Castle Doctrine Question


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SrDedosRapidos
December 30, 2008, 09:56 PM
Hello all,

New here. Own several handguns (.357, .44 and 9mm) and soon to have a DPMS LR308. Im going for carry concealed in early February but have a question about home defense. I live in KY and we just recently (semi recently i believe) got our castle doctrine.

Id just like to make sure that i understand it before im presented with a defensive situation that gets me jailed. Ive already been in 2 situations that, had i been armed, would have lasted much shorter and involved no property damage. One involved a man simply walking into our home and throwing my step-dad through a large window after he was confronted. The second involved another man walking up to our back porch and trying to force open the back door. Luckily someone was in the kitchen and it scared him off.

If i awake to a man breaking into my house forcibly (with some form of blunt object or otherwise) does this give me the right to open fire or do i have to say "hey... stop that!" first? Does the Castle Doctrine protect me %100 from criminal liability in ANY situation wherein an unknown person is forcing their way into my home or car? Do i have to meet certain criteria (when in my own home or car) before i start shooting or is that simply duty to retreat (which, i understand, is nullified by the castle doctrine)?

Thanks in Advance!

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mgkdrgn
December 30, 2008, 10:11 PM
You'll have to check the specific wording of YOUR state legislation on this one.

Here in SC, scenario #1 would be BANG!, no questions asked.

In your other situations, personally I'd likely shout a "GO AWAY!" command, but unless they complied IMMEDIATELY (as in before the echo dies) it would likely end in BANG! I don't believe you have to actually let them break in before you are allowed to defend yourself ... but that for sure makes it more clear cut here.

As for the liability ... (again, just for SC), the fact they have broken into your home while you are there is considered sufficient evidence that you can assume they intend to do you grievous bodily harm. That is sufficient cause for the use of deadly force to defend yourself.

Also, we have no duty to retreat from our cars, OR ANY OTHER PLACE WE HAVE A LEGAL RIGHT TO BE. If I believe you intend to do me serious harm, I can defend myself with deadly force. I will have to come up with why I believed I was in danger, which I do not have to do with a home break in.

When you go to the class for your CCP, they should cover this in great detail.

Hello all,

New here. Own several handguns (.357, .44 and 9mm) and soon to have a DPMS LR308. Im going for carry concealed in early February but have a question about home defense. I live in KY and we just recently (semi recently i believe) got our castle doctrine.

Id just like to make sure that i understand it before im presented with a defensive situation that gets me jailed. Ive already been in 2 situations that, had i been armed, would have lasted much shorter and involved no property damage. One involved a man simply walking into our home and throwing my step-dad through a large window after he was confronted. The second involved another man walking up to our back porch and trying to force open the back door. Luckily someone was in the kitchen and it scared him off.

If i awake to a man breaking into my house forcibly (with some form of blunt object or otherwise) does this give me the right to open fire or do i have to say "hey... stop that!" first? Does the Castle Doctrine protect me %100 from criminal liability in ANY situation wherein an unknown person is forcing their way into my home or car? Do i have to meet certain criteria (when in my own home or car) before i start shooting or is that simply duty to retreat (which, i understand, is nullified by the castle doctrine)?

Thanks in Advance!

rbernie
December 30, 2008, 11:52 PM
The basic 'Castle Doctrine' (looks like it was 'Senate Bill 38') for KY reads as follows:

503.080 Protection of property.
(1) The use of physical force by a defendant upon another person is justifiable when the
defendant believes that such force is immediately necessary to prevent:
(a) The commission of criminal trespass, robbery, burglary, or other felony
involving the use of force, or under those circumstances permitted pursuant to
KRS 503.055, in a dwelling, building or upon real property in his possession
or in the possession of another person for whose protection he acts; or
(b) Theft, criminal mischief, or any trespassory taking of tangible, movable
property in his possession or in the possession of another person for whose
protection he acts.
(2) The use of deadly physical force by a defendant upon another person is justifiable
under subsection (1) only when the defendant believes that the person against whom
such force is used is:
(a) Attempting to dispossess him of his dwelling otherwise than under a claim of
right to its possession; or
(b) Committing or attempting to commit a burglary, robbery, or other felony
involving the use of force, or under those circumstances permitted pursuant to
KRS 503.055, of such dwelling; or
(c) Committing or attempting to commit arson of a dwelling or other building in
his possession.
(3) A person does not have a duty to retreat if the person is in a place where he or she
has a right to be.
Effective: July 12, 2006
History: Amended 2006 Ky. Acts ch. 192, sec. 5, effective July 12, 2006. -- Created
1974 Ky. Acts ch. 406, sec. 33, effective January 1, 1975.

This might also prove useful, for it's discussion of the legalities of deadly force:
http://kentucky-concealed.com/Information/Kentucky%20Concealed%20Carry%20Justifiable%20Homicide.pdf

SrDedosRapidos
December 31, 2008, 01:17 AM
Thanks guys!

I am looking for ward to the ccp class to answer my questions. I have quite a few really, but the threat of home invasion exists without my privilege of concealed carry, as well as the possibility of a nice car jacking.

I have read through most of the gun laws and all of the defense laws for KY, but sometimes the wording gets weird. I think that its pretty clear cut that if someone is forcing their way in, ive a right to forcibly reject them. I wasnt 100% sure though and even then i doubt i will be until a lawyer is nodding his head yes as im spouting off scenarios.

jorb
December 31, 2008, 05:45 AM
Good luck and I hope you have a quiet live.

orchidhunter
December 31, 2008, 08:37 PM
First take up all the Welcome Mats. Don't shoot till they are in the house. orchidhunter

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