The most reliable, rugged, accurate rifle EVER.


PDA






esmith
December 4, 2008, 09:49 PM
I was watching TV last night and while sorting through the numerous useless and un-entertaining programs i found a countdown of the best military weapons on the outdoor channel, maybe the military channel, can't remember. Anyway, they were talking about the lee enfield rifle and one of the narrators said it was the most rugged military rifle ever made.

What? So all the AK variants, Mosin Nagant rifles and German Mausers weren't the most rugged military rifles?

It seems that no matter what gun a program is talking about it is always the best gun out there. Un-paralled in terms of accuracy, reliability, and ergonomics.

Anyone else notice this?

If you enjoyed reading about "The most reliable, rugged, accurate rifle EVER." here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Mossberg88
December 4, 2008, 09:56 PM
Well, I think the Enfield may have been dropped the most :)

Wheeler44
December 4, 2008, 10:03 PM
Well the Lee Enfield in all of its iterations is one of the best bolt action battle rifles ever.

Mossberg88, I think you are thinking of something else.

Pulse
December 4, 2008, 10:06 PM
one of those "Top Ten of ..." series?

those are utter bull****.

just as a example, the "Top Ten of Main Battle Tanks"

in the US version, the leopard2 is not even listed, Abrams on #2, Russian T34 wins.
in the British version the Challanger 2 Wins, Abrams on #7
in the the German version, Leo2 wins, Abrams #2, Challanger was somewhere below #5.

mind you, it was the exact same show, even with the exact same Guest speakers, just slight bit diffrent..

US version: "The Abrams has superior firepower due to the DU shells and the 120mm smoothbore cannon"

UK version: "The Abrams is on par on firepower with the Challanger but can not match its accuracy"

Ger version: "The Abrams has very high firepower, but can not match the upgraded leo2 /L55 Gun"

all 3 sentances spoken by the same guy..

Kind of Blued
December 5, 2008, 12:22 AM
The most reliable, rugged, accurate rifle EVER.

Such a unicorn can not plausibly exist.

mgregg85
December 5, 2008, 12:28 AM
Yeah those top ten shows are just geared for the uneducated(at least in this area) masses. Don't take them too seriously.

Future Weapons is always good for a laugh. I never knew that 5.56x45mm was prone to bouncing off windshields until I started watching that show.

KC0QGL
December 5, 2008, 12:50 AM
Such a unicorn can not plausibly exist.

French Chauchat:rolleyes:

RonE
December 5, 2008, 12:56 AM
It must be that the editor/producer of the show is also in the print media business and someone with a warehouse full of SMLE's just took out a two page advertisement.

frogomatic
December 5, 2008, 01:21 AM
I'd take a Mauser over an Enfield any day of the week, and twice on sunday.

woodybrighton
December 5, 2008, 04:40 AM
but the enfield is a better military rifle

the M98 Mauser rifles, particularly the 98k, have a completely undeserved, and entirely mythical reputation for accuracy. The 6.5 x 55 M96 rifles are indeed very, very accurate, but the military M98 rifles are not.

Compare and contrast these acceptance standards:

M1 Garand: four minutes of angle

SMLE and No. 4: 3.5 minutes of angle ( four out of five shots within a 1 x 1.5 inch rectangle at 100 feet, assuming outside edge-to-outside edge). Interestingly, the partial 600 yard test was nine out of 10 within a 24 Inch Circle for the smle, and six out of seven shots within an 18 x 18 inch rectangle for the number 4, giving 3.8 minutes for the smle and 2.9 minutes for the number four, assuming that the group is circular and not making use of the corners of the box.

Kar98k TO BE SELECTED FOR USE AS A SNIPER RIFLE: at 100 m,3 of 5 shots in a rectangle measuring 80 x 140 mm, all five within a circle of 120 mm. Assuming that this is all shots edge-to-edge, this is exactly 4 minutes of angle.


the interesting conclusion of this is that any Garand, smle or number four coming off the production line intended for infantry use was accurate enough to be considered for sniping use by the Germans. No wonder there were complaints from the field about the accuracy of the 98k Sniper!
its also faster firing 10 round mag rather than five more reliable in mud. It was the pinnacle of military bolt action combat rifles. There are more accurate bolt actions out there but not by much and those that are not as reliable or as fast to shoot.

John-Melb
December 5, 2008, 06:31 AM
It's probably worthwhile pointing out the first significant defeats handed to both the Germans and the Japanese during WW2 were both delivered with the .303 SMLE.

steveracer
December 5, 2008, 07:18 AM
Garand.

Officers'Wife
December 5, 2008, 07:46 PM
In the end does it really matter? The '03' Springfield brought my great grandfather home from WWI, the Garand my grandfather from WWII, the M16 my Dad from Vietnam and the Winchester shotgun my uncle from Vietnam. They may not have been the 'best' but they were good enough.

Selena

gvnwst
December 5, 2008, 08:16 PM
Future Weapons is always good for a laugh.

2(times infinity)+, i thought that the M82 was a few decades old, but i guess i am wrong.:rolleyes: And i thought he said that the M82, the CHEYTAC intervention and the .416 barret wereall the "ultimate sniper system".... Seems to be a bit of ______ here.....:D

WardenWolf
December 5, 2008, 08:36 PM
Honestly, the award really has to go to the Mosin Nagant M91/30. Some were used as snipers and achieved some incredible long-range shots, and the standard infantry issues were abused to hell and still work, yet still had a reputation for accuracy. I say work, not past tense, because there's still countless M91/30's in good working order. Some were rearsenaled and rebarreled, but many are original. When you put it all together, no other rifle has done so much.

goon
December 5, 2008, 08:59 PM
There is no most or best in every category.
Some do pretty well but none will have every possible good characteristic and none of the bad.
If I had to go use one to stay alive today I'd probably want an Enfield.

As for Mosins, they're functional and they've seen use for probably longer than any of their contemporaries, but they're not really that great.
I've only ever seen one that had a functional cartridge stop (interruptor, or whatever the hell the technical term for it is). With the rest of them, you had to carefully load one round at a time to avoid rim-lock. Call me crazy, but I'd want to be able to reload with stripper clips and not have to worry much about that happening.
FWIW, the Enfield can run into this too but if you load the strippers correctly you'll have no worries.

The best of the Mosin breed would be the Finn M-39.
Those Mosins are real rifles!

Ruggles
December 5, 2008, 09:58 PM
I have purchased 3 Enfields, 1 Garand and 1 Mauser.. The Garand and the Mauser are gone the Enfields remain.

If their is a tougher battle rifle the Enfield I have yet to see it. Maybe the Mosin?

esmith
December 5, 2008, 11:43 PM
Im not saying their is a best rifle in any category, but there are certainly guns that could be considered more rugged than the enfield.

I have yet to stop my mosins with anything outside of the bolt being clogged with cosmoline. Now that i have worn in the extractor and the feed ramps it cycles quite nicely and reliably. All the stripper clips i have tried have been bad, however.

Needless to say, Most mosins are beasts. Not the most accurate, but they get the job done.

I have purchased 3 Enfields, 1 Garand and 1 Mauser.. The Garand and the Mauser are gone the Enfields remain.

If their is a tougher battle rifle the Enfield I have yet to see it. Maybe the Mosin?

You sold a garand. How could you ever sell a piece of American History like that? That sir, is an abomination.

frogomatic
December 6, 2008, 12:42 AM
@woody

Accuracy is more dependent on the workmanship put into the individual rifle. I was speaking on a design basis (somthing I know more than a little about). From a design standpoint, the mauser is the superior rifle. The 1903 springfield... A direct knock off of the mauser, so similar in design to the mauser that the US had to pay royalties to Paul Mauser for every one we made. The pre-64 model 70(quite possible the finest rifle ever made)...a Mauser with a better trigger and a side swing saftey. The ruger M77...a Mauser with a better trigger and a side swing safety.

The differences between a Mauser and Enfield...
cock on open vs. cock on close...cock on open is superior for safety reasons
front locking lug vs. rear locking lug...front lugs are superior for safety reasons
Safety lug vs. no safety lug...:rolleyes:
the Mauser's bolt shroud is designed to deflect gas away from the shooter, another safety advantage. The mauser introduced controlled round feed with it's claw extractor and manual ejector. there is a reason nearly every bolt action rifle since was based on the Mauser design. How many rifles were based on the SMLE? Hell, modern companies are still building Mauser inspired guns. Why? Because the design of the gun is that good.

louie19
December 6, 2008, 12:50 AM
Ruggles: What happened to the M1 Garand? Seems like you'd want to hang onto that.

woodybrighton
December 6, 2008, 07:39 AM
The mauser on paper and design wise is a better rifle.
But on the Battlefield the Lee Enfield dominated its now been in service for over 100 years and two world wars years :D still on issue in India and by the Canadian rangers who rely on it because it will go bang in some of the most extreme conditions on earth.
mauser military rifles no longer in service.
Think that settles the argument longest serving military bolt action rifle. With a powerful round like a .303 it will put most creatures down so why bother designing something else? with 4 million made you could get one cheap enough.

SaxonPig
December 6, 2008, 09:49 AM
As can be seen, the notion of "best" is completely subjective.

Any of the military rifles mentioned in this thread will do the job. Which is best will be a matter of personal preference.

The AK is tough and has been made in countless numbers. It was designed to be rugged and unbreakable in the hands of peasants who lack training and education with machinery.

The M1 was perhaps the greatest rifle of its day but that day is long passed.

The AR was designed by committee and the smaller caliber is still rejected by many.

I have owned one Enfield (that I later sold) and many Mausers which I still have. My preference is obvious. Both the Enfield and Mauser did the job asked of them. I find the 98 simpler, more ergonomic, and simply more elegant than the Enfield.

IMO the 1898 Mauser is the apex of bolt-action rifle design. Copied by just about every design since, and never really improved upon by any, I think the 98 is the best bolt gun ever built. I find the Enfield clumsy and clunky. Not to mention just plain ugly.

My personal favorite battle rifle of all time is the FN FAL. If I were called into combat this this the rifle i would want.

BTW- Military arms are designed for reliability above all else. This means loose tolerances to prevent jamming and this is not the way to make a rifle accurate. Target guns are tight, and they don't do well in combat conditions. No military rifle will be supremely accurate. All they wanted was "minute-of-enemy-soldier" at 200 yards.

Rem700SD
December 6, 2008, 09:55 AM
If I'm thinking of the correct show, the ranking are based on VOTES from the audience from their web site. Hence, the nationalistic discrepencies.

Oro
December 6, 2008, 10:23 AM
+1 for SaxonPig.

I have known him for several years on multiple forums, and rarely have a disagreement with him. Should I need a battle rife, the FN FAL is my first choice by far.

But the OP asked about "rugged, reliable, accurate" and did not specify practicality, price, rate of fire, or with maximum lethality. Based on only those three criteria, I might stray to the SMLE.

While it's only bolt action and not semi (or full) auto, it's worth noting that in competent hands, it's hard to tell the difference. German regiments in Belgium in August of 1914 thought they ran into machine guns nests when they hit competent British battalions.

Two ansers:

Cheap answer: SMLE

More expensive: FN FAL

Keep in mind the maxim, while the .303 has probably taken more game than any cartridge on the planet, it has also WOUNDED more game than any other. It's not as suitable for one-shot drops in hunting as a .308, or better yet, a .30-06 like a springfield or Garand is. I think of the .303 as in the same category as a .30-30, it's almost exact contemporary.

There is just no simple answer!

PS: SaxonPig:

"minute-of-enemy-soldier" at 200 yards.

You need to copyright that phrase before it hits the gun press!

yokel
December 6, 2008, 10:31 AM
The rugged simplicity of the bolt action rifles originally designed at the turn of the 19th century tend to be the most reliable under adverse operating conditions.

Can't say that I would sooner relinquish my Remington '03 than my Garand rifle.

Art Eatman
December 6, 2008, 01:33 PM
For rugged and reliable, bolt actions are better than most semi-autos because of the vulnerability of the detachable magazines.

Among bolt actions, the Springfield's bolt mechanism isn't as rugged as the Mauser and others.

For accuracy, it's less the inherent accuracy than it is the ability of the user to shoot accurately: The location of the rear sight. The Mauser, easily among the most rugged and reliable, loses out because the rear sight is mounted ahead of the receiver ring. Rear-mounted peep sights make life easier for the shooter.

Among bolt actions, the SMLE and the 1917 Enfield rate high in all three categories. The SMLE likely gets the nod from TV folks because of the 10-round capacity. The 1917 is 5+1.

As far as semi-autos, I'd give the nod to the Garand because of the magazine vulnerability issue--remembering that "firepower" is not at all important in this particular discussion.

The question of quantity produced, and over how many decades, involves such parameters as, "It works okay," and "We're tooled up for it, already."

Art

Ruggles
December 6, 2008, 04:13 PM
In response to why I sold my Garand.

It was a nice looking gun, a six digit Springfield from 1941. In truth it has a reliability (FTE & FTF) issue that I did not want to mess with. I know the legend of the Garand and really wanted to love that rifle but the SMLE to me is more fun to shoot. I am not saying I would not like a Garand again but I just never felt the "magic" that some do with the gun. I like the M1 Carbine better than the Garand in fact.

NotSoFast
December 6, 2008, 04:54 PM
The ones I own. :D

My vote is the M1 Garand in semi-auto and the Swiss K31 in bolt action.

SammyIamToday
December 6, 2008, 07:39 PM
The mauser on paper and design wise is a better rifle.
But on the Battlefield the Lee Enfield dominated its now been in service for over 100 years and two world wars years still on issue in India and by the Canadian rangers who rely on it because it will go bang in some of the most extreme conditions on earth.
mauser military rifles no longer in service.
Think that settles the argument longest serving military bolt action rifle. With a powerful round like a .303 it will put most creatures down so why bother designing something else? with 4 million made you could get one cheap enough.

Isn't that probably more because both of those places were part of the British Empire and had them around than any argument that it's better than the Mauser? Personally, I have no preference between them, but the Germans never really had a world spanning empire that would lead to other former colonies still having old weapons around.

esmith
December 6, 2008, 08:43 PM
My main argument was the fact that these countdown shows shouldn't be saying such and such guns are the best. I wasn't defending any said rifle. I was just pointing out how the shows are jokes and shouldn't be believed word by word.

There are countless arguments that defend all types of military rifle styles. The fact that enfields have been in service for decades past WW2, the fact that guns today are still being modeled after traditional mauser type actions, and the fact that AKs are so widespread in their usage, all prove to say a "best" rifle doesn't exist, and that many people dispute what is the "best."

To put it shortly, im going to say that the best rifle is the one that goes bang when you need it to.

Wheeler44
December 6, 2008, 09:07 PM
The Germans made the best "hunting Rifle" the Mauser
The Americans the best "Target rifle" the Springfield
And the Brits the best "Battle rifle" the Lee Enfield
It's pretty hard to beat 38 aimed rounds on target in one minute.
Try that with a Mauser or Mauser clone.
I like my Enfields both the Lee Enfield and the Model of 1917

Wheeler44

elmerfudd
December 6, 2008, 09:10 PM
The Mauser is undoubtedly the better base design to build a hunting rifle from, but as far as being a battle rifle it's markedly inferior. It's slower, has much worse sights and a much smaller magazine. It's one real advantage is that it's a stronger, safer design, but since the Lee Enfield was and is a reasonably safe weapon to fire, it's a minor advantage.

dscottw88
December 6, 2008, 09:11 PM
I saw that top ten show. It gave number 1 to the AK, number 2 to the AR. The nonsense spewn from the screen of any television should be taken with a very large grain of salt.

madcratebuilder
December 6, 2008, 09:34 PM
The best battle rifle is the one YOU are best with.

jpwilly
December 6, 2008, 11:31 PM
What can be said of the rifles being discussed, all have a good service record with each of the countries who fielded them. They were fielded after a selection process in each army with ruggeness, accuracy, and ability to produce them as key factors. The Nagant was the right rifle for the Russians just as the M1 Garand was it for our boys. I think it's absolutely necessary to pick a rifle by action type, era used, see how it was deployed and the rate it based on the success and failures of the design. I would have wanted a M1 or Tommy gun if I was in WWII. Right now I'd pick my DPMS LR-308 AP4 over my M1, Enfiled, Mauser, 1903, Nagant, AR-15, or AK-47!

Beagle-zebub
December 6, 2008, 11:40 PM
I'll second the comment to the effect that the Enfield's speed is a key advantage. I hadn't thought of the sights vice the Mauser, good call. I guess I just take it for granted that the iron sights on the military rifles of every non-America country are mediocre, which is generally the case. (I'm not being at all nationalistic--I just think open sights suck.) I sometimes wonder what an FAL could do with a more precise rear aperture.

elmerfudd
December 7, 2008, 12:21 AM
The sight difference goes beyond just open sights vs. peeps. The #4 mk1 had a nice peep sight, but the SMLE, while it didn't have a peep sight, still had pretty good iron sights. They were easily visible and reasonably precise. The K98 on the other hand had an awful set of iron sights. They aren't easily visible, nor are they precise.

I know a few people have mentioned the Mosin Nagant and I'd have to emphatically disagree with that. The MN has the bolt handle placed too far forward for most people to cycle the action without lowering the rifle and the safety is virtually inoperable. The triggers generally are bad and as others have noted the magazine disconnector often doesn't work. It's also possible to jam the magazine badly if you single load a cartridge that isn't all the way back, (learned this from experience).

I'm not a Mosin Nagant hater, (I own 5 of them), and I rather like their sights and their rugged construction, but there's just no way they were the best bolt action battle rifle.

Jefferson Herb
December 7, 2008, 02:58 AM
Thru the ages,countries built the best design[they thought] with the best metalurgy available;untill demand during war dictated shortcuts.
Sweed 96 was obendorpf untill they got production up.Mausers,93's,95.s were very serviceable;as the us found out in the Spanish / American war.Smle's were built in several countries,with canada 2 groove rifles being the most accurate.Not so many years ago,after a fun shoot,a Friend and I baffeled shooters with a #1 ,cordite ammo ,and hitting targets [metal] at 440 yds.Smle's had lots of headspace to operate in dirty conditions,any handloader of this cartrige knows this.
The best one is the one in my hands with plenty of ammo.

yokel
December 7, 2008, 12:49 PM
The Mauser is undoubtedly the better base design to build a hunting rifle from, but as far as being a battle rifle it's markedly inferior. It's slower, has much worse sights and a much smaller magazine.
The Germans made the best "hunting Rifle" the Mauser.

Well, I would be willing to bet that a fair amount of Soviets, French, Brits, G.I. Joes etc. lost their lives or have been maimed by Mausers used to hunt and kill humans.

woodybrighton
December 7, 2008, 01:36 PM
true but a few Germans were killed by the Chauchat does not make it a great combat weapon.
The enfield was the pinnacle of bolt action combat rifles.
The British army also concentrated on marksmanship and individual zeroing of weapons while the Germans factory zeroed there weapons for conscripts.

yokel
December 7, 2008, 02:46 PM
Of course, we're all entitled to our respective opinions.

We have the curious notion of the best/greatest "hunting", "battle" or "target" rifle.

Jerry D
December 7, 2008, 05:47 PM
AHAH reading this is funny - I do watch those top 10 count down shows... You can never say or prove that one is better then the other really.

the Enfield though was the best bolt action design for WWII - good sights, good action, and 10 round magazine compared to the other bolt actions.

The M1 though I believe is a better rifle for war due to its semi automatic design - however warfare has changed - bolts worked fine in open areas and bombed flat urban areas - however when it got close having a semi became a lot nicer.

Basically these shows are not comparing 1 against the other in the count down, rather they are placing them in order of the effect they had on history and how well they worked.

For example the best tank of WWII most people would call the German Panzer as it was superior to the Sherman, however Russia's tank was superior to the German Panzer however it was not publicized to the extent as the Panzer was because the Sherman's never had to fight it. The best tank of WWII then might have to be the Sherman due to the fact that hordes of them were being produced. See the discrepancy? what one do you choose?

earlthegoat2
December 7, 2008, 06:02 PM
Terry Weiland says: In WWI the Americans had a target rifle, the Germans had a hunting rifle, and the British had a battle rifle.

I tend to agree.

Old Time Hunter
December 7, 2008, 07:58 PM
I thought the topic was "The most reliable, rugged, accurate rifle ever" Is that just military or any? Why a bolt action? You have to be more specific. based on the question, one would consider the Springfield Trapdoor the most reliable, rugged, and accurate if you place credence in the Sandy Hook trials, otherwise you might consider a modern gatlin gun in 20mm...all you would have to be is close. If bolt actions were the only criteria, wouldn't one consider the Swiss K31? A ton more accurate than the Enfield, faster rate of fire too because of one less movement and safer for the user with the rotating front lock up bolt. Don't get me wrong, I like 'em all, but the Enfield is nothing more than the Lee Navy rifle or even farther back the Lee-Winchester of 1882. Also, remember the Lee lost out to the Krag because of the Krag's faster, smoother action.

elmerfudd
December 8, 2008, 12:46 AM
The K31 is fast, but I think the Lee Enfield is faster. While the K31 only requires you to pull and push the bolt handle, it takes significantly more effort to do so. As far as accuracy is concerned though, you're right, it beats the pants off the Enfield.

HorseSoldier
December 8, 2008, 01:29 AM
Would have been interesting to have the "also rans" of the bolt gun world in the mix on the battlefield in WW2 or WW1 and seen how the K31 and the Swedish Mausers (AG-42B, too, while we're at it) compared to the SMLE, 1903 and 1917 or Garand, Moisins, Kar-98s and such. I guess the Swedes saw some combat late in the Winter War in the hands of the Swedish volunteers who fought there, but I haven't heard much about how they stacked up against Russian troops with M-Ns.

30mag
December 8, 2008, 01:43 AM
For the record, for a gun that is being sent to war, safety is a pretty relative term...
The safest gun in war is probably the one in your hands.
Unless of course it happens to be one of those glock grenades...

:p

paintballdude902
December 8, 2008, 01:45 AM
this is quite possibly the hardest question to answer

its like what is the best caliber its all gonna be opinion

aka108
December 8, 2008, 09:51 AM
The weak point of the No 1 and No 4 Enfields is the extractor. Replaced two of them on couple of mine.

lefteyedom
December 8, 2008, 11:58 AM
BEST OF SHOWs... History channel The H stands for All Hitler all the time.
How about all the shows that are produce showing how advance the Germany weapons development was just before the end of the war. Super fighter and bombers, rockets and rifles. Worshiping the Teutonic master of engineering, as if Hitler had only funded them in 1938 the world would be better now.

Lets us not forget what other Germany engineers were delvoping..group showers and group driers.

elmerfudd
December 8, 2008, 02:35 PM
It's not "The Hitler Channel" anymore. It's gotten much worse. Now the majority of their programming seems to be shows like "modern marvels", "mega movers" and "ice road truckers". I guess that stuff's fine, but it's become like MTV only instead of there being no music there's no history.

Ian Hutchison
December 16, 2008, 05:15 PM
The mauser on paper and design wise is a better rifle.
But on the Battlefield the Lee Enfield dominated its now been in service for over 100 years and two world wars years still on issue in India and by the Canadian rangers who rely on it because it will go bang in some of the most extreme conditions on earth.
mauser military rifles no longer in service.

No. True, the Lee-Enfield as a battle rifle is still in use today (Kind of, not really. Do police count?) whereas the Mauser as a battle rifle is not.

However, the Mauser action has been far more influential. For example, we imitated it (without license btw) in our Springfield 1903 and many, if not most, other nations bought or copied the mauser*. Indeed, the mauser action is still used in many military and police sniping weapons and is still seen in, or has influenced, many (very many) modern bolt action hunting rifles.

* To name some:

Argentina
Spain
Sweden
Japan
Czechloslovakia
Yugoslavia
Turkey
Egypt
Iran
Belgium
China
Israel
Albania
Chile
Denmark
Finland
France
Guatemala
Iceland
Iraq
Portugal
Mexico
Vietnam
Norway
Korea
Romania
Hungary
Austria

22lr
December 16, 2008, 05:19 PM
Springfield 1903a3

Ive got one and ill just say that I can hit what ever im aiming at. Ive never had anything resembling a problem, and its as rugged as rifles come. Cant really say much more than that.

Golden Hound
December 16, 2008, 05:47 PM
Honestly if we're talking about the rifle that is most reliable, rugged(durable) and accurate at the same time - in other words, it has to have all three of those, as opposed to sacrificing one for the other - I would pick the G3. The much-maligned and underrated G3 manages to be insanely durable and insanely accurate at the same time. The FAL might edge it out IF it had better sights, but as-is, in stock configuration, I think the G3 is the winner if we're looking for a rifle that has extreme reliability, extreme durability, and extreme accuracy all in one package.

The downsides of the G3 are that it's heavy, and is not very ergonomic. It has a heavy charging handle that's far forward, thumb safety that's hard to operate without adjusting the grip, and there is the notorious fluted chamber that mangles the shell casings and flings them the length of a football field. It lacks a bolt hold open on the last shot, and it would be helped by a bolt forward assist. All of this might be true.

BUT - it's rock-solid reliable, with the durability of the AK, and it's absurdly simple to take apart. It doesn't have a gas system to worry about fouling or failure to cycle. And it has very good sights and a slightly higher degree of accuracy than the FAL.

For bolt actions I would pick the Finnish Mosin.

gunmaker2872
December 16, 2008, 05:53 PM
what about the americans version of the enfield, the eddystone chambered in 30 06 ?

MarcusWendt
December 17, 2008, 11:40 AM
You simply can not have a single best rifle given the varying scenarios one may be exposed to. Best for what?

natescout
December 17, 2008, 11:47 AM
Mauser , the most copied action ever .

Float Pilot
December 17, 2008, 03:05 PM
The 54 caliber 1817 US Rifle (common rifle.)
It served until 1865, while being used as a rifle, club, spear and staff.
They were an improved version of the 1814.
While originally a flintlock, their design was again modified for percussion caps and paper roll caps.

ken22250
December 17, 2008, 03:50 PM
i have no problem beliving that, a have an A-Square Hannibal in .577 Trrannosaurus, and A-Square uses all 1917 Enfield actions, because they are the longest and strongest bolt action ever made.
ken

If you enjoyed reading about "The most reliable, rugged, accurate rifle EVER." here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!