Awb '08


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Joshua M. Smith
November 9, 2008, 07:13 PM
Bill is here:

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h110-6257

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Quoheleth
November 9, 2008, 07:27 PM
(a) RESTRICTION- Section 922 of title 18, United States Code, is amended by adding after subsection (u) the following:
(v)(1) It shall be unlawful for a person to manufacture, transfer, or possess a semiautomatic assault weapon.

So, even POSSESSING semis, not to mention high-cap mags (which I read as +5) will be illegal?

Guess there's no reason for me to go buy an AR or a Mini-14 then, huh?

BTW...the wife was reading on-line this afternoon BO plans to use his executive privilege privileges to "right the wrongs" of Pres. Bush. I guess he could fast-track gun bans with an EO, then - huh?

Q

Bubba613
November 9, 2008, 07:38 PM
I could easily be wrong but the bill will expire at the end of this Congress. So introducing it is essentially worthless.

Joshua M. Smith
November 9, 2008, 07:47 PM
I can see it being reintroduced once Obama takes presidency.

I think that if it does expire at the end of this Congress, I will take whatever money OBama "gives" me for being a good little American and spend it on arms.

I believe they will be grandfathered, from how I'm reading it.

Josh <><

Tom488
November 9, 2008, 07:48 PM
So, even POSSESSING semis, not to mention high-cap mags (which I read as +5) will be illegal?
You should have kept reading... the next paragraph states:

(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to the possession or transfer of any semiautomatic assault weapon otherwise lawfully possessed under Federal law on the date of the enactment of this subsection.

That's your basic "grandfather" clause.

However, right now, it's nothing more than a proposal. There's still a long way to go before an AWB gets voted on... and a lot of legal challenges to any, thanks to Heller. So, go buy what you want... at worst, you'll be covered under a grandfather clause. While banning future sales of a certain type of firearm may pass legal muster (regulation of interstate commerce, and all that), an outright ban on possession will fly directly in the face of Heller.

Quoheleth
November 9, 2008, 08:13 PM
You should have kept reading... the next paragraph states:

(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to the possession or transfer of any semiautomatic assault weapon otherwise lawfully possessed under Federal law on the date of the enactment of this subsection.

That's your basic "grandfather" clause.

:o

Mea culpa.

I did read that line, but (somehow) I misunderstood what it was saying.

Q

Beren
November 9, 2008, 08:35 PM
Not going to happen until next year, but this line made me puke:

To reinstate the Public Safety and Recreational Firearms Use Protection Act.

jrou111
November 9, 2008, 08:42 PM
Start writing your reps!

RP88
November 9, 2008, 09:20 PM
isnt this the same one that was introduced by incumbent NJ reps that only had six sponsors/supporters? This bill didnt go anywhere at all, and it was introduced months ago. It really didnt even pick up any supporters.

few things to note:

things that are different:
-a 'by-name' section
-shotguns changed to not be able to accept any sort of detachable mag
-any semi-auto weapon that has a built-in mag of five or more (SKS) is now an assault weapon; however, an 'antique section' was included, which the SKS is also under
-an appendix of weapons at bottom

things that are the same:
-basic definitions are largely intact
-grandfather clause
-hi-cap mag ban
-10-year sunset provision

yea, this wasn't really a whole-hearted attempt.

either way, start writing.

gbran
November 9, 2008, 09:27 PM
Under a new AWB that caps magazines/clips to 10 rounds, how will the authorities be able to look at your mags and determine whether they are pre-ban? Of course this assumes they grandfather in the old ones.

Zane
November 9, 2008, 09:34 PM
Did they leave the AR-10 and similar rifles off the list? Unless it is considered to be a higher caliber AR-15...

ArmedBear
November 9, 2008, 09:36 PM
Under a new AWB that caps magazines/clips to 10 rounds, how will the authorities be able to look at your mags and determine whether they are pre-ban?

Who cares?

I'd be using the post-ban magazines for target practice anyway. Wouldn't want to wear out the hi-caps, just in case.

nwilliams
November 9, 2008, 09:40 PM
Another link about the bill....

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/110-h6257/show

misANTHrope
November 9, 2008, 10:27 PM
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=401028

Airburst
November 9, 2008, 10:28 PM
Buy what you want NOW! What ever bill materializes, obama will sign it. I have pretty much all of the self loading rifles and pistols I want. I have mucho hicap magazines. I have lots of ammo. Hey, it is coming. Get what you want and need right now. Do not waste a single minute debating whether or not a bill of some sorts will be signed. It will be law with in a year or two, max. The gun banners/confiscators/democrats have been waiting eight years for this moment and they wont waste a single minute getting this signed into law.

UnTainted
November 9, 2008, 10:44 PM
I found their definition to be pretty much everything but my bolt. Good thing they think bolt guns aren't dangerous, I guess...


‘(30) The term ‘semiautomatic assault weapon’ means--

‘(A) any of the firearms, or copies or duplicates of the firearms in any caliber, known as--

‘(i) Norinco, Mitchell, and Poly Technologies Avtomat Kalashnikovs (all models);
‘(ii) Action Arms Israeli Military Industries UZI and Galil;
‘(iii) Beretta Ar70 (SC-70);
‘(iv) Colt AR-15;
‘(v) Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, and FNC;
‘(vi) SWD M-10, M-11, M-11/9, and M-12;
‘(vii) Steyr AUG;
‘(viii) INTRATEC TEC-9, TEC-DC9 and TEC-22; and
‘(ix) revolving cylinder shotguns, such as (or similar to) the Street Sweeper and Striker 12;


‘(B) a semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of--
‘(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
‘(ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
‘(iii) a bayonet mount;
‘(iv) a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and
‘(v) a grenade launcher;

‘(C) a semiautomatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least 2 of--
‘(i) an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;
‘(ii) a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer;
‘(iii) a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;
‘(iv) a manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and
‘(v) a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm; and

‘(D) a semiautomatic shotgun that has at least 2 of--
‘(i) a folding or telescoping stock;
‘(ii) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;
‘(iii) a fixed magazine capacity in excess of 5 rounds; and
‘(iv) an ability to accept a detachable magazine.’.

gitnsige
November 10, 2008, 07:08 AM
I see Chris Shays (the worthless republican from CT) was the one to re-introduce this bill. Well, Shays was sent packing this election, fwiw. I doubt this helps but we are all better without him.

Art Eatman
November 10, 2008, 10:37 AM
Again--and again and again--snalimail your US Rep & Senator. Send money to the pro-gun groups to help with their lobbying efforts.

Otherwise, be content to vent and rant on the Internet and watch Bad Things Happen.

poorfolks
November 11, 2008, 03:44 AM
why would the weight of a pistol be one of the defining factors?:confused:

Tom488
November 11, 2008, 03:57 AM
why would the weight of a pistol be one of the defining factors?
Duh.... because if the pistol were heavier, you could throw it at somebody and HURT them :D

It makes about as much sense as banning a 10/22 because someone dropped the action into a stock with a pistol grip and a folding stock. Makes it SOOO much more evil that way.

That just gave me an idea for an Oleg-style poster... on the left, a 10/22 in a Tapco stock (show the ammo it shoots... little itty-bitty .22LR round), with a "BANNED" stamp across it. On the right, a semi-auto 1919A3 on a tripod, with a 10-round belt of ammo hanging out, and a "LEGAL!" banner. "AWB II - now with even less sense"

30mag
November 11, 2008, 11:07 AM
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h110-1022

Be worried...

Kind of Blued
November 11, 2008, 11:50 AM
Hmmm. So...

Legal:
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=87558&stc=1&d=1226418487

Illegal:
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=82755&d=1218179952

:confused:

K3
November 11, 2008, 02:57 PM
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill...bill=h110-1022

Be worried...

That bill is from the.....

2007-2008 (110th Congress)

alsaqr
November 11, 2008, 04:20 PM
Look closely at the list of sponsors and co-sponsers. You may be surprised.

Joshua M. Smith
November 11, 2008, 05:25 PM
Yup. RINOs.

woofe
November 12, 2008, 02:36 PM
UnTainted said: I found their definition to be pretty much everything but my bolt. Good thing they think bolt guns aren't dangerous, I guess...

Don't worry, as soon as the Semi's are safely placed in scrap heaps, your bolt action deer rifle will become a EVIL SNIPER WEAPON able to destroy satellites in orbit!

woofe

expvideo
November 12, 2008, 03:20 PM
So, even POSSESSING semis, not to mention high-cap mags (which I read as +5) will be illegal?
No. Read the document before you start thinking the sky is falling.

First of all, shotguns are limited to 5, mags are limited to 10. The 5 round magazine is what determines if it is an "assault weapon".

Secondly, possession is not illegal, because the line immediately following the one you quoted says:

‘(2) Paragraph (1) shall not apply to the possession or transfer of any semiautomatic assault weapon otherwise lawfully possessed under Federal law on the date of the enactment of this subsection.

Besides, Obama doesn't enter office until 2009. So there will not be a "ban of 2008".


Don't worry, as soon as the Semi's are safely placed in scrap heaps, your bolt action deer rifle will become a EVIL SNIPER WEAPON able to destroy satellites in orbit!

Not to mention your shotgun which fires a wall of bullets without precision and killing everything in it's path without discrimination.

IncredibleGord
November 12, 2008, 03:39 PM
I think the ban is a good thing. It keeps dangerous assault rifles that are used to kill police out of the hands of the criminals. I think it's good that they are finally going to close the gun show loophole that allows mass murderers to get their weapons.

















Just kidding. I hate how they call it a gun show loophole. Selling guns from party to party is what keeps the government from totally owning us. If guns were only allowed to be sold from authorized stores with a list of guns that are "bad" we will have lost all of our rights. Are you telling me that I can't sell my gun to my brother? That I have to sell it to the store, then he has to get a background check, finger stamp, iris scan, tracking chip, and then mod the gun to one shot at a time. I don't like bans based off of ignorance. Politicians need to change their strategies, and work on criminal prevention and control. Guns don't kill people, dangerous criminals with improper trigger control do.

ATAShooter
November 12, 2008, 03:53 PM
I hope this thing dies...

mljdeckard
November 12, 2008, 04:28 PM
Try the decaf airburst. Stop speaking in absolutes. Nobody knows what they will do or when they will do it.

FLA2760
November 12, 2008, 04:47 PM
Join the 2nd Amendment organization of your choice. Find out who your representatives are and then let them know that you vote and will watch how THEY vote on gun issues.

Crow1108
November 12, 2008, 04:53 PM
(iii) a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;

Looks like someone told the gun grabbers that we're making fun of them for not knowing what features they're banning. :rolleyes:

X-Rap
November 12, 2008, 05:05 PM
You only have to go to the NY statutes to see the direction this is going. I hope some people from there will speak up and tell us how happy their gun world is say compared to TX. or Wyo.

LKB3rd
November 13, 2008, 06:50 PM
Under a new AWB that caps magazines/clips to 10 rounds, how will the authorities be able to look at your mags and determine whether they are pre-ban? Of course this assumes they grandfather in the old ones.
It would mostly mean that shops and suppliers wouldn't be able to get or sell them anymore. If you could manage to get one somehow, I think you are right, it would not be easy for them to prove when it was made.

MGshaggy
November 13, 2008, 10:13 PM
Under a new AWB that caps magazines/clips to 10 rounds, how will the authorities be able to look at your mags and determine whether they are pre-ban? Of course this assumes they grandfather in the old ones


There's two ways:

They could either use magic spells figure out when your mags were made...

OR

The law could simply mandate that all high-capacity mags made after that date must be stamped with the date of manufacture so if you are in possession of mags dated after the law took effect you'd have a problem.

X-Rap
November 14, 2008, 01:35 AM
I'm leaning toward the magic spells:evil:

BHP FAN
November 14, 2008, 02:22 AM
WAIT...
''‘C. Sharps Arms 1875 Classic Sharps''
What the heck is that doing on this list?!

misANTHrope
November 14, 2008, 10:17 AM
WAIT...
''‘C. Sharps Arms 1875 Classic Sharps''
What the heck is that doing on this list?!

The long list at the end is of guns that are specifically exempted from the ban.

asiparks
November 14, 2008, 05:43 PM
It's good that the bill includes more than just the usual evil black rifles, it'll reduce it's chance of going anywhere the more shooting/ sporting catogories it impacts..then it's just not us loony lovers of all things high cap and wicked looking that will feel the need o push back....

That aside, I think it will be quite a while before AWB II, people are demanding action on the economy, housing, jobs, healthcare and education first and any serious legislative energy put towards doing something that to most people is less important than the ability to provide for their families will be a hard sell.

K3
November 14, 2008, 05:53 PM
That aside, I think it will be quite a while before AWB II, people are demanding action on the economy, housing, jobs, healthcare and education first and any serious legislative energy put towards doing something that to most people is less important than the ability to provide for their families will be a hard sell.

How hard do you think it would be to add in an AWB to a big old economic bill?

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