Have you read the Heller Decision?


November 2, 2008, 04:49 PM
Just wondering how many people have read all, or part, of the Supreme Court's decision in "District of Columbia Et Al vs. Heller." I've only read part of it so far, but it's interesting.

There are some parts of it which are actually kind of funny. My favorite so far involves the interpretation of the words "keep," "bear," and "arms" from the Second Amendment. After a lengthy explanation about the uses of the words which were current at the time the Second Amendment was written, the author dismisses the various other interpretations this way:

The word "Arms" would have two different meanings at once:"weapons" (as the object of "keep") and (as the object of "bear") one-half of an idiom. It would be rather like saying "He filled and kicked the bucket" to mean "He filled the bucket and died." Grotesque.

For some reason, this conjures up images of Statler and Waldorf - the two old Muppets who sit in the balcony - arguing over something.

Anyone else have a favorite part, or a related comment on reading the document? (For anyone who wants to read it, the full decision can be downloaded from the page here (http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-290.ZS.html).)

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The Bushmaster
November 2, 2008, 05:21 PM
And I'm not all that happy with what I did read. Too many holes in it...

November 2, 2008, 05:35 PM
I read it all. Most important is to read the dissenting opinion of the other four justices.

They noted that one reason they rejected the 2nd amendment as being an individual right is that they don’t believe all of the other nine are either. There is a scary line of thinking that is just one more vote away from making significant changes to our country.

November 2, 2008, 08:41 PM
It is very scary to note that if one vote swayed the other way their could be thousands of cites in the US creating bans right now.

November 2, 2008, 08:47 PM
I read the big gist of the winning opinion, and both dissenting opinions. I was more interested in what the other four had to say, and I was rather shocked to find - as said - that just about any restriction on any of the bill of rights amendments could feasibly pass constitutional scrutiny of any sort.

They flat-out said "We don't think that the second amendment guarantees any right to any individual." No citing of why, either. They just felt that way.

JT in VA
November 2, 2008, 08:54 PM
Zminer - love the Statler and Waldorf ref.

November 2, 2008, 08:59 PM
I read it all. While the dissenting opinions are interesting remember they are dicta, not law. They merely express the opinion of what should have been the law had the liberal justices won. It is scary to think that they can twist the simple wording of the second around to make it seem like it is not an individual right but the Supreme Court has been twisting words to fit the justices own views for as long as there has been a court.

November 3, 2008, 01:09 PM
I have read all of the majority opinion and most of the minority opinion. This is a historic moment. The DC v Keller decision was the first time that the court said that they were attempting to define what the Second Amendment meant and who the amendment applies to.

We take for granted that the Second Amendment is and individual right but, until this decision by the court it was not legally defined that way. Until the DC v Keller decision the argument made by many gun control advocates that the Second Amendment applies not to an individual but applied only to the militia of the United States had some legal merit. Now it does not. The Second Amendment is now officially a personal right just like the freedom of speech. Prior to this decision The Second Amendment was not officially and individual right. Most people of the United States assumed that the Second Amendment was an individual right its nice to know that the court now agree with us.

Now there are some restrictions on the Rights granted by the Second Amendment just like there are restrictions on the Freedom of Speech, ie you can’t falsely shout fire in a crowed building and expect the First Amendment to protect you from prosecution.

The DC v Keller decision my not contain everything that one could want but it still is a tremendous victory for gun rights. If you don’t believe that consider the implications had one of the justices voted the other way and the minority opinion would now the majority.

I have been wondering why this decision had not generated more excitement in the gun rights community. This decision is monumental. We should in my opinion be throwing our hats in the air and screaming hooray. I think that the reason that this decision did not generate more excitement is because we, the gun rights community, have always assumed that the Second Amendment was an individual right but I would be willing to bet that there are some gun control advocates that have there knickers in a twist over this decision.:neener:

November 3, 2008, 01:15 PM
For those of you who haven't, here it is in its entirety (I think).


November 3, 2008, 01:23 PM
Maybe I am to dumb to figure out the link above. :eek: but once I followed the link to the outside page I could not figure out which link to click.

I like this link better it is the one off of the courts web page. http://www.supremecourtus.gov/opinions/07pdf/07-290.pdf

it is a link to a pdf doc so it take a bit to load.

November 3, 2008, 01:26 PM
While on this subject, has ANYONE received their 'slip' copy of the decision...............I, and a LOT of others requested one and were assured it'd be sent...........not a thing here yet........anyone?????

November 3, 2008, 01:33 PM
I did not ask for a copy of the report but the link that I posted links to a pdf doc that has the word slip on it. Not sure if that helps.

November 3, 2008, 02:38 PM
Uhhmmm... Errr.... Well..... :uhoh:

I was hoping someone here would read it, then tell me if there was anything I needed to know.

November 3, 2008, 03:49 PM
I was hoping someone here would read it, then tell me if there was anything I needed to know.
Unfortunately, they ruled that everyone has to send all of their guns to the nearest government collection site. If you'd like, I'll turn in yours for you just to be a pal. Just let me know and I'll forward my address :)

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