ar15


PDA






wheelgun51
November 17, 2008, 10:40 AM
a friend has a ar15 and wants to replace the 223 upper with a 308.Will this work?

If you enjoyed reading about "ar15" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Onmilo
November 17, 2008, 10:43 AM
Nope.
Two different calibers and two different platforms.

gvnwst
November 17, 2008, 11:05 AM
The reasson it won't is that they .223 and .308 use different size mags. The .308 can't fit inside AR-15 mags, that is what the AR-10 is for. You can get more powerful cartridges in the AR 15, but not the .308.

Hoppy590
November 17, 2008, 11:06 AM
Two different calibers and two different platforms.

well thats not entirely true, theres plenty of differant caliber uppers that will work with a ar 15 lower

but i know what you mean.


what onmilo wants to say is that the Ar15 lower is differant from an AR10 lower. its shorter, with a smaller magazine well and depending on the type of AR10 you buy, the upper has a differant shape.

long story short, there are some calibers you can freely swap onto an AR15. but .308 (X51 nato) is not one of them

hso
November 17, 2008, 11:21 AM
Ask your buddy to put a 7.62 NATO round beside a 5.56 and consider that the magazines have to be of correspondingly different size and that the magazine well on the lower has to be of correspondingly different size as well. He's "see" that the answer is no.

expvideo
November 17, 2008, 11:31 AM
I think what Hoppy590 is saying is that "Two different calibers and two different platforms" is true in this case, but that it is not a universal truth about all calibers. For example, you could use a .223 lower to fire a variety of other calibers, by simply changing the upper (and a magwell insert for 9mm). A few of these calibers are:

5.56
9mm
.22
5.45x39
6.8 spc

and so on. However, 7.62 is much longer, so you are absolutely right that it would require a different lower. I don't think that Hoppy was disagreeing with you on that.

Tarvis
November 17, 2008, 11:45 AM
Well if we are going to nit pick what Onmilo and Hoppy said, I guess that leaves everyone open to criticism right?

expvideo: Describing 7.62 Nato/7.62x51 as 7.62 is misleading for the most obvious of reasons. You are asking for someone to misunderstand you and think you are referring to 7.62x39/7.62 Soviet, especially because there are 7.62x39 uppers for the AR platform.

Remember that the AR platform doesn't need a different lower to shoot .308, it is completely incapable; the cartridge needs a different rifle. An AR10 is not an AR15.

expvideo
November 17, 2008, 12:09 PM
Well if we are going to nit pick what Onmilo and Hoppy said, I guess that leaves everyone open to criticism right?

expvideo: Describing 7.62 Nato/7.62x51 as 7.62 is misleading for the most obvious of reasons. You are asking for someone to misunderstand you and think you are referring to 7.62x39/7.62 Soviet, especially because there are 7.62x39 uppers for the AR platform.

Remember that the AR platform doesn't need a different lower to shoot .308, it is completely incapable; the cartridge needs a different rifle. An AR10 is not an AR15.
An AR is made up of a lower and an upper. Replacing both = new gun. So when I say that you would not only need a new upper, but a new lower as well, that means a new gun. Sorry if that was confusing to you.

It was my understanding, and I could very well be wrong, that there were no 7.62 rounds, 7.62x39 included, that will work with a .223 lower. They require a special lower with a different mag well, from what I've read. I could be wrong, but I've never heard of a 7.62x39 being able to work with a .223 lower. Please let me know if I'm wrong, but please show me an example of a .223 lower that will allow 7.62x39, since it is my understanding that it doesn't exist. Besides, it was already established that 7.62 NATO was the round being discussed, so the only confusion was yours.

BTW, I don't see how my post could be considered nit-picking or hostile in any way, so maybe you could ease up on the hostile tones in yours. I would appreciate it.

Tarvis
November 17, 2008, 12:26 PM
An AR is made up of a lower and an upper. Replacing both = new gun.
Fallacy. You aren't changing out the lower for a different one you are buying a different gun with a different name. This is not the same as swapping them out.

Besides, it was already established that 7.62 NATO was the round being discussed
It was established that .308 was the round being discussed, and yes, you would confuse someone when you're talking about 7.62 in general when referring to the AR15 platform.

BTW, I don't see how my post could be considered nit-picking
We all understood what he said and meant.
or hostile in any way,
I never said it was.
so maybe you could ease up on the hostile tones in yours.
I wasn't being hostile, I was correcting you, and you obviously needed correction. Search google for 7.62x39 AR.

wheelgun51
November 17, 2008, 12:30 PM
Thanks for replies.What will a AR10 cost? We live about 45 miles west of Fort Worth Texas.No gun shops left where we are.

Hoppy590
November 17, 2008, 12:31 PM
i dont even know whats going on in this thread. what i said, what onmilo said... i donno.

my point was that a change in calibers doesn't always necessitate a new lower/gun that some CAN be done on the AR15 and some must be done on AR10 if you want magazine feed. in the case of .308 it does require an AR10 lower.

if you dont want magazine feed, then you can do anything on the AR15 lower including .50BMG (and even one side magazine fed BMG)

R.W.Dale
November 17, 2008, 12:42 PM
t was my understanding, and I could very well be wrong, that there were no 7.62 rounds, 7.62x39 included, that will work with a .223 lower. They require a special lower with a different mag well, from what I've read. I could be wrong, but I've never heard of a 7.62x39 being able to work with a .223 lower. Please let me know if I'm wrong, but please show me an example of a .223 lower that will allow 7.62x39, since it is my understanding that it doesn't exist. Besides, it was already established that 7.62 NATO was the round being discussed, so the only confusion was yours.

I've been shooting a 20" 7.62x39mm upper on a plain jane Superior Arms .223 lower for several months now


http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=405210

gvnwst
November 17, 2008, 01:50 PM
I think that he was thinking of using AK mags. That would require a different well, but if you use mags designed to use 'x39 in the AR, any regular lower will work.

As for how much AR-10's cost, check out DPMS. Armalite makes them too, but they are more expensive. DPMS had one for as little as $900, IIRC. Many different grades, just like the '15.

Here is the link:
http://www.dpmsinc.com/

Hoppy590
November 17, 2008, 02:00 PM
Thanks for replies.What will a AR10 cost? We live about 45 miles west of Fort Worth Texas.No gun shops left where we are.

alot. 1k +

there is 2 variations of AR10's. Armalite and DPMS style.
and theres maybe 1/2 a dozen major manufacturers

Armalite style rifles use a slanted cut in the upper reciever. these must use a lower with the same slant cut
http://www.coldwarshooters.net/images/ar-10-stripped.jpg

DPMS style rifles use a rounded cut like an AR15. and require a rounded receiver
http://estore.websitepros.com/stores/829285/images/dpms%20308%20complete%20lower.jpg

Upper differance
http://www.ar15barrels.com/tech/ar10-dpms308rec.jpg

then rifles can be had in either DPMS magazine format, Armalite Magazie format then some random ones like HK G3 mags and others

jerkface11
November 17, 2008, 02:52 PM
Maybe he should get a custom one? You can get one made in a wildcat called .300 WSSM it fits in an AR15 lower and gets about .3087 ballistics. Of course he'd have to handload for it.

expvideo
November 17, 2008, 03:05 PM
Fallacy. You aren't changing out the lower for a different one you are buying a different gun with a different name. This is not the same as swapping them out.
Did I say that you would have to "swap" the lower, or did I say "that would require a different lower"?


It was established that .308 was the round being discussed, and yes, you would confuse someone when you're talking about 7.62 in general when referring to the AR15 platform.

The person I was responding to had mentioned "7.62 NATO". Since I was responding specifically to him, saying "7.62" shouldn't have been confusing to anyone. You are seriously nit-picking and seriously getting on my nerves.

We all understood what he said and meant.
Kind of like we all understood what I said and meant.

I wasn't being hostile, I was correcting you, and you obviously needed correction. Search google for 7.62x39 AR.
OK, first of all, you are being hostile. Secondly, you are correct about the 7.62x39 AR. I was unaware this. But this shouldn't matter because, again, I was addressing someone else's post, who was talking about 7.62 NATO, so abreviating it to 7.62 was acceptable and didn't confuse anyone but you. Now if you have nothing important to say on the topic, why don't you take your grammar nazi-ing elsewhere and cut this out. There was nothing wrong with my post and you are being unnecessarily hostile.

CYANIDEGENOCIDE
November 17, 2008, 03:07 PM
I'll say it, Yes he can shoot .308 from an ar-15 if he can find an upper that fits his lower. Point of note it will be a single shot rifle ala bohica uppers.

If you enjoyed reading about "ar15" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!