at some later date.

[baxter007]

No, this is the genuine article. My grandfather bought it and gave it to my dad.

[kingpin008]

And even if it was lettered/verified as being a true Fitz, the engraving your dad added will almost certainly reduce the collector's value. I don't personally know much about revolver value, but you might want to contact XavierBreath on here. (he's one of the Mods) He's got quite a bit of knowledge, and if memory serves, he's profiled the Fitz Special variant on his blog a few times in the past.

Good luck!

[Larry Ashcraft]

Sounds like a really neat piece!

Moving this to revolvers where maybe XB or some of the other experts will chime in.

[The Lone Haranguer]

No, this is the genuine article. My grandfather bought it and gave it to my dad.
Then a factory letter is in order. I would not pay a premium for a "Fitz Special" without proof it is genuine, i.e., "Fitz" personally did the work. Otherwise you just have an old Colt revolver with the hammer spur and trigger guard cut off. This is not to doubt or impugn anyone, just business. :) (Hypothetically speaking.)

[Meowhead]

pics please.

[rcmodel]

See this post by dfariswheel to verify the VP proof mark is where it should be on a factory made Fitz Special.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=4858196&postcount=7

If it isn't, it isn't!

rcmodel

[kingpin008]

Wow, learn something new every day! Thanks RC. :)

[baxter007]

Here's some pics. Thanks for all the great info and taking it easy on a newbie! It has the VP stamp and all the other stuff but not the checkered hammer.

[dfariswheel]

Due to the great rarity of genuine Fitz Colt's the value can be high today.
However, also due to the rarity and value, the Fitz Colt's have been counterfeited, INCLUDING to the extent of having a fake Colt letter.

Such is the case, that today, without a Colt factory letter ALL Fitz guns are suspect to potential buyers, no matter what the history.
In your case, since the value could be significant, you will almost have to have a recent Colt letter in hand before anyone will pay the true value.

Due to the few Fitz Colt's that come up for sale, it's almost impossible to give any kind of close estimation of value.
I'd guess that the best price would probably come in an online gun auction on Gun Broker, and that would HAVE to have the Colt letter as a estimate to it's authenticity.

http://www.coltsmfg.com/cmci/historical.asp
Note the links to researchable models and letter prices on the right.

http://www.gunbroker.com/

[Old Fuff]

I agree with Dfairswheel, and I believe that Colt will confirm an original letter for less cost then getting a new one. In any case a new letter or confirmation from Colt is necessary.

To correct one point: Mr. Fitzgerald did not personally make all of these revolvers, and most of them were done-up In Colt's service and repair department. However the genuine guns were noted in the shipping records, and if Colt made it you will find it there.

Because of the custom nature of these revolvers they were not all exactly alike, and it is quite possible that for whatever reason they didn't checker the top of the hammer - although it was a Fitz feature. The greater question is, "Do the other points check out" and "Does Colt confirm that it's genuine?"

[bill boucher]

Did colt ever do the colt fitz in gold? I have a 1933 colt fitz that I have been able to verify the date and serial # on but the gun is in gold plated. I'm just looking for information on this gun.

[rcmodel]

It seems highly improbable that Colt made any Fitz Specials in 1993.

Even that long ago, the corporate layers would have had a heart attack over selling a gun without a trigger guard!

Sounds like somebody just had it chopped, along with the gold plating.

rcmodel

[bill boucher]

The serial # on the colt fitz detective special that I am asking about is 414xxx which my records show was made in 1933. I know that someone has gold plated it. The plate is well done. Is there a serial # list of Fitz produced weapons?

[rcmodel]

Sorry, I could have sworn it said 1993 when I replied!

No, there is no serial number list.

As already noted, it was a custom order option while Fitzgerald was at Colt between WWI and WWII.

It was also a very popular DIY job for a lot of years after.

The only sure way to know is a factory letter.

rcmodel

[Old Fuff]

I am aware of a factory Fitz Special that was made on a .38 Cobra platform. It was of course a special order, and the owner was a New York City police official. I think it dates from the late 1950's or early 1960's, but it could be later. I suspect that if I had ordered such a revolver I would have been turned down.

I am also aware of another Fitz that was made at the factory on an Official Police frame, and was nickel plated. Colt did make handguns on special order with various combinations of blue or nickel, silver and gold plating - usually with engraving and pearl or ivory stocks. However the gents who carried such hardware as a Fitz most often went for plain ol' blue with walnut stocks. Rex Applegate was an exception, as his had ivory stocks.

As an aside: I was once told by an officer in the U.K.'s S.A.S. that their opertives working in the tropics sometimes carried Colt 1903 (hammerless) Pocket Automatics that were nickel plated and had ivory stocks, in white shoulder holsters no less. The reason was that this combination was less likely to be seen through the lightweight white linen suit jackets they wore on undercover missions.

Nobody told James Bond... :D

[Vern Humphrey]

Fitz is burning in hell for butchering so many fine Colts.

[Old Fuff]

Fitz is burning in hell for butchering so many fine Colts.

I doubt it.... :)

His efforts in a number of fields, but most particular - law enforcement and target shooter sales - helped pull Colt through the black years of the Great Depression (1929 - 1940). He was the company's public face and number one promoter. Obviously they could use someone like him today.

[Blacksmoke]

Maybe I am dense but why would anyone want to cut the trigger guard?

[dfariswheel]

The idea was, no obstruction in front of the trigger for a ultra-fast shot.

Of course, this is considered today to be ultra-unsafe, as a number of people have found out the hard way over the years.

Fitz intended these things to be carried in a canvas or leather lined pants pocket.
Due to the open trigger guard you really can't holster it safely, and sticking it in the waist band is really dumb.
Also, the trigger guard can bend easily on these softer pre-war guns, and the trigger can fail to return and reset.

In the Texas Ranger museum at Waco, they have a pair of Colt 1911 automatics owned by Ranger captain "Lone Wolf" Gonzales.
They're highly engraved and inlaid, and were given the Fitz treatment..... No trigger guards.

Like a lot of gun fads, the Fitz idea died off due to impracticality.
However, every time a gun magazine shows a picture of a Fitz, you can count on any type of Fitz style revolver showing up at the gun shop within a few months, as soon as the owner realizes there's no really good way to actually carry one.

[Old Fuff]

Maybe I am dense but why would anyone want to cut the trigger guard?

The Fitz Special, named after John Fitzgerald who worked for Colt, was conceived as a revolver to be carried in a gentleman’s side pants pocket. The purpose of cutting away the front of the trigger guard was so that the trigger finger could wrap around the trigger while the gun was still confined within the pocket.

Today of course the whole idea is condemned as being dangerous. I once ask Charlie Askins about that. His personal body count was supposedly double-digit, and he not only cut away the guard on his pocket guns, but holstered sidearms as well. He unquestionably spoke from a position of unequaled knowledge and experience.

He looked at me for a moment and then said, “well there are a lot of things more dangerous that happen in a fight then a cut-away trigger guard.”

In my experience the amputated guard will buy you a split second when the revolver (or pistol for that matter) is carried in a pocket. Split seconds often make the difference between life and… whatever. Askins never felt obligated to give the other guy an even break, and eventually he died of old age. Somewhere in there, they're is a message.

As has been mentioned, all of the Fitz Specials that were made at the Colt factory were custom ordered, as they were never cataloged. Most of them were channeled through Mr. Fitzgerald himself, and the individuals that got them read like a whose-who of legendary gunman of the middle 20th century. They were neither incompetent or stupid, and like Askins took any advantage they could get.

[Blacksmoke]

The downside of removing the trigger guard can be experienced when holstering or pocketing the weapon. I knew a Chief of Police who shot himself in the butt and now I know how he did it :evil:.

[Old Fuff]

Well most of the individuals that got factory-made Fitz Specials weren't the kind that shot themselves in their.... well anywhere. :D

It is presumed that when you pocket or holster the piece it isn't cocked, although most of the Colt Fitz Specials did retain the single-action option. The double-action trigger pull of around 10 to 12 pounds wasn't easy to accomplish while reholstering or returning the revolver to one's pocket, unless the person doing it didn't take their finger off the trigger first.

It is not the gun's fault that some users of non-Colt conversions didn't understand that there was no known cure for stupid. :uhoh:

I should mention that most of the more professional users didn't use special pockets, as Fitzgerald did. Pocket and OSW as well as shoulder holsters were common, and designed to cover what was left of the trigger guard.

[Jim Watson]

Or you could do like Bill Jordan and just narrow the trigger guard from the strong hand side. No hangups and no snagging or bending.

[Gordon]

My old NYPD Detective uncle was well aware of Fitzs and said that it was dangerous because the unsupported trigger bow, if slightly knocked in left you with an unweildy black jack.

[Vern Humphrey]

Amen. If you got into a fight and hit someone with your revolver, by better keep hitting, because you weren't going to be able to shoot it after that.

[gizamo]

Interesting thread....

Ever tried to shoot your revolver with gloved fingers. Especially those designed for cold weather? As to holsters.....there are some that lend themselves well to a Fitzed gun

Besides, gotta hand it to Fitz....there's just something so his guns that exudes confidence


http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l163/Gizamo1/Fitz002-1.jpg


Berns Martin Holster...

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l163/Gizamo1/Fitzfits001.jpg

Giz

[Jim Watson]

Someone, Elmer Keith, maybe, said that Mrs. Fitzgerald liked jewelry. Apparently Mr Fitzgerald meant to see that nobody took it away from her. That he carried a Fitz in each front pants pocket and was seldom seen without one hand in his pocket.

[Old Fuff]

Amen. If you got into a fight and hit someone with your revolver, by better keep hitting, because you weren't going to be able to shoot it after that.

Don't think that men like Col. Askins ever went around hitting folks with their revolvers. They used them to shoot people. He did mention an incident where a Border Patrolman hit someone 'long side of the noggin with a 1911 pistol. Thereafter the frame pointed in one direction while the slide in a slightly different one. Through most of his Border Patrol years, and through Africa and Italy during WW2 he had his .38 New Service Colt with the amputated trigger guard. He wasn't particularly gentle, but that trigger guard never got bent.

The Fitz Special was made for a particular kind of person, and for them it worked well.

[Vern Humphrey]

Askins would probably have been charged with manslaughter, at least for some of his shootings.

But many a cop, with a choice between buffaloing a suspect and shooting him, took the former course of action.

[Old Fuff]

But many a cop, with a choice between buffaloing a suspect and shooting him, took the former course of action.

True, but when done correctly you strike with the side of the barrel, not the bottom of the frame where the trigger guard is.

And at best, a pocket revolver isn't particularly good for the purpose. :uhoh: ;)

[Gordon]

You old guys talking about proper pistol whipping is like ancient greek to these young uns :p

[Old Fuff]

Pistol whipping, sometimes called "buffaloing" during the 19th century, is a lost art. It went hopelessly out of style when everybody switched to plastic pistols. However most pistols don't make good hitting tools. It isn't what they were made for, and Fitz Specials aside, smart people who intend to have their handguns shoot don't use them as a club. ;)

[Beagle-zebub]

That under-barrel fin on some of those 19th century Remington revolvers would have done nicely for buffaloing.

[Old Fuff]

Uh.... The idea was to knock someone out, not axe them... :what: :evil: :D

[Vern Humphrey]

True, but when done correctly you strike with the side of the barrel, not the bottom of the frame where the trigger guard is.
Sometimes you don't have a choice.

And at best, a pocket revolver isn't particularly good for the purpose.
But when you carry a pocket revolver, you are stuck with it when the fight starts.

[Old Fuff]

But when you carry a pocket revolver, you are stuck with it when the fight starts.

Well I have been known to carry a Colt Single Action Army, which has an excellent and well established reputation for working well as a club, what with the cylinder mounted on a solid pin, supported at both ends of the frame.

But these days I don't think it's seen as being the best choice for a self-protection weapon, and besides I don't hit prople over the head.

I, like a lot of people, are most likely to be found carrying a pocket revolver. On two occasions in my life I have been confronted by others who I think intended to do me harm. In both cases when they discovered I was armed the departed in a hurry. If they hadn't and pressed an attack someone would have probably got shot.

A law enforcement officer is in an entirely different position, as he or she is charged with the responsibility of going after, and apprehending criminals, and the apprehending part can be very dangerous. For this reason their choice of arms may be much different then mine.

Today most of those in the law enforcement profession carry high-cap pistols with polymer frames, and I think hardly any of them consider using them to club anyone.

To return to the original subject; the Fitz Special was intended to be carried in a pocket, and the design was dictated by the purpose. At the time it was far less controversial then it is now, but even then some knowledgeable people didn’t approve of it. On the other hand some very experienced individuals such as Charles Askins, Rex Applegate and William Fairbairn did, and these gentlemen all knew their way around a gunfight. It still remains as an innovate solution to a particular situation that was favored by some, and rejected by others. You could say the same about any defensive handgun that was ever made. I doubt that we will see very many more. Besides being out of favor the Colt revolvers that were the basis for conversion are no longer being made. Smith & Wesson and Ruger revolvers are not particularly good platforms for the modification. But the fact remains that Fitz Specials were carried by a lot of users that didn’t depend on theory when they made their choices – which are as valid today as they were then.

[Vern Humphrey]

Well I have been known to carry a Colt Single Action Army, which has an excellent and well established reputation for working well as a club, what with the cylinder mounted on a solid pin, supported at both ends of the frame.

But these days I don't think it's seen as being the best choice for a self-protection weapon, and besides I don't hit prople over the head.

But back in the days when the Fitz Special was all the rage, it was common practice for officers to use their guns as clubs in fights.

[Old Fuff]

But back in the days when the Fitz Special was all the rage, it was common practice for officers to use their guns as clubs in fights.

True, and even before The Fitz was ever thought of. But sometimes after a hard hit the revolver wouldn't work for its intended purpose anymore... :eek:

But anyway, I get the impression that those that carried Fitz Specials were not the kind that used their sidearms to hit someone with. Others made different chocies.

The genuine Fitz Special was a custom made gun, and the total number wasn't very high, especially when compared to the total number of the basic platforms they were built on is considered.

Then, as now, most people - including police officers - carried plain, stock handguns.

[Vern Humphrey]

True -- and then as now, radical modifications to handguns was unwise.

Would anyone here take a pocket revolver and cut off the front of the trigger guard?

[Old Fuff]

Would anyone here take a pocket revolver and cut off the front of the trigger guard?

Put it this way... I have been known to do so. :what: :D

Not saying I still would, but I might... :evil:

[gizamo]

The goal was to hit the opponent with the butt end. I have had and seen many LEO grips that had a metal plate screwed to the bottom of their guns grip bottom as a form of reinforcement....

Giz

[Vern Humphrey]

The goal was to hit the opponent with the butt end. I have had and seen many LEO grips that had a metal plate screwed to the bottom of their guns grip bottom as a form of reinforcement....

Yes, but the gun was held in the firing position to deliver the blow -- essentially striking with the little finger and heel of the hand (plus the gun butt.)

In this position, in a real fight, the cop was as likely to hit with the trigger guard as with the butt.

To strike in any other way required reversing the grip, and basically holding the gun by the barrel -- leaving the cop unable to fire, should he have to, and with his own gun pointed at him.

[dfariswheel]

Jeff Cooper spoke to this. He said:
"If you want a sap.... BUY a sap. The pistol should be reserved for it's intended purpose, which is firing bullets".

[gizamo]

Vern,,,,,

And your point is......:)

We will never know. Somewhere out there were a bunch of guys enforcing the law. Back when, sometimes as they saw fit. Nobody kept count.;)

Pistol whipping or Buffaloeing was only as good as the man applying it. If I meant to hit you with the butt of my gun on the noggin' then it just meant that I didn't really mean to kill you in the first place:evil:

Giz

[Vern Humphrey]

My point is, cutting away the front of the trigger guard does nothing for you, and can put a working cop in a situation where his gun can be disabled.

And as I said, you don't see people cutting away the front of the trigger guard nowadays.

[Stan in CT]

Hi,Newbe here. Found this thread while trying to research what I think is a Fitzgerald Special.I inherited a 1930 Colt DS with trigger guard and hammer bobbed and checkered in the manner of the FS. The trigger guard does not, however have the vp stamped at the rear.On the left rear side of the guard is a small number 3.The DS originally belonged to my Dad's business partner. He was a salesman on the road who made collections.He had big hands and thick fingers. He said couldn't fit his finger on the trigger without the cut guard. This was back in the late 30's.

[Old Fuff]

The pieces in your description fit. One clue might be the checkered hammer. Colt usually stamped the checkering (called "coining") rather then cutting the diamonds with a file, but there could be exceptions.

The only way to know for sure would be to obtain a letter from the Colt factory, and I believe that could set you back $100.00 or so. However if the revolver was genuine the increased value would more then make up for the cost of the letter.

[T191032]

Gizamo,

Thats a nice-lookin' .45!

[XavierBreath]

I don't know how I missed this thread! Very informative one it is.... I defer to the expertise of Old Fuff and dfarisweel on the ins and outs of the Fitz Special. I've learned a lot about the subject in this one thread.

I just wanted to say.........
My point is, cutting away the front of the trigger guard does nothing for you, and can put a working cop in a situation where his gun can be disabled.I have had two revolvers, one a Victory Model, the other a Model 10 pass through my hands with a trigger that binded on the trigger guard, rendering the gun inoperable or at least giving it a "sticky trigger."

When you pistol whip someone, a full trigger guard is no guarantee that it will not become bent and disable the gun if it makes skull contact. Of course, a cut away trigger guard is almost certain to do so.

[Old Fuff]

See post #38.

... the Fitz Special was intended to be carried in a pocket, and the design was dictated by the purpose. At the time it was far less controversial then it is now, but even then some knowledgeable people didn’t approve of it. On the other hand some very experienced individuals such as Charles Askins, Rex Applegate and William Fairbairn did, and these gentlemen all knew their way around a gunfight.

The Fitz Special was never intended to be used as a striking weapon. Those that used or advocated it (such as the ones named above) used their sidearms for the intended purpose, which was to shoot, not hit. All of them had been in gunfights, and all of them knew that ones life could hang on a fraction of a second. So if cutting out the front of the trigger guard would gain them an additional fraction they were willing to take the risk. Askins understood those risks - he so much as told me so - but it didn't matter. He had seen handguns rendered useless after the user used it for a club - which it was never intended to be, and he had no intention of making that mistake himself. In his day if someone believed in using a handgun to hit someone with they'd best arm themselves with a Colt New Service, S&W .38-44 Heavy Duty or Colt Single Action Army...

But not a Fitz Special...

[Hawkflyer]

Wow, what a memory tweak. As a kid my Father took me every other year to the NRA meetings in Washington DC. I grew up with guys like Askins, Keith, Weatherby, and many others. This thread just took me back 50 years. Unfortunately those guys are all gone and we could really use them today.

My father was given a "Fitz" Special by Fitzgerald himself, or "Fitz" as Dad called him. By Dads description "Fitz" was a character. He carried a gun in each pocket and had his cloths tailored to that purpose, even adding pockets. One of his famous lines was "If anyone ever shoots me with a .25 auto, and I find out about it I will beat him to death."

The pistol I have is almost pristine. I say almost because it does have the guard cut away in the front and the hammer bobbed. The finish is perfect. Dad said it was new and unfired when it was presented to him and as far as I can tell, it is still in that condition. I know Dad never fired it.

Dad also told me these were designed to be used just as described in this thread with one small addition. One common carry method was in the pocket of the commonly worn overcoats of the day. In that carry mode the method of fire was, put hand in pocket, grab the gun, thrust the hand forward and shoot through the pocket. The gun was never drawn. The cut out guard facilitated getting at the trigger, and the bobbed hammer avoided any hanging up on the pocket as the trigger was pulled.

Thanks for the memorys
Regards

[Storm]

Fascinating thread. Thank you, gentlemen.

Old Fuff, if you haven't already, you should write a book.

[Old Fuff]

Old Fuff, if you haven't already, you should write a book.

It been suggested... :what: Others want to park me in front of a tape recorder... :eek: I need one of those computers where you can talk to it and it will write text... :evil: :D

[Beerme]

The idea was, no obstruction in front of the trigger for a ultra-fast shot.

Of course, this is considered today to be ultra-unsafe, as a number of people have found out the hard way over the years.

Fitz intended these things to be carried in a canvas or leather lined pants pocket.
Due to the open trigger guard you really can't holster it safely, and sticking it in the waist band is really dumb.
Also, the trigger guard can bend easily on these softer pre-war guns, and the trigger can fail to return and reset.

In the Texas Ranger museum at Waco, they have a pair of Colt 1911 automatics owned by Ranger captain "Lone Wolf" Gonzales.
They're highly engraved and inlaid, and were given the Fitz treatment..... No trigger guards.

Like a lot of gun fads, the Fitz idea died off due to impracticality.
However, every time a gun magazine shows a picture of a Fitz, you can count on any type of Fitz style revolver showing up at the gun shop within a few months, as soon as the owner realizes there's no really good way to actually carry one.
http://www.sightm1911.com/1911pix/historic/Texas_Ranger_1911.jpg

[sgt127]

Since this thread popped back up, I suppose I can add a little info to it. In his book 50 Years a Lawman, Clint Peoples (Texas Ranger Captain and US Marshal for Texas) describes how he came upon two bad guys. One began to pull a gun and he smacked him on top of the head with his gun, dropping him where he stood, the second refused to cooperate (may have had knife) and, Clint told him to give up, and, the guy did. According to the story, he was TRYING to shoot him but, discovered that he had bent the trigger guard on his gun and couldn't pull the trigger on the first one. Turns out the guy he hit died from the head injury.

In a more modern era, we actually teach how to use our issue weapons as an impact weapon. (We have a pretty aggressive defensive tactics instructor, I give him alot of credit) We are issued Glocks. The prefered method for using the handgun as an impact weapon is to hold it in the firing position and strike with the top of the slide. In martial arts it would be considered a "ridge hand" blow. Its a lateral swing. Is it considered a good idea to hit someone with your gun? No. Is it another tool in the tool box if you need it? Yeah.

[GuidoTorpedo]

It's informative threads like this that keep me coming back to this site!

Hawkflyer, any pictures of the pristine Fitz?

[Vern Humphrey]

For what it's worth, I have completely tied up an M1911 by using it as a club -- bent the slide enough so that it couldn't be retracted.

[Old Fuff]

According to Charles Askins, a Border Patrolman in El Paso during the late 1930's also put his 1911 out of commission by using it as a club. :eek: I don't think that John Browning intended his pistol to be used for that purpose... :D Askins (who was left handed) soon decided that he liked Colt New Service revolvers better.

During that era it was widely held that if one was determined to use his handgun to hit people with (which wasn't highly recommended) the old Colt six-shooter was the best choice for the purpose, because of its solid frame with the cylinder supported both fore and aft on a heavy center-pin. Also those with experience would hit the object of they're attention from the side, not the top of the head, to insure that a bent trigger guard wouldn't happen.

This works to a degree with revolvers, but pistols are another matter... :uhoh:

[Guillermo]

I have completely tied up an M1911 by using it as a club -- bent the slide enough so that it couldn't be retracted.

:what:

WOW

what were the circumstances?

[Old Fuff]

Actually it isn't the slide that gets bent. The blow to the slide bends the frame, and it doesn't take much to prevent the slide from going back and forth. :eek:

[ddixie884]

ttt......................................

[whitecoyote]

Haven't heard from Baxter007 in nearly 2.5 years on this.
Something tells me he didn't get that Colt letter confirming his Fitz. :confused:
http://i55.tinypic.com/2e0obo3.png
Check in Baxter007, and give us an update.
Thanks :)

[Oyeboten]

Any time the notion of the open front Trigger Bow comes up, there are always a handful of people who begin referencing "remove the Trigger Bow' as if the entire Trigger Bow were to be removed on the Revolver.


Also, people who feel the modificaiton is somehow 'unsafe' and a waste of time anyway, saying how 'dangerous' and how 'impractical' and so on, it is, or is purportedly shown to have been by how it is relatively unknown or confusing to people, now, etc.


Of course, none of these people have ever carried or used a revolver which had the modifications, and, none of them understand it.


Nor were these Modified Revolvers likely to be carried by ordinary Uniformed Policeman, unless, maybe, as a back up.

Nor were they ever touted to the Public as somehting intended for 'everyone'.

They were and remain, either a 'Special Order' item, or, a Modification done by a private person or Gunsmith, in order to arrive at the form intended.

They were carried by LEO or G-Men of the kinds who had autonomy, owned their own Arms, and wore Plain clothes, and or were carried by savvy private persons whose occupations or haunts recommended the advantages of the design.


Also, if one wore or wears Winter Gloves or Riding Gloves or Driving Gloves, unless having a large Frame Pistol, or a Colt 1878/1903 'Alaskan Model' with it's HUGE trigger Bow, the Gloved index Finger would tend to present a problem for readily accessing the Trigger of a normal small Frame or even mid Frame Revolver...as well as that a Spurr Hammer could or would catch on Clothing of carried in the Pocket.


As Olf Fuff has repeated many times now, these were 'Pocket Guns', and, not Holster Guns anyway.




Various people always imagine some sort of mis-hap occurring in holstering or Pocket-carrying a 'Fitz', because they are not understanding how difficult it would be to somehow actually DO the mis-deed they envision.

Do these people believe that Carrying a Cocked DA Revolver with a normal Trigger Bow, and a normal Spurr Hammer, in the Pocket or in a Holster, is a good way to Carry? If not, why do they always harp on how a 'Fitz', Carried in the Pocket, or any other way, could somehow just go 'off' because it lacks the front portion of the Trigger Bow and lacks a Hammer Spurr?


One would have to be a complete and utter incompetent to have the Revolver inadvertently discharge
and or to actuate a full Double-Action Cycle, TO discharge it, while Carrying or drawing or putting back into one's Pocket.


I genuinely doubt anyone can cite one example in fact, where any such mis-hap with a 'Fitz' had ever actually occurred.



We have imaginary vignettes being touted, of people mentioning things they 'imagine' which then get repeated by others as if such were an actual event being reviewed.


Given the by now likely thousands of NDs occuring with LEO or anyone else with 'Glocks', calling the 'Fitz Special' dangerous or impractical, ( particularly in the absense of even one authentic or factual or cited instance of any mis-hap having ever occurred at all, with a 'Fitz', no matter how incompetent or clueless the operative may have been, ) seems beyond absurd to me.



Any Arm requires intelligent, informed, aware, and responsible ownership and management.



If an Arm has design features which will tend to invite neglegent discharge incidents among informed and competent people, or, even among uninformed and inexperienced and ordinary people, or among poeople who have specific training for the Arm, then, somewhere in that grey zone of operator error, vis a vis design attribute which invites such operator error, there is a threshold where a design which is widely subject to operator error, is clearly is NOT for everyone...or, maybe, in some instances, not a good election for anyone.


I have never heard or read of one actual or substianted instance of any operator error occuring with any verion of a 'Fitz' style/design Revolver.