.45 isn't even a cell phone stopper, let alone a manstopper


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smoothie
November 20, 2008, 01:35 AM
http://www.wwltv.com/topstories/stories/wwl111908tplucky.1cc3c41f3.html

9mm would have penetrated that cell phone.

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IncredibleGord
November 20, 2008, 02:06 AM
lol. Don't start a caliber war again.

mnrivrat
November 20, 2008, 02:09 AM
Investigators said the bullet was probably shot a quarter of a mile away or more

9mm would have penetrated that cell phone.

Might want to re-think that .

bmxr4life87
November 20, 2008, 02:21 AM
i bet my 30-30 woulda made short work of that cellphone......


but seriously thats a freak accident and hes pretty lucky that nothing happened.

Mike U.
November 20, 2008, 02:29 AM
Just think of how many Moros and Japanese could have been saved if they only had their cell phones clipped to their chests! Ohh, wait...



I'm really happy nobody got hurt.

And I hope the shooter was just the victim of a ricochet and NOT firing his weapon in the air.

JimmAr
November 20, 2008, 02:31 AM
I can only imagine the cellphone still being in working order after being hit by a 9mm instead.. so damn that 45 for being so powerful!

Makes me wanna go drop some bills on a 45 right now.

Snowdog
November 20, 2008, 02:34 AM
I wouldn't expect a 230gr .45acp at nearly 500 yards away to be the cat's meow at stopping a cellphone, though I wouldn't hold out much more faith if it were a 115gr 9mm either.
If my target is a Motorola Razr at 500 yards, I demand nothing less than a 7.62x51 as we know how dangerous a wounded cellphone can be.

General Geoff
November 20, 2008, 02:43 AM
If the cell phone stopped the bullet, a rib or sternum would likely have stopped it as well.

Still a lucky fellow though.

Master Blaster
November 20, 2008, 08:49 AM
It was a .45 caliber bullet, and it hit his cell phone. Investigators said the bullet was probably shot a quarter of a mile away or more, and was probably falling at the time it hit Richard.



Must have been fired in the air or it was a riccochet. Big difference between that and a .45 fired from 50 yards or less directly at a target.

If anyone has a cell phone we could take it to the range and test at 25 yards.....

hso
November 20, 2008, 10:22 AM
On a more serious note -

According to Strain, shooting guns in the area around Lee Road, is not unusual.

“We have no reason to believe that there was any type of criminal intent,” he said. “That this truly was just an incident where someone discharged his weapon, whether it was target practicing or hunting."

But Strain did caution that if you fire a weapon anywhere, you are criminally and civilly responsible for where the bullet comes down.

Tommygunn
November 20, 2008, 10:34 AM
If a cellphone ever attacks me I will be sure to use a 9mm. . . . .:uhoh::neener:

Zach S
November 20, 2008, 10:39 AM
If the cell phone stopped the bullet, a rib or sternum would likely have stopped it as well.
I've never cracked my sternum (or anyone else for that matter), but have broke a few phones.

BBQLS1
November 20, 2008, 10:43 AM
Keep drinking the kool aid smoothie.

Robert
November 20, 2008, 10:45 AM
Must have been using volley sights...
Shot was taken form at least a 1/4 mile away, that's 440 yards if my math is right. Still, he is lucky, but at that range I would only expect a bruise, maybe a cracked bone.

#shooter
November 20, 2008, 11:23 AM
If true, this is like those western movies where the whisky flask stops the bullet.

IfYouOnlyKnew
November 20, 2008, 12:02 PM
My place of work is only a few miles from Lee Road. It is a winding heavily traveled two lane road in a rapidly developing area that was much more rural only a few years ago. Referencing the heavy traffic a popular bumper sticker in the area states "Pray for Me. I Drive Lee Road." Now, apparently, there's another reason.

Eyesac
November 20, 2008, 12:45 PM
What caliber for cellphone...:neener:

America
November 21, 2008, 09:05 AM
YOu wanna be safe out in the woods.

http://kdka.com/watercooler/phone.stops.bullet.2.869764.html

cavman
November 21, 2008, 09:30 AM
Cell phone in man's chest pocket stops bullet



Fri Nov 21, 1:00 am ET

COVINGTON, La. A man says his cell phone saved his life. A stray .45-caliber bullet hit R.J. Richard's chest while he was mowing the lawn hitting so hard he thought it was a stone kicked out by his tractor. He pulled out the phone. It fell apart.

The 68-year-old man was bruised. He said doctors told him two things prevented worse injury, maybe even death: the phone, and the fact that the bullet came in at an angle rather than head-on.

Reports of pocket Bibles saving their owners' lives pop up every so often. Richard says he's sure that God told him to put the phone in his overalls chest pocket rather than a pants pocket as usual. He said that Saturday's incident increased his faith.

He figured the bullet was fired by a hunter in woods near his 5-acre property.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081121/ap_on_fe_st/odd_cell_phone_bullet

xd45gaper
November 21, 2008, 10:02 AM
lucky it wasnt a 10mm, it would have blew the man and his mower apart!:what:

Pilot
November 21, 2008, 10:12 AM
Just reinforces that "Know your backstop" is mandatory at all times. This could have ended very differently and been a black eye for shooters.

eldon519
November 21, 2008, 10:34 AM
Must have been a .45 GAP.

xd45gaper
November 21, 2008, 10:43 AM
Must have been a .45 GAP

:cuss: the GAP would have blown him off his mower!!! ROFL

jackdanson
November 21, 2008, 10:47 AM
cell phone saved him? If it didn't penetrate a cell phone it wouldn't penetrate your chest... idiotic press thinks getting hit by a bullet inherently sends gore and limbs flying through the air. Although the welt wouldn't have been comfy without the phone.

xd45gaper
November 21, 2008, 10:57 AM
wonder how far away it was shot! the average 45 acp round is what 200+ gains? thats quite a bit of force coming down. obiviously not enough to pentrate the phone and the mans chest.

up close and personal i think it would have been over that phone wouldnt have stopped jack!

Serial Crusher
November 21, 2008, 10:59 AM
I really like the Sheriff's response. Surprising to here a public official say "s**t happens" when they're not involved in after action CYA. I'm glad he didn't broadly condemn shooting and firearms.

rondog
November 21, 2008, 01:13 PM
Bah. If it didn't even have enough energy left to crack the plastic on the phone, it wouldn't have broken his skin either.

Quoheleth
November 21, 2008, 01:18 PM
Trust me...as thin-skinned as some people are these days, had that cell phone not been there it coulda been a through & through.

Q

Double Naught Spy
November 21, 2008, 02:47 PM
Reports of pocket Bibles saving their owners' lives pop up every so often. Richard says he's sure that God told him to put the phone in his overalls chest pocket rather than a pants pocket as usual. He said that Saturday's incident increased his faith.

Why didn't God just tell the shooter not to pull the trigger at that moment?

yeti
November 21, 2008, 03:26 PM
Why didn't God just tell the shooter not to pull the trigger at that moment?

:D:D

Would have been cheaper if god had just let him know, it was time for a glass of sweet tea, at the correct moment.
Or called him on that cell, he told him to put in that pocket, and just say, "Richard, this is god, duck!"

Guy B. Meredith
November 21, 2008, 06:07 PM
"He figured the bullet was fired by a hunter in woods near his 5-acre property."

.45???

98C5
November 21, 2008, 06:15 PM
"He figured the bullet was fired by a hunter in woods near his 5-acre property."

.45???

Maybe he was using a Tommy gun...


:p

I LIKE IT!
November 21, 2008, 06:34 PM
Who cares, they'll both kill you with good shot placement. Stupid argument.

PTK
November 21, 2008, 06:36 PM
Once again, pistols are pistols, rifles are rifles, and distance is your friend.

eldon519
November 21, 2008, 06:56 PM
They never say what kind of bullet except .45 caliber unless I missed something. Could have been a 600-grain solid from a .458 Win Mag for all we know.

rfwobbly
November 21, 2008, 07:34 PM
Makes you want to sew dead cell phones into your coat, doesn't it?

dust_101
November 21, 2008, 07:41 PM
On a riding lawnmower, at that distance, hitting a cell phone.

That's either the most unlucky ricochet ever, or someone is a very good shot.

All kidding aside, as hso said:

"if you fire a weapon anywhere, you are criminally and civilly responsible for where the bullet comes down."

Never forget that.

Mal H
November 21, 2008, 07:47 PM
I just saw the story on the evening news. They showed the bullet and the cellphone. The man who got hit said he was very lucky, that if he hadn't had his cellphone in his pocket the bullet would have killed him for sure. I had to laugh at that. The small dent (dent, not hole) in the cell phone was so shallow, I think I could throw the bullet at the phone faster and cause more damage. If he hadn't had the cellphone, I seriously doubt the bullet would have even broken the skin. It probably would have left a bruise, but that's about it. That bullet traveled a long way or lost most of its energy in a ricochet or two.

The bullet was a round nose, but I think it had a cannelure, so it wasn't a "normal" .45 ACP bullet. It looked to be too long to be a .45 FMJ. (I should have recorded the story to have a better look.)

Blue .45
November 21, 2008, 08:10 PM
Is this it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaPB7Aq1fIE

While the shot wasn't lethal, It would still be good to to find the person who fired the shot, so they can be told to fire in a safer direction, or use a better backstop.

Mississippi
November 21, 2008, 08:20 PM
There are some pics on this page.

http://www.wwltv.com/perl/common/slideshow/sspop.pl?recid=13161&location=www.wwltv.com

koja48
November 21, 2008, 08:30 PM
Glad the fella is alright. If I ever anticipate 500-yard shots at cell phones or any other target, reckon I'll continue using a rifle. In the meantime, I'll keep carrying my trusty 1911 for those shots under 20 & typically much nearer. And remember: "A handgun is what you use to fight your way back to your real gun."

LightningJoe
November 21, 2008, 09:20 PM
Probably the clean miss I had back in 1986 or so. Finally came back down. Sorry.

koja48
November 21, 2008, 09:24 PM
Can I trouble you for your reloading data, Joe? Great "hang-time" . . .

azhunter122
November 21, 2008, 10:32 PM
It was a .45 caliber bullet, and it hit his cell phone. Investigators said the bullet was probably shot a quarter of a mile away or more, and was probably falling at the time it hit Richard.

Sharps-shooter
November 22, 2008, 12:48 AM
I'm really impressed that a .45 can hit such a small target as a cellphone from a quarter mile. I never realized the round had such good inherent accuracy.:)

Schofield3
November 22, 2008, 01:04 AM
Probably the clean miss I had back in 1986 or so. Finally came back down. Sorry.

:Dhahaha

7.62X25mm
November 22, 2008, 01:09 AM
Yeah, well when I was in the SeaBees back in the 'Nam we had this guy out on his Cat in the middle of a rice paddy.

His Zippo stopped an AK round from Charlie . . .

-- and if you believe that story, let me tell you about hunting the side-hill gougers with Sarah Palin in Alaska.

:neener:

dunlop
November 22, 2008, 01:21 AM
good thing it was a .45 otherwise any other call he would of been dead :what:

25wssmisgood
November 22, 2008, 08:03 AM
Hmm Well, good to read that he wasn't arrested for using his cell phone (for self defense) while driving (his mower)

Flyboy
November 22, 2008, 10:08 AM
The bullet was a round nose, but I think it had a cannelure, so it wasn't a "normal" .45 ACP bullet. It looked to be too long to be a .45 FMJ.
The pictures Mississippi posted make it looks like a .45ACP. Picture 2 looks too long, but when you look at 7, you realize it's on a reflective surface, so the "cannelure" is just the base of the bullet being reflected.

moooose102
November 22, 2008, 10:22 AM
well, that does it. now i know i am going to have to sell my 45acp, and buy a 45 winchester magnum!:neener: who would have thought that after ONLY 1/4 mile, a 45 bullet would loose most of its energy:banghead: i wonder why nobody has ever thought abould rocket powered bullets so as the velocity slows, the rocket lights and kicks it in the hiney!:evil: that way, we could get 3 or 4 miles of range from our pistols! :D sheesh!

Mike J
November 22, 2008, 10:30 AM
As others have said please make sure you have an adequate backstop. Incidents like this just give ammunition to those who would take our rights away.
I'm just glad the man wasn't seriously harmed.

1858rem
November 22, 2008, 10:36 AM
soooo... buy the number of lands and groves, direction of rifling and rate of twist..... who can figure out what gun it came from:neener:. righthand twist maybe....5-6 lands/groves, relatively fast twist cause you can see the directionality over a, what, 5/8 inch tall bullet? so who knows what it came from?:scrutiny:

1858rem
November 22, 2008, 10:40 AM
they did make rocket powered caseless ammunition before to reduce weight..... but, if your just at the range, maybe slip one of the rockets into a case to launch it from for the added range maybe. originally the caseless ammo failed because it, well i dont remember, i do remember at very short ranges it was about useless because it hadnt built enough speed yet off the little rocket.

Double Naught Spy
November 22, 2008, 11:30 AM
http://www.wwltv.com/perl/common/slideshow/sspop.pl?recid=13161&nextimage=4

Somehow, I have trouble believing the story given the picture of the shirt with the nearly perfect hole in it, as if the bullet went through at high velocity, but then only dented the phone. Something doesn't add up. This is especially significant given that the bullet would have been going through the shirt as it was impacting the phone.

savage116
November 22, 2008, 12:03 PM
In the one slide someone said "You just appreciate everything so much more, and how fragile life really is. (If not for the cell phone) he would not be with us."

I don't think he would have been injured severely.Sure it would hurt but it didn't go through the phone.It would probably be like a frozen paintball.

Mal H
November 22, 2008, 12:32 PM
The pictures Mississippi posted make it looks like a .45ACP. Picture 2 looks too long, but when you look at 7, you realize it's on a reflective surface, so the "cannelure" is just the base of the bullet being reflected.You're right! They didn't mention that the bullet was photographed on a mirror. The TV news I watched only briefly showed the closeup of the bullet. Yep, that's a regular old 230.

mgregg85
November 22, 2008, 12:39 PM
It was a .45 caliber bullet, and it hit his cell phone. Investigators said the bullet was probably shot a quarter of a mile away or more, and was probably falling at the time it hit Richard.

Yeah I doubt 9mm would have done a thing at 1/4 mile but this is a troll post anyways so what the hell.

ccsniper
November 22, 2008, 12:47 PM
we know how dangerous a wounded cellphone can be

your not kidding!! i once was following on through the backwoods of arkansas only to find it still alive... most horrific scene of my life. to see that sony ericson flying at my face, lukily i shot it 2 more times with some buckshot and finally put it down.:neener:;)

tblt
November 22, 2008, 12:55 PM
I just went outside and shot my old cell phone with a 22 and it went right thru it then pulled out my 9 and it blew it apart.I didn't want to use my 7 mm mag its too noisy

xd .45 shooter
November 22, 2008, 12:59 PM
this is definitely a troll posting. at a real range the 45 would have definitely at least really wounded the cell phone. depending on shot placement he would have to buy a new one for sure.:neener: no seriously, glad he was not hurt, but if it would have been meant to hurt him, he would not be with us anymore as the shot would have been made much closer and he would have been a drunken idiot trying to run you over with his lawn mower.:uhoh:. nine more deadly thatn a 45 rrrrrright. i think you would be dead with either when closer that 100 yards not close to 500 yards, what a troll:banghead:

Officers'Wife
November 22, 2008, 01:39 PM
By the use of penetration at a quarter mile, a .22 LR would be more effective than the .45. It would appear smoothie should find work at a Gannet newspaper as he has a remarkable talent of slipping on a premise and sprawling to a conclusion.

Yellowfin
November 22, 2008, 02:52 PM
I wonder if Motorola or his cell provider will use this for an ad.

230RN
November 22, 2008, 09:26 PM
The bullet looks like a 230gr .45 pistol bullet. But it's not cannelured --the circumferential mark is just from where the mouth of the case is. Note the rifling mark starts just ahead of that mark, as would be expected if it were a case mouth mark rather than any kind of reflection. It's not from a Colt barrel, since AFAIK all Colt pistols have a left hand twist, though a Colt may have been re-barreled. The rifling twist looks like the slow twist of a handgun.

It does not look as it it had ricocheted off dirt or rocks, though it may have clipped branches, etc, without leaving any substantial marks. The little ding on the nose which looks almost like a drop of water could be anything, but I've certainly seen enough bullets after striking earth or rocks, and the marks from that are indisputable. Perhaps it's from the impact with the cell phone.

The cell phone looks like it was struck a glancing blow, and the hole through the shirt looks as if the bullet had some energy to it. A direct 90 degree hit probably would have penetrated the cell phone and might well have caused at least a serious injury if it had gone between ribs. Or hit any vulnerable/soft parts without being slowed by the cell phone.

I wonder how come the shirt hole is round, but the cell phone shows a glancing hit. Perhaps the bullet was tumbling rather than spinning when it struck, which might account for this.

I am also interested in whether Richard had reported hearing shooting, or even a shot, before being struck, although he may have been wearing ear protection or any report may have been swamped by the mower noise.

The above is just as I see it. Seems to me it's a little better than 60-40 that it's a true story. We all know how anti-gunners will make up stories about their houses being hit, and showing an empty case or even an unfired complete cartridge to "prove" it, and the like. Not calling Richard a liar, but P(false) = 0.40.

Moral: As population density increases, you cannot simply say, "Why, I've been shooting here for years with no problem."

Copyrighted pic added for critical review purposes.

http://www.loesch.org/~arviel/002.jpg

1858rem
November 22, 2008, 11:54 PM
ill betcha anything the hole is so "perfect" form his wife poking her finger through the shirt so many times showin it off.... who here has a smaller than .45 finger? i think she made it quite a bit bigger, glancing blow definitely helped reduce deadliness, but as long as the bullet had a stabilizing spin i think it would remain at least 450+fps .....230g bullet and you still got 103 ft/lb energy, little more than a frozen paintball ~300fps eh?

Double Naught Spy
November 23, 2008, 07:16 AM
So the bullet made a beautiful hole because it still had so much velocity to cut like a wadcutter, then glanced off the phone and no longer had the energy to exit fabric anywhere or enter the guy's body (which it apparently didn't actually hit)?

Still hokey.

230RN
November 23, 2008, 11:25 AM
I got hit by a Bible thrown at me once. If it weren't for the bullet in my shirt pocket, that Bible would have gone right through to my heart and killed me.

45R
November 23, 2008, 11:37 AM
:confused:9mm........:rolleyes:

The Annoyed Man
November 23, 2008, 03:44 PM
9mm would have penetrated that cell phone.
I have a spent 9mm bullet sitting on my desk right now. It was sitting on the door mat outside my office one morning, the first day back at work after New Year's Eve about 20 years ago. The ogive on one side is very slightly flattened, and there was a corresponding "skid" mark on the paint of the wooden front door. It is obvious that the bullet struck the door at a downward angle and came to rest on the door mat. As undamaged as were the door, the doormat, and the bullet itself, it is obvious that there was not much energy involved.

That bullet most certainly would not have gone through a cell phone. It would have dented the phone a little bit, and it might have torn a hole in a shirt - if the fabric was light enough. But there is no way that this 9mm bullet would have done any more damage than the .45 caliber bullet which is the subject of this story.

I worked for several years on the PM shift of a level one trauma center back in the 1980s. Late one afternoon, we treated a guy who was hit by a .45 ACP FMJ. He was sitting in the driver's seat of his rag-top Jeep at a red light. The bullet came down through the top and struck him in the thigh, breaking his femur at the mid shaft - a very serious and significant injury. Since there were no tall buildings anywhere nearby, and since nobody heard the shot, that bullet had to have been fired upward at an angle and then arced in from some distance.

Mr. R.J. Richard is damned lucky he didn't get hurt worse, but I suspect that you can't support your assertion that a 9mm would have penetrated the phone. Maybe it would, and maybe it wouldn't. It's entirely possible that if R.J. Richard cared to repeat the experiment, he might be killed. So let's look at the numbers to see what they can tell us....

I've just looked at the Federal Cartridge website, as an example, and here are the data for a 124 grain 9mm FMJ (http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/handgun.aspx?id=93) compared to a 230 grain .45 FMJ (http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/handgun.aspx?id=88) (both are standard loads for the caliber):
Load No Caliber Muzzle 25 Y 50 Y 75 Y 100 Y
AE9AP 9mm 1150 1095 1049 1010 977

Energy in Foot Pounds (To nearest 5 Foot Pounds)
Load No Caliber Muzzle 25 Y 50 Y 75 Y 100 Y
AE9AP 9mm 364 330 303 281 263


Load No Caliber Muzzle 25 Y 50 Y 75 Y 100 Y
AE45A 45 Auto 890 872 856 840 824

Energy in Foot Pounds (To nearest 5 Foot Pounds)
Load No Caliber Muzzle 25 Y 50 Y 75 Y 100 Y
AE45A 45 Auto 404 389 374 360 347

Now, I have nothing against the 9mm caliber, and some day I'll buy one; but I think it is safe to say from the above data that, given identical circumstances of a 440 yard distance and with just a caliber change, there is no way on earth that your 9mm would have gone through the phone when a .45 couldn't. Not a chance.

But that's just me. I'm a numbers guy.

:D

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