Lawyers, guns and.....Booze?


PDA






ffm303
January 11, 2009, 01:38 PM
Do you drink and handle your weapons? I am talking about over the legal limit drinking. Just curious. Want to see just how right my lefty friends are, ya know, painting all gun owners as drunk hicks. Just a survey, please dont start ranting about how its your right or how I should'nt have lefty friends or whatever. Do me a favor, if you are sitting there on your 14th Busch light, stripping your Desert Eagle.... Just say yes. If you are on your 6th cup of coffee and its 2 a.m and you are stripping your G17 for the 612th time today(me)....then say no.

I personally, by the grace of God, don't drink anymore. And as such, dont drink and handle my weapons.

If you enjoyed reading about "Lawyers, guns and.....Booze?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
KarenTOC
January 11, 2009, 01:44 PM
I've been known to fondle an empty handgun while sipping a glass of red wine. But clean? shoot? load? nope.

zombienerd
January 11, 2009, 01:52 PM
You won't catch me with a loaded weapon when I'm loaded...

You also won't catch me behind the wheel in that state.

I avoid putting alcohol together with any dangerous machinery.

The Lone Haranguer
January 11, 2009, 01:52 PM
No excessive drinking. I might sip on a beer while cleaning, no more than that.

zammyman
January 11, 2009, 01:53 PM
I just don't drink anymore, period.

Duke of Doubt
January 11, 2009, 01:54 PM
As a general rule, alcohol and firearms do not mix well. But it's one thing to dust and lube a cleared collectible piece in the den after a few beers, and quite another to load up and shoot under those conditions. My range has a strict no-alcohol policy. I've never seen it actually enforced, but that may be because as a slow-fire long distance marksman, I tend to go shooting when I know few if any other people will be around. I have left the range when others appeared either drunk or excessively "gun-happy." Generally the latter. If they are there for a noisemaking party, I'm out of my element. Also, I would suspect that unlike, say, bowling, shooting scores would tend to decrease with intoxication. Couldn't say from any personal experience, though.

Grassman
January 11, 2009, 01:55 PM
I'm drunk right now...........:neener:

xsquidgator
January 11, 2009, 01:56 PM
I don't handle guns when I'm having adult beverages, to answer your question.

My state (FL) law prohibits the use of firearms while under the influence. However, FL law also specifically excepts self-defense from this prohibition. So, I wouldn't say I wouldn't pick up one of my guns in self-defense even if I were under the influence. Short of a self-defense situation though, I don't and I agree with those who think alcohol and firearms don't mix. I just wouldn't go so far as to say absolutely not.

mainmech48
January 11, 2009, 02:10 PM
No, I don't. Not ever.

Of course, it helps that I seldom drink and that those occasions are limited to a single glass of wine with a meal, a bottle of Guinness or two fingers of whiskey or brandy before retiring. At social gatherings I'm usually the designated driver and prefer non-alcoholic drinks at this sort of affair anyway.

Misanthropic of me, perhaps, but it's served me and mine too well to have all of what wits I have about me amid groups of relative strangers too many times to quit now.

model of 1905
January 11, 2009, 02:13 PM
When I drink my guns are put away.

Moccw
January 11, 2009, 02:18 PM
I dont ever drink and handle any of my guns, I might drink a beer or two with in a months time, but thats about it. I dont ever drink, and drive at all!

BeltfedMG
January 11, 2009, 02:22 PM
Nothin wrong with people enjoying a beer sitting out in their backyard (Not at private range, no need to worry someone else and it would me) shooting your guns with someone else you know can handle the beer and not gonna get wasted and keep shooting. I dont drink, if im around certain people that i know their safety techniques and their drinking ability, it doesnt bother me at all. If i go to the range (Public) and see people drinkin and shooting, thats a problem for me.

There, i was the first to go against the general pop. Theres alot of people on here that do handle firearms when drinking, maybe they dont want to admit it, nothing wrong with it in my books as long as theres a limit.

twoclones
January 11, 2009, 02:36 PM
Nope. Rarely drink and almost never to the legal limit.

kd7nqb
January 11, 2009, 02:42 PM
I dont carry if I am going to drink and I dont handle my guns if I have been drinking. Even when hunting I make sure to put HOURS preferably hours of sleep between a beer and handling the gun.

However that being said if I had a beer with dinner and something goes bump in the night I am still grabbing a gun to check it out.

matrem
January 11, 2009, 02:48 PM
I treat it the same as getting behind the wheel.

ljnowell
January 11, 2009, 02:57 PM
There are a few people i know that I trust. That being said if they want to have a beer or two while we are target shooting it doesnt bother me. These are also the kind of people that will tell anybody "dont sweep, trigger out of the guard, keep it pointed downrange, etc". They are very attentive to detail. I also know that one or two beers arent intoxicating them (we have put them away together in our youth). That being said, I dont drink at all anymore, so no.

Larry Ashcraft
January 11, 2009, 03:11 PM
Also, I would suspect that unlike, say, bowling, shooting scores would tend to decrease with intoxication.
When I used to bowl, one beer seemed to help my scores. Any more than one, and they went down.

I've found the same thing with shooting. I know I can handle one beer and then go out and shoot some pasture clays, but before the second beer gets opened, the guns are put away.

a2fireball
January 11, 2009, 03:49 PM
No. Never. Ever.

Its a matter of situational awareness. Alcohol affects the judgment center of the brain first...therefore, if one has been drinking, you are impairing your ability to judge if you are impaired.

I just choose to remove all doubt. ;)

Nathaniel Firethorn
January 11, 2009, 03:58 PM
Alcohol and tobacco: Cool.
Tobacco and firearms: Cool.
Alcohol and firearms: Not cool.

- NF

Prince Yamato
January 11, 2009, 04:47 PM
I never exceed the legal limit while carrying. I was CCWing when I went out for my first glass of Absinthe. I also CCW when I go out to eat and have a glass or two of wine with dinner. My morality and judgment do not change when I drink, only physical reaction times and motor skills. If I know I'm going to drink more than the legal limit, I leave my gun at home and carry pepper spray.

Blaming alcohol for your problems is like blaming guns for violence. Alcohol in itself is neither good nor bad, it's only when it is used irresponsibly. I never liked it when people used the expression, "I was so drunk that I..." when a better expression would be, "I drank a lot so I could use it as an excuse to..."

JImbothefiveth
January 11, 2009, 04:52 PM
I will never shoot drunk, and in my opinion shooting or handling guns after even one beer is irresponsible.

I might CCW at a resturaunt and drink a small amount of beer, but if I'm "buzzed", that's too much to be CCW'ing. 2 beers or one strong beer is also too much to be CCW'ing.

ffm303
January 11, 2009, 05:17 PM
Glad to hear everybodys response.

rduckwor
January 11, 2009, 05:26 PM
No

RMD

BeltfedMG
January 11, 2009, 05:31 PM
I have a feeling theres alot of folks not chiming in in fear of getting ripped on or maybe we have some fibbs told.

That or maybe im so used to seeing it around here i think its the norm. I live in rural area, beer is a fav pastime, guns are fav pastime. They get mixed alot. Even by the cops, have watched them shoot and enjoy beer while doing it. The public range here always has couple empty 6 packs in the trash can. Some people are responsible enough that i shoot with them while they "enjoy" a beer or 2, not slam a 12 pack. Others i wouldnt.

Rembrandt
January 11, 2009, 05:56 PM
Lawyers, guns and.....Booze?

I wouldn't have expected this many responses....didn't know there were so many Lawyers on the High Road....

matrem
January 11, 2009, 06:02 PM
"didn't know there were so many Lawyers on the High Road...."
Oh,we just thought the op wanted the correct answer!!

ffm303
January 11, 2009, 07:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ffm303
Lawyers, guns and.....Booze?

I wouldn't have expected this many responses....didn't know there were so many Lawyers on the High Road....

It was a play on a song by Warren Zevon. Or was that an attempt at humor?

larry_minn
January 11, 2009, 07:32 PM
Well as I don't drink. (and am not a lawyer)
I have been members of a number of shooting groups over the yrs. The rule has ALWAYS been the shooting is DONE and guns put away before the beer comes out.

Last I heard in MN if you carry its .04% as legal limit. (as I don't drink if it changes I might not have noticed) Most I have had is half a beer or drink with meal at one time.
Yrs ago I did some "testing waters" drinking... I used a vidio game I was fairly good at as measure. I was 14 and with 4 JD and coke after half hr I could barely reach same level that sober was common. So not much of a change in reaction time.

ojibweindian
January 11, 2009, 07:58 PM
I don't drink, so...

Tamlin
January 11, 2009, 08:01 PM
My rule is, No drinking before shooting. After coming back from an afternoon at the range, my ritual is to grab *A* beer and clean my guns. No ammo around while I am cleaning. When the guns are put away, then you can play (drink). Same as on motorcycle trips. Once I'm safely parked for the rest of the day, then it's time to walk over to the watering hole.

Now, when I am camping and having a few beers around the campfire, I don't take off my loaded sidearm. But I am also not going shooting. It stays there just in case that growling and crashing in the woods behind the tent turns out to be a bear.

Armed 24/7
January 11, 2009, 08:56 PM
I don't drink anymore, at all, so I don't really spend much time thinking about it. I never used to handle or shoot any firearms while drinking though...

Mello
January 11, 2009, 10:54 PM
Do you drink and handle your weapons?
I do not drink alcoholic beverages and handle firearms, drive vehicles, fly planes or make decisions about money.

NotSoFast
January 11, 2009, 11:36 PM
When I drink my values change and I use bad judgment. Therefore I don't drink, let alone drink while handling guns.

hankdatank1362
January 11, 2009, 11:44 PM
Handle weapons after a few drinks?

No.

I've had a weapon on me after a few, but I was on my own property, and I was just carrying. Darn sure wasn't touching it, much less playing with it.

And while I was probably over the legal limit for driving or carrying a concealed weapon in public (Like .08% and .05% respectively, I believe, here in SC) I was not intoxicated.

Definitely no carrying in public, shooting, handling guns, or driving, after a few.

However, I can't play pool worth a darn until I'm schnocked and seeing double.

Sato Ord
January 12, 2009, 09:49 AM
When I'm loaded I don't handle firearms, or lawyers for that matter!

BBQLS1
January 12, 2009, 10:02 AM
No. (My message was too short, so you see this extra text.)

wkoonce
January 12, 2009, 10:08 AM
In the aviation world it is, 8 hours bottle to throttle or .04 blood alcohol content. Or was that 8 feet I keep forgetting. Mmmm. Just kidding. Personally I don't mix alcohol with complex activities.

I will throw another twist to the mix. NASA has done sleep studies and its effect on reasoning skills. If someone has been awake for 24 hours they have the cognitive abilities of someone who is legally intoxicated. Do you handle your gun after pulling a double shift at work?

hso
January 12, 2009, 10:13 AM
Alcohol, firearms and ammunition are a risky combination that requires responsible control. There are plenty of states that allow you to carry having a beer with your wings at the tavern. They don't see any greater rate of shootings of permit holders than a state like mine that doesn't even permit carry in an establishment that sells alcohol for consumption on the premises.

Over indulging in alcohol and shooting/carrying are a flat out dangerous combination and no responsible adult combines the two.

Tell your friends that the myth of the drunk shooting up the place is no more a reflection of gunowners in general than a wreck caused by a DUI is a reflection of drivers.

expvideo
January 12, 2009, 10:18 AM
2 drink limit. That's my rule. If I'm carrying a gun, it's a 2 drink limit. After that the gun gets put away or I stop drinking.

That only applies to if I am carrying a gun, like I always do. It does not apply to playing with guns, cleaning guns, showing off guns, etc. If I am drinking, guns are not being handled/viewed/cleaned/etc. Not at all. The only exception is that I will continue to carry my daily carry gun until I reach that 2 drink limit.

It doesn't take much for alcohol to affect judgement. .02 is the point where alcohol starts to affect your judgement, and it doesn't take a lot to get to .02. No matter how much I trust myself to make the right decisions, I respect that my judgement is affected by alcohol and I act accordingly.


ETA
I was disappointed. I thought this thread was about lawyers getting drunk and handling guns. I was going to take a cheap shot at public defenders just to get Duke of Doubt going, but I guess I'll have to be nice ;)

Macmac
January 12, 2009, 10:27 AM
I never drink anything more than 2 beer's in a given day. One before a meal maybe and maybe one with a meal. So I never meet the drunk criteria ever.
OT maybe:
I also ride a bigger cruiser motorcycle and do not drink and ride.

jbauch357
January 12, 2009, 10:33 AM
I drink like a fish, and pretty much the only thing I don't do when hammered is drive in the city (mtn roads in the middle of nowhere are great for hammered wheelin'). When we're camping I drink like a fish and shoot, for days straight - and it's glorious. Just Sat night after a buddy and I polished off two fifths of Pendleton we were going through my range bag looking at what I planned to shoot the next day (but didn't actually go shooting because I was so hung over)...

I'm also the person that a bunch of otherwise decent friends will no longer go shooting with becuase I'm the one that doesn't hold back from yelling at the idiots for sweeping, not indexing, loading while people are placing targets, etc. I'm a safety nazi, regardless of state of sobriety or intoxication...

paul
January 12, 2009, 10:37 AM
I answer in the affirmative...
I can't imagine shooting without a nice, warm buzz on...
And vice versa.
p:)

expvideo
January 12, 2009, 10:40 AM
I drink like a fish, and pretty much the only thing I don't do when hammered is drive in the city (mtn roads in the middle of nowhere are great for hammered wheelin'). When we're camping I drink like a fish and shoot, for days straight - and it's glorious. Just Sat night after a buddy and I polished off two fifths of Pendleton we were going through my range bag looking at what I planned to shoot the next day (but didn't cause I was so hung over)...
wow... You're not the brightest bulb on the christmas tree are you? (still in the christmas spirit)

jbauch357
January 12, 2009, 10:41 AM
wow... You're not the brightest bulb on the christmas tree are you? (still in the christmas spirit)
not always - I'll be the first to admit that...

expvideo
January 12, 2009, 10:50 AM
not always - I'll be the first to admit that...
All right then. I suppose that's good that you are honest with yourself. I do think that you are being more than a little careless about things that should be given much care. I live out here in Washington too, and those mountain roads are pretty dangerous at night if you don't have quick reflexes. They can be pretty unforgiving. They aren't very well maintained, so sections of them can be missing due to mud-slides, bridges can be gone, there can be water over the road, some of those pot-holes can be much deeper than they look, etc. And handling guns when you are that toasted is going to get somebody hurt. I've been shot in an accidental shooting, and it's not fun.

I'm not trying to be your mom or anything, but I really hope that you can stop being so reckless before you get yourself hurt. Continuing this kind of behavior will get you hurt or arrested or both. It's not a matter of "if", it's a matter of "when".

tinygnat219
January 12, 2009, 10:52 AM
I don't touch the stuff when I am carrying. Of course, VA makes it simpler by not allowing one in the bar when one is carrying concealed. In some ways, this makes life a little eaiser.

jbauch357
January 12, 2009, 10:56 AM
I would explain what/when/where I drive in the woods, and the manner in which I enjoy shooting - but that would look too much like me trying to defend what I know are reckless activities...

Please also note that I'm not displaying typical THR behavior - but at the same time I know there are many more just like me, regardless of how many may admit it or not...

Eric F
January 12, 2009, 11:18 AM
I think its a poor policey to discuss alcohol on THR almost always it blows up and gets out of control or turns into flame wars. I know I started a few threads on the subject. Some where some one way out to one side or the other will claim you should get the death penality for having a drink and even looking at a gun and the person on the other end will claim that no mater how much they drink they have a right to have a gun under 2a. Both sides are just as wacked but its when those two individuals meet on the forum a lock will apear.

expvideo
January 12, 2009, 11:27 AM
I would explain what/when/where I drive in the woods, and the manner in which I enjoy shooting - but that would look too much like me trying to defend what I know are reckless activities...

Please also note that I'm not displaying typical THR behavior - but at the same time I know there are many more just like me, regardless of how many may admit it or not...
Look, I know that you don't have to justify yourself to me, and I'm not asking you to. I also know that I'm not going to help you to reach an epiphany over a forum. But as redundant as it may be, I feel that I need to at least try to help you here.

A lot of people do a lot of things. It doesn't mean that it's ok, or that you're going to be fine if you keep up with it. I know you aren't going to do it, but I would ask you to take just one afternoon and go to a courthouse. Sit in on a court session where people are being sentenced for DUIs. I wish everyone could have to sit through one of those. You'll see several people go before the judge and just imagine yourself in those shoes. It's not hard to imagine, they're normal people like you or me. Even then, you might still not have seen enough to change your mind.

I would further ask you to spend a night at Harborview Medical Center in the ICU. Ask if you can talk to one of the surgeons about some of the cases that they have had to deal with where guns and alcohol were involved.

I know I'm not going to get through to you here, but I feel that I have to try. You see I was shot by a friend in an accidental shooting. I had to have emergency heart surgery because the .25acp bullet went through my heart. I died twice before I even reached the hospital, but I was revived. It took a long time for me to recover from this and it was the most eye-opening and shocking experience of my life. My friend who was also traumatized from the experience is now a convicted felon because of it. He has to deal with that for the rest of his life. And this was just two young guys being stupid. Alcohol wasn't even involved. But you see how I could be concerned about someone not being careful with firearms?

Admitting to being careless does not make it ok. I'm glad that you can admit your faults, but you need to do something to fix this. It is a problem. I really hope that you will try to seek out something to change your mind. Whether it is spending a night at the hospital or spending some time in a court room, you need to have your eyes opened before they are opened for you.

If you wait until you or one of your friends is dead or in jail, it's not going to matter if you can admit that you're an idiot. I can admit that my friend and I were idiots. That's not going to take that bullet back. It's not going to change the fact that I had to go through the physical things that I did, and it's not going to make my friend a non-felon. I'm still shot and he's still convicted.

Funderb
January 12, 2009, 11:37 AM
NO.

never ever drink and handle.
This was instilled from a very early age by my father.

jbauch357
January 12, 2009, 11:46 AM
expvideo - PM inbound, I don't want us to get this thread locked...

Ditto_95
January 12, 2009, 06:53 PM
Quit with the Lefty friends. They can't do you any good.

shooting4life
January 12, 2009, 07:58 PM
Quit with the Lefty friends. They can't do you any good.

this

Frank Ettin
January 12, 2009, 09:02 PM
If I've been drinking at all, I don't handle guns.

If you enjoyed reading about "Lawyers, guns and.....Booze?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!