Omega III Rifle by Homer Koon - what's it worth


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ginsmith_1911
January 29, 2009, 10:33 PM
I am in possestion of an Omega III rifle by Homer Koon. I have been asked to sell a collection of guns for a widow. I am having trouble pinning down a value on it. I've read online - anywhere from $1250 to $65K. I don't want to short change her on the deal - on the other hand, it needs to sell in a reasonable amount of time.

Any information is appreciated.

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Omaha-BeenGlockin
January 29, 2009, 10:51 PM
Think I read something in a mag a few years back---only 100 were made and the company bought back most of them---very rare---if its what i'm thinking of.

rangerruck
January 29, 2009, 10:53 PM
Very rare is like saying a Strad violin is a bit expensive. I think only 9 are known to be in existence, 1 owned by the John Wayne or his estate, 1 or 2 owned by the origional owners/makers of the rifle. I would not even start to look at a amount for it lower than 3000 bucks.

rangerruck
January 29, 2009, 10:56 PM
if condition is perfect, double that amount, if unfired, double it again. You really need to know the provenance of this rifle; who owned it before, and do you have any proof. What you have here, is a rifle made to very exacting tolerances by former aerospace engineers; it was far ahead of it's time, and still is , in many ways. if this was owned by J wayne , or another celeb/famous person, double it again, also if it was owned by one of the origional owner/designers. I wanna say John Ford may have owned one as well, so that is why we need to know where this came from.

nwilliams
January 29, 2009, 10:58 PM
It's worth nothing in fact it will cost you money, I'll take it off your hands for free and even pay for the shipping!:D

Seriously you need to post a pic of it!;)

Oh and welcome to THR!

bang_bang
January 29, 2009, 11:04 PM
From a Google search. Might help, or might be old news.
What I know about the Omega III

The first I ever heard of the Omega III was an article in Guns&Ammo several years ago. The High Shear company, known mostly for aerospace parts like explosive bolts for the space shuttle, was looking to branch out into civilian areas. They somehow hooked up with a man named Homer Koon who had designed a rather unique rifle. The receiver is large and heavily machined on the inside, surrounded by a two piece stock. The bolt face is square, giving it a very short throw. The most innovative part is the firing pin spring, which is made up of seven belville washers. The firing pin travel is only 1/8 inch, which gives it a very fast lock time. Altogether it was a pretty expensive rifle made for the higher end market, about $2500 in today's dollars. But after a hundred or so rifles were built, the bean counters at High Shear decided that profits would never amount to much, and liability might be a problem in our lawsuit happy world. It was decided to not only stop production, but to try and buy back all the rifles they had sold. From what I can tell they were pretty successful. I have seen a claim that only three rifles remain, but I have seen one for sale and talked to the owner of another, so I think there are probably a good deal more than three. Two owners I talked to have tried to contact Hi-Sheer about the rifles, but one got no response and the other couldn't find anyone at Hi-Sheer who knew anything about them. I guess that's to be expected, seeing how the Omega division at Hi-Sheer was torpedoed so quickly, and this happened back I believe in the mid 70's.

Before Hi-Sheer, Homer Koon ran the Omega Arms company in Flower Mound Texas to produce these rifles. From what I can gather about 1000 or so rifles were built there in the 60's and early 70's before Koon sold the rights to Hi-Sheer. I have talked to two people who worked at Omega Arms, one of them owns a gun shop today. I own two of the Omega Arms rifles, serial numbers 6xx and 9xx. One is a 7mm Rem Mag and the other a 338 Win Mag. Both are near perfect.

The Hi-Sheer built rifles were marked "HI-SHEER CORP" and "TORRENCE CALIF" on the receiver, and "OMEGA III" on both the receiver and buttpad. The owner of one told me that the crown at the end of the barrel is recessed nearly half an inch. I know that stocks came in either nice walnut or laminates. The only calibers I have heard of in the Hi-Sheer Omega's in 270 Win and 30-06.

The Omega Arms built rifles are marked "OMEGA III" on the receiver top, "BY H KOON" on the receiver side, and "OMEGA ARMS INC, FLOWER MOUND, TX" on the left side of the barrel. There is a nice recess at the muzzle, but not half an inch. Stocks came in many varieties and grades of wood and laminates. It came in a variety of calibers as well. I have also seen a left handed rifle for sale.

One owner I emailed with claimed that his Omega III rifle had no markings at all, no Hi-Sheer, no Omega Arms, nothing, but I don't think that was accurate.

Both rifles have silver grip caps (both of mine are initialed) and nice butt pads. There may be slight differences in the shape of the bolt handles and stock forends that differentiates between the Hi-Sheer and Omage Arms built rifles.

That's about all I know about the Omega III rifle. I understand that Homer Koon died around 1997 or so. If anyone has any additional information or corrections, please email me at spider44@airmail.net. I'm very interested in finding out all I can about these rifles, and I'll update this site with that info, since people keep finding me when searching the web for Omega III. Also, if anyone is looking to buy or sell, let me know. I'll try to hook you up.

From http://www.geocities.com/capitolhill/6677/

Hasn't been updated in 5 years though...

ginsmith_1911
January 29, 2009, 11:05 PM
It was made before Hi Shear took over the production. It is 1 of about 1000 as I understand it. It is 7mm Rem Mag, it has a walnut stock (not laminate like most), it has been hunted with.

rangerruck
January 29, 2009, 11:08 PM
okay, further research shows some amazing things; they were all destroyed by HiShear, the origional company that backed Homer , to make these rifles.
EXCEPT A FEW DID NOT GET DESTROYED~~~ three rifles were given an add '
S' letter to the serial numbers, these were presentation rifles given to 3 people, the origional dude from HiShear who financially backed Homer, s-1, s-2 was given to John Wayne, and can be seen in the Cowboy Hall of fame, in Oklahoma.
s-3 was given to John Conally, and was sold at a estate sale several years ago, so if someone has that in private hands, that would be huge. The others that escaped? The next 9 production rifles that left the line. So a total of 12 made it out. If you have s-1 or s-3, I would start the bidding at 100k, not a penny less. The other 9? I would start the bidding at 3k.
Now then , the rifles made by just Homer, before Hi shear? I do not know , but even then, I would not start the bidding less than 3k, esecially if in fantastic condition.
The Homer made editions, were all custom made, by custom order, that is why they could be
made in a variety of cals, woods, actions, etc., so that is why they are still worth a ton, even
if they were made before the Hi sheer models.

ginsmith_1911
January 29, 2009, 11:14 PM
I think only the Hi Shear guns were bought back and destroyed. This one is number 74X, one of the ones he made before he made the deal with Hi Shear. Not that lucky.....

Jubjub
January 30, 2009, 12:19 AM
You might check with Collector's Firearms for a value. I'm pretty sure that I saw one for sale on their web site last year. Don't recall what they were asking, but it looks like it sold.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
January 30, 2009, 10:39 AM
More links.

http://www.huntingclub.com/Community/Forums.aspx?g=posts&t=123100

http://www.huntingclub.com/uploadedFiles/Community/Member_Forum/100_4300%20(Small)(2).jpg

http://www.huntingclub.com/community/Forums.aspx?g=posts&t=101296

ArmedBear
January 30, 2009, 11:01 AM
If you grind it up and eat it, you will be less likely to have a heart attack, as I understand it.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
January 30, 2009, 11:11 AM
The reality here is this:

I've read online - anywhere from $1250 to $65K.

And they're exactly right - ALL of them. It *could* fetch anywhere from 1250 to 65000, on any given day. It's such a rare unknown thing that it has no established value, nor can a 'standard' value BE established. It's worth exactly what someone will pay for it, so it just depends on the buyer, and finding one of those handful of buyers who really value it intrinsically for its history. So if you want to sell it quickly, without holding out for one of the "right" buyers, it'll likely fetch $2,000-$5,000 pretty easily - taking it to the Wannamacher show, for example, will likely fetch toward the upper end of that spectrum, or maybe a whole lot more. But if you auction it at a serious large auction of fine & rare guns, and are willing to pay the auctioneer's fees, it just might fetch the $25K-$50K or more, if someone with money loses their head a bit at the auction, as well all tend to do. So it's worth all of those prices and everywhere in between, just depending on how patient you are, and how hard you work to find the right market, and if you stick a high reserve on it at the auction, how many times you're willing to let it not sell and re-submit it at the next one.

You could also stick it on gunbroker with a reserve (different type of auction but same principles, of course). You might have to relist it 100 times, depending on the reserve you set, but something THAT rare AND THAT well-made certainly has the potential to fetch a heck of a lot of money. IIRC, there is no re-listing fee on gunbroker, so I'd just stick in on there with a $40,000 reserve, give or take $15,000, and then list it over and over and over again - maybe in 1 month, 6 months, or 5 years, someone will bite. A lot like fishing. :)

Semmerling
January 30, 2009, 01:16 PM
Nobody....as in not a single person or company concerned with liability buys back every one of their rifles if there wasnt a significant design or material failure. I am willing to bet that there is a high point of failure in the design that was known to the attorneys and accountants. Realizing this they recalled every single rifle, stopped production and closed down the shop until they could sell the patterns and designs to somebody that would work out the issues. Every single retrieved rifle was cut into small pieces......

In the mid 70's there was little anti gun reasons to worry about liability, there was HUGE product failure as this is where attorney's focused their attention.

Warning Will Rodgers, Warning.

everallm
January 30, 2009, 01:49 PM
If this rifle is as rare and unusual as it appears, under no circumstances use Gunbroker or their ilk.

Contact either Christies or Sotheby's, the auctioneers, rare and unusual are their bread and butter and they have some of the most knowledgeable folks around. If the weapon is that rare/expensive, they'll come to you and give you a market valuation.

Christies US number (212) 636 2000
Sotheby's US number (212) 606-7010

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
January 30, 2009, 02:34 PM
under no circumstances use Gunbroker or their ilk

Why not? There's no harm as long as you put the reserve you want up.

But contacting the big auction houses is an excellent idea.

Nobody....as in not a single person or company concerned with liability buys back every one of their rifles if there wasnt a significant design or material failure. I am willing to bet that there is a high point of failure in the design that was known to the attorneys and accountants. Realizing this they recalled every single rifle, stopped production and closed down the shop until they could sell the patterns and designs to somebody that would work out the issues. Every single retrieved rifle was cut into small pieces......

In the mid 70's there was little anti gun reasons to worry about liability, there was HUGE product failure as this is where attorney's focused their attention.

Warning Will Rodgers, Warning.

I would be willing to bet that you're exactly right about that.

Wait a sec - Will Rogers or Will Robinson? Political satirist or child lost in space? :p

Nevertheless, design defect or not, it could and probably would fetch quite a high price.

everallm
January 30, 2009, 03:57 PM
Why not? There's no harm as long as you put the reserve you want up.

If this is the type of firearm being discussed who knows what is the right reserve, do you have any idea of the reality of the bidders, time wasters, tax liability on the sale, is it the right audience of collectors.

Gunbroker et-al, great for that Moisin, FAL or Sooper-Tactical AR......8-) bu, for what may be a piece a museum or serious collector would want?

Farmdog
February 22, 2009, 10:58 PM
The Blue Book of Gun Values shows a new in the box Omega at $795 or. HEAR ME OUT, please! However, they also list it as being a single shot rifle, which it is not. I bought a Koons Omega a few years ago for $950 I believe. If not, it was $850. It was laminated and in 25-05. I have actually seen more in high grade wood than in laminate, but that is just what has presented itself to me and is not necessarily a true cross section of the available Omegas out there. I purchased a High Shear model in .270 a couple of years ago for $1,650. It was also a laminated stock, and showed no signs of ever having been fired. Price is what the market will bear, but $2,500 is probably the most you can hope for unless it was owned by a famous person.
To the gentleman who posted the comment about the Omega with no markings: it has "7 mm mag" on the barrel and 101 under the forestock on the left hand side. I either bought that rifle from, or sold it to the gentleman who sent you that information. It does exist, and I wish that I still owned it. The stock was of a different configuration and much, much higher grade wood than is to be found on the already beautiful normal Omegas. As well, the flat metal spring that shows at the top of the rotary magazine the bolt is open is a solid metal piece instead. The trigger pull was better than any I have seen before. I always appreciate information on Omega III's, and would probably be interested n buying another one in a couple of months or so.
Thank you for reading, and though I may have rained on a few peoples parade, I hope that I have been of some help.
farmdog

st. hubert
May 5, 2009, 11:12 PM
Have you sold the rifle yet? If not, and you are still wondering about the price, I will ask my cousin and see if he has kept abreast of the numbers. He has several and I believe that he still has the prototype.

st. hubert
May 5, 2009, 11:14 PM
Oops.

I see that I entitled my reply "Jeff Koon" by habit. He hated the name "Homer" and went by Jeff.

sbarc1
June 10, 2009, 01:43 PM
I too have an Omega III in 7MM. I acquired it from one of the gunsmiths who worked for the Koons company. When the company closed its Flower Mound operations, he told me that the company let the employees buy the rather small inventory in lew of severence. Mine is sn#640. I kept it unused for about 15 years but began some very lite use in 1980 for deer and elk when I lived in Colorado.

I am interested in the value for insurance purposes and always believed it to be worth around $3,000 or more mainly because of its rarity and outstanding quality. However I wouldn't sell it for that. The wood in the stock is fabulous. I have never seen another one in a gun show or heard anyone mention that they saw one. But there must be some still in the Dallas area.

bgrayson
November 21, 2009, 06:38 PM
Gentlemen, this is my first post to THR as I am a new member. I appreciate the commentary on the Omega III that has been posted here. I own 4 of the Omega's including the prototype rifle. Farmdog, referred to this gun in his post and I believe it was I that bought/traded you for it. The serial number is 101, it has a different bolt handle than the production guns and has a longer barrel. The wood on it is fabulous, oil rubbed walnut with a beautiful grain. My father and Homer where very good friends and when Homer opened up Ranger Arms in Gainesville Texas, pre Omega Arms, he produced two actions the Texas Magnum and the Texas Maverick. He gave my father serial #101 which was the first production rifle. He also produced two other guns, the infamous snake charmer and a light rancher gun called the Alpha I. The first time that I saw an Omega was on an opening day of dove season in the early 70's. My dad's hunting group had gathered for the annual opening day hunt and after a successful opening day we met at a friends home and Homer brought in a box with the un-blued action and unfinished stock of his new rifle the Omega III. It truly caught all of our attention and of interest I clearly remember him saying that the idea for the rotery magazine came from the Savage 99 action. He felt that it was a more positive feed mechanism. Anyway, I hope you guys find this of interest and please pass on any other information that you might have. I do not claim to be the final fountain of information. I just love the guns and have a close bonding with them. As for the assertion that there are only 9 Omegas left other than the presentation guns. Well as I count, there are 4 referenced in this blog and I have 4 and I know where there are at least 3 others, so I think that there are more of them around in private collections than just 9. Of course I do not think that they will hit the market as they will most likely just be passed down and kept in the families.

rangerruck
November 21, 2009, 09:37 PM
MAN!!! this thread is too good!!! We need more info from the seller of the rifle; we need pics and markings, anywhere they can be found on the rifle. To the owners of Omega III's that have talked back here; did he put the markings in easy to find places, or do you need to take them out of the stocks, and look with a mag glass?

Also we are talking about omega III's, what was the prototype? was there a 1 and 2? You mentioned 2 different actions made by Mr. Koon, were these for the Omega III's, or any omega rifles?
Is there an S prefix stamped before any of the serial numbers?

bgrayson
November 22, 2009, 03:35 PM
The markings on the guns are all very readable and stamped on each part including the stocks. Of course to view those numbers the stocks will have to be removed. As for the prototype, it is a .300 Win Mag, it has a blued bolt handle, where as the production guns were not blued. I am sure there were a number of development actions worked on before the prototype was finally assembled, but i remember seeing this action before it was blued. The two actions that I referenced were for the Ranger Arms Guns, not the Omegas. I have not seen any of the Omegas with an S prefix, but that does not mean they aren't out there.

oldgold
November 22, 2009, 04:04 PM
http://flipgrip.net/product.sc;jsessionid=93E1546D61BB7208809BD2FA4E2576DD.qscstrfrnt03?productId=8&categoryId=1

Here one posted for sale.

Kurt99
December 22, 2009, 09:52 PM
My dad recently bought an Omega3 at the local gun show its serial number 591 is this thing really as rare and valuable as it looks like it might be.I havent seen it but he says it was an extremely nice gun when it was new. You dont want to know what he paid for it :D

dfkoon
December 30, 2009, 01:29 PM
I came across this post while looking for an Omega for my son. That would be Homer Koon's Grandson. Just thought I would set a few of the details straight.

The Omega III was produced in Flower Mound Texas prior to Hi-Shear purchasing. The original 3 presentation rifles where given to John Wayne (actor), John Connolly (Governor) and Herb Klein (hunter). Note: Hi Shear is not involved and did not recieve one. The presentation was at the Kaufman ranch between Gainesville and Denton. These rifles were enlayed with gold and had a ruby in the stock. That is the reason that these 3 are worth so much. They were absolutely the most beautiful rifles you could ever see.

There was nothing wrong with the rifle produced in Texas (hence why I am looking for one). However, Hi-Shear moved the production to California after the sale. They were attempting to mass produce what really was a custom rifle. Though my father had been consulting with Hi-Shear after the sale, their own "experts" were in charge. They made a few poor choices and ended up with a bunch of worthless tooling.

There was never an effort to track down and recover the rifles made in Texas. Frankly, I'm not sure about the one's made by Hi-Shear either. Sounds like a pretty good story to up the price on a rifle. I'll have to look through the old write-ups later.

As far as the value... well it is worth as much as someone is willing to pay. These are/were very fine rifles. But keep in mind. Only 3 are really worth an obscene amount.

taliv
December 30, 2009, 02:39 PM
welcome to THR

rangerruck
December 31, 2009, 12:32 AM
first off, It is great to hear from a person of such history, anything you can tell us first hand is fab!!! Do you know how those 3 were marked, with the " S " in front of the serial number? Of the ones produced in Texas, do you know about how many there were?

dfkoon
December 31, 2009, 02:30 PM
taliv, Thanks for the welcome.

rangerruck, Sorry, but I don't recall that detail. They might have had an S. There is however no mistaking one of the three presentation rifles. I am attempting to upload a picture. This is the presentation rifle. I had to play around with it to get the size down and that was after I gave up on doing an album. I would have posted the entire brochure if I could have done an album. Not sure whether the limit is per pic or all pics together.

The presentation were valued at ~17k new. New Omega III originally sold for ~$400.

rangerruck
December 31, 2009, 09:25 PM
WOW!!! My mouth actually started watering, when I began reading the words of the workmanship on these rifles... I would have to take any model I ran across, Texas model, even a hi shear model, if they got made.

MarkDozier
January 1, 2010, 12:04 AM
you think Duke would mine if I borrow his rifle for th rest of my life?

COINOPS
March 1, 2010, 11:31 AM
my first time here but already I have found some excellent info especially on these rifles that have particular appeal.

armlaw
March 7, 2010, 08:02 PM
Kurt...
Was the show in Manchester, N.H. ? If so it may be one I sold as I Repped for Homer and sold many units. Port Clam Rake, Co. on Long Island was my best dealer customer.

ltriker
April 1, 2010, 11:34 PM
Nobody....as in not a single person or company concerned with liability buys back every one of their rifles if there wasnt a significant design or material failure. I am willing to bet that there is a high point of failure in the design that was known to the attorneys and accountants. Realizing this they recalled every single rifle, stopped production and closed down the shop until they could sell the patterns and designs to somebody that would work out the issues. Every single retrieved rifle was cut into small pieces......

In the mid 70's there was little anti gun reasons to worry about liability, there was HUGE product failure as this is where attorney's focused their attention





I spoke to Homer Koon in 1984 and he told me himself that the rifles he made in Flower Mound were rounded up using the order list he had. According to him all but nine were retrieved and their destruction was reported to the BATF at the time. There was NOTHING WRONG with these rifles, but with the THINKING of the people who backed him with cash to make it possible to have the production run he wanted.
There was an incident in 1970 involving an imported revolver, an RG 44mag, made in Germany. The owner HANDLOADED some shells to the MAX and blew part of his hand off. He sued the IMPORTER, and the anti gun judge sided with him and he won enough to put them out of business. This was the reason for the worry of a liability lawsuit that COULD run into the millions(a lot at the time).

Mr Koon said that when this happened, is pretty much smashed his dreams of firearms manufacturing and he felt betrayed. He also told me that there were some special presentation rifles made and each one got special numbers and special work. S1 was given to John Wayne, S2 to John Connally and S10 to a good friend of his that had backed him financially. I have seen S1 and S2 in museums and admired the gold inlays, etc. I have seen S10 and it looks like a regular production rifle except for the fact that is was never testfired, has a two tone red/blue finish, a silver grip cap with a gold "B" inlaid, and the special S serial number. I has a laminated stock and is chambered in .270 Win at the request of the recipient, who never fired it and let it sit in a gunsafe until his death in the early 1980's. I do not know who recieved S3-S9 or what happened to them, I would guess they were destroyed.

I saw a production Omega III in a gunshop in Kansas that was missing the bolt, but do not recall the serial other than is was three digit beginning with a 1, such as 189.

I see posts pop up on the web every few months about these rifles and every time, this SAME argument comes up...what are they worth? Who knows for sure, but I guarantee they are NOT going DOWN in value. I met a guy at a Dallas gun show who had three sitting on his table and calimed to have another at home and at teh time they were priced between $1000-2500, but none had the original scope and rings on them. From the production line, they came with Leupold VariX II scopes mounted with ConeTrol rings and bases. Other than S1-S2-S10, I have never seen an Omega III with the original scope and rings still on it, so that could also bear on the pricing.
Guns and Ammo magazine did a review on these rifles in 1970, then revived the story in 1984 and reviewed the test and said that most people have never heard of, musch less have seen one of these rifles. If you get a chance to check one out, do so.


If Homer Koons' son can search out the people who worked with Homer at the time, perhaps he can find more information, unless he was old enough to actually have been there at the time and can give us firsthand information.

dfkoon
April 2, 2010, 05:18 PM
I really wasn't going to respond much more on this thread though I do get notices when someone posts (and those who send me private messages, I don't find out about those unless I log in or someone responds to this thread). This last post kinda inspired me to respond.

ltriker is obviously a fan of my father's and the Omega but seems to mix a bit a fact with a bit of fiction and some very illogical conclusions. And I'm not sure, but it might have been his post on gunbroker that I 1st found when looking for one of these rifles. I didn't save a copy of that post but what I recall was a feller selling a production Omega for an obscene amount and claiming there were only 9 in existence. There was the same story that they were all gathered and destroyed and he knew this first hand. It wasn't all bad as I did get back in contact with Bennett Grayson who was the son of a friend of my father. Bennett has also posted on this thread. Bennett had posted on that string that he had 4 of these so called 9 in existence, which is kinda a polite way to say you are full of it.

One of my first jobs (other than paper route and mowing yards) as a kid was cleaning up in the Omega plant in Flower Mound. So, I will not be an expert with intricate details, but you can't fly wild claims past me either. I'm not going to track down anyone though if there are folks that come across this I would love to hear from you. We might actually put together a book some day. Most of the folks I knew other than family members have passed. Anyway, let me debunk a few parts of this last post.

There was not a design flaw with the Omega's produced in Flower Mound. There was not a recall of production rifles and there are many (as in 800-1000) still out there. This is a lot less than say a Winchester Model 94 but quite a bit more than 9. Oh, investors/shareholders are interested in a return on their investment. Does buying back every bit of production sound like a good return? If there were ever a design flaw companies usually repair and refurbish, not destroy. And you don't have to cut it up into little bits. Just one cut through the receiver is all it takes to destroy a rifle by ATF standards. But this is what I recall from the replies on the gunbroker also. Not too many folks bought into that there were only 9 of these rifles left.

The Omega III was produced in the following calibers: 25/06, 0.270, 30/06, 7mm Rem Mag., 0.300 Win Mag, 0.338 Win Mag, and a 0.357 Norma Mag. The barrel length was either 22 or 24 inches. The stocks came in Claro Walnut in either a Monte Carlo, Classic or Thumbhole-Varminter style. I'm looking for a larger caliber preferably the 300 Win Mag.

With my father, there were 3 classes of each rifle he made. The 1st were the prototypes. These were the very 1st rifles. They were field tested and design changes made based on individual recommendations from the tests. These rifles (which were actually made in Denton Texas - not Flower Mound) were returned and destroyed. Then there were the presentation rifles. As I said there were 3 of these not 10. The one that I do not know what happened to was presented to Herb Klein. My guess would be it is still with his estate. Then there were the production rifles. These production rifles were produced and sold until the company was sold to Hi-Shear. As I said previously there are 800-1000 Omegas out there.

I did have a bit difficulty following the anti gun and the liability in the 70s. So, all I will say to this is that there is and has been an anti gun movement in this country for some time including in the 70s. And guns and lawyers don't mix. There are many lawsuits involving guns that have nothing to do with product liability. But that is what product liability insurance (which is expensive) is for. My father's company had product liability insurance.

My father was involved in some lawsuits. This could be a chapter in a book though I think most folks who read this forum are versed enough to recognize why lawsuits and gun manufacturers go hand in hand in this country. I do not know the story of the imported revolver. I do have many other stories including people shooting themselves in the foot or pulling the trigger after they stuck the muzzle in the mud. My father was not too keen on lawyers for this reason. But he couldn't have been too discouraged as he started 3 additional gun companies after Omega.

I will also clarify that the Omega had factory installation of either Leupold or Redfield scopes on Conetrol or Buehler mounts. My father leaned toward Leupold but it was really up to the buyer.

The one area that I will agree with Mr. ltriker is I think these rifles are worth between 1000-2500. Though I think I stated before that they are worth whatever someone is willing to pay.

DRYHUMOR
April 2, 2010, 06:34 PM
I've watched this thread as it's developed, it's very interesting to hear about the small shop craftsman in the trade. I've seen a few through the years that were out of small production shops. Very nice, and very good quality, rifles you can tell were built with pride.

I think a lot of us following this thread would like to see a few photos, if at all possible, of the real deal.

If it's not too much trouble. Thanks.

rangerruck
April 3, 2010, 01:15 AM
to df koon and others who have contributed to this thread; I can't speak for others, but being a person who loves rifles, and history, and anything american history and all things americana, this is a fantastic thread, and if you wrote a book, you can count me down for at least 2 copies right now...
THANK YOU , THANK YOU , THANK YOU , df koon. really. Phil

dfkoon
April 4, 2010, 03:10 PM
Thanks to everyone who has appreciated my input. It was certainly not my intention to take over the thread (I assume the original poster has sold his rifle and moved on). I'll try to put some pics together. Due to the size restrictions, I'll probably upload them to a site that I"ve seen other folks use on different forums. I've looked at the rules and this appears to be acceptable. If not please let me know. In the meantime, the following was sent to me by a friend who knows that I'm looking for an Omega. Just not the caliber that I'm looking for. Good pics though.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=162833056

Also, I am very stongly leaning toward a book. This was Bennett's idea originally. I have alot of material and alot of memories and folks that were around are not getting any younger. I already have some ideas for chapters but would definately welcome additional input. I don't really see it as a big money maker, just another way of setting the record straight and documenting a man that I believe produced some very fine rifles.

btw, my name is Duncan Koon. I also go by dk and my father used to call me Ty (very few do anymore).

rangerruck
April 4, 2010, 09:24 PM
that rifle appears to even have the correct rings/mounts that went with
the rifle; so awesome.

genericusername
April 14, 2010, 12:22 PM
Hi fellas, my first post here, signed up just to respond to this thread and add what little information I have on Omegas to the mix. My Dad (89 yr old Purple Heart Vet, born and raised in Denton,Tx) has an Omega III. I'm printing this thread for him to read.
We seem to have all the paper work except for the factory test target. Dads gun is a left handed .270 Classic model with Claro walnut stock, initial on the grip cap, ser# 568. Never been fired since it left the factory, and it didn't come with mounts, rings, or scope.
The brochure, owners instructions and invoice have Denton, Texas on them. The back of the brochure says "Firearm Development Inc." The invoice indicates the rifle was ordered in March 1971, shipped June 1973. In the space on the invoice that says "Shipped Via" are the typed initials HEK. The total including tax is $413.40.
I'll try to get some pictures of it and the brochure/manual up later and I'll ask my Dad what he remembers about buying it. Great info on these super scarce, beautifully crafted rifles. Thanks especially to "Ty" Koon for contributing his firsthand memories.

armlaw
April 20, 2010, 09:04 PM
Thanks to everyone who has appreciated my input. It was certainly not my intention to take over the thread (I assume the original poster has sold his rifle and moved on). I'll try to put some pics together. Due to the size restrictions, I'll probably upload them to a site that I"ve seen other folks use on different forums. I've looked at the rules and this appears to be acceptable. If not please let me know. In the meantime, the following was sent to me by a friend who knows that I'm looking for an Omega. Just not the caliber that I'm looking for. Good pics though.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=162833056

Also, I am very stongly leaning toward a book. This was Bennett's idea originally. I have alot of material and alot of memories and folks that were around are not getting any younger. I already have some ideas for chapters but would definately welcome additional input. I don't really see it as a big money maker, just another way of setting the record straight and documenting a man that I believe produced some very fine rifles.

btw, my name is Duncan Koon. I also go by dk and my father used to call me Ty (very few do anymore).
Hello DK...

What caliber did you need? I can check my records and see if there may be a match. I have several original full color promotional flyers used for advertising. There is a left hand rifle and one with parkerized finish called "Hunter Finish". My personal rifle is.308 Win. Serial # P35. The interesting Serial # 666 can be located for anyone interested in making an offer. BTW I deal only in gold and silver coin.

armlaw
April 25, 2010, 05:55 PM
Hello DK...

In reading your previous posts I noted you mentioned the presentation location for Omega III Serial #1-#2-#3 and that is not what I remember. My wife and I attended the indoor (barn) Texas Barbecue at Rex Cauble's Quarter Horse Ranch in Denton,Texas. (which I understand was sold 10 or more years ago) I remember the Plate Glass displays on both sides of the entrance to the "barn" which had stainless steel corals for the horses. The beautiful tooled Bridles and saddles adorned with jewelry like silver which were behind the plate glass were remarkable. This is where the "Duke" was presented with the oak leaf and acorn carved stocked Omega III, serial number #1 which had his Brand in a gold insert in lower forearm. A Six millimeter Ruby encircled, in gold graced the right side of the butt stock. Serial #2 was presented to John Connolly, former Governor and Secretary of the Treasury and Serial #3 was presented to Herb Klein, a noted gun writer. After the Barbecue we returned to downtown Dallas where a Reception was held on the 35 floor of the City Club. This was one of the most elegant receptions my wife and I ever attended. The food was just great. I'll never forget the display of hand carved ice in the shape of large scallop shells which had shrimp hanging on the edge of the ice shell. This is where there was a reception line with the "Duke" greeting and chatting with all that attended.
This is a snapshot of my recollection of that great day.

dfkoon
April 25, 2010, 06:52 PM
armlaw, you are 100% correct. The presentation was at the Rex Cauble ranch between Denton and Gainesville. I had thought Cauble actually lost his ranch much longer ago after he was convicted of drug smuggling. I used to drive past it regularly on my way to Gainesville and it went down hill a long time ago. Anyway, I'm very glad the day stands out in your mind.

Carl Kaufman owned the ranch in Menard that Alpha leased. It was actually one of two Menard ranches that I hunted when I was young. The other being the Henderson ranch, Max I think. Sorry for the mix-up.

I don't have a specific caliber that I'm looking for. Just a larger caliber than a 270. I would be happy with any of the magnums. I would like to be able to drop just about any North American game with it. Ever finding time is another story. I have a 284 Alpha that I'll pass down to my son too, so I kind of want the Omega to compliment it.

Your .308 is a very unique rifle. It is a prototype (as indication by the "P"). I don't think the 308 was part of the production run. That is definately a rifle you should hang on to.

DrRDB
May 2, 2010, 11:22 PM
I inherited a beautiful rifle from my grandfather, an Omega lll 25-06 with walnut (Turkish or French ?) stock, original Leupold scope and Conetrol mounts. I even have the original bill of sale and the owners manual!
I am enjoying reading about the history of this gun and the true craftsman behind it.

CuffemNow
May 10, 2010, 12:02 AM
I think the previous post was right and there are probably many still floating around in collections. I have a 338WinMag that I tried to find info on several years ago and didn't have any luck but happened on this thread now. Anybody have an idea on what a "p" prefix means? Also were some rifles marked Firearm Development Corp, Denton Texas? I didn't see any mention of that

Maverick223
May 10, 2010, 08:14 AM
Anybody have an idea on what a "p" prefix means?Look two posts up, it is a prototype. :rolleyes:

JohnBT
May 10, 2010, 10:00 AM
This is a great thread. I missed it the first time around and just now read it all. Thanks to everyone.

John

halogrinder
July 29, 2010, 08:52 PM
i have a friend who has one.

its a presentation rifle with special serial number. it was made in 1970. its chambered in .270. never been shot, never been test fired- in absolutely mint condition, laminated stock and leupold scope. he wants 55k.

contact me if you know a buyer, or are seriously interested.

BigBear2890
August 1, 2010, 10:49 AM
This post is for DK or anyone else who might be interested I have found online a man claiming to be selling a rifle similar to the one described in this thread, he is located in Stephenville here in TX. Heres a link to the rifle.

http://texasguntrader.com/index.php?a=15&b=63754

-Bear

dfkoon
August 3, 2010, 09:02 PM
Bear, Thank you for the lead. I might drive out and take a look.

halogrinder, unless it really is like the one posted in the pic on Dec. 31 (gold enlay with ruby), it's not a presentation rifle and all rifles were test fired at the factory. There were three (3) presentation rifles, two of which are in museums that I know. I would have to look at the caliber that the presentation were in, but I don't think any of them were in a .270 as they took them elk hunting. And yes, I do believe the presentation rifles were all shot on that hunt. I'll look all that up when I have more time... So, your friend probably has a very nice rifle that probably is not worht 55k.

halogrinder
August 3, 2010, 11:28 PM
ill get back with you on more information if your serious, or know someone who is serious about it.

halogrinder
August 4, 2010, 04:05 PM
Ok so more information.... this is rifle S10 with original scope and rings. So it actually hasn't been test fired then, correct?

dfkoon
August 8, 2010, 10:25 AM
halogrinder, I'm sure it is a very nice rifle. I'm not sure why you and your friend believes the rifle has never been fired. I wish your friend luck in selling it. In my opinion, it would not be worth 55K.

rangerruck
August 8, 2010, 06:22 PM
In case anyone is interested; there is a 7mag for sale , that has been used, for sale over on texasguntrader, for 1500bucks, pics are decent. Came from a widow's collection.

Maverick223
August 8, 2010, 06:34 PM
Beautiful rifle, and at a fair price too. I only wish it was a different chambering (non-magnum). Looks like just the rifle for Mr. Koon though. ;)

halogrinder
August 11, 2010, 11:27 PM
Mr Koon,
with all due respect, this rifle is based on what S.P. Fjestad (writer of the Blue Book of Gun Values) stated after looking it over in person and doing some research himself. The rifle was never test fired at the factory (per Homer).

armlaw
October 24, 2010, 09:48 PM
halogrinder, I'm sure it is a very nice rifle. I'm not sure why you and your friend believes the rifle has never been fired. I wish your friend luck in selling it. In my opinion, it would not be worth 55K.
DK...Just wondering if you got my snail mail I sent you a few month ago? I included the original full color brochure that we used at the Sporting Goods Show at McCormick Place in Chicago and the later one that you posted on this site. Price had increased a little. If you had a problem with my scribbling, I do have a typewriter and can list all ten with specs if you are interested? I use the governments calculator to take the selling price in 1970 to what it is today in depreciated FRN's, which I distaste with a passion! Please use this calculator to give you an idea of current value. I will trade for gold & silver eagles, converting to whatever the spot price is at the time of sale.
http://www.bls.gov/data/inflation_calculator.htm
There are eleven Omega III rifles in all including my Pilot model Serial #3X in .308 custom made for me with the short action. I am now at the age whereby my wife would be at a loss to dispose of them if don't come down for breakfast. So, here's looking to hear from ya'all . Armlaw

dfkoon
November 6, 2010, 02:42 PM
Armlaw, yes I did get your snail mail and I'm so sorry for not yet responding. I do keep it in my briefcase. I haven't had a lot of free time the past 6 months due to my working out of town. I'm only home today due to getting back really late last night so I thought I would try to catch up on a few things.

I'm also into archery (at least try) so I enjoyed the article on you though I haven't used a recurve in years (my son and I have compounds).

It looks like you have a very extensive rifle collection. It was only the last two lines of your note that I could not read. Until this post, I hadn't realized that you were selling any from your collection. I'll send you a PM with my email.

My son had a school project this last week in which he had to make a shrine for someone. He picked his grandfather. I thought I would include the poem that he had to write:

The Man With The Plan
By Gunnar Koon

Even though I never really knew you
I know you knew me
So here I sit making a shrine for you
That you can look down and see.

I know you liked to hunt
You liked to sail
Always leading the front,
Never wanting to fail.

An inventor you were,
Things made from Oak, birch and fir.
A big Cowboy fan, always a guy with a plan,
All things that make a great man

As I look up and say,
ďHereís to you granddadĒ.
That maybe we will meet some day
And that sure wonít be bad.

Well, I liked it. dk

DRYHUMOR
November 15, 2010, 06:11 PM
Just saw another good looking Omega 3

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=200687577

Interesting that it only has a 22" barrel(?).

dfkoon
November 15, 2010, 06:31 PM
What a coincidence, I happen to be home and online. 22" and 24" were common. So, not too interesting. Thanks for the post though.

DRYHUMOR
November 16, 2010, 04:40 AM
No problem, I seldom see any Omegas for sale, thought I would share.

Good looking wood on that one. I didn't realize the 22" barrel would have been offered for a 25 06; it would be handy though. Probably handles well.

sjwright
December 8, 2010, 04:24 PM
Thank you all for this information......I have taken my Omega III .300 Win mag to numerous gun shops all of which have been unsure of how to value the weapon.......all of which have marveled at the craftsmanship......DK, your father was a great craftsman and took great pride in his work.....most of the more knowledgeable custom gun makers would keep finding things to wow! themselves with once they started looking closely at the gun.........I received my gun as a present from my father in law from farmerville, LA.....he was an efficianado of firearms and this piece has proven him more knowledgeable.....I do have a question though........why the double safety?......my gun has a safety(blued) on the end of the bolt, and one also on the trigger....the silver grip cap, a jeweled bolt with the square end, the best trigger action I have ever felt, the best blueing I ever seen on any gun, and 514 stamped on the right side of barrel( is that the serial number?) Yes, If you havent already put a book out, I would buy one.....or if anyone has an owners manual, I would buy it.....

SJWright

federalfarmer
December 8, 2010, 06:41 PM
"History of Firearms in America"

That would have been my favorite class in college ... had they offered it!

Great thread.

Slimbo
December 8, 2010, 08:41 PM
beautiful rifles, i wouldnt mind having one in 25-06. :) where abouts in denton was the production located?

my grandparents have a snake charmber, first real gun i ever fired.

dfkoon
December 26, 2010, 03:09 PM
Sorry folks for the delay. End of year is always full.

SJWRIGHT, double safety was for double insurance. It is just another step to prevent an accident. My father was also a gun safety instructor when he was in Gainesville. What was strictly voluntary back then is mandatory now days. I actually intend to get my instructor certification this next year if I can make the time for it. But safety is a frame of mind and it shows in the double safety. If my father were still alive he would also say never leave a rifle loaded unless you were on the hunt. Never put a loaded rifle in a case or in a gun rack. And always treat every rifle as if it were loaded. Growing up, I recall an older boy who died when he pulled a loaded rifle out of a truck gun rack by the muzzle. That was devestating for his family. And it was totally preventable. The bolt safety also had the added benefit of being able to disassemble the bolt without fighting the firing pin spring. The 514 should be the serial number.

Slimbo, I think it was at 211 Austin street. I got that from a magazine article but I also recall it being next to the newspaper. But that was just the temporary location before the production plant in Flower Mound was built. Think there were only 6 employees at that time.

My father called the snake charmer his worst design but by far the most popular gun... I have three myself and got myself into a magazine article as a young boy back then. I was in a gun shop earlier this year looking for some insta-blue to patch up a 22 for my son. Whole other story... but there sat a brand new snake charmer... was being made over seas now a days. Most popular design by far. Night and day difference in quality with any of his rifle designs.

I haven't started a book yet. This year I found myself working out of town. That will continue into next year but hopefully not forever. Hope everyone had a very Merry Christmas and looking forward to a New Year.

sjwright
December 28, 2010, 08:49 AM
Thank you DF......and Happy New Year to all! If anyone has an owners manual for sale, please let me know.....would be very interested in buying one...

SJWright

panhead58ak
February 7, 2011, 03:08 AM
i just purchases an omega 111 off auction arms it is left handed in 300 win mag if DFKOON writes his boook I am very interested in getting one ,please post it on this site.Does any one know how many lefty guns may have been produced?mine is NOT going to be for sale it is now a prized toy!!! Us lefties dont always get own a gun this special

armlaw
March 19, 2011, 08:07 PM
Slimbo...

NIB 25-06 is available.

See Post #58 for Labor Department Calculator to estimate your cost.

FSJeeper
March 19, 2011, 10:27 PM
I remember drooling over these rifles when they came out. This is the most interesting post here in a long time

bsflyfish
March 29, 2011, 11:51 PM
How was your dad involved in Ranger Arms?

How was Dubiel involed in Ranger Arms?

animator
March 30, 2011, 12:26 AM
i have a friend who has one.

its a presentation rifle with special serial number. it was made in 1970. its chambered in .270. never been shot, never been test fired- in absolutely mint condition, laminated stock and leupold scope. he wants 55k.

contact me if you know a buyer, or are seriously interested.
We have the same friend. :)


He has had it for a long time, and it is currently for sale, although he's not been actively pursuing the sale. He's had a few people interested, but no one has ever followed through.


It is still available, and either I, or halogrinder can provide contact info for anyone that is serious about it. If anyone wants any additional information about the rifle, let me know and I give him a call and pass along the request, and follow up in this thread.


This pic is stamped 2005, and was taken prior to at least 2007. The rifle is currently in Texas, and as far as I know, it is in perfect condition. I can see about getting more recent pics and additional information if there is any serious interest.


This is S10:

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm21/animator752/100_4300Small.jpg

halogrinder
March 30, 2011, 11:18 AM
I have current pictures animator, if anyone needs them...... but yes we both know the same friend.

bsflyfish
March 30, 2011, 05:07 PM
Not an Omega III, but here is a presentation rifle from Ranger Arms that mentions Homer Koon in a letter:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=222304529

bsflyfish
March 30, 2011, 05:09 PM
And here is a .30-06 Omega III currently listed on gunbroker.com:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=222475136

bsflyfish
March 30, 2011, 05:10 PM
halo,

Any chance you could post pics for all to see?

halogrinder
March 30, 2011, 06:48 PM
Let me ask before posting.

halogrinder
March 30, 2011, 11:01 PM
got permission to post them via the owner.


a note from the owner of the gun-

"This is number 10 and one of the THREE remaining presentation rifles that Homer Koon made back in 1970. Regardless of what anyone else says, Homer himself told me in 1994 that this rifle was given to his best friend in 1970 for loaning him the money to help get his Omega III project off the ground. #1 and #2 are gold inlaid with a ruby in the stock, no other "S" numbered guns got that treatment. #3 was given to his rancher friend and no one has seen it since it was given to him. [snippet removed to not ruffle any feathers]
This rifle is what it is, number S10 that has special color treatment that the production rifles did not get, red receiver and blue bbl. It does NOT say flower Mound or Denton or Kali on it and Homer told me it was made in the Flower Mound shop and specifically only had Omega III, his name, the serial, and caliber.

How did I arrive at this asking price? S.P. Fjestad, writer of the Blue Book of Guns, looked it over in 1997 and told me that since there are so few of these (plus finding a presentation rifle much less a production in unfired condition) is likely impossible, that this rifle is easily worth $60-65K. That was 1997, wanna take a guess what John Waynes rifle would be worth today? The museum in OKC has it insured for $350K. Is mine worth $55,000? perhaps, but here is the deal, there are no more like it ANYWHERE.


BTW, I am open to offers that include other guns in addition to cash for this one."

Maverick223
March 30, 2011, 11:01 PM
Hmm, I actually like the Ranger Arms rifle a bit better (but I wouldn't turn down either). From the looks of it, it should be quite a bit lighter than the Omega-III.

halogrinder, is the receiver of the Omega-III Al.? I notice that it shows up differently (like anodized Al. often does) due to the camera flash.

:)

halogrinder
March 30, 2011, 11:19 PM
im not sure of that maverick. i was not taking the pictures. if i could get decent lighting and a nice DSLR up there im sure the photos would look different.

Maverick223
March 30, 2011, 11:24 PM
I'm sure they would; that color is indicative of a change in the finish, I am certain that it matches the rest of the rifle reasonably well when viewed in person.

Edit: Just noticed that you changed the referenced post...I suppose it is just a red-colored receiver. Interesting choice.

:)

halogrinder
March 30, 2011, 11:26 PM
if my photo-nut friend is ever in the neighborhood of my Omega friend's..... ill see if he can meet up and snap some pics. i dont think that will be happening any time soon, but hey pigs can fly sometimes :)

Maverick223
March 30, 2011, 11:30 PM
It would be nice to see some HQ photos, but don't go out of your way just to satisfy my curiosity.

:)

halogrinder
March 30, 2011, 11:31 PM
its at LEAST a 8 hour drive for me.

animator
March 30, 2011, 11:47 PM
if my photo-nut friend is ever in the neighborhood of my Omega friend's..... ill see if he can meet up and snap some pics. i dont think that will be happening any time soon, but hey pigs can fly sometimes :)
Next time I'm up his way, I might see about getting some photos of it with the 5D MkII. Might not be until the shoot in April though... hopefully you plan on going.

halogrinder
March 31, 2011, 08:27 AM
im trying! couple of my guns are sick though :(

not that that's anything new lol

dfkoon
April 2, 2011, 12:26 AM
Friends, Iím sorry that Iím not able to be more responsive. I spend a great deal of time out of town these days. And when I am home, I really prefer spending the time with my family. I really do hate my next post on this subject.

bsflyfish, I promise to reply when I have more time and can really devote the effort that Iím sure you would appreciate. I did receive your private message. It might not be this weekend, but I will reply. Homer Koon designed the Ranger action. This was the 1st firearm company that he started. I can and will provide much more information later. It is really its own story and Ranger was also a really good action. That will be a good post.

halogrinder, animator, ltriker, whatever alias you are going by today, the rest of this post is directly for you and/or your group.

For my protection, let me state that I am not interested in purchasing your rifle. I am not interested in negotiating a price for it. I am not trying to dissuade others from purchasing it either. And I am certainly not interested in helping you learn more about it. And I am only interested in protecting the other gun lovers in this great country of ours. I have been honest in every one of my posts. I do not know where one (1) of the THREE (3) presentation rifles is. That does not mean that I do not know what it looks like.

I have tried to be diplomatic. I am not a lawyer (tax paying engineer actually). I believe that profiteering based on a fraud is a crime. False advertising, intentional deceitful selling of an item, fraud, conÖ. Iím sure there is a perfect word that is escaping me at this time, maybe someone else can chime in on the term that I am looking forÖ. [armlaw, you are a judge, what is the crime these guys are perpetuating??] But nonetheless, Iím sure it is a crime. And that is exactly what you or your group is attempting to do.

I have really tried to figure out if you are really this stupid or just really do have the criminal intent that is so apparent to me. You have made many outrageous claims. Many of these were prior to my participating in this thread. All of these false claims would benefit any owner of an Omega. I tried to set those claims straight without seeming to be insulting. I am a bit disappointed in the others that know these claims to be false for not speaking up. But I guess their possessions gain value if your lies are really accepted.

I have pointed out that there are many more than nine (9) of these rifles in circulation. Besides your one (1), Bgrayson has four (4) with knowledge of (3) others. Armlaw has ten (10) (which Iím sure he wonít mind my mentioning are for sale). And there have been several others that have come up for sale since I got involved in this thread. That is just those folks who have been part of this thread. This thread is but a sample of the population. At this time I don not know how many there are. My guess is 700-1000. This is a bit more than your nine (9).

I have informed you that the rifle that you are attempting to pass as one of the THREE (3) presentation Omegas is NOT one of the THREE (3) presentation rifles. I have explained why I know this to be true. I have shown you what the THREE (3) presentation rifles look like. The presentation rifle had gold inlays with a ruby in the stock. Your rifle does not. You found your way around that by noted that the picture of the brochure that I provided only showed two (2) of the THREE (3) together.

Well, I am now providing (or attempting to) a few pictures showing all THREE (3) presentation rifles together and an picture from an article that states those three (3) went to Herb Klein, John Connolly and John Wayne (as I stated earlier). If you pay attention, you will note that all three (3) are inlayed with gold and a ruby just as I described earlier. I would very much like to hear which of those THREE (3) men who received those rifles is the ďrancher friendĒ that your Ďfriendí received this rifle from. Or maybe your ďfriendĒ is this unnamed ďrancher friendĒ. You are soooo mysterious. I really do not know. Nor do I really care unless you rip someone off. I hate to break it to you but Elvis is dead and so are those THREE (3) fine men who were chosen for there own attributes.

http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb465/dfkoon/Omega/OmegaIII002.jpg
http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb465/dfkoon/Omega/OmegaIII003.jpg
http://i1207.photobucket.com/albums/bb465/dfkoon/Omega/OmegaIII001.jpg

I would also like to know why you and he remain anonymous. If Iím selling something I generally tell folks who I am. How many years have you been trying to pass this off as one of the THREE (3) presentation rifles (not really a question). And why your friend chose to remove any markings that would make it one of the three (3) presentation rifles. Gold is of value these days. But to remove it from a presentation rifle in itself should be criminal. Again, not really a question as I know it never had gold inlay.

And by the way, the presentation rifles did not even exist in 1970. And how you get S10 is equal to #3 is beyond my reasoning of math. That must be the new obama math. But nice touch on ď#3 was given to his rancher friend and no one has seen it since it was given to him. [snippet removed to not ruffle any feathers]Ē. THAT certainly adds a mysterious realm to the quest. Except that Iíve already told you who the THREE (3) presentation rifles went to, long before this post. You ruffled my feathers nonetheless. If my father were still able, I can hear exactly what his words would be to your false claims.

Whoever actually owns this rifle ought to be proud that it is a very fine rifle. It was made by Homer Koon. All of the Omegas that have been kept up are very fine rifles. However, I think to try to sell this rifle for 50k+ is insanity, but only criminal due to your false claims. Your rifle has value. However, to claim that it is one (1) of the THREE (3) presentation rifles is outright criminal fraud.

If you ever actually find someone who falls for your ruse, and if asked (I wonít be hiding), I will personally be there at your trial to testify that I did inform you and your group of the fraud that you are perpetuating. Just because you do not use your real name here, does not mean that it can not be determined once you fleece your prey. I may also notify both gunbroker (that is where you like to post) and the attorney general of the state that you post your next ad from.

I really do hope that I am stating my position clear enough for you this time. Though, I do not expect to hear from you and it might be comical to actually hear or read your snippets, I know that you will be hiding in the shadows.

For the record without aliases, I am Duncan F. Koon, 1st born son to Homer E. Koon Jr. My father designed and founded Ranger Arms, Omega Arms, H. Koon Inc. and Alpha Arms (in that order) among others after he served in the US Army and the US Marines. You do not know me. I do not believe you knew him. And he certainly would not have called you a friend. His friends had honor.

Assuming that there will be a next post. I hope it will be about Ranger as bsflyfish had some real questions that the true fans might like to hear about.

Maverick223
April 2, 2011, 01:20 AM
Thank you for your public service announcement and information, Mr. Koon. I too hope this thread stays afloat as it affords a wealth of information about a very nice, but not terribly well known group of rifles. I'd very much like to hear more about the Ranger (here or in another thread) when you have the time, as it too looks to be an interesting specimen.

:)

panhead58ak
April 4, 2011, 03:26 PM
Thank you Mr Koon It may have been uncomfortable to write you last post but rest easy most everyone likes facts over make believe stories.I have no idea how many guns were made my Omega is #962 its left hand in caliber 300 win mag .I woud not imagine mine was the last one made so a thousand or so seems very possible. The gun is so unique and finding information is tough when I can find info it sucks to have to weed out the nonsense I really appreciate your input to this thread and hope someday you can write a book on all your fathers guns. thanks Kelly

armlaw
April 17, 2011, 10:46 PM
Thank you DK.
You are a man of honor.
Have question that might confirm for me my recollections of that great day when my wife and I attended the "Gathering of Eagles". It was great to see the photo of your Dad on the left. It was just they way I remember him.

Can the photos you have be exploded to show the underside of the Dukes fore stock?
Why I ask is, I thought I saw the Dukes "BRAND", that was engraved in a gold insert on the fore stock? I forgot what the BRAND looked like but it surely personalized #1 .
Keep in touch. Armlaw

dfkoon
May 1, 2011, 06:52 PM
Hi all, I took a bit longer break than I thought I would. Iíve got to admit that I let a few folks get under my skin. I am sorry for that. I used to think that I was a bit thicker skinned. Responding to their outrageous claims took precedence over the legitimate questions that are probably more interesting. I probably should have just posted a picture of the presentation rifles and simply asked which of the three (3) was the one that was given to this secret person and that no one has seen forever. But there was a big part of me that just wanted to shut these guys up once and for all. Judging from the lack of response from them, I might have actually been successful.

I am not perfect by any means. When I get a question, I will usually go thru my files and refresh my memory even if I am sure of the answer. I really didnít do that on my last post as I asked a pseudo question that I actually had the answer to. When I asked how you get S10 = #3, I already knew his answer. This was from ďltrikerĒ on a different thread from Gunbroker.com and let me say upfront that it is a complete fabrication of the truth.


ďPerhaps you saw one of these in the Cowboy Museum in OKC, OK? One was given to John Wayne(a special presentation version) and is serial S1(production rifles were 101 and up) or maybe you saw S2 in Huntsville, TX at the prison museum where some artifacts once belonging to Gov John Connelly were displayed. Unfortunately S3-S9 were given to the board of directors of Homers business partner, they turned theirs in to be destroyed, that leaves only ONE presentation model left, S10 is out there somewhere in a private collection. Now, the presentation rifles differed(aside from the serial numbers) from production in that they got special polishing treatment, glossier wood finishing, perfect alignment on every part, and were NEVER test fired.
When you get a chance to see something like this, do you go dig a little to try to find the history? Do you wonder what it is? Do you dream of owning something RARE?Ē

All I can say these days is BUYER BEWARE and what a crock! Like any con, add a bit of fact with a whole lot of fiction and see who you can dupe. Did he try to dig a little to try to find the history? NO. Maybe if my last name was Smith or Jones. But Koon? How hard is it to really track me down? Or anyone from my family for that matter? Ltriker, you should give that rifle to a charity. No one will ever provide you with its history now. And if the government asks me what it is worth, Iíll let them know (at your trial). So think twice about that route too.

So, Iím really hoping that Iíve got these guys out of my system now. And Iím really sorry that I didnít do it with a bit more brevity. I would like to thank the positive responses on this thread, the PMs and the other correspondences.

Bsflyfish has a question and a couple of PMs that I have not responded to due to my above fixation. Instead of using the PM or your email address, I thought I would include the answers in the post. Your questions are not totally different from another reader who had contacted me a while back.

Ranger Arms was the first firearm company that my father started. He designed the Ranger action and was the president of the company. He was not the money behind the company which is probably one reason it eventually failed.

After the war, my father was interested in hunting. My grandfather didnít hunt, but loved to fish. Anyways, my father spent a few years tinkering with modifying existing actions before he decided to create one. According to my mother, he spent a couple of years perfecting the action. From articles that I have there were a couple improvements made after.

I was 9 years old when we left Gainesville. I did now know Joe Dubiel. Another person has told me that he might have been the shop foreman. That would make sense to me. I have asked my aunt to ask my cousins who did work at Ranger but have not ever received an answer as to Dubielís position in the company (if any). If Dubiel was the shop foreman they should remember. And if they do then I will post the answer. Dubiel did not develop the Ranger action. That was my father. I understand that Dubiel did develop his own action many years later and that Dubiel made some fine rifles.

Ranger arms made both actions that were sold to other gun makers (custom by todayís standards) as well as complete rifles. There is a chance that Dubiel was one of those other gun makers.

I am sure the Dubiel that you bought is a very fine rifle.

Van Ellis was the main money behind Ranger. According to my mother, he had married the Morton Potato Chips only child and that is where the money came from. There were other investors that were present prior to Van Ellis. All but one sold out when my father did.

Besides Ranger, Omega, Snake Charmer (K. Koon Inc.) and Alpha, there was only one other firearm company that we were trying to start up when my father died. It was a fully automatic weapon firing plastic ammunition. We hoped to market it to the police and military. There were technical and other issues that prevented us from completing that project. Eventually I folded it because there was not a solid market for it. That was a hard pill for me to swallow.

My father did spend a few years trying to branch out into other areas. Iím sure I eluded to it earlier, it was tough being a gun designer with all of the slip and fall lawyers that we have created. Guns are what my father knew and loved.

I have not yet purchased the rifles that Iím looking for due to various reasons. I am hoping to do so either this year or next. A Ranger will hopefully follow an Omega. However, I have family members who have Rangers.

If you are really interested, I can put you in touch with a couple of people who have Omegaís for sale. Iím not too worried that you might buy the only one out there. I was quite serious when I said there are more than 3.

I think Rangers might be a bit easier only due to the higher number produced. I have an Alpha that my father and I built. And several snake charmers. Those I havenít been looking for, so I canít really state how hard they are to find.

Maverick223
May 1, 2011, 07:07 PM
Thanks for the info, D.F.Koon. I'd very much like to hear more about the Rangers, particularly history, chamberings/variations, and fair market value, when you have the chance. I might be interested in purchasing one (or perhaps even a Omega, if not too costly) in the future.

:)

Coal Dragger
May 1, 2011, 08:47 PM
halogrinder,

Have you considered approaching any firearms museums about selling the rifle? Just curious since $55-$65K is pretty steep for an individual, but an institution might be able to swing it. Someplace like the W.F. Cody Museum in Cody, WY for example.

halogrinder
May 1, 2011, 08:59 PM
'taint my rifle- just a friends. apparently its a subject thats "slightly" touchy. i guess what happened here is what happens when you just relay information.... supose i shouldnt do that any longer.

halogrinder
May 31, 2011, 07:40 PM
odd- it could be because i was on vacation for a few weeks- but i remember there being a post below mine.......

was it erased? i know THR doesnt allow editing/deleting posts after its been up for a few hours......

animator
May 31, 2011, 09:28 PM
Responding to their outrageous claims took precedence over the legitimate questions that are probably more interesting. I probably should have just posted a picture of the presentation rifles and simply asked which of the three (3) was the one that was given to this secret person and that no one has seen forever. But there was a big part of me that just wanted to shut these guys up once and for all. Judging from the lack of response from them, I might have actually been successful.


So, Iím really hoping that Iíve got these guys out of my system now. And Iím really sorry that I didnít do it with a bit more brevity. I would like to thank the positive responses on this thread, the PMs and the other correspondences.






If you're directing this post at either myself, or halogrinder, or anyone else that you could possibly be more specific to--and I can only assume that you are, due to calling us out by name in a previous post--I can assure you that you have not shut anyone up, nor any other claim to internet-toughness regarding myself or others that you may wish to pursue. You have no leg up on me, nor does anything you have to say determine any sort of intellectual superiority to that of myself or anyone you were referring to in your recent posts.


I have done absolutely nothing in this thread or on this forum to deserve the negative, and downright vitriolic attitude that seems to be emanating from your last few posts. I have no dog in this fight. And I could care less what the rifle is, or what it isn't, but judging by what you write, you seem to hold me to a fault by simply knowing someone with a rifle that is for sale. Weather or not that rifle is what it is claimed to be is not for you or I to discuss. That is to be left between the seller and any prospective buyer, and there's not a whole lot you can do about it, aside from speaking negatively about the seller or any people that may know him on a personal level--to which you are quite accomplished.


Rest assured that your lengthy, and borderline arrogant replies have not changed anything regarding myself, or other individuals you wish to call out by name in this thread. Instead, take a moment to comprehend the simple truth that possibly the reason "we" (for the sake of argument) have stopped responding to this thread because "we" really don't have anything else to ad to it, and, speaking personally, have no desire to continue a pompously one-sided conversation that will go nowhere positive.

dfkoon
June 5, 2011, 09:23 PM
Yes halogrinder, there was a post. As it was remained well less than a day, you most likely have an email copy of what it said to know that it existed. That post was either removed by the poster who doesn't appear to be a member or one of the moderators. My bet is the moderator probably deleted the post and canceled the posters account. I received an email with the message. As the subject matter was in regard to this so called ďpresentation rifleĒ that a few of you have tried to sell, I naturally assumed the post was from your group. Maybe there is another explanation. I would have responded to the post, but no sense in responding to something that does not exist.

Animator, besides trying to sell this rifle as an intermediary/agent (see post #72 if you do not recall), exactly which post have you really contributed? And the fact that you "we" really don't have anything else to ad to itis news to whom?

I did consider not including you in those that I ďcalled outĒ but decided that you would probably respond claiming to be a non-involved party. I included halogrinder as he too offered the same service that you did for someone looking to be duped. He also provided posts #49 and #78 of this thread which clearly states the con to which my ďarrogant postĒ (#87) attempted to stop. Iím not too sure why the owner of this rifle that yall are trying to sell can not post on his own. Maybe you two are the fall guys or maybe one or both of you own this rifle.

Those of you that I did ďcall outĒ do not need to pretend that you have no dog in this show. There is probably a finders fee if the actual owner (assuming that you are not he) can unload this rifle at the price that has been listed. BTW (means ďby the wayĒ), I also have a copy of the 2005 ad from gunbroker for this rifle that yall are trying to sell (posted by an ďltrikerĒ). That was a beauty. Too bad yall didnít sell it before I searched the web. But your story is still about the same. Why you must fabricate a story is beyond my understanding. It is a beautiful rifle. I guess you couldnít turn the profit you were looking for.

I do not believe that I have attempted to shut anyone up. I welcome all posts involving my fatherís rifles even the false ones (though I will respond with the truth). My arrogance is based on your perspective. To me, Iím self confident. Iíve only provided proof as to what the actual three presentation rifles look like (S-10 is not one of them) as well as those who received them (not your rancher friend). Pictures are worth a thousand words. Iíve got plenty more.

I welcome you to provide any type of tangible proof that I, the reporters that were present who wrote the many published articles or anyone else that was involved might not have. We know what the Omega III presentation rifles look like. As you should know by now, there were three (3) presentation rifles that were given to John Connolly, John Wayne, and Herb Klein. This should not be in question at this point.

My motivation for posting lies solely in the fact that I am Homer Koonís son. I have 1st hand knowledge. You do not. I am not trying to make any money from my posts. And Iíve already stated that Iím not interested in purchasing this rifle that you are involved with. This is probably the wrong forum/post to try to sell this rifle under false pretense. Folks tend to know the truth when it is presented.

I have plenty to add and will be back. Lord willing.

animator
June 6, 2011, 12:05 AM
But there was a big part of me that just wanted to shut these guys up once and for all. Judging from the lack of response from them, I might have actually been successful.


I do not believe that I have attempted to shut anyone up.


So which is it?


Animator, besides trying to sell this rifle as an intermediary/agent (see post #72 if you do not recall), exactly which post have you really contributed?


I don't feel a personal responsibility to justify my presence on this board, or even in this thread, to you. I'm sorry if you take exception to that, but that's just the way it is.

This thread came up, and there seemed to be an interest in this particular family of rifles among several users, with an interest in seeing photos of these rifles. I responded by mentioning having a friend with one, and included a pic, hoping that people would appreciate seeing one, as there are not many photographs available. I did mention it was for sale, but only because it is.

I can see how you, or anyone, might think that post was a sales pitch, but I can assure you that was not the intention. Just more or less an "oh by the way..." plug for something that someone might be interested in. Those kinds of situations happen all the time, in almost any forum you could possibly visit.

If someone inquired about it, cool, and if not, I don't care either way, because it's of no consequence to me.

I also did not include a price because, quite frankly, I do not know a price, or even what a price should be. Again, it's not for me to decide or to even care about.


I did consider not including you in those that I “called out” but decided that you would probably respond claiming to be a non-involved party.


I certainly feel this is a safe statement to make, as my involvement goes only as far as knowing someone who has one, as well as having access to a picture of it. This should not place me in a negative light.


Those of you that I did “call out” do not need to pretend that you have no dog in this show. There is probably a finders fee if the actual owner (assuming that you are not he) can unload this rifle at the price that has been listed.


Rest assured, there is no "finders fee" for anything mentioned in this thread. Weather or not you believe me is up to you, but I can guarantee that. You need to stop assuming things that simply do not exist.


I welcome you to provide any type of tangible proof that I, the reporters that were present who wrote the many published articles or anyone else that was involved might not have.


I really don't feel I need to prove anything to you, or to anyone, in this respect. Again, there is nothing about this entire subject for me to need to prove. All I've done is mention knowing someone with a rifle, posting a pic, and mentioning it was for sale. Any burden of proof beyond what I have done will need to be determined by anyone else, because my involvement with it stops there. And in reality, my involvement is even less than that, although you seem to refuse to accept this.


My motivation for posting lies solely in the fact that I am Homer Koon’s son. I have 1st hand knowledge. You do not. I am not trying to make any money from my posts.


That's great that you have family ties with this subject, and I can respect that you have first hand knowledge, but please understand that it really does not matter to me, as again, I have no dog in this.

I also sincerely need you to understand and accept that I--and in no way do I mean any disrespect to my friend that owns one--do not give a single [redacted] about the value of the rifle. It could be worth a dollar, or a million, and it makes absolutely no difference to me. My only involvement with this discussion revolves around knowing someone with a rifle. He could sell it or be buried with it, and I don't think it would make a whole hell of a lot of difference to him.

You also need to understand and accept that no one, and definitely not I, is trying to make any money off of anything that I post, and to claim otherwise, would be a foolish move on anyone's part. And that's the way it is.

rbernie
June 6, 2011, 08:28 AM
Gang - let's ease this one back down, ok?

Dryft
June 6, 2011, 08:37 AM
Would you guys be having this same conversation, with this level of anger, if you were in the same room? Please, this was a great thread - can we take the high road on this one?

Maverick223
June 6, 2011, 10:46 AM
Gang - let's ease this one back down, ok?+1, lets not get this one killed. I am very much interested in hearing more about these interesting rifles.

:)

halogrinder
June 6, 2011, 09:58 PM
Koon- listen up. I'm going to keep this short and sweet, based on the moderators post. Your attitude towards me sucks. You act like I'm some piece of garbage. You seem to paint a picture that my motivation of being in this thread is to rip some one off. Let me tell you, I am anything but that. Since you dont know me any better than Adam, you "calling me out" doesnt sit well with me. AT ALL.

Let me give you some solid facts, so you can understand that my integrity and actual intent in this thread was genuine:

I do not get a spiff, kick back, "finders fee" or any other BS (means "bologna sandwich" since we like to explain simple internet abbreviations) you seem to think I get.

I do not have any financial interest, part ownership or anything of the sort regarding S10.

I have a friend who owns it, who in my opinion personally is one of those "salt of the earth" types of people. He will help anyone on dang near anything. All I did was relay his information.

Dryft, I am not angry at all, nor am I upset. I'm more aggrivated about being called a lier, cheat, con artist and other things when I am nothing of the sort.

On another note Koon, no I didnt get an email with that post, I dont have that option enabled. i regularly surf THR on a semi daily basis and saw the post was bumped.

Since your dad seemed to be a so-so book/record keeper based on the limited information that I have actually looked around for on the internet, it seems that we have to believe you as gospel when it comes to your fathers business.
let me ask you a question: how old were you when all this happened? im being serious.

Admittedly, I have been around my fathers business my entire young life. From about 6 weeks old (strapped to a chimney while my dad worked on a roof) till I was about 18...... every single summer and almost every weekend I worked for my father doing construction work....... now that I am an adult and have my own career working on BMW's, I could'nt tell you much about how to build a house.

I would love to hear more about the numbers, manufacturing and history of your Fathers guns, but will not participate in a thread that involves personal attacks and slander towards others when it isnt called for.

~halogrinder

fishermen0105
June 8, 2011, 10:53 PM
I would love to hear more about the rifles made by Ranger Arms. I've been looking for one of these for several years now. There seems to be do little information floating around. Would love to see a book on the history of all of this as well.

Maverick223
June 9, 2011, 06:46 PM
I would love to hear more about the rifles made by Ranger Arms. I've been looking for one of these for several years now. There seems to be do little information floating around. Would love to see a book on the history of all of this as well.+1 on both accounts.

:)

dfkoon
June 11, 2011, 06:55 PM
I want to start out by apologizing to the forum members who had enjoyed this thread for my part in this tone that has developed in the thread. I probably should not have called anyone out by name. I should just have referred to their posts as potentially dishonest that could lead to the sale of a rifle under deceitful and fraudulent means.

I recall driving back from a hunt a couple years ago thinking I should track down and buy at least one of every rifle that my father designed and made. These rifles that I would acquire would hopefully be passed down in my family from generation to generationÖ lots of time to think when you are on the road. This wasnít the 1st time Iíd had this thought and Iíve had other ideas such as I might make and name the design that never got made (I have the plans). Or I might even remake one of my fatherís designs. I might even improve on it if that could be. Until this thread, I donít really remember ever thinking about a book.

My father sold his Ranger rifle (it was a presentation complete with the engraving and inlays Ė very nice gun). Iím not sure of the circumstance, but Iím sure that we needed the money. He sold his Omega to help pay for my sisterís college. It was a beautiful rifle on its own as all Omegas are. He had hunted with it and Iím sure the person who bought it did so as much for the fact that it was my fatherís rifle as any other reason. My fatherís Alpha was stolen after his death. I have my Alpha that I built with my father prior to my college days at Texas A&M. Snake CharmersÖ got plenty. Did you know those are still made? Now in Turkey. The worst design of all was the most successful.

So I decided during that drive that I would 1st track down and buy an Omega. After all, Iím not getting any younger. I did a search on the web. I found a whole lot of disinformation out there including this thread. There was one person who went by ltriker that had tried to sell S-10 on Gunbroker on 9/15/2005 for a really high amount. Curiously this rifle he was selling was ďnot hisĒ. His ad used a lot of the same claims that exists in Post #78. The story at that time was that there were 10 presentation riflesÖ the others were given to the board of directors who turned them in to be destroyed. According to this person, the presentation rifles were unique in that the ďthey got special polishing treatment, glossier wood finishing, perfect alignment on every part, and were NEVER test firedď. Remember the test fired questions? There were also only 9 production rifles left. Why, how on earth would I possibly find one with only nine Omega IIIís in existence? I must have been just plum out of my mind. :banghead:

This auction had long expired by the time I read it, thus I did not have an opportunity to contribute any to the dialog. Fortunately other posters didnít believe the story eitherÖ and needless to say, S-10 did not sell. After a certain poster on this thread, I did go back out and find it so that I would have a record of it. Last time I looked I couldnít find it.

There was also this thread on The High RoadÖ it had started in late January 2009 and was still going almost a year later. The facts were just all wrong. This was most likely not intentional, but due to few folks with knowledge of Omega and this forum. They found what they could on the webÖ which itself probably originated by that 2005 post in Gunbroker. It is funny how everything on the web is supposed to be the truth. Heck, I just read on this thread that my father must have been really bad at record keeping because it is not on the internet. Yea, I remember getting on the web quite a bit back in the 70s, on my laptop with my wireless wifiÖ I even remember that guy that invented the webÖ his name was Al Gore wasnít it? :) And they said back then that if you donít put your information on the internet then how will we know it is true? Well my 1st post on this thread was #27 in late December. My sole intention was simply to correct a few facts. Maybe even locate an Omega. I guess this internet information didnít really dissuade me after all from finding one of the elusive nine that were left.

I did find it amazing that there was this interest out there about my father and his guns. And that this post was still active almost a year after it started. It had been a very long time since anyone contacted me about one of my dadís guns. I had helped several folks who had contacted me. I canít recall if any of them were about Omega. Youíve got to really wonder just how much effort some of these guys put in to really find out the true information. I guess they didnít really need to. After all according to them, Homer told them.

For a while it seemed like folks here liked my posts as much as I liked writing about my father. In my eyes, I was very fortunate to have the father I had. I was also so fortunate to grow up with guns and hunting. I rebuilt my 1st rifle when I was 12. It was an old ďRangerĒ 22 long rifle for those who really have a memory. Not the same as my fatherís Rangers. By the time I started college, I knew how to work most any machinery from a mill to a lathe. And I knew guns. My future in the industry was just about preordained. That was the plan long before I was 18 years old. So you see, not only do I like talking about my father, I like talking about guns and I was paying a little bit of attention while I was growing up.

So, it was 4/1/2010 when ltriker posted with #35. Funny, I just now got the irony of the date Ė I should have known it was a joke. I knew it was probably the same guy that had placed that 2005 ad. At this time, I did not know if he just had bad information or really bad intentions. I responded to the claims in what I thought was a very nice way. I had actually already provided information that was in direct contradiction to his claims. I had even posted the pic of what the presentation rifles looked like. I guess he didnít appreciate the information I provide because he never posted again.

Then post #49 claims a presentation rifle for sale for the bargain price of 55k. More S-10 for sale on posts #52, #57 #72, #73, #77, #78, #80, #82, #84, #85, & #86. They had a really good buzz going on the thread that I had already provided the truth according to dk. My father was quoted in #57 as the rifle never being fired. We now know that the posters have no interest in this gun what so ever, but my father did tell at least one of these posters that this rifle that the poster did not own had never been fired. I often search out the manufacturer of firearms that I do not own and ask silly questions about someone elseís gun. :D

And no one is trying to sell this gun; they are just really interested in this thread. According to them, they only mentioned that it was for sale and to contact them if you are interested. And no one is the owner of this gun that is for sale. But letís repeat this over and over while clicking our ruby red slippers, S-1, S-2, S-10Ö S-1, S-2, S-10Ö and throw in a couple of Homer told meís. And wa la, we have a new truth all courtesy of the internet. :eek:

It was really #78 that was my tipping point. I was probably really tired. Last year I was pretty busy. This guy or guys have said
1. S-10 is the 3rd presentation rifle
2. Only S-1 and S-2 got the gold and ruby treatment.
3. #3 which is S-10 was given to the rancher friend and no one had seen it sinceÖ
4. every other one was cut up into pieces.
5. there was a design flaw.
6. my father felt betrayed and his hopes of owning a manufacturing plant were ruined due to some accident in 1970 with a hand gun that my father did not design or make.
7. And they say that Homer Koon told them all this like they knew my father.
8. ďRegardless of what anyone else saysĒ

Obviously they think they know more than I do. I think even when I posted S-1, S-2 and S-3 all in the same picture they still didnít get it. I say a picture is worth a thousand words. The picture shows all of three of the presentation rifles with the gold and ruby treatment (S-1, S-2 and S-3). Notice what it doesnít show, S-10. As a matter of fact, there is not a single article written about S-10. And there are a lot of articles written about Omega III.

Now they say
1. Who is this dfkoon, what makes you the authority?
2. Why should I believe you?
3. I was only relaying information.
4. Whether this S-10 is or isnít isnít for you to decide.
5. How Ďdare you call me out?
6. How dare you make this personal?
7. No, S-3 doesnít exist. S-10 exists.
8. S-10 is the 3rd gun and itís for sale.
9. My friend has it.
10. You have no knowledge.
11. You were too young.
12. Iím not part of a con and you need to understand this.

Not once has any of these guys said, hey, maybe we donít know what we are talking about. And maybe, our ďsalt of the earth friendĒ doesnít know what he is talking about either. And gee, I can see how it looks like we are part of a con. Why is my friend relaying his posts thru me anyway?

The post most of yall didnít see was from a guy who said Mr. Riker is the owner of S-10 and this new poster wants to buy it. He goes on to say that no one knows what it is worth cause there are no records. The post did exist and it did disappear. I thought that quite odd. I did hope this guy would buy this rifle or pretend to and that no one ever asks about it again.

See the new twist? There are no records. Why do these guys think that there are no records? Just because they donít have them, they donít exist. Oh thatís right, cause itís not on the internet. If itís not on the internet then it doesnít exist. I know this next bit of information will totally astound everybody. Omega Arms didnít even have a computer. I know it is hard to believe that a company could exist without a computer. But before you draw that inevitable conclusion that Omega Arms didnít have a computer therefore there were no records. Remember some of the prehistoric companies used this technology called typewriters, paper and carbon paper. Mind boggling isnít it? Before we had the internet, we had newspapers. :uhoh:

Most likely S-10 is going to remain for sale for 55K. The story behind it will continue to change as it already has. And the truth most likely will not be part of that story. I do not fault anyone for buying and selling rifles and making a profit along the way. I donít think my father would fault them either. He made a living from his guns. So some guy got this rifle from a widow for a bargain. I think everyone reading this post would have bought it from that widow if they couldíve. Some of us might have insisted on a fair price for the widowÖ and maybe this guy did. I donít know what he paidÖ I donít think I would trust it if I heard it.

I just donít like the lies that have been told in trying to sell this rifle. I do not know what else to call it either. It is not a misunderstanding. There is absolutely no possible way that my father ever said some of the things these guys say he said. Isnít it always convenient when someone quotes someone who is dead? I havenít even mentioned what I know about S.P. Fjestad. The story changes as bits of truth are presented. Therefore, it canít even be said that it is an unintentional lie. The lies behind S-10 are my entire objection. ďI will not lie, cheat or steal or tolerate those who doĒ was a code from the corps (A & M). I have tried to live my adult life by that code. Obviously, I didnít tolerate some of these guys very well. Sometimes I just cut through all of the political niceties and call a spade a spade.

Then the real kicker; S-10 is not even that unique. It doesnít have the unique stock they originally claimed. I can provide plenty of pictures of production guns with equal or better stocks. Special polishing? Really? The receiver is kind of redish is what is unique. Rust is kind of redish too. Though I wonít claim that is rust. But we are to believe that a redish receiver (not that I think it looks good), is worth and extra $55000 Ė $400 (new) = $54600. See the reason for the lies? I wonít put a value to it, but if it were offered to me for $2000, I would turn it down.

Start with a beautiful rifle that was made a long time ago. Make sure most of the folks who know about this rifle are dead. Build up a story around it as to how unique it is. Shoot for the moon when you put a value on it Ė after all it is one of a kind. The bigger the price, the more the story must be true. When you tell folks about it make sure that you say that you donít own it, but you know someone who does and you can help. That sounds like the ultimate con to me. The owner, he didnít tell a story. The ďfriendsĒ, they were just doing a favor. It doesnít even have to be a gun for a con like that to work. At the end of the day, everyone can deny their part. And on the internet, everyone thinks they are anonymous. I do believe that if these guys sell S-10 under false pretenses as they have tried (at least twice) that we will all meet in a room one day. And thereís likely to be this guy wearing a robe and holding a gavel. These guys most likely wonít like what he says either. For you see, there will be someone who spent a lot of money for this gun based on a lie. He will show it to his friends who will tell him of this person that actually knew Homer Koon and actually knows a thing or two about the Omega III. Stories will be swapped. And then this person who spent his hard earned 55k for this gun will have the worst feeling in his gut for he will know at that point that he fell for a con. Those who told the story, they will be called coconspirators. They are not quite as anonymous as they might think. They will end up testifying against their friend who makes the sale and the person with the gavel, who has to sit in judgment, will have to figure it all out. We the taxpayers will have to foot the bill. :fire:

Ok, so I think that is about it on that subject for me. I only mentioned one name this time as that was the original name, and I couldnít tell the story very well without it. I should also restate that in that 2005 ad, he didnít own the gun either. He too may be just ďa friendĒ. The only post that Iíve seen that states he is the owner is that post that disappeared. The other guysÖ you decide your level of participation in all of this. If you believe in your heart that you did not participate in any type of deception, then hold your head up high. Continue on as you have before, keep your dear friend and help him sell his rifle. Either way you do not need to let me know.

I do apologize to this forum for previously losing my cool. Iím not sure how many of you there are. Is there 10 or 100 or more folks that follow this thread? I couldíve probably accomplished the same result with ridicule and humor. I think Iím too close to the subject matter. While I wasnít looking for a fight, Iím not the type to back down either. I havenít liked my last few posts. Iím not sure that I like this one either. This was supposed to be about my fatherís guns; not about me. Notice how most of my posts are rather long? I hope that was ok. I might just have enough words in me to make a book happen.

I think this will be my last post for a while. I know a couple of folks will be thankful for that. I also know a couple of folks would like to hear more about Ranger and I can see now that I did not answer all of the questions. I think focusing my effort on a book would be better use of my time. Maybe Iíll post parts as I complete them. I hope the name calling doesnít continue, but if it does I do not think I will participate. I think I have accomplished what I originally intended. I presented the truth to the best of my ability.

I would also hate to see this post removed. When you do a search on the internet this thread pops up. Iíd certainly like the truth to remain for as long as possible. And Iím sure the forum has gotten at least a couple new members as a result.

I reread most of the thread in deciding how this post would go. A couple more things Iíd like to address.
1. I should not have posted that poem. Iím proud of my son, but yall could care less. In retrospect, it looks egotistical.
2. I called the P models as prototypes. My father called them pilot models. Itís the same thing Ė just different terminology. Not all of the pilot models were destroyed either. Most were not.
3. Armlaw, I either missed or forgot when you asked about the picture. I am going to digitize the pictures and articles that I have. Iíll drop you a dvd of it.
4. rbernie or other moderator, I am curious of the post that disappeared. I would like to know if a moderator removed it and why. It was obviously part of the sell job.
5. I am going to edit a couple of my posts. There are some misspelled words. What kind of writer am I?

I am about to acquire my Omega III. I was so fortunate to find one of the only 9 that still exist. :rolleyes: The next rifle I intend to acquire will be a Ranger. Luckily no one has told me that those were also destroyed. So if you come across some for sale. Drop me a line. Ideally, Iíd buy back my fatherísÖ I think last time it sold it was for ~17K. It is a real presentation model and probably worth it. I just donít know that I would want to pay that much and Iím sure the price will have increased. I think I could make one every bit as nice for a lot less.

The book idea has gone from 50% to more like 99.9% probability. Iím actually getting kind of excited about it. There are a couple of folks that have expressed wanting to help. The digitization of the articles and pictures is just the 1st step. I like gun books to have lots of pictures. I thought it would be a mix between technical facts about the guns to the story behind each company as well as stories about my father. I would love to name as many names as I can of folks who were involved. So if you know someone who knows someone, let them know that the project is in work. They might want to contribute.

I think this thread is going to make a great chapter in the book. It is definitely the inspiration. Maybe it will be the final chapter or maybe the 1st. Starting is the toughest part. 14 years after my fatherís death might be the way to start. I was thinking working in ďthe high roadĒ into the chapterís name. Iím sure Iíd probably have to get the siteís permission. What do you think? Or maybe Iíll call it the riker factor. That has a nice symbolic ring to it.

I just provided my gun club with a story about my fatherís elk hunt with John Connolly and Herb Klein. I had previously donated the elk. There will be some stories like that too. This book might not make it to a bookstore or a best sellers listÖ and it might only be electronic. Heck, I might be the only one who buys a copy. I wonít get rich doing it so Iíll definitely be keeping my day job. If you have specific ideas or things youíd like to read about, drop me a line. PM or add it to the thread. I do get emails when someone posts to this thread or sends a PM.

I encourage everyone to re-read the entire thread. It is amazing how this thread started, developed and ended. As Iíve said, people tend to know the truth when it is presented. Talk it up. Keep it going. Heck, maybe Iím the one living in la la land. You decide. God Bless, even those that Iíve offended.

Maverick223
June 11, 2011, 10:51 PM
Is there 10 or 100 or more folks that follow this thread?Can't speak for anyone but myself, but I have read it from day one, and it is one of the few threads (very few, perhaps the only one that I didn't create myself) of which I retain a perennial subscription.

Anyway, I'll try to keep my post brief for the poor fellers that read your big ole wall of text (I read every character and am rather proud of myself for it) :neener:. My first thought is that I would love to hear more, particularly about the Rangers, as I may very well be interested in one, or perhaps an Omega III, but I like to educate myself on most any rifle prior to making a purchase and I don't know a great deal about either (fair warning, I haven't $55k to spend on one). Whether I buy one or not, or you decide to post more here in this thread, I am interested in the book...so now you know to print at least two copies (I like books, but I don't have $55k for that either ;)). If you decide to write the book (and it seems that you are intent on doing just that), I am a pretty fair writer, and wouldn't mind helping you edit, time permitting (feel free to PM me if you'd like).

Now lets start a new chapter and leave the negativity behind. :)

rbernie
June 11, 2011, 11:16 PM
rbernie or other moderator, I am curious of the post that disappeared. I would like to know if a moderator removed it and why. It was obviously part of the sell job. No posts have been removed from this thread - the supposition by halogrinder that a post was missing was made in error.

halogrinder
June 12, 2011, 06:29 PM
mod- im POSITIVE there was a post that was there and then removed.... i mean koon and i arnt the only ones who saw it, right?

Maverick223
June 12, 2011, 07:32 PM
A while back some data was lost (about 1 complete days worth, including new memberships and PMs) while moving to a new server...this might be the origin of the confusion.

:)

Les Brooks
August 28, 2011, 10:22 AM
Is this thread still open? I have first hand information on the Omega III and the Ranger rifles. I found this site a few nights ago looking for the site where we made the rifles using Google Earth fly over.

The S10 rifle is not one of the high grade presentation rifles. The plain S10 color on the reciever was due to the alloy used in investment casting of the first few recievers. The first three rifle actions were machined from either 4140 or 4340 bar stock. You may find a few rifles with the gloss of black chrome plate finish. Many changes were made in the manufacturing process to find the best combinations.

I hope to clear up some of the information on this rifle.

Les Brooks, gunsmith working with Homer Koon from 1966

Maverick223
August 28, 2011, 02:13 PM
Les, this thread is certainly still open. I don't know about the other folks subscribed to it, but I personally would love to hear more about Koon's creations, particularly the Ranger. Thank you for chiming in, and I hope you find the time to tell us more.

:)

Les Brooks
August 28, 2011, 03:33 PM
Maverick223 and Others,

I have been in contact with one other person that I know worked on both the Ranger and Omega rifles. We are trying to write up an outline of events in making the actions. This all started in 1966 when Homer came to me with his first project action. I barrelled the first one and a few more before the plant was built in Gainesville, Tx. He hired me to move to Gainesville and be his first head gunsmith at the plant. I didn't do the machining of the parts. He had a shop foreman head up about 6 machinist. I made the final assemble and checked for the tolerances working with the actions. If you want to see the patents go to Google Patents and search under Homer Koon rifle actions.

This was a long time ago and trying to remember events comes back slowly. I hope to get with the Duncan Koon and help with the writing of his book with facts that I only know. I think he was about 4 or 5 yrs old when we made the first guns. I am still waiting to hear from him.

I have been open with my name and don't hide behind any posts. I wish others would do the same.

Les

Fathom
January 30, 2012, 05:11 PM
Hi, I am also looking to see the value of an Omega III 7mm rifle that someone is offering to sell us. After reading most of the older posts, it seems to be a legit rifle except for an unusual serial # starting with DMX **? could it be a prototype? the rifle has never been fired and is in pristine condtion. Anyone have any more info on this it would be much appreciated.

sdafft
February 10, 2012, 08:08 PM
Great thread. Im looking for info on the alpha I. Whats the difference between the alpha and alpha I. My father bought this alpha I in the 80s and it is the finest shooting rifle ive ever shot. Its has been used alot for many years, and would like to find as much info as I can get. I would never sell or trade it in fact I would like to purchase others.

DRYHUMOR
February 10, 2012, 09:06 PM
Haven't been on this thread for awhile... looks like I missed something. No worries though, I'm caught up now. ;)

I did happen upon an old sale ad for a Ranger Arms, nice rifle judging by the photo. Shame the guy only put one photo up.

http://www.gunsamerica.com/924038519/Guns-For-Sale/Gun-Auctions/Rifles/R-Misc-Rifles/RANGER_ARMS_JJ_17_23.htm

Poking around and found another one....

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=272837322

Though that one is in a different league.

Col. Plink
March 8, 2012, 07:39 PM
Hey y'all!

I got a gander at a buddy's 7mmRemMag last night and decided to try to learn a bit more about it and VOILA!:eek:

Wow! To have uncovered such a rewarding thread about something I've actually seen and knew had to have a good backstory is fantatstic.

So my buddy's is an Omega III, jeweled bolt, square bolt face, did not get any other markings off of it. It is a gem, to be sure. He says he's taken some deer with it, should I tell him not to for value's sake?

So here's to the reopening of a great thread and another positive ID of an Omega III in 7mmRemMag!

Maverick223
March 8, 2012, 09:06 PM
He says he's taken some deer with it, should I tell him not to for value's sake?Not an expert (really just a spectator), but in my opinion, absolutely not. It's not highly engraved (artwork), outstandingly valuable, nor historically significant (not to detract from a very nice rifle); the rifle in question, like most others, was designed to be used...as long as it's not abused, I'd let it be. In my experience a good rifle with a few character marks from use in the field brings more joy than one that sits in a glass cabinet never to be touched. In other words, I'll not chastise someone for a differing opinion of their own guns, but mine are to be used (in one way or another)...and if I pick one up, that's just what I'll do.

:)

Roger_Roger
April 5, 2012, 11:29 AM
Omega III in 25-06

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z69/J_R_not_Ewing/100_6556.jpg

Maverick223
April 6, 2012, 10:42 AM
Welcome to THR, Roger_Roger! That is a beautiful example of an Omega, want to tell us a bit about it?

:)

armlaw
August 23, 2012, 07:48 PM
beautiful rifles, i wouldnt mind having one in 25-06. :) where abouts in denton was the production located?

my grandparents have a snake charmber, first real gun i ever fired.
Slimbo....Use the calculator on Post #58 to convert the 1970 price of $600 into today's depreciated FRN's
If you are still interested in a 25-06 at current FRN price, let me know. Armlaw

GSSP
November 9, 2012, 07:13 PM
I am selling by best friends deceased father's Omega III (Mound Flower) for him and am hoping to contact Mr. Koon for more info. I've sent a PM but no response within this past week. Any one know another way to contact him?

Thanks,

Alan

Maverick223
November 9, 2012, 07:22 PM
Welcome to THR.org, Alan.

No idea the best way to contact him, but he has made his identity clear so you can probably track him down with a little searching on the internet (social networking, et al).

I would recommend that you (or your friend) post an offer to sell in the Buy, Sell, & Trade forum here on THR, you might just find a buyer, and you won't have to pay a service charge for listing it like GunBroker or GunsAmerica. Best of luck...

:)

GSSP
November 9, 2012, 08:38 PM
Maverick,

Thanks for the reply. Would you good folks mind if I post some pics here? You might be able to help me decide what to ask for it.

Alan

Abel
November 9, 2012, 08:47 PM
We all love pics of rifles! Go for it!

Roger_Roger
November 9, 2012, 09:26 PM
I bought mine at the Dallas Gun Show many moon's ago, would buy another on a full moon.

GSSP
November 9, 2012, 09:28 PM
Let's see what damage I can do. This is a Flower Mounds rifle in 300 WM. The owner used to own two different wholesale firearm companies in Calif.; M&N Distributors and Excel International. He used to be an executive for Hi-Sheer. He passed three years back and his spouse asked the son, my best friend, to sell the gun collection; about 31 guns in all. This rifle is VERY clean with a unique European style checkered stock. Try as I might, I cannot find a serial #. Any help locating it would be most appreciated.

Alan

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-19-45_733.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-20-12_646.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-21-10_926.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-22-01_58.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-22-19_155.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-21-45_737.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-23-32_549.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-24-10_667.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-26-05_50.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-29-29_794.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-02_06-30-04_977.jpg

Maverick223
November 9, 2012, 10:28 PM
We all love pics of rifles! Go for it!+1, photos are always welcome. BTW, that's a beautiful rifle your buddy has.

:)

panhead58ak
November 10, 2012, 12:43 PM
NICE rifle!! I have a left handed omega3 and the serial#is stamped on the right side of the reciever it is also engraved on the bolt in the recess on the bottom. If you are looking for scope rings the only ones I could find were controll they arent cheap but they are very nice and still available kelly

GSSP
November 11, 2012, 10:14 PM
Without removing the stock, which I don't care to try, the ONLY # I can find on this rifle is in the recess on the bottom of the bolt body. There is a "CA" and a "5". If I truly have #5 Omega III from Flower Mound, I would dare say it's a great find.

Alan

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c129/GSSP/DANs/2012-11-09_21-01-49_758.jpg

Maverick223
November 11, 2012, 11:23 PM
Just a hypothesis, but the "5" is probably the last digit of the serial (to insure that the bolt matches the rifle). The "CA" is likely an identifier/proof-mark from the inspector.

:)

GSSP
November 12, 2012, 12:35 AM
LOL. Well, then where do you think the rifle's serial # is?

Alan

Maverick223
November 12, 2012, 02:16 PM
LOL. Well, then where do you think the rifle's serial # is?No idea, and my hypothesis is just that. Perhaps someone with more intimate knowledge of the rifle in question will be able to answer both.

:)

panhead58ak
November 12, 2012, 02:18 PM
pulled the bolt on my omege its marked LM### which is my serial number so maybe you have #5 cool !! the stocks come off pretty easy if you want to check more and if memory serves me correct mine had the serial # in the inletting of the forarm also kelly

Jim1958
November 15, 2012, 11:40 PM
I have a preproduction model, P8. It was my dad's. He was a sales rep for the company in the 70's when they were first starting. Really nice zebra stock. gorgeous gun. The gun has been in storage til last weekend when it was used by my son to shoot his first deer. We got tired of having it as a collector. Decided to use it. No idea what it's worth. But it's earning its keep now. My dad died years ago, so I can't get the history. But curious now. Thanks for all the posts.

dfkoon
November 16, 2012, 07:07 PM
Greetings all,

I spoke with Alan (GSSP) the other night and said that I would post a bit of what I know in case it helps him. I believe that he is in possession of production #5 from the description he gave me. The Omega III is a "take-down rifle". That is one of the unique features of the Omega III. It was designed to be taken apart and re-assembled without needing to be re-sighted. Verifying the receiver is also marked with a "5" should not be difficult.

What makes this rifle unique besides the low S/N is the checkered stock. The stock pattern is very similar to the presentation (those 3 that are really unique) with some obvious exceptions. I think the odds are high that my father did the checkering. I can not verify this so Iím not sure how much that statement is worth. However, there are a couple of reasons that I believe this to be true: 1) the low serial number with checkered stock (most production rifles did not have a checkered stock Ė though this is probably not the only one), 2) the pattern relative to the presentation (compare the pictures) but most of all 3) this rifle was owned by a Hi-Shear executive, the same company that bought Omega III. My father would have provided this person with an exceptional rifle (more so than already).

What I may or may not have mentioned is that the pistol grip cap was custom with the initial of the customers choice. This shows up very well in one of Alanís pictures. That works out great if the initial of the original owner is of significance to you. Another option for this was an Omega III symbol. My rifle (#900 that I got from a very good friend, in case there are still some folks that really think there are only 10 out there) has this symbol which works out great for me as I am not the original owner (in case you havenít followed all of this thread). One of these days I'll try to post more pics.

Regarding value --- as I've said previously and I will stick to this --- the rifle is worth exactly what someone is willing to pay for it. I have a figure in my mind that may or may not be what someone else would be willing to pay or sell for. There is only one person out there that has been totally insane in the value of their rifle and I don't think I need to mention him. He still tries, though no longer spreading the obvious lies. I would put the value of this rifle above the value of that one.

I wish Alan the best of luck finding the new owner for this rifle.


Jim (Jim1958), P8 is a very fine gun and I hope you are able to pass it down to your son. I think the prototypes are unique because they are. It is very likely that your rifle has a feature that the production rifles do not. Iíve always had difficulty parting with my rifles and still have the majority of them including my 1st deer rifle (Iíve promised to let Bennettís daughter use it for her 1st hunt as it was also his 1st deer rifle - our families were once very close).

These rifles were made to be used so why let them rust in some cabinet. Take care of them, but use them for what they were made for. I will hunt with any one of my rifles.

Well, I can see once again that Iím still not short winded. I hope everyone enjoys good hunting this year. Take care, dk

Maverick223
November 16, 2012, 08:57 PM
Thanks for the update and information, Mr. Koon. One quick question, though...any idea on the significance of the two initials on the bolt (is it a inspector's mark)?

:)

panhead58ak
November 17, 2012, 04:58 PM
Glad to see your input back on this site it is fantastic to have insider knowlege!I am hoping you are still going to write a book on your fathers guns please let this site know if you do I am very interested.Also do you have any idea how many of the omega3s were left handed 20%,50%?Was the silver grip cap an option as mine has a very nice wood one thanks kelly

bsflyfish
November 22, 2012, 10:48 AM
Gssp. Please email me at bsflyfish1@yahoo.com

Thanks

w reid
December 4, 2012, 09:25 PM
Mr. Koon ,my father was Hershel Reid .The Flower Mound plant was built on my grandfather Ray Spinks land . I was at the ribbon cutting but unfortunately I was only a few months old. I had 3 rifles 2 25-06 and 1 7mm . I gave 1 25-06 to my brothjer who has a few he purchased from a couple stockholders around Denton. The other 2 I had were stolen from my house. The theives will never fire them though because I had the bolts removed . I had a full collection of black and white pics from the opening night .

dfkoon
January 1, 2013, 09:59 AM
Maveric, I think it is the gunsmiths initials.

Panhead, don't know exactly how many left hands were made right now. My guess is more than the 3 I just read a minute ago. The Japeto guy who sold the rifle to you obviously didn't know squat about much. My father never worked in the space industry (I do). And most of the other misinformation I've already tried to debunk. But I think you got a good deal. The silver cap could be customized with initials (customers choice). Another option was an Omega symbol (which would be my choice). That's what is on my Omega.

Mr. Reid, I would love to get with you sometime. Life has just had me really busy lately.

panhead58ak
January 1, 2013, 03:29 PM
Thank you dfkoon, getting true info on these fantastic rifles is adventure to so the least.The spin on facts is tremendous I wish people could say I dont know instead of making stuff up!I for one am looking forward to you hopefully writing a book on your fathers guns(all of them)i Think it would be a valuable resource and possibly put an end to the nonsense.

kelly

cowboyboogie
February 5, 2013, 11:59 AM
I am so glad to find information on these fine rifles. Most folks do not even know what an Omega III is much less have any information about them. I happen to own serial # P-1, which I have never fired. My father purchased it from Homer Koon himself around 1991. My Dad was a fan of the Omega III and at one time owned 31 rifles in various calibers and stock configurations.

I also have what Mr. Koon told me was the "last" Omega III as it is just a barreled action that was pulled from assembly for being stamped incorrectly as a .25-60 caliber. It is unfired as per Mr. Koon and will remain so as long as I own it.

These rifles are tack drivers. I have used my .270 Win to take almost everything that Texas has to offer in the way of big game. I rebarreled a .338 Win Mag that I purchased in 1992 to become a .257 Weatherby Mag so that I would have a fantastic pronghorn rifle and it performs better than I could have ever hoped. It's also fun to go on a hunt, pull this gun out and watch peoples expressions as they try to figure out just what the heck I am shooting!

If you ever get the chance to own one of these firearms, I do not see how you could be disappointed.

Col. Plink
February 7, 2013, 11:43 AM
So I've done my darnedest to read this whole thread and discern something of the potential value of my buddy's Omega III.

I got another look at it the other day and it does not have a serial# (at least not visible with the rifle fully assembled), or any markings about where it was made. Just "Omega III" "by H Koon"

7mm RemMag, Leupold 3-9x50 scope with ConeTrol mounts. Walnut stock, silver grip cap (no engraving), square jewelled bolt.

So clearly a production rifle, but I wonder if it's lack of markings distinguish it at all. I snapped some pics with my phone but they suck (sorry). As the most "common" type of OmegaIII I'm guessing he should expect to get around $1500 for starters for it? He's not emotionally attached to it...
Thanks!

GSSP
February 14, 2013, 12:39 AM
The Omega III, Serial #5 is up for sale. Please email me for questions or if you want it.

gsspatterning@mstar2.net

Alan

http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=518103&f=2711043&m=8411028381&r=1361016581#1361016581

GSSP
February 17, 2013, 04:33 PM
Just dropped the price to $2400.

Alan

Maverick223
February 17, 2013, 08:51 PM
GSSP this is a thread about the rifle in question, not a place to sell one...keep that content in the BS&T area.

:)

johnnydollar
January 18, 2014, 03:26 PM
Interesting thread. dfkoon, I've sent you a PM.

HoustonBob
March 5, 2014, 11:39 AM
Came here just to say...

A business associate and I attended the Tulsa Wannemacher show last year and apparently met the LTRiker from this thread. He was a vendor at the show withwith several tables of very nice weaponry. Including the S10 Omega II.
my companion for the day looked it over and it was, indeed, pristine. He told us that it had been given to a close friend of H. Koon in 1970 and that he purchased it from that persons widow in the early 1980's (I forget what year he said). He also had an original sale brochure for the company with it. Price was around $40,000 and a nearby dealer was offering several guns plus cash while we were at the table.

The gripcap had a gold "B" on it if that helps figure out who it may have been given to.
We did not buy it, but my business associate sent me a link to this thread yesterday after he and another person went on a web search while discussing the rifle.

If you enjoyed reading about "Omega III Rifle by Homer Koon - what's it worth" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!