[Rob96]

The poop hits the fan and you have a choice between an AK-47 and an AR-15. Which do you choose and why?

[gryphon]

This horse has been beaten soooo dead, the bones are now powder!:barf:

[Rob96]

I know. But its good to lok into it again. I like to see if minds have changed as we are in a war and all kinds of "informative" posts crop up about each weapons pros and cons.

[Dave Markowitz]

Mini-14. :D

[FPrice]

AR series because I am much more familiar with them.

[Warner]

AK

Even if I wasn't familiar with them, I'd get so.

During those times, I'd want a tough and stone reliable rifle. AR's don't come to mind when those words are mentioned.


Thanks

[Soap]

Where is the option for evasion?

[Andrew Wyatt]

AR, cause i can hit stuff with it and it doesn't offend my sensibilities by assuming i'm untrained.

[Kurt]

I'll take an AK, because I don't talk to my guns:D

[TrapperReady]

Fecal matter hitting rotating blade?

I'd choose "Bounty - The Quicker Picker Upper".

[ojibweindian]

Neither; I'd grab my .30-06. No way am I gonna engage multiple targets on my own.

[Ian]

Either a Daewoo series or a Mauser series.

[cordex]

10th Mountain Division, please.

[ReadyontheRight]

AK in .308:D

[MicroBalrog]

AKM

[Pumpkinheaver]

I wouldn't choose either one, I'd pick my good L1A1 along with my Kimber.

[Coronach]

The correct answer is C.) FAL

Mike

[keederdag]

No, the correct answer is .D: an L1A1; because to go metric is just too icky to consider.:D

[Pinned&Recessed]

A 10/22 and a .38 is all you need.

:evil: :D

[SodaPop]

I would choice my AR since I don't have an AK.

Depends on the environment I'm going to be in. I've found the AK to stink in certain environments and the AR to be a nightmare in others.



Mini 14 and FAL are my top choices for me and my family.

[Warner]

Too bad nobody was given any of those nice choices - huh.

[Soap]

ojibweindian- Come on now! You can't have ninja fantasies with an '06! :banghead: ;)

[Devonai]

Sure you can! '06 as shuriken, '06 as daggers, who says you have to use it in a firearm?

[MiniZ]

I'd probably go with my AK 74 clone. I have a lot of mags, a lot of ammo, it has been utterly reliable, and I shoot pretty good with it.

[gun-fucious]

Its hard to get field resupply of parts and ammo for a russian weapon when the Blue Helmeted occuping force is toting NATO equipment

All ya really need is a guitar string and a #2 pencil
:neener:

[Rob96]

Trapper, I like the suggestion for Bounty.:)

[T.Stahl]

If I can't get an HK in .308, I'd rather take an AR than an AK, mainly because of its better ergonomics and accuracy.

[308win]

A bunch of people who ask questions like this to die gloriously while I beat feet to a survival friendly environment.:D

[Rob96]

Posted by 308Win
bunch of people who ask questions like this to die gloriously while I beat feet to a survival friendly environment.

I ain't dying gloriously, I'll be bugging out as well. I just want to have a carbine with me in case I have to shoot my way out.

[TODD3465]

I went AR because mine works just fine clean or dirty.
Don't get me wrong I own a SAR-1 and a SAR-2 but of the types mentioned the AR is my pick. Just more accurate and ergonomic.
If I ever had to shoot 500+rds without getting a chance at cleaning it I'd be in deep dodo anyway.:D

[JeepDriver]

Why can't I take both of them? :evil:

[MicroBalrog]

bunch of people who ask questions like this to die gloriously while I beat feet to a survival friendly environment


Choose modern weapons, my friend.
Fight to win, not to make a last stand. (C) Oleg Volk

[Jedi_7.62]

I'm thinking some kind of bomber with really big bombs. Like I'm going to sit around and play RAMBO!!

I love my SAR 1 but get real folks.

Is your name Arnold or Sylvester?

[Mike Irwin]

Quilted Charmin.

[Warner]

Please allow me.

I enjoy the lighter side of things as much as the next guy, but.....

I don’t understand the (wishful) elitism and/or salty attitude of those that won’t cough up a serious answer here. Why post at all guys.

From ojibweindian deciding that he won’t ever have to engage multiple targets, to Daniel Flory opining about our “ninja fantasies” from his university perch. Have you guys (and the others) ever taken any serious assessment of the world around you? And please never let us know that you may be some of the “it can’t happen here” brand of folk..... because it just recently did.

A little secret, as an LEO I do the “what if” thing all the time. In traffic, enroute to a call, or walking up to a closed door. I plan my tactics, back-up and possible escape routes to situations that seldom actually happen. Keeps me and my kind sharp. That’s a large part of the spirit of what you’re being asked to do here. One fine day, situations may come to your very own doorstep.

Go read Rob96’s question again. It was a pretty straightforward and it's difficult to believe that some of you couldn’t understand it. These exercises are good for most everyone in some way - when taken a bit more seriously.

Thanks

[Politically Incorrect]

This horse has been beaten soooo dead, the bones are now powder!

LET'S MAKE GLUE!

I think-ah I like-ah my-ah M-1 Garand-ah.

I sold both my SAR-1 and AR-15. Just like the M1/M14 type guns.

-Tommy

If it weren't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college.

:neener:

[Mannlicher]

neither. I would stick with the M1A

[Warner]

OOPS!!! - forgot a whole 'nother class :neener:

;)

[Benton]

Of the two choices offered, I'd take a Kalashnikov, preferrably in 7.62x39. It is sufficiently accurate at combat range and I like the greater weight and diameter of the bullet over 5.56.

If I had my choice of any rifle, however, I'd go with my DSA StG 58.

[Joe Demko]

The most appropriate choice every time this question asked: Webley-Vickers 50.80

Google it to find out why it is the ultimate gun for these threads.

[Art Eatman]

Warner, this about the seventy-'leventh time this subject has been worked over...

:), Art

[Warner]

I know Art, and thanks.

I'm newish here but I been around for awhile too.

I keep thinking about casting newbies aside, and how easy it is for those not interested in these posts to just ignore them, rather than messy up the landscape.

We're all in this ship together.

[Dr.Rob]

Don't own an AR. Know it's lighter, know its more accurate.

Shot an AK a heap bunch. Oh and mine is a 223 so I could get ammo from the blue helmeted guys.

Seriously, watching IDPA side matches with rifles.. I have never seen an AK jam. I've seen one (Mine) slamfire, but never a jam. I realize not all AR owners are qualified USMC armourers, and not AR's are alike (Armalite, Colt, Bushmaster etc) but MAN do they jam a lot. They have more moving parts, the action bleeds gas into itself.. just seems like an overengineered rifle. Too complicated for throwing a chunk of copper a few hundred yards.

Would I turn down an AR? No, especially if it had a Horse on the reciever.

[ojibweindian]

Warner

It's really quite simple; if I'm in a "SHTF" situation with multiple hostiles in close proximity I'm more than likely dead, regardless of the weapon on hand.

Oh sure, I'd be able to take a few out, but the outcome is still the same; I'll be dead. My best bet is to avoid, if at all possible, close encounters with multiple hostiles.

Also, the area in which I live is rural. Engaging multiple targets at fairly long range (400+ yrds.) is quite doable. Shoot and scoot is the name of the game out here.

You see, I've already thought about it, and have decided that an AK or an AR is not practical for the survivable situations in which I may someday find myself.

[Rebeldon]

AR, because I already have one. :D

[Edward429451]

Of the two, the AR. Its slightly more prevelant for mags ammo & parts. Plus I have one already. But its just a loaner if the blade turns brown. I'd have the M1A.

[Coronach]

Golgo-13:

Niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice :D

Mike

[Mike Irwin]

"I don’t understand the (wishful) elitism and/or salty attitude of those that won’t cough up a serious answer here. Why post at all guys."

Stick around a while longer, and you'll probably be coming back with smart-assed comments after the 400th or so time the same question is asked in a slightly different way. :)

Oh, and my choice?

My Remington 722 in .300 Savage.

I can keep the Charmin over the barrel. The roll should still be under the bell of the scope...

[Warner]

Ahh Grasshopper, the salt flows freely tonight. Never underestimate others; and get to know the inner peace of some self-control when confronted with such nasty AK/AR posts.

Seriously, it’s hard to imagine just what it is about such posts that confound and irritate grown men so much. Do you also throw barbs at, and mess up a shotgunners thread just because you can’t relate? I’m sure you don’t.

We were asked to participate in a simple scenario, with only two choices available. Simple…clear cut….and easy to understand.

ojibweindian – training.

At the highest levels, some operatives would use whatever is at hand and improvised. It most likely would be small caliber ineffective semi-auto handguns, large pieces of wood, rocks and fistfuls of dirt. Any lowly AK or AR could very well be a lavish luxury for them.

Also, too many principles of basic common sense would dictate not counting on being able to stay far away from trouble for the duration. And good luck on choosing just when that time might come to you.

[ojibweindian]

Warner

Yep, training. Which is why I "train" with my .30-06 quite often.

[Art Eatman]

"Also, too many principles of basic common sense would dictate not counting on being able to stay far away from trouble for the duration."

Yup.

Which is why I keep yapping about "no one size fits all" when it comes to scenarios, and "your skill level is more important than your choice of any particular weapon". You're gonna adapt your tactics to what weapon happens to be near at the time.

Art

[riverdog]

AR because it shares ammunition with another AR and a scoped bolt action. I have lots of .223 and mags, zero 7.62x39 and no AK mags. But my first choice would be an M-1A and .308 bolt action and those ammo cans.

[ojibweindian]

Which is why I keep yapping about "no one size fits all" when it comes to scenarios, and "your skill level is more important than your choice of any particular weapon". You're gonna adapt your tactics to what weapon happens to be near at the time.

Art, I completely agree.

If I am caught with my pants down, and am forced to fight a close engagement while severely outnumbered, I will be dead regardless of the weapon I have. I can't see justifying the cash layout for an AR or AK just to die gloriously.

Shoot and scoot is gonna mostly work in my AO.

[Rob96]

Warner. Your comments were very well typed out. I have been on these boards for a few years now, and yes I do realize that that these questions do get asked quite a bit.

Mike Irwin, the reason I aksed the "same" question in a different way is because if you look back the typical question is "Which is better?", which quickly turns into a pissing match. I asked a plain and simple question and chose the two most prevelant semi-auto carbines that are around. Just wanted to know what every one would choose and why, your own personal opinion on why you would chose A or B.

Also, like Warner had said. You may not always have the option of running to the hills. If you live in the city, and you decide to bug out......chances are everyone else has decided to bug out as well. I would hate to be caught in a nasty traffic jam and have the need arise for a long arm.

[ojibweindian]

Fortunately for me, I do live "in the hills". The bad thing is that I commute an hour each way to work in Huntsville. I sure do wish that telecommuting were an option for me!

[Warner]

Rob96 - thanks.

ojibweindian - I keep getting the feeling that we would agree many times more than not, it's the small stuff that hangs me up a bit.

Shoot and scoot is King in such circumstances, but while we're scootin' we may face stiff opposition - so our choice of those two rifles was requested.

Alternate weapon choices, actual geographic locations, particular situations or any cash outlay by you for these items works to divert the intention here. Again, I believe the spirit of this exercise is captured only when we keep our eye on the big overall picture and evaluate these weapons from whatever perspective you may have on them, AND in the most all-encompassing scenario possible.

Personal: From symptoms resulting from NOT citing my fondness for FAL's in this post, I've started some mild medication recently - so maybe you guys had the right idea. I should have let the thread take some abuse instead. Excuse me while I go out back and hit the big old stump with a baseball bat for a while.


:cool:

[Chris Rhines]

I think that if the feces is impacting the rotating blades, right now, it's probably too late to debate the merits of one rifle over the other. You'd be so far behind the power curve that a rifle wouldn't help much.

I'd hope that if the scat is contacting the propellor, anyone here would pick up the tool most appros to the situation, and would be competent enough with their tool of choice to be able to do some good.

So perhaps the question could be re-written to: "Which do you prefer, the AR or the AK, and why? And for what?" And then maybe, "You've picked your rifle and gotten trained with it: Now the guano is hitting the oscillator - what do you do?"

I've pretty much settled on the AR system, myself. Two major reasons - ergonomics, and adaptability. I like they way the controls are arranged on the AR. It works with you, not against you. I like the fact that you can have AR-system guns in every configuration from a 16"/5lb./.22LR plinker, to a 20"/8lb./7.62x51 battle rifle, to a 36"/20lb./.50BMG precision rifle, all with the same LOP, same trigger length, and some degree of parts commonality.

But that said, a slightly different upbringing or a quirk of genetics could have swung me over to the klatch camp. If you decide that the AK is your cup of vodka, by all means, go for it. Practice with it a lot, get as much training as you can, and you'll be in good shape. Probably better shape than me, as anyone who's seen me shoot a rifle can attest.

- Chris

[Jedi_7.62]

O.K. I'll play along. I would go AK series myself. It's been said the scariest sound in the world is a click when you expect a bang! For this reason alone I prefer an AK series. Probably Saiga in .308 with a scope. FAL would be nice but it's not AK series so I'll leave it out. I love my SAR 1 and the little scope I put on it but in such a scenario I would prefer to maximize the distance between me and the BG's.

I agree with Sam Elliot in We Were Soldiers. - "If the time comes I need an M 16 there will be plenty of them laying around".

I know, customised Saiga .308 w/ pistol grip and modified to take high cap mags. It is a Kalishnikov design thus being AK type though it isn't 7.62 x 39.

Although if I were engaged by multiple enemies w/ similar weapons in the 300 yd. range and I was all alone I'm probably going to be dead.

I would really prefer a cruise missile tho.

[Moparmike]

I chose an AR because my area is relatively clean, even in the dirt. However, if I was in someplace rather contaminated (lots of rain, salt in the air, muddy, jungle) I would choose the AK. In NW arkansas, its relatively clean compared to say, the delta of Louisiana. Then I want an AK.

[benewton]

I'd have three rational choices: AR, AK or M1A.

Living in New Hapmshire, and not in a city, I'm out in the woods. Thus, no shot is likely to be over 100 yards. So, while my M1A NM was my personal gift to myself for getting my MS back in '82, and it'd be the last weapon I'd ever sell, it would be overkill, and you do have to consider ammo weight.

The AR is a mixed breed "mess": A2 upper and Oly lower built with Bushmaster parts. Works fine, is plinking accurate, and, since I trained on it back in the '70's, familiar to me. Feels good, if I might say so, and I do like the bolt holdback. But it fires a light round, 69 grains at the moment, and they're subject to deflection by pine needles, of which I've many. Also, the 6 pounds of the old A1 version are long gone. Too, I like two stage triggers

Which leaves the AK, or actually the MAC90, modified, of course, but all in cosmetics, not gunsmithing issues.

Heavy, but not all that much more than the AR. It fires a heavier bullet, and, to my mind, is sufficiently accurate, to 100 yards, which fits my situation. Hate the safety, miss the ergonimic funtionality of the AR, and really detest the lack of a bolt hold back, but it fits me physically, and, as noted almost everywhere, it always goes bang.

So, the AK it is, even though I built the AR, and, since it was my first build, have just a "slight" attachment to it.


All that said, I'd probably be better off with the 70's A5 shottie, given the conditions and a good mix of shotshells.

One other thing.

I'm aware of the supply situation, but if I can get close enough to take his ammo, I can get his rifle too...

And I agree with the point of view that if I need to fire off my available ammo in anger, say a few hundred rounds or so, I'd be dead long before I needed replacement parts, or ammo for the weapon.

[Amish]

AK because ammo and mags are so cheap, which means I got more of them. Also cheap softpoints are available.

[Abominable No-Man]

Oooooh, let me play.

Hmmm....after careful deliberation of both the AK and AR series..............now I'm weighing the pros and cons of both types...........let's seeeee, considering the advantages of 7.62x39mm and
5.56mm........considering the disadvantages of reliability vs. ergonimics....
I'VE GOT IT!

M14!:neener:

LOL.

Okay, okay......AK, I guess......

ANM