Shot with a hunting rifle?


November 10, 2008, 04:03 PM
Recently, in AZ an eight year old shot his father and another man who stayed with them.
This is indeed very tragic.
But what really pisses me off is the media. This morning the story was aired on CNN.
To me, it appeared that the reporter was trying to make it seem more tragic, and probably an aim towards the anti's, by claiming they were shot with a "Hunting" rifle.
Really? Isn't every rifle a hunting rifle?
The gun used was a .22

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Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
November 10, 2008, 04:27 PM

November 10, 2008, 04:42 PM
Sorry. Here's a link to the original story from Friday.
I don't have any video though.

November 10, 2008, 05:08 PM
Yeah, saying "hunting rifle" is kind of like saying "eating fork" or "digging shovel".

Wait a minute.... did you say
:what:8 years old?!?!??:what:

What is this world comming to? :(

November 10, 2008, 05:10 PM
It's just a reporter doing his job of sensationalizing the story.
It's up to the reader to sort the details. Like you did.

Apple a Day
November 10, 2008, 05:10 PM
It was too small to be a "sniper rifle" or "assault rifle" so they have to call it something. :(

November 10, 2008, 06:20 PM
because the media does get things wrong, of course, but I think that is taking a really big jump in trying to make the reporter an anti-gun person by calling a .22 rifle a hunting rifle. Let us try to be objective and fair and, let us not make too many judgments without having all of the facts. Why not try to email that reporter on the netnews and see what he/she has to say about that adjective.

November 10, 2008, 06:37 PM
Well, it could have been worse and had a folding stock, maybe even a 30rnd mag.

November 10, 2008, 08:59 PM
A truly tragic situation. Lets just hope the libs don't sensationalize it to pass some silly ass law.

November 11, 2008, 08:23 AM
While most of you are thinking of a hunting rifle as a rifle of larger caliber you need to rememeber that the lowly .22 is still a hunting rifle. There are plenty of people that use a .22 for hunting small game and varmits. I started my hunting career with a .22 hunting small game. That's not to say that the reporter was just trying to sensationalize his story.

November 11, 2008, 08:29 AM
I honestly don't see the sensationalism.
I also don't think this story needs a whole lot of sensationalizing to sting - it's pretty tough as it is.

As far as the "hunting rifle" thing - what do you propose would be a better description? "A small caliber, relatively harmless, low powered rifle"? There are FAR worse descriptions that could have gone with this if they were trying to sensationalize...

November 11, 2008, 01:57 PM
+1 on contacting the reporter, the only way to improve public opinion on firearms is to inform the public and the media is very good at doing that, even if they aren't always right. Hopefully the reporter will not make the same mistake again if you were to make an effort to explain the differences between a 22 and a typical hunting rifle.

I also agree that the 22 is seen by many as a hunting rifle so the line is somewhat blurry here

Happiness Is A Warm Gun
November 11, 2008, 02:21 PM
To the media there is no such thing as a "rifle" only:
1) hunting rifle
2) sniper rifle
3) assault rifle

Or sometimes less commonly known variants
5) ARMOR PIERCING rifle (how exactly the rifle pierces the armor I don't know maybe if you use it as a club it can split the armor?)

Given the "choices" I am kinda glad they said hunting rifle. To most uninformed #1 has a better image than #2 or #3.

Some might say I forgot automatic rifle but everyone in the media knows the correct name for anything automatic (or sometimes even semi-auto) is a machinegun. No exceptions.

November 11, 2008, 02:46 PM
Thanks for the post.

I pretty much agree with the consensus.

I do think that we should make the media accoutable for their word choices and start being more critical of them. The anti's are doing that and we need to do everything in our power to protect our sport.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
November 11, 2008, 03:59 PM
Arizona law generally holds that a child lacks competency to be held responsible for a homicide. However, Melnick said, “We think an exception can be made based on the facts and circumstances … This is precedent-setting. We're going to charge an 8-year-old with two counts of homicide.”

So they're going to blatently flaunt their thumbing their noses at the law, by charging an EIGHT YEAR old with murder? Talk about your overzealous law enforcement. It doesn't matter HOW BAD the crime is - in our society, a child of EIGHT years cannot be held criminally responsible for a crime - what are they gonna do, lock him up in the big house with the adult men? Ridiculous. Some heads need to roll on this. "We're going to make our own exception to the law" because "we think it's justified." Well la tee da, aren't you the all-knowing one - good thing we made you a dictator - oh wait, we didn't. Jiminy, I hate it when prosecutors break the law they are sworn to uphold. Juve hall, yes - this kid should be locked up in juve until at least 18 years, but then ya gotta set him free - you can't charge him as an adult.

November 11, 2008, 04:04 PM
actually they can charge him as an adult iirc check the state law

November 11, 2008, 04:15 PM

Published: November 10, 2008

An 8-year-old Arizona boy charged with premeditated murder in the deaths of his father and another man shot each victim at least four times with a .22-caliber rifle, methodically stopping and reloading as he killed them, prosecutors said Monday.

Although investigators initially said they thought the boy might have suffered severe physical or sexual trauma, they have found no evidence of abuse, said Roy Melnick, the police chief in St. Johns, Ariz., where the shootings occurred. Psychologists say such abuse is often a factor in the extremely rare instances in which a small child murders a parent.

An investigation found no evidence that the boy had had disciplinary problems at school or shown signs that he was troubled, Chief Melnick said. “That’s what makes this case somewhat puzzling,” he said, adding that the court had ordered a psychological evaluation for the boy. “Our goal is to get him some help.”

Kathleen M. Heide, a criminology professor at the University of South Florida, said the odds of such killings “are so infinitesimal, it’s really hard to even comprehend.”

From 1976 to 2005, there were 62 cases in the United States in which a 7- or 8-year-old was arrested on murder charges, said Dr. Heide, who analyzed F.B.I. data. Only two of those cases involved a child killing a parent. Children younger than 7 who commit killings are not charged in most states.

In cases in which a child kills a parent, the child is typically a teenager and usually acts for one of three reasons, psychologists say. Most often, the child has suffered years of physical or sexual abuse. Others kill because of severe mental illness. And some have extreme antisocial or psychopathic tendencies — a child who is used to getting his way and kills out of anger.

“The wrinkle here,” Dr. Heide said, “is that this boy is so young, it could possibly be immaturity and impulsivity.” In children as young as 8, parts of the brain that weigh decisions and consequences are so underdeveloped that a child might not understand the finality of death.

The boy in Arizona was no stranger to weapons — his father, an avid hunter, reportedly trained his son to shoot prairie dogs — and psychologists said that might have played a role.

The shootings occurred Wednesday afternoon in the two-story home in St. Johns, about 200 miles northeast of Phoenix, where the boy lived with his father, Vincent Romero, 29. The deputy attorney for Apache County, Brad Carlyon, said Monday that the boy was taken to the police by his grandmother and initially considered a victim because he was believed to have discovered the men’s bodies.

But about 45 minutes into an hourlong police interview, Mr. Carlyon said, the boy confessed to shooting his father and a man who rented a room in the house, Timothy Romans, 39, of San Carlos, Ariz.

Mr. Carlyon said the boy told the police that he had been spanked at home the night before because he was having trouble at school. But, the prosecutor said, the boy “did not say that was the reason he committed any of the acts.”

Prosecutors said the murder weapon was a single-action .22-caliber hunting rifle that requires reloading before each shot. “He had to eject the shell from the rifle and put in a new shell each time he fired,” Mr. Carlyon said.

Mr. Carlyon and Chief Melnick spoke to The New York Times shortly before an Apache County judge placed a gag order on lawyers and the police a little before noon Monday.

Mr. Romero, who was divorced from the boy’s mother, had recently remarried and had custody of his son. Mr. Romero was the first victim, investigators said, shot in the head and chest as he walked up a staircase inside the house shortly after 5 p.m.

Mr. Romans was outside the house talking on his cellphone to his wife, Mr. Carlyon said, when he heard some commotion inside. Mr. Carlyon said the rifle produced only a “muffled, soft popping” sound, making it likely that Mr. Romans had no idea what had happened inside. Mr. Carlyon said Mr. Romans had told his wife that the boy was calling for him. He was on the porch on his way into the house when he was shot in the chest and head, the authorities said.

The police arrived at the house one minute after receiving a phone call from a neighbor at 5:08 p.m., Chief Melnick said. Both men were dead. The chief said the boy was not immediately taken into custody. “He was considered a witness,” Chief Melnick said.

A secretary for the boy’s lawyer, Benjamin Brewer, said Mr. Brewer was in court all day Monday and could not be reached for comment. Mr. Brewer has said that neither he nor the boy’s family was present for the questioning and that the boy was not read his rights. He is being held at the Apache County Juvenile Detention Center.

no more abuse claims? shot em both 4 times with a single shot?

November 11, 2008, 04:19 PM
I hope the gun did not have a black stock?Those are more dangerous ya know?

November 11, 2008, 07:15 PM
That's it - I'm calling for nothing less than an a full ban on .22 rifles.

[I'm not making light of the incident - It is very sad, and living in AZ myself, can appreciate the implications. However, incidents such as this only serve to inflame the antis - and I feel a response, no matter how sarcastic, is in order.]

November 11, 2008, 08:16 PM
OK, they said "hunting rifle". I don't find that objectionable. It just means that we're all in this fight together. Black evil rifles and hunting rifles, it's all the same stuff. Anti-gun folks are equal opportunity haters. Anyway, I didn't find the articles to be too biased against gun owners overall.

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