[damien]

Does this thing really exist? Is it legal? I've seen ten-gauge, but eight-gauge? Never. Must be custom.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/SHOWBIZ/Movies/09/25/mortensen.appaloosa.ap/index.html

TORONTO, Ontario (AP) -- Viggo Mortensen follows a classic cowboy code in the Western "Appaloosa": Speak softly and carry a big honkin' gun.

As an Old West lawman, Mortensen packs a booming eight-gauge shotgun in "Appaloosa," which reteams him with "A History of Violence" co-star Ed Harris, who also directed and co-wrote the Western..."'

[jordan1948]

Yeah 8GAs do exist, ammo must me handlaoaded or custom ordered but it's kinda pointless anything over 10GA is illegal for hunting in TX

[Majic]

8 gauge shotguns were made in Europe in the 1800s.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJS8PBqdF8g

[BMW2]

I read an article in Sports Afield about European shotguns. If I remember right they get even bigger than an 8 gauge. I want to say some were 4 gauge? It's been a while so I don't remember the particulars but it was impressive.

[Kind of Blued]

They were, indeed, made in England. Even more rare than the 8 gauge, however, was the 11 gauge.

Last I heard there was only one shotgun left in existence that went to eleven, and it was owned by the British rock guitarist Nigel Tufnel.

[DeadHorrorFan]

I think 8 gauge shotguns have been outlawed for sport (waterfowl) use. I've seen the brass shells in a collectors shop before, and I'm sure someone still makes them, but for practical reasons, they're extinct.

[El Tejon]

The American Rifleman/Hunter reruns 8 gauge articles every few years, including the industrial applications of the 8 gauge. Once this movie is released look for the gun rags to rerun their 8 gauge stories.

Yes they are legal, but not to shoot migatory birdies. Why is everything rare illegal in the gun culture?:confused:

[Pilot]

Its a big gun!

[Onmilo]

One of the shopd customers owns an 8 guage double gun and it is American made though I don't remember the exact manufacturer.
The 8 guage guns, single and double barreled, breech loaded and muzzle loaded, were popular in the Illinois region from the 1880s to about the turn of the century and primarily used by migrant waterfowl market hunters.

In terms of power, the old 8 guage blackpowder loads, both muzzle loaded and cartridge, were about equvilent to a modern 3.7/8" ten guage load.
4 1/2 drams of FG or Cannon grade black powder or smokeless equvilent and 1 7/8 to 2 ounces of lead shot.

There are examples of even larger muzzle loaded punt guns on display in some of the museums.
Some of these guns went to 1 3/4" bore and were loaded with one to two ounces of cannon grade powder and up to four ounces of lead shot.
These weren't shoulder fired but tied to the bow of a flatbottom river skiff.

Kills of resting waterfowl numbered sometimes in the hundreds with just one shot from these cannons.

None of these guns are legal for hunting anywhere that I know of in the states.

[Cacafuego]

Last I heard there was only one shotgun left in existence that went to eleven, and it was owned by the British rock guitarist Nigel Tufnel.


Booooo!

[Navy_Guns]

The 8 gauge shotgun is still used to knock off "clinkers" from the walls of giant industrial cement or lime kilns. They shoot a really big zinc slug!!!

[Samuel Adams]

I've also seen a 4 guage in a steel mill used to remove slag from the inside of a blast furnace. It was mounted on a fixed stand, which is good because I surely wouldn't want to fire it more than once.

[Ron James]

:) Never heard of the 8 gauge, the 4 gauge,15 gauge, 18 gauge, 24 gauge, 32 gauge, and a bunch more are out there waiting for you to discover:)

[Cougfan2]

8 guage and even bigger guns were sometimes called punt guns and were used in market hunting for waterfowl. Particularly on the East coast in the Chespeake Bay area they decimated waterfowl populations and led to sport hunters pressuring the govt to institute game laws governing the methods used for hunting waterfowl.

[Blofeld]

Viggo was in G.I. Jane, the guy that always had the Dragunov. I like this guy.

[Stump Water]

The 8 gauge shotgun is still used to knock off "clinkers" from the walls of giant industrial cement or lime kilns. They shoot a really big zinc slug!!!

The guns (http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/industrial/kiln_guns.asp)

The ammo (http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/industrial/ammunition.asp)

[bogie]

Guys, if that makes you nervous... Imagine firing 5,000 rounds out of a pair of 10 gauge doubles over a two day period...

Actually, he fired more, but he broke 5000 targets...

[BobbyQuickdraw]

Well its been decided that the 8 gauge exists, but if you want more information on the movie, here is a review I wrote over at the website I work for. In short - I really enjoyed it, there are lots of very pretty guns too!

Film School Rejects - Review: Appaloosa (http://www.filmschoolrejects.com/reviews/review-appaloosa.php)

For us lucky cowpokes that live in Los Angeles and New York, we got a chance to take a look at Appaloosa before its wide release on October 3rd. The film was adapted for the screen by Ed Harris and Robert Knott based on the novel of the same name, written by Robert Parker. Harris also took on directorial duties, as well as staring as one of the films leads, the lawman-for-hire Virgil Cole. Joining Cole is his long serving Deputy and friend, Everett Hitch, an intelligent and soft-spoken man played with charm and subtlety by Viggo Mortensen.

Rounding out the all star cast are Renee Zellwegger as love interest Allison French, Jeremy Irons as the cold-hearted Randall Bragg, and Lance Henrickson as gun-for-hire Ring Shelton, of the infamous Shelton brothers. The story starts with Bragg gunning down a City Marshall and his deputies after they attempt to arrest him for a murder. Held in the grip of fear by these cowboys, who take what they want without paying and terrorize the town, the leaders of the city of Appaloosa hire on Virgil and Everett to bring order to the town. Literally minutes later, the two out of towners have made their presence known and put the screws to the Bragg gang. Soon, the arrival of a flirtatious woman, Miss French, draws the attention and care of Cole. Meanwhile, a turncoat from Bragg’s gang agrees to testify against him on the charges of murder, so Virgil and Everett make plans to take him in.

What follows are quick gunfights, emotional twists, questionable deals, and a battle between prideful men. Appaloosa delivers everything a Western aficionado could ask for, from beautiful scenery, majestic horses, and locomotives to shooting duels, witty banter, and honest characters. The primary strength of the film is an engaging script that flirts with humor, wit, violence, and the nature of men. The relationship between Miss French and the alpha males around her is interesting and frustrating, to both the audience and Virgil. Mortensen plays Hitch as the quintessential cowboy hero. He’s quiet, modest, honest, and deadly with a 10 gauge shotgun. Yet, in all his openness, he still reserves a secret here and there that are revealed at exactly the right moments in exactly the right ways.

Harris obviously deserves much of the credit, turning in a classic machismo infused “Top Dog” Lawman performance peppered with just enough insecurity to make him relatable. His playbook from the directors chair is genre perfect - clearly he’s done his homework and knows what type of film he’s making. The shot selection is wonderful, with the requisite number of establishing shots and pans across the beautiful countryside. Musically, Jeff Beal provides a rich, full score with a very notable string performance, and good horn accents. Beal and Harris even combine forces on two tracks, with Beal composing and Harris singing on “You’ll Never Leave My Heart” (which plays during the latter part of the credits) and “Ain’t Nothin Like a Friend.” All are available on the official soundtrack.

If there is a fault with me, it would be Renee Zellwegger. While she is given somewhat more depth than your average Western love interest, her depth makes her character somewhat unlikable and when you look at her, you’re seeing Renee Zellwegger, not Miss French. Still, that wasn’t nearly enough to stop my enjoyment of the film and by the latter half, I had started to believe her character much more. The other performances throughout the film are very strong - Mortensen outshines all and Irons, while given less to do, is none the less fully capable of domineering a scene with nothing more than a look.

Some modern audience goers may feel the pace of the movie is a touch slow, which one could say it is. Though, it is slow like a good Western can be. In capturing the real earnestness of the West, there are times when things go blisteringly fast and times when the duo simply sit and talk, as friends were apt to do before television and radio. The dialog between the two men is as sharp as a bowie knife and crisp like a frontier morning. Overall the movie is a very traditional Western with fast paced action, sharp dialog, and deep characters.

Like a good period piece, the real heart of the film lays within the heart of the men on screen. They run the gamut of emotions from pride to hubris to modesty and transition through them all. As the credits roll over beautiful still photographs, you have a real understanding of exactly who each character was and the type of man they’ll always be. This kind of movie deserves Oscar recognition, though its the kind of quiet performances, so dependent on subtleties, that it just may go unnoticed. Make sure you notice this film when it releases on October 3rd.

[jad0110]

Not sure the gauge, but this punt gun is pretty nice (good for a safe room) :evil: :


USE ENOUGH GUN!!! :neener:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7Vt0mr2sjE

[TallPine]

Adapted from Robert B. Parker's novel, the film is the story of two old trail buddies, Virgil Cole (Harris) and Everett Hitch (Mortensen), itinerant lawmen who sign on to clean up the town of Appaloosa, where a murderous rancher (Jeremy Irons) runs the show.


What a novel idea for a western plot :rolleyes:

[JCMAG]

In "The Road," adapted from Cormac McCarthy's novel, Mortensen plays a man struggling to survive with his young son in a bleak post-apocalyptic landscape.

:what::what::what::what:

Awesome! I just recently read the book and it was fantastic. I'm a big fan of both Mortensen and McCarthy. This is great news! I'd heard a long while back, when the book was still in its first edition, that a movie would be made (along with Blood Meridian, his masterpiece) but I hadn't heard anything more until now.







Am I the only one who is surprised to see a gun-centric AP story? They could have written it about anything concerning the movie, but they sure chose a great focus! And in Canada, to boot! :

[Loomis]

Anything bigger than a 10ga is referred to as "bore" not guage.

Yes, there is a such thing as an 8bore. They were judged "non-sporting" many many years ago(possibly the 1920s) and were thus illegal for used by hunters. That pretty much made them useless in north america. You would probably have to go to africa or india to see them in actual use.

[goon]

There was an 8 gauge shotgun in Streets of Laredo.

For my uses, one would be totally useless.
But that doesn't mean it wouldn't also be utterly cool!

[halfbreed808]

"For my uses, one would be totally useless.
But that doesn't mean it wouldn't also be utterly cool!"
goon


Totally agree. Just thinking about shooting one made my heart skip a beat.:evil: Guess my chances are pretty slim though.:fire: Maybe seeing the movie will make me feel better.:D

[frogomatic]

for a real eye opener, go pick up a copy of Cartridges of the World. Take a look at the 950JDJ. It's a 20mm cannon case chopped off and necked down for a 95 caliber bullet. My book is at the shop, but I seem to recall it pushed a 3000 grain projectile at about 2000 fps. And somehow the BATFE didn't classify it as a DD, go figure.

[Stevie-Ray]

Recoil junkie and writer Ross Seyfried owns an 8 gauge shotgun. (Big surprise) He said at one time he has never fired a 4-bore rifle, though he welcomed the opportunity. (Again, big surprise):D

[Werewolf]

Yes they are legal, but not to shoot migatory birdies. Why is everything rare illegal in the gun culture?Maybe because they're illegal. Once they get that way the market dries up and everyone stops making them. Thus they get rare.

[loose cannon]

i once held a side by side 4bore rifle when westley richards was in springfield mo.the thing weighed 15 -18 lbs.

and if i had to shoot it id want every ounch of that weight.

it was a utility grade gun and was worth $25000 at the time.

i still kick myself for not getting pictures of me with that gun and the 600 nitro sbs rifle that was worth around a $100,000:cuss:

[proud2deviate]

They're not useless. The 8 gauge pump in Halo is one of the very best guns for knocking the crap out of The Flood :neener:

Can you imagine? An 8 gauge pump with a top loading magazine. Schweet.
(SPARTAN powered armor not included!)

[akodo]

Anything bigger than a 10ga is referred to as "bore" not guage.

are you sure? I though the use of 'bore' denoted a rifled barrel. 8 bore and 4 bore to me denotes an 'elephant gun' firing a single large projectile spinning due to rifling, NOT to a smooth barreled fowling piece

[PeteRR]

The 8 gauge shotgun is still used to knock off "clinkers" from the walls of giant industrial cement or lime kilns. They shoot a really big zinc slug!!!

Yeah. I was grinding the tyres and rollers on a lime kiln in a paper plant in Springfield Oregon and they had them to knock the buildup off the inner shell of the kiln. They had about a 9 cu yd hopper full of spent hulls.

[TEDDY]

I saw a 4 bore and 8 bore in Trinadad when I was stationed in 43/44.they had a 37 mm punt gun too.I wish I had the cat from BRitain.one of the hunters had a Rem s+s.I just had one to fix. oct 10 1910.:uhoh::rolleyes:

[Carl]

I really want an 8 gauge. my Ithaca double barrel 10 gauge will have to do for now.

[SpecialKalltheway]

They were, indeed, made in England. Even more rare than the 8 gauge, however, was the 11 gauge.

Last I heard there was only one shotgun left in existence that went to eleven, and it was owned by the British rock guitarist Nigel Tufnel.

hahahaha this made my morning. "but this one goes to eleven!"

[jacob.elliott]

i don't know if anybody has watched the t.k. and mike videos for sell at bass pro but in their duck hunting video they have a 4 ga 'waterfowl widowmaker', it looks kinda cheesy but it would have made a big boom

[saltydog452]

Betcha John Ross has one.

salty

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

"It's not that manageable, it's not going to be accurate at much distance. I said, `I'm not going to shoot that thing off a horse, because I'd get blown off the horse, realistically."'

Is this an Onion article? Since when do actors shoot real loads or shoot at real targets?

[Zach S]

On a side note, I thought the movie was boring.

[notbubba]

British rock guitarist Nigel Tufnel.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4wJh_lwLvo

[Tinpig]

I liked the guns and the horses and enjoyed the slow pace of the movie. Zellwegger was irritating and unconvincing.
The cowboy-buddy theme was a little over the top...there were times I was afraid ol' Virg and Ev were going to ride on up to Brokeback Mt. :uhoh:

Anyone notice that the Sheriff's plan for Law and Order was to have everyone turn in their sidearms while in town. Of course The Law got to keep theirs. Sound familiar?

[X-Rap]

The 8ga. Industrial is loaded by Winchester, I have seen them used in smelting operations to shoot out clay plugs used to plug tapping holes in furnaces.

[Macmac]

Once these were common as dirt. Pre electricty. Punt and market guns were just common. 8 bore is a little gun compared to most..

[DoubleTapDrew]

About 20 years ago I remember reading an issue of Guns & Ammo where they tested an 8 gauge and (I think???) a 6 gauge shotgun using brass cases. It seems to be more of a novelty since I don't think you can hunt with bigger than a 10 gauge in the US. On the cover of the issue they had a picture of the author touching off a round. Both his feet were off the ground, obviously falling backwards, with a painful expression on his face.

[George Lander]

I am fortunate to own two eight gauge doubles: a Joseph Braddell of Dublin, Ireland and a James Beattie of London. I recently bought and had restored an E.M. Reilly of London four (4) gauge double in it's original case. These guns are legal to hunt waterfowl with in England but not in the U.S.A. Nothing larger than ten gauge here. The four gauge takes 4 drams of ffg powder & hurls 4 ounces of lead shot from each barrel. Once you shoot it you probably won't want to again.

Best Regards, George

[Red Cent]

No pictures?

[bobmcd]

Going back to post #39

"Since when do actors shoot real loads or shoot at real targets?"

It's not that the actor is going to shoot live ammo during the movie, it's that a (good) actor is going to be concerned that his character is realistic and the way he handles props (e.g., a monstrous shotgun) will look realistic. (Unlike, say, the way gigantically overpowered and oversized firearms are handled in video games ... and in many movies).

When Viggo M. said "I'm not going to shoot that thing off a horse, because I'd get blown off the horse, realistically." he's saying "Don't show me shooting that thing from horseback, because it would look unrealistic", not "I ain't shooting that thing from horseback, because I will fall off and break my neck."

For another (fictional ... but allegedly based on a real event) story involving a preposterously large shotgun: Trevanian's "Incident at Twenty-Mile" (http://www.trevanian.com/books/incident.htm) (Trevanian, by the way, is the guy that wrote "The Eiger Sanction" and other thrillers.)

[W.E.G.]

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/humor/volume11.jpg

[Unistat]

We have an 8 ga. shotgun at the museum where I work. Single Barrel break-action from about the 1870-1880's. It is pretty big, about 4.5' long, and very heavy. I would not want to shoot it without some shooting sticks or something. I would have problems if I had to traverse with the thing, once it builds some momentum, it would be hard for me to stop.

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

It's not that the actor is going to shoot live ammo during the movie, it's that a (good) actor is going to be concerned that his character is realistic and the way he handles props (e.g., a monstrous shotgun) will look realistic. (Unlike, say, the way gigantically overpowered and oversized firearms are handled in video games ... and in many movies).

When Viggo M. said "I'm not going to shoot that thing off a horse, because I'd get blown off the horse, realistically." he's saying "Don't show me shooting that thing from horseback, because it would look unrealistic", not "I ain't shooting that thing from horseback, because I will fall off and break my neck."

Viggo M. is a method actor. He routinely puts himself into the character he's playing, even off the set. During Lord of the Rings, he sometimes slept outside in a tent, carried his sword on his back even when not filming, and mended his own costumes. It wouldn't be at all surprising if he went to a range and got a feel for how an 8ga shotgun feels when shot. I'm sure he's not a "gun guy" like us on THR, but he's definitely not an actor for whom a gun is a prop pulled out of a box before a scene and tossed back in when done.

[FLAvalanche]

There are even 2 and 1 ga. shotguns.

I remember seeing a 2 ga. phosphorus round. It was used to mark drop zones and bombing targets.

[VegasAR15]

In case anyone is interested, here is the info on the guns in the movie.

http://www.imfdb.org/index.php/Appaloosa_%282008%29

[BluEyes]

Maybe because they're illegal for hunting. Once they get that way the market dries up and everyone stops making them. Thus they get rare.

Fixed that. Otherwise, I agree. An 8 gauge or bigger would be fun for S&G and maybe the occasional round of clays with friends, but you are not going to support the industry making guns and ammunition like millions of people buying 12ga for hunting!

[huntingworld2010]

If anyone has seen Appaloosa what make was the 8 Guage shotgun used in the movie? Can a 8 Guage still be had this day and time?

[Jubjub]

From IMFDB:

Everett Hitch (Viggo Mortensen) carries an 8 Gauge Double Barreled Shotgun in the film, refered to only as "The 8 Gauge" in the dialogue. To handle the vicious recoil of the massive weapon, Everett has a leather pad build into the shoulder of his coat to help absorb it. Since the only existing 8 Gauges today are antiques and are unsafe or too expensive to fire, a genius alternative was made. Armorer and gunsmith Steve Karnes built three "8 Gauges" for Gibbons Ltd. out of reproduction Colt 1878 shotguns, two of which fired 12 Gauge blanks with 8 Gauge sleeves over the barrels to increase the bore diameter and hide its real caliber, while one was built to chamber 8 Gauge inert rounds for scenes in which the gun was loaded, as the size between 8 and 12 Gauge is far too different for no one to notice. To see more on the production of the shotguns, visit the SK 1878 shotgun page, with actual information and images by Steve Karnes.

[Jubjub]

If you look at the gun in close-up, it's pretty oddly proportioned. The frame is much smaller than the barrels.

Great movie.