AR in .308 or M-1A?


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SniperStraz
November 17, 2008, 06:33 PM
I'm looking into buying myself a combat type rifle with good range. I'm a little bit partial to the AR platform because I was trained using mostly ARs and M-24s. With an AR I can strip it down and or fix a jam with one hand in the dark. On the other hand the M-1A/M-14 platform is legendary for its accuracy. I want to be able to accurately hit a "head sized" target at 600 yards min. and be able to use it for CQB type applications. So does the AR in .308 even compare or am I just kidding myself? And how easy is to to become truely proficient with the M-1A as far as learning to take care of it and such? Thanx in advance for your help.

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Zundfolge
November 17, 2008, 06:36 PM
In general AR10s are more accurate than M1As.

The only major advantage of the M1A is if you have to butt stroke someone, otherwise the AR10 will likely cost less, be more accurate, lighter weight, have more accessories available and me more versatile and customizable.

You know the AR platform, just get an AR10, you'll be happier in the long run.

DPMS (http://www.dpmsinc.com/firearms/category.aspx?id=9) makes a nice line of them (they also make the one Remington sells).

If you want a .308 AR platform rifle priced in the M1A range, the POF (http://www.pof-usa.com/p308/p308.htm) offerings in .308 are pretty sweet.

H2O MAN
November 17, 2008, 06:42 PM
The M14 is a better rifle, but since you are more familiar with the AR... stick with what you know.

Z71
November 17, 2008, 06:50 PM
Don't know anything about AR-10 rifles, however I have 3 M14 pattern rifles(2 Polytech M14's and an M1A). I also have an L1A1(FAL).

The M14 rifles do shoot quite well, as does the L1A1. I don't know about legendary accuracy. The M14 is subject to stock fit and other issues that may effect a wooden stocked rifles accuracy.

While I have no experience with AR-10 rifles, I can say that the M14 type rifles do seem to be the most accurate of the 7.62 NATO rifles I've fired. Better(in my opinion) than HK G3's and FAL style rifles.

May not be a fair comparison because I really like the M14!

karnaaj
November 17, 2008, 10:43 PM
In general AR10s are more accurate than M1As.

I have to strongly disagree with this. It has certainly not been my personal experience (and I have shot both). In addition, if the AR10 platform was so great why is it the army is trying to dig up as many M1A/M14's as they can for mid-range sniper duty over in A'stan and Iraq? And don't forget that the AR10 suffers from the same malady as the AR15 in that it craps where it eats.

To the OP, buy an M1A. You'll never regret it. The history of it alone is worth it.

longdayjake
November 17, 2008, 10:46 PM
I vote for m1a. The only thing that I think the ar10 offers that is better than the m1a is the magazine is easier to insert which makes reloading faster if you are in a hurry. Everything else is better on an m1a.

jpwilly
November 17, 2008, 10:54 PM
As far as I have seen the DPMS LR-308, AR-10 and other variants can match up with the best M1A's. Both are more accurate than is needed for a MBR and will serve quite well as a DMR...some can even handle the snipering role. Most high power matches are won with AR platforms these days.

I personally prefer the feel look and feel of the M1A and plan to pick one up someday. As far as the "everything else" being better on a M1A that's pretty subjective and if you already like the AR platform than I don't think it matters much.

Not to contradict myself but I recently picked up a DPMS LR-308 AP4 with quad rail and 6 position stock because I think the platform is more versatile and will be more accurate for less money. I already have a beautiful M1 Garand in 308 Win...very close to the M14 in many ways - great sights, good trigger, big, heavy, long, and a pussy cat to shoot. Wanna see it:

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p38/jpwilly/range020208002-1-2.jpg

This isn't mine but I want to outfit my DPMS AP4 like this:

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y161/coopmandu/DPMS308001.jpg

Pipe Burn
November 17, 2008, 11:52 PM
M1A

-Passes as a hunting rifle to the untrained eye
-Has that "Look"
-shoots well 2.5 MOA or less
-expensive as all heck $1300-$4500 new (see crazy horse package or super match for the most expensive examples)
-scope mounts are expensive for a good one (150-300 dollars), and they do not remove or attach quickly.
-heavy

AR10/SR25

-versatile platform for tacti-cool stuff
-looks like an "evil rifle" to the general public
-shoots well 2.5 MOA or less
-expensive as all heck $1100-?
-scope mounts quickly to the flat top upper reciever
-heavy

I bought the standard loaded M1A for $1500. With the $270 smith scope mount, $100 steel rings, $50 fiberglass stock, and the $380 scope from Leupold, I now have a $2300 rifle that shoots 1.5 MOA on a good day with hand loads.

I love my M1A and shoot it the most, but I could of got more fore the money going the AR10 route. And I too trained on the AR platform during a 20 year career with Uncle Sam, but there is something about an M14 clone that made me go wood and steel.

Bowfishrp
November 18, 2008, 12:01 AM
Well I can do 1" groups at 100 yards no sweat with my dpms lr-308AP4 which runs about $1100.
I have nothing bad to say about the M1A just love my LR.

Mannlicher
November 18, 2008, 10:51 AM
I am staying with my M1A rifles.
http://www.myhostedpics.com/images/Mannlicher/freedomisnotfree.jpg

Jason_G
November 18, 2008, 12:49 PM
All in all, you will have to shoot both and determine which you like better.

On paper, the AR has most of the advantages:


More accuracy per dollar spent.
Parts and upgrades are cheaper and more abundant.
Optics mounts are far cheaper and easier.


However, my personal and humble opinion is that the AR has no soul. I have tried very hard to like the platform, and I just don't. The M14/M1A is just the opposite to me. I love it. If I could only own one rifle, that would be it.

I guess what I am trying to say is that you need to get the one that speaks to you. Sounds cheesy, but that's the only way you'll know which one will give you the most satisfaction of ownership, and we're talking about some fairly expensive rifles, so whichever it ends up being, you want to get it right.


Best of luck in your search,

Jason

T J
November 18, 2008, 03:48 PM
I have been kicking around the same issue of trying to decide between an AR type and M14/M1A type. Want something to put a good scope on, and think the AR's can handle that issue with no problems. On the M14 type, does anyone have any experience with the M25 style rifles such as maybe the Springfield White Feather, or the LRB rifles? I am guessing they might be better for scoping than a standard mount on an M14/M1A. What I have read so far gets above my knowlege about the lug configurations etc. Any insight?

Jason_G
November 18, 2008, 03:58 PM
I have been kicking around the same issue of trying to decide between an AR type and M14/M1A type. Want something to put a good scope on, and think the AR's can handle that issue with no problems. On the M14 type, does anyone have any experience with the M25 style rifles such as maybe the Springfield White Feather, or the LRB rifles? I am guessing they might be better for scoping than a standard mount on an M14/M1A. What I have read so far gets above my knowlege about the lug configurations etc. Any insight?

For a dedicated optics rifle, the LRB M25 receiver would be tough to beat, but they are expensive. LRB makes the best M14 receiver out there though.

I can't comment on the SAI M25 Whitefeather. I've never even seen one in person. I would opt for an LRB build for that kind of $$ though.

As far as lugs on the receiver, the hear-say is that they don't really add anything to accuracy, but they do tend to make glass-bedding last longer. For me, I would probably do without extra lugs as it makes stock selection a little tougher.

Jason

ds92
November 18, 2008, 04:08 PM
+1 for the AR-10. I personally dont like them very well but if you have familiarity with the platform i think thats what you should go with.
However, personally, I would buy an M1A.

The best thing you could do would be to hold them both, shoot them both (if possible) and decide then.

T J
November 18, 2008, 04:30 PM
On LRB's it seems like I saw on their website that they will custom build to customer specs, but I guess I am rather uneducated on what options are available and would be wanted. Also regarding a dedicated optic rifle, I have had in mind to have a scope with quick connect mounts that would not loose zero and have the option of iron sights as well. Would this be a workable idea? If so, what kind of mounts (like ARMS or some other)?.

HOLY DIVER
November 18, 2008, 08:04 PM
dad has an m1a i've put a few rounds through it its sweet!love it
never not once has it jammed very accurate but on the down side it is a little heavy still a work horse though!

Paladin_Hammer
November 18, 2008, 08:07 PM
If you can get the ADAMSARMs gas set for it, get the AR-10.

If not, the M1A is far more reliable than an AR-10. What's the point in getting a semi-auto .308 if its just going to break on you?

FLRon
November 18, 2008, 08:24 PM
I guess I wanted a piece of American military history, so I opted for the M1A just a few weeks ago.

My immediate intention is to stay with the iron sights. It has been a fun learning experience to discover and get up to speed on a new platform. I will say that by the time you start tweaking a Springfield with some USGI, Smith and Sadlak parts, you are not that far off the cost of a LRB.

hak
November 18, 2008, 09:48 PM
i pondered the same question. AR10 or M1/14.

the benefits and limitations of the M1/14 have been covered. i held a few, even. hard to put down.

the black/'evil' look of the AR wasn't a draw or deterrent, just utilitarian. the gas system at first turned me off, and i understand the issues in 'sandbox' environments, but as range, hunting, target, SHTF MMR (my main rifle) platform it won out for me.

some of the things that swayed me to the AR10 variant:

1) commodity based pricing (well before the Nov 5th anyways) vs. a market price + a mystique premium ;)

meaning, a very wide range of AR platform folk. the M1/14 lines offered seemed to be, beautiful, but less plentiful; sure there are some fixer-uppers, but not for my first semi-auto rifle.

2) availability of parts/flexibility. and not just grips/sights. i realized that i could start with one of these

http://www.hakalugi.net/images/boomstick/sm_full%20profile%20LR-308.jpg

and enjoy the 24" barrel, and bolt-gun accuracy. yet... thanks to the DPMS, when budget allows: get the AP4 upper/assembly with its own 16" barrel with rails, etc. loosing 8" of overall length and 3-4 pounds in the process. the flat top uppers with integrated rail, means my scope goes along with the 24" assembly and the (aimpoint/___?) will stay on the 16" barrel assembly.

kinda why i'm looking at the Mossberg 930.

i had zero experience with either. so it was a cold/impartial decision. and the flexibility and value of the AR outweighed the 'poops where it eats' maint needs.

45B@cav
November 19, 2008, 12:35 AM
M!A are you high!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

jpwilly
November 19, 2008, 12:37 AM
Right now you desicion will be hampered by availability. I say buy the one you can find...Both rifles are awesome!

JWarren
November 19, 2008, 07:45 AM
However, my personal and humble opinion is that the AR has no soul.



Souls are overrated. :evil:


I have a LR-308 that I just sighted in yesterday.... Best group after zeroing was .38 at 100 yards.

I'd LOVE to have an M1A, but I'd not sell my LR-308 to get one.



-- John

oneeyenurse
November 19, 2008, 08:04 AM
I like mine.

http://i8.ebayimg.com/05/i/001/1d/9a/2bc7_1.JPG

eldon519
November 19, 2008, 08:14 AM
If you want to use the iron sights, I think accuracy will be a wash. I believe the AR-10 to be more mechanically accurate, but with the increased sight radius the M1A has compared to the AR10 for a given barrel length, I think practical accuracy would be similar. If you want to use optics, the AR10 is a ton easier and cheaper to mount up.

I believe the M1A is the more reliable of the two rifles. I also like that the M1A/M14 has seen extensive military service which means that it has been heavily tested and there are lots of mil spec parts floating around.

I may be wrong about this, but as I understand it, alot of the "AR-10" style rifles we currently see are not truly interchangeable or built to the same specs.

If you are experienced with the AR though, I'd say go with it. I still haven't gotten the hang of loading a new mag into my M1A with an open bolt.

lonegunman
November 19, 2008, 08:20 AM
Depends on what you can find these days. The Obamafurher will be banning both of them in the near future anyway.


I have used both platforms quite a bit and seem to shoot the AR-10 quite a bit better at distance. My only complaint about Armalite is that their magazine followers are about the worst quality possible and every mag I have ever tried tipped at some point and jammed.

M1A's on the other hand,,,,,always go bang and a pretty straight grained piece of walnut feels like home.

30 cal slob
November 19, 2008, 08:29 AM
i've heard good things about GA Precision's AR 10 style SPR:

http://www.gaprecision.net/AR10.html

I've also heard nice things about DPMS' .308 builds, which surprises me somewhat, since I'm not a huge fan of their .556 stuff.

Jason_G
November 19, 2008, 04:54 PM
SniperStraz, did you decide anything yet?

Jason

SniperStraz
November 20, 2008, 06:48 PM
Looks like I'll probably be going with an AR if I can find one. They sell out pretty quick these days. I appreciate everyones help.

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