Is Buffalo Bore +P .380 ok in the LCP?


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1KPerDay
February 6, 2009, 01:36 AM
:uhoh:

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GRIZ22
February 6, 2009, 02:02 AM
I'm not sure but I wouldn't use it. to me a +P 380 is a 9mm parabellum. My point is you do not gain a lot in any +P; even less from a short barrel.

RevolvingCylinder
February 6, 2009, 02:09 AM
The manual states: The Ruger LCP pistols are compatible with standard factory ammunition
loaded to U.S. Industry Standards, including hollow-point loads loaded in brass
or aluminum cases. No .380 Auto manufactured in accordance with NATO, U.S.,
SAAMI, or CIP standards is known to be beyond the design limits or known not
to function in these pistols.

Not sure if that helps since it makes no specific mention of +P.

tostada
February 6, 2009, 03:25 AM
So, you really want to shoot Buffalo Bore in a 9.4oz gun?

Try it once and get back with us.

rhartwell
February 6, 2009, 07:39 AM
i use buffalo bore in my LCP. works very well

mr2guru
February 6, 2009, 08:55 AM
I use BB in my P3AT and it functions fine.

rhoggman
February 6, 2009, 12:40 PM
Just because Buffalo Bore advertises their stuff as +P doesn't mean that is not an advertising gimmic.

Anyone know if it falls withing the standards listed previously?

MICHAEL T
February 6, 2009, 06:22 PM
I don't belive he is a member So he isn't required to hold to the standards As for SAAMI this is no +P in 380 They have never set any standards as they have in other calibers.
I shoot all Corbon in my 3 kel tecs That makes them lively enough I don't see need for more when DPX is around.

1KPerDay
February 6, 2009, 07:23 PM
If cabela's had had any cor-bon I would have gotten that; this was the only "defense" round they had, last box, and I was out of my Hornady TAP.

I'll try it until I can locate some Hornady Critical Defense and see how that runs. I haven't been able to make this gun malfunction yet... 6 different brands of ammo.

ToadPS
February 6, 2009, 10:56 PM
According to Ruger Customer Service, no +P

This is the response to an E-mail I sent them:

************************


This e-mail is in response to your question or comment of 08/05/2008
Request No: 7755

Comment / question:

Is it alright to use .380 +P ammo in the LCP for concealed carry use?

I would not make a practice of shooting +P all the time. I just want it in case I actually have to use the gun for personal defense.

I would imagine firing a box of 25 through it to ensure proper function but other than that I'd use regular ammo.

I am thinking particularly of the Buffalo Bore 380 ACP +P 95 Gr FMJ.

Response:

Ruger recommends firing only SAAMI specification ammunition in the LCP. No +P ammunition should be used.

If you need further information, please visit our website at www.ruger.com or contact us at:

Revolvers, shotguns, rifles, 10/22 Charger Pistol: (603) 865-2442
Pistols: (928) 778-6555
Serial Number History Information: (603) 865-2424

Please note: This e-mail is sent from a notification-only address that cannot accept incoming e-mail. Please do not reply to this message.

Sincerely,
Ruger Firearms

1KPerDay
February 6, 2009, 11:03 PM
interesting... Michael says SAAMI standards have not been established for .380, though. So what does +P mean?

GRIZ22
February 7, 2009, 12:04 AM
I'm think what michael is saying Buffalo bore is not a member of SAAMI so is no required to hold to their standard.

Standard pressures for most cartridges, including 380 ACp can be found here:
http://www.lasc.us/SAAMIMaxPressure.htm

+P would be up to 10% over standard pressure. +P+ anything over thast with no upper limit.

gglass
February 7, 2009, 12:31 AM
Just go with what has proven to be the best all around .380 acp cartridge available. The Remington Golden Saber 102gr has been shown in test after test that it is superior and usually costs less per round than any other premium SD round made today.

This is a list of scores of independent tests and most show the Remington GS at the top of the heap:

http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1199737660

There are others, but it's late... I'm heading to bed.

Good luck.

JohnKSa
February 7, 2009, 12:44 AM
Michael says SAAMI standards have not been established for .380, though. So what does +P mean?There are SAAMI standards for .380ACP, but not for .380ACP +P.

1KPerDay
February 7, 2009, 11:38 AM
Thanks

-v-
February 7, 2009, 12:36 PM
Check if the LCP has a fully supported chamber as well. I seem to recall that its parent gun did not have a fully supported chamber, thus any over-pressure rounds were...well, unadvised.

jocko
February 7, 2009, 01:09 PM
Have to agree with Michaelt T on his message..

What next a +++P round??? IMO doesn't mean a damn thing other than good phoney add hype...


Smoke um if you got um.

laerley
June 5, 2009, 06:02 AM
It would seem to me that the bb round is clearly NOT standard pressure (whether SAAMI has set standards for the +p designation, or not). Their 90 gr. JHP has a muzzle velocity of 1175fps, and an ME of 267 lbs. Compare that to you standard pressure rounds, and then tell me you think the +p designation is an advertising gimmick ;-).

I think the only real question is: SAAMI DID set standards on the .380, would BB be +p, or +p+?

jocko
June 5, 2009, 07:37 AM
until there is a saami standard set for 380, to me anyhow a +P or ++P is merely unsubstantiated hype. It might be the hottest round out there but that does not make it +p or ++p or what ever.

Iknow many who shoot it in the lcp's and other than a report of stiff recoil, it has caused no harm to any guns that Ihave read about.

It is not cheap, so not sure it wold be daily fodder for rangeuse anyhow but for carrying and shooting for reliability, this round by many users is the cats nuts.

I prefer 102 golden sabre and dpx..

marcodo
June 5, 2009, 03:49 PM
I'll stick to my Hornady's Critical Defense for now and let you guys figure out what +P means to a LCP...

Let me know:p

TurboFC3S
June 5, 2009, 03:58 PM
I think next will be p^2 ammo ... and then the same "is it ok to use" questions.

laerley
June 6, 2009, 02:37 PM
Since Ruger recommends +p ammo NOT be used in the LCP, and since the BB is clearly identified as +P (on the packaging), I would have prefer not to shoot it on a regular basis (and thatís not even considering the cost factor ;-). However, after searching all dealers within 50 miles, and spending several hours/day scouring the internet, BB was the only ammo to be found (and I had a brand new LCP waiting to be shot). While waiting on the BB ammo, I did run across a couple boxes of PRVI FMJ.

I shot up the PRVI and only six rounds of BB at the range, the other day. I can tell you with absolute certainty, that there was NO doubt (recoil wise) which rounds were BB!

F1
January 29, 2010, 04:23 AM
Before I learned that you're not supposed to do it, I shot a bunch of Buffalo Bore .380+P in the Ruger LCP. They kicked like a mule and were no fun but worked well and apparently caused no damage to the gun. Now that I know better I would definitely not do it again. I think that Ruger should show their "no plus p" warning more prominently instead of burying it inside the manual, especially if it might be dangerous to shoot or harmful to the gun.

SalchaketJoe
January 29, 2010, 06:43 AM
I carry BB 100 grain Cast load. Have fired it for function, works fine. You can tell the difference, thats for sure. The LCP isnt exactly a peach to shoot with normal loads.

Speedo66
January 29, 2010, 08:53 AM
This is a huge topic of conversation on the LCP forum, www.elsiepeaforum.com

My interpretation of the general consensus there re: so called ".380+P" ammo is:

1- Ruger states they don't recommend it in their newer owner's manual.

2- Many have used it with no apparent ill effects, other than increased recoil, and damage to their bank account.

3- Test it for reliability, load your carry mag with it if you wish, but don't use it in large amounts.

There was a very good test there done by a member with lots of different brands including Buffalo Bore. The conclusion was that BB was hotter than anything else out there, and was one of the top expanding rounds.

I bought an LCP, waiting for a license amendment to come through. I intend to try it, if reliable in my gun, to carry it. Won't shoot it heavily because of possible long term damage to gun, recoil, and cost, but I will carry it.

kokapelli
January 29, 2010, 09:33 AM
Jeff Quinn's take on Buffalo Bore ammo shot from a Bersa is interesting.

http://www.gunblast.com/Bersa_Thunder380-2.htm

F1
January 29, 2010, 10:13 AM
The Bersa is a much heavier gun than the LCP, but he also shot Buffalo Bore in the LCP:

http://www.gunblast.com/Ruger-LCP.htm

kokapelli
January 29, 2010, 10:19 AM
The Bersa is a much heavier gun than the LCP, but he also shot Buffalo Bore in the LCP:

http://www.gunblast.com/Ruger-LCP.htm
Yes it wasn't about the pistol. I just wanted to point out what Jeff said about the BB brass. Quinn said "examining the fired cases showed no signs of excessive pressure."

F1
January 29, 2010, 10:28 AM
Have there been any reports of catastrophic failures using the BB's?

jackstinson
January 29, 2010, 11:04 AM
Their 90 gr. JHP has a muzzle velocity of 1175fps, and an ME of 267 lbs.
By normal math, a 90 grain bullet at 1175fps would generate 275.98 fpe.
BB has a lot of figures thrown around on their website...they always do. Interestingly enough, nowhere do I see 1175fps listed for their .380acp 90 grain JHP. The first figure shown is 1200fps for 288fpe. If you read further down, that appears to be from the guy's 3.75" barrel Browning...not exactly a pocket pistol like the LCP or P3AT. Then they go down and list "their world" figures from four different pistols of varying barrel length.
K-T P3AT at Goldon Loki doesn't have figures for BB, but they do show:
Corbon 90grain JHP at 950fps for 181fpe and Corbon 80grain XTP at 956fps for 162fpe.
BB's website says he gets 1100fps from his K-T P3AT, that would be 241.87fpe. I remain skeptical.

351 WINCHESTER
January 29, 2010, 06:34 PM
Don't know about bb .380, but when we tested their .38+P from my smith snubbie we actually got better velocity than they claimed. Those same loads from a 4" were getting into the .357 range. Good ammo.

kokapelli
January 29, 2010, 06:48 PM
I carry Buffalo Bore in both my Micro Desert Eagle and my P-3AT.

I only carry two rounds of it in each pistol, one in the chamber and the top round in the magazine and the next five rounds in the magazine are PMC fmj.

I have shot enough of it to know it is reliable in both guns.

When I carry my PM9 it is stoked with Gold Dot +P for short barrels.

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