NJ Gun Laws


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DRS1
December 6, 2008, 06:02 PM
I have a question, does anyone have an example of a letter that you need to acquire from your doctor to say that you no longer suffer from an illness that would preclude you from 1st keeping your FID card and second from buying more guns? The laws in NJ are very very invasive, and even more so if you say on the form that you have been treated by a mental health professional. It seems that the acquisition of hand guns lets them get into every detail of your medical records if you allow them. Have had my FID for over 30 years, had a bad run of anxiety attacks three years ago, one that landed me in the hospital for an evening but was our the next morning. Looking for some advice here.

Thanks,

DRS1

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everallm
December 7, 2008, 07:20 AM
The FID is for life or until you move address when it has it be re-issued, usually only as an administrative process and not as a full review. The only other time the police MAY look at the mental health issue is if you apply for a permit to purchase a handgun.

The 4473, not sure but not an NJ specific issue.

With regard to the mental health issue it solely relates to if you have been hospitalized or institutionalized involuntarily or due to you being an immediate danger to yourself or others.

The sniff test is, could you walk out at any time or coulf you, would you be held against your wish.

rscalzo
December 7, 2008, 08:13 AM
Any firearms purchaser identification card may be revoked by the Superior Court of the county wherein the card was issued, after hearing upon notice, upon a finding that the holder thereof no longer qualifies for the issuance of such permit. The county prosecutor of any county, the chief police officer of any municipality or any citizen may apply to such court at any time for the revocation of such card.

It is a very broadly worded section. Beyond contacting a lawyer, the only suggestion I could make is give it a try. When and if you submit a SP684 the question 6 & 7 (Mental or physical defect) number 7 would (in my opinion) mean a non-voluntary confinement. The STS-33 for Handgun Purchase Permit would most likely require the attending doctor to document that your condition does not cause a concern in the use and ownership of a firearm. If you don't answer truefully, the SP66 could very well pick up your treatment but I have no idea how the medical instatutions in NJ file their records, nor if there is a central database of such treatment.

If you are thinking of a upcoming purchase, I would be ready for a somewhat draen out process. Getting medical records or a response from the doctor treating your case may be lenghtly. No idea if he moved from that facility and may ne hard to track down. Better yet, spend a few bucks and contact alwyer with experience in this field. He might be able to point you in the right direction. To be honest, from what I've just read about an aniety attack, I don't see it is a major block to the process. Hell, I bet a good portion of the population has is and doesn't know it. Good luck with the quest.

scottc1071
December 7, 2008, 09:01 AM
When you apply for your handgun permit(one for every purchase) you MUST give them permission for mental health search.
I went through the same thing for my long gun permit(fid card). i had had treament with a mild antidepresant. mild depression. i was denied! because i couldnt prove i no longer needed treatment... my doctor was no longer in practice, it had been three years.
its totally up to the opinion of the detective or chief if they sign off on it or not. I got a lawyer and appealed, got the fid card. it wasnt cheap!!!!!!!!! but the last thing i wanted was a denial on my record. Talk to a lawyer before you apply for a handgun permit!!!!!!!!


scott


you have a PM.

indiandave
December 7, 2008, 10:17 AM
Do what I did move to Pennsylvania. I still work in Corzinestan but come home to the land of the free in the evenings. In PA you can walk into a gun store buy a gun, do the background check and walk out with a hand gun in about 30 minutes.

DRS1
December 7, 2008, 02:14 PM
Thank You all for the information, my doctor has 0 issue giving me the letter, her only question is what should the letter say, she wants me to give her the verbiage. I have purchased long guns since this and it has never raised a flag, it is the hand gun application that concerns me. Thanks’ for the PM Scott I responded, I know that Lawyer and the stay was totally voluntary left the following morning, felt stupid getting so upset about bullxxxx after it was all over. It was all work stress related.

Anyway I was also considering the road of expungment of that Hospital visit. Has anyone every been through that process, otherwise clean as a whistle.

DRS1

rscalzo
December 7, 2008, 02:35 PM
what should the letter say, she wants me to give her the verbiage.

Something to the effect that this incident in no way would affect your safe and compitent operation of a firearm.

what the issuing agency is looking for is documentation to cover their butt if something goes wrong with the permit holder. They do not want it coming back to them that they knew of the condition and did nothing about it. It is a issue of liability.

The biggest hurdle is getting the doctor to sign off. you have this covered so I don't see it as a big issue.

Anyway I was also considering the road of expungment of that Hospital visit

What would you get expunged? It isn't a criminal issue so you are asking the medical facility to destroy their records? I don't know if this is possible. I tend to doubt it. Again, an issue for a lawyer who knows that area of the law.

scottc1071
December 7, 2008, 04:12 PM
I think i would wait to see if it became an issue. There seems to be an avenue of comuncation with your local police, that i didnt have, so if it becomes an issue you should be able to give them what they want. I think you have it covered.

Scott

Downr@nge
October 12, 2010, 01:42 AM
I know its an old thread and my question is VERY relevant. Does NJ have any statutes specifically defining mental illnesses that would be cause to deny a permit? I too had an anxiety attack once and would NOT want that to be a risk of me getting denied my permit. I never took medicine for it. In fact, I went to the hospital because my heart rate was very high.

General Geoff
October 12, 2010, 11:25 AM
If you were never officially diagnosed with it, there's nothing in your medical records about it.

Downr@nge
October 12, 2010, 09:23 PM
I just read This (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CBcQxQEwAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdocs.google.com%2Fviewer%3Fa%3Dv%26q%3Dcache%3AGec5edw-ktQJ%3Awww.judiciary.state.nj.us%2Flegis%2F2003c73.pdf%2Bnj%2BC.24%3A21-2%26hl%3Den%26gl%3Dus%26pid%3Dbl%26srcid%3DADGEESjG1bVjy8uFPNsXPz5gpBoE_kzmfV3lyMIG0RUjKwUScpZdBDzC54qwaDRxFS66-GuzUpJJuqXyoqPgduVw2qF51kviFpmG0fbna8Rt_MoNnQo6ApAdLaDLhiPx6VboGeu3G9TV%26sig%3DAHIEtbS4vHa-rVLSddjrFsFX7mxU7Qdo0w&ei=Swm1TOSdOMWAlAfT84D0Cg&usg=AFQjCNE_1v4T2tZAz9Pqm7GnCwry67aS_Q) and I couldn't find ANYTHING that said someone who has anxiety or has anxiety disorder will be denied a permit in NJ.

Only thing I did find was the reference to "drug dependant" and being committed to a mental facility. This: "whether he is an alcoholic, habitual drunkard, drug
dependent person as defined in section 2 of P.L.1970, c.226 (C.24:21-2)," And yes, I actually read the ENTIRE said section.

Also, it says this: "c. Who may obtain. No person of good character and good repute in the community in
which he lives, and who is not subject to any of the disabilities set forth in this section or other
sections of this chapter, shall be denied a permit to purchase a handgun or a firearms purchaser
identification card, except as hereinafter set forth. No handgun purchase permit or firearms
purchaser identification card shall be issued:

(2) To any drug dependent person as defined in section 2 of P.L.1970, c.226 (C.24:21-2),
to any person who is confined for a mental disorder to a hospital, mental institution or
sanitarium, or to any person who is presently an habitual drunkard;

(3) To any person who suffers from a physical defect or disease which would make it
unsafe for him to handle firearms, to any person who has ever been confined for a mental
disorder, or to any alcoholic unless any of the foregoing persons produces a certificate of a
medical doctor or psychiatrist licensed in New Jersey, or other satisfactory proof, that he is no
longer suffering from that particular disability in such a manner that would interfere with or
handicap him in the handling of firearms; to any person who knowingly falsifies any information
on the application form for a handgun purchase permit or firearms purchaser identification card;"

My remaining question is, what is the state's definition of "confined" and what does the state define as a "mental disorder?" Call me paranoid but I don't want my incident getting me denied because it was diagnosed as anxiety. Can anyone point me in the direction of the definitions I ask about?

Downr@nge
October 13, 2010, 12:21 AM
Found this but still no definition as to what NJ considers mental disorders or what they define as "confined."

"N.J.A.C. 13:54-1.6 Exception for physical disability, mental disorder or alcoholism
A permit or identification card may be issued to a person who had previously suffered from a physical defect or disease, or mental disorder, or was an alcoholic if the applicant provides a certificate of a medical doctor or psychiatrist licensed in New Jersey, or other satisfactory proof that he or she is no longer suffering from that particular disability in such a manner that it would interfere with or handicap him or her in the handling of firearms."

I think I may say on my app when I was in the hospital just to be safe, because I have recourse (per the statute above) by getting my doc to say i'm oky to own a handgun. I really don't want to be denied because I didn't put it on there.

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