[Jason_G]

Silly name for a backpack, and I hate to play into the "tactical" mumbo-jumbo, but they look like they would make a great woods pack for overnight hunting/camping trips. I'm looking at this one (http://www.majorsurplus.com/New-Enhanced-3-Day-Assault-Pack-P13874C2232.aspx) and this one (http://www.blackhawk.com/product1.asp?P=603D00). What do you guys think? I've got an old Jansport that I've been using for that sort of stuff, but there's not much space in there for cold weather stuff (thick extra socks, ponchos, etc.). Add in ammo, calls, etc., and it's pretty stuffed. These look larger, but not as bulky as a framed pack. I'd like to stick to something I could wear on my back.

Anyone used or otherwise laid eyes on these in person? I'm open to other suggestions, but I'd like to pay less than $80.

Jason

[Code3GT]

its been a while since i've been on a 3-day assault but I like that first one you posted. May pick one up myself to hold my rescue gear :thumbsup:

[Nematocyst]

Jason,

Speaking only for myself - YMMV - I wouldn't carry a 2200 cu in pack for overnight, let alone 3 days.

My current "day and a half" pack is an Arcteryx Bora 50 (that's 50 liters = 3050 cu in), and I find it too small for even overnight, especially if I've got to carry ammo, etc. It'll carry layers & food, and even a bivy sack, but with no room for a sleeping bag for cold nights.

If you are a true minimalist in a Tom Brown (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Brown_(naturalist)) sort of way, who likes to construct shelters with a knife and use conifer needles for insulation, then I guess those packs would work fine. I like something a bit more substantial, especially during fall, winter or spring in the Pac NW.

I'm looking at the Arcteryx Bora 65 (http://www.arcteryx.com/product.aspx?Bora-65#) (liter = almost 4000 cu in). It's actually a relatively small overnight pack (compared to expedition packs) that will allow me to carry food, layers, sleeping bag, bivy sack, even a tarp, plus ammo, first aid kit, etc.

Also, I like the suspension system on Arcteryx packs a LOT; great for carrying loads.

Considerably more than $80, though.

[~z]

Much of it depends on the where, when and how many. I have one similar to the first pack, it does great spring through fall in TX where I am not concerned about cold weather. If you have a buddy along to split the load, it may suffice when you get into carrying cold weather gear, but I'd hate to pack sleeping bag, biv-tent, misc cold weather gear & cooking stuff in there and still expect it to be any kind of sufficient.
Agree with Nemo, a bit bigger would be a lot better for a 3 day pack, especially if you intend to do much assulting.
~z

[Jason_G]

I only intend for it to be used for 1-2 days at a time, and I would not need to pack a bedroll/sleeping bag in it, nor a tent.

It would be used mostly for things like extra socks, some extra thermal underwear, extra ammo, a poncho, first aid kit, thermo cells, compass, fire starting kit, a length of rope, foldable saw, flashlight and extra batteries, cell phone, etc. Basically all the crap that ends up filling up your pockets would go in the pack, along with some extra cold weather clothes. I don't want to get too big of a pack, because I intend on carrying it to and from the stand while hunting.

Jason

[HM2PAC]

I like the 1st one that you linked. IMHO, both companies make good gear.

Another option you may want to look at is Cabela's. The stuff you have linked to is specific for military assault. Hunting is similar, but how much of your hunting gear is MOLLE compatible?

[Jason_G]

Okay, I finally found a pic of the Blackhawk pack being worn. Now that I have an idea of the actual size of these, the Blackhawk (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.patriotoutfitters.com/img/products/14900/14957.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.patriotoutfitters.com/scripts/z.exe/sbproc%3Faction%3Dshowproduct%26productid%3D1678&h=374&w=300&sz=68&hl=en&start=1&um=1&usg=__J8l4CaC9-aKX3sKpyAm7_MX6cl8=&tbnid=mQiYL64G82VdRM:&tbnh=122&tbnw=98&prev=/images%3Fq%3D3%2Bday%2Bassault%2Bbackpack%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN) one does look a bit small for what I need. It's not really any larger than the Jansport backpack I was using. I guess the other one might be too small too, judging from the dimensions.

I was looking for something this size (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.airsoftgi.com/images/tan3day1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php%3Fproducts_id%3D1045&h=400&w=500&sz=38&hl=en&start=73&um=1&usg=__mtPHYU70hFYjnN9bOJDpStzr7ZE=&tbnid=4J68sv7ZYYPCdM:&tbnh=104&tbnw=130&prev=/images%3Fq%3D3%2Bday%2Bassault%2Bbackpack%26start%3D63%26ndsp%3D21%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN). Website says OE Tech, but it looks like this pack (http://www.desertdeucesurplus.com/servlet/the-775/Condor-3-Day-Assault/Detail) by Condor.

Anyone know anything about the Condor pack?

Jason

[lamazza]

There are enough genuine USGI packs for reasonable money out there.
That way you are assured ruggedness and reliability.

[Vern Humphrey]

I was an infantryman for 22 years, have hiked Pennsylvania's Horseshoe trail from end-to-end, Arkansas' Ozark Highland Trail from end-to-end, and the Appalachian Trail in 9-day sections.

Choose a pack by making a list of the things you plan to carry. The best way to do this is to categorize the items:


Shelter and sleeping
Spare clothing
Cooking
Navigation
Rain gear
Food
Etc.


When the list is complete, let it sit for a few days, then go over it again and throw out about half of what's there. Then see if you can find lighter versions of the stuff you keep.

Then choose a pack that will barely carry those items -- a bigger pack is only a temptation to overload yourself.

[Nematocyst]

Then choose a pack that will barely carry those items -- a bigger pack is only a temptation to overload yourself.<laughs>

Vern speaks truth there. If you've got room to carry it, you'll carry it.

My choice of packs for 1-day, 3-day and expedition (8 - 16 day) is based on three decades of backpacking/mountaineering in TN (Smokies), trans-Pecos TX (Big Bend), NM (mainly Sangre de Cristo), AZ (Superstition Wilderness), UT (canyons (http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=68954&d=1197453882)), CO (mainly the Weminuche wilderness (http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=60051&d=1183110292)), WA and OR (Northern Cascades and Great Basin desert (http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=76445&d=1208160287).)

I began by reading the backpacker's bible: The Complete Walker (http://books.google.com/books?id=zaN_tWdttvkC&dq=isbn:0375703233&ei=_wbgSKaiJoKgswPrj6jeDg&pgis=1) by Colin Fletcher (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_Fletcher). From Fletcher I learned the incalculable value of finding a good pack that fits. In his words, you don't "carry" a good pack but "wear it". A well-designed, properly fitting pack can mean the difference between misery and comfort.

Then, find the "minimum" gear that you need in the lightest version available. Take what you need, but make sure you really need it. The pack will remind you that ounces add up to lbs on those 3-hour uphill stretches dominated by "switchback" (even quicker if it's just "up" with no switchback). Is that tiny espresso maker really necessary? :scrutiny: How many compress bandages do you really need? Full tent or just a strong tarp?)

Fletcher tells stories of carrying a postal scale to the mens dept to buy the lightest underwear.

He wrote that he knew he'd gone too far when he found himself tearing the paper tabs off of tea bags to save weight. :D
__________

{Added by edit: yes, the linked photos are mine. One trip into the Weminuche for 10 days included a 35 mm camera with small tripod. That pack was 72 lb at the beginning of the trek.}

[Browning]

I wouldn't buy the Voodoo 3 day assault pack (the first link)

Although I've never owned one personally I've heard ALOT of complaints about the seams and the stitching coming loose after a very short period of time and I've heard that particular complaint so often and from so many different places I'm pretty sure it's at least partially true. If you buy quality the first time (Blackhawk, Camelbak or something like them) you won't have that problem.

As far as the name it's not that big of a deal, it's just marketing.

[Vern Humphrey]

One more point. Read the specifications on the pack, and if the manufacturer doesn't tell you the weight of the pack, don't buy that pack.

The reason is simple -- let's say you're shooting for a 21-lb pack, which is on the heavy side, when you consider carrying a rifle, ammo, skinning knife, meat sack and other hunting gear. If the pack itself turns out to weigh 7 lbs, that leaves you only 14 lbs of gear.

A manufacturer who doesn't tell you the weight of the pack is trying to sell you a gimmick, not a real useful pack.

[Jason_G]

I wouldn't buy the Voodoo 3 day assault pack (the first link)

Although I've never owned one personally I've heard ALOT of complaints about the seams and the stitching coming loose after a very short period of time and I've heard that particular complaint so often and from so many different places I'm pretty sure it's at least partially true.
I appreciate the heads up.

Another option you may want to look at is Cabela's. The stuff you have linked to is specific for military assault. Hunting is similar, but how much of your hunting gear is MOLLE compatible?
I've looked. Generally "hunting" packs cost about 2x-3x as much. So far the only difference I see is that they are in Realtree or Mossy Oak. I'll pass.

What about this one.... North Face Heckler (http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2364101)
Can be had in Woodland camo. About 2050 ci.

Jason

[Vern Humphrey]

Here are the specs:


Dimensions: 21 in x 14 x 10 in
Volume: 2050 cu in
Average Weight: 2 lbs 2 oz
Comfortable, stitched foam back panel
Ultra-padded shoulder strap
Main compartment with a universal sleeve and VELCRO® brand closure accessory pockets
Secondary compartment with an organizer
Front stash pocket with an audio port
Mesh water-bottle pockets
Bottom compression
Side compression
Reinforced daisy chain
X-bungee
Removable waist belt
Reflective hits


That's a reasonable weight -- if you set your loaded pack weight limit at 21 lbs, you can carry better than 18 pounds of gear.

Why set pack limit at 21 lbs? When you add in a rifle and ammo (8 lbs or thereabouts), boots (2-3 lbs), clothing (4-5 lbs), meat bag (2-4 lbs), skinning knife and bone saw (about 1 lb), a quart of water (2 lbs), you're looking at 40 to 44 lbs -- and that's about all you want to carry.

[Nematocyst]

In general, North Face makes good quality stuff. Not the top of the line (any more), but still good quality. They cater mainly to the mountaineering folks, and their designs reflect that. And as Vern points out, their pack weights reflect it also. Light weight without sacrificing too much quality.

[ojibweindian]

Here's what I use:

http://www.fatiguesarmynavy.com/store/item/FA1940

I can put about 2 days worth of stuff in there.