How long has this "slim frame" Glock .45 acp pistol been out?


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Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
February 23, 2009, 06:08 PM
http://www.gunsamerica.com/903100426/Guns/Pistols/Glock-Pistols/20-21/GLOCK_MODEL_21SF_SLIM_FRAME_45ACP_NE.htm

SLIM FRAME?! How could that be? That would be admitting BOTH that:

1. They weren't really "perfection" after all, as it turns out.

AND

2. The GAP cartridge is completely superfluous, after all, since a .45 acp can be put into a thin gun.

So where does one find the formal admission of #1 and #2 by Herr Glaston? :p :D

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ljnowell
February 23, 2009, 06:10 PM
Actually its a "short frame", not a "slim frame"

I'm not sure what the intention of this thread is, but I am 100% positive of where it will end up.

IBTL:evil:

gvnwst
February 23, 2009, 06:14 PM
I remember adds for it dating back to august of two years ago, but i could be wrong....

Red Eye Fred
February 23, 2009, 06:17 PM
According to the Glock manual the G36 is the slimest Glock at 28.5mm most of the rest are 30mm including the 21

MisterMike
February 23, 2009, 06:35 PM
I'm not sure if I understand the question, but there's a mistake in its basic premise. The .45 GAP cartridge was created at Glock's request to permit the use of a shorter .45 round in a Glock that was closer in dimensions to its compact and subcompact models in 9mm. There's more info at http://www.shootingtimes.com/ammunition/new_45/.

However, as noted above, the "SF" designation refers to "short frame," not "slim frame." The ad referred to by the OP just got it wrong.

krs
February 23, 2009, 06:49 PM
And before someone points out that the G21SF is the same height, same width, and same length as the G21,
"SF" indicates a shorter front to back length of the grip, making for easier handling of the pistol by those with such small hands or such short fingers that the standard grip is difficult.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
February 23, 2009, 08:19 PM
And before someone points out that the G21SF is the same height, same width, and same length as the G21,
"SF" indicates a shorter front to back length of the grip, making for easier handling of the pistol by those with such small hands or such short fingers that the standard grip is difficult.

Exactly. Which means it's not "shorter" top to bottom - it's slimmer. And it also means that the question is not flawed - it accomplishes precisely what the GAP round was supposed to accomplish - a grip with a smaller total girth or circumference. The question and conclusion are valid.

Dorkfish
February 23, 2009, 08:32 PM
The SF models are a new addition for 2008.

These are slightly "slimmer" than their predecessors. For example: The G30 is pretty wide, but the G30 in SF (slimframe) is 2-3 mm narrower in width. That 2-3 mm is enough to make a huge difference as a carry firearm.

MisterMike
February 23, 2009, 08:36 PM
Exactly. Which means it's not "shorter" top to bottom - it's slimmer. And it also means that the question is not flawed - it accomplishes precisely what the GAP round was supposed to accomplish - a grip with a smaller total girth or circumference. The question and conclusion are valid.

Methinks you're pushing an agenda. The point is that the grip is "shorter," front to back. Am I missing the point? Are you suggesting that new designs in a pistol line prove that the previous versions were inherently flawed?

Duke of Doubt
February 23, 2009, 08:37 PM
I hear in a couple of years Glock will offer a new, improved "Dura-Frame" constructed of aluminum alloy. Another brilliant Austrian innovation.

Dorkfish
February 23, 2009, 08:50 PM
Innovation won't matter if they don't return to the lifetime warranty. This 1 year warranty w/ 10 years on the barrel is a bunch of garbage. I ran 10,000 rounds through my G30 in 6 months back in 2002. Folks at Smyrna didn't believe it and wanted me to bring it buy....just needed a new striker.

Dorkfish
February 23, 2009, 08:51 PM
Innovation won't matter if they don't return to the lifetime warranty. This 1 year warranty w/ 10 years on the barrel is a bunch of garbage. I ran 10,000 rounds through my G30 in 6 months back in 2002. Folks at Smyrna didn't believe it and wanted me to bring it buy....just needed a new striker.

Springfield is really trying to bump Glock out of the LEO market with their pricing and warranty. Love my Glocks, but warranty is important.

Great point below. Brilliance in design....success in motion.

MisterMike
February 23, 2009, 08:56 PM
:D

Actually, while I have yet to drink the Kool-Aid, I'm among those who are impressed by the genius of the Glock design. They're perhaps not "perfect," but I'd submit that they're the most important pistol design since the 1911.

ljnowell
February 24, 2009, 12:54 AM
Innovation won't matter if they don't return to the lifetime warranty. This 1 year warranty w/ 10 years on the barrel is a bunch of garbage. I ran 10,000 rounds through my G30 in 6 months back in 2002. Folks at Smyrna didn't believe it and wanted me to bring it buy....just needed a new striker.

Springfield is really trying to bump Glock out of the LEO market with their pricing and warranty. Love my Glocks, but warranty is important.

Great point below. Brilliance in design....success in motion.

Warranty is a moot point with a glock. No matter what is in print, look at how they treat the customer. I have never known anyone to have issues with them. If there is something wrong with the gun and its not your fault, they are gonna fix it for free. I have even called for a friend and gotten free parts sent to us for his gun. Many people on this board even have sent an old glock in and for no charge got it back with all new springs and parts etc.

I'm not worried about glocks warranty that I will probably never use. I would be more worried about the more expensive manufacturers warranties that will undoubtedly need used.

Magnus1959
February 24, 2009, 04:00 AM
SLIM FRAME?! How could that be? That would be admitting BOTH that:

1. They weren't really "perfection" after all, as it turns out.

AND

2. The GAP cartridge is completely superfluous, after all, since a .45 acp can be put into a thin gun.

So where does one find the formal admission of #1 and #2 by Herr Glaston?
Oh, one of them.

dirt_j00
February 24, 2009, 12:23 PM
I really wanted to like the 21SF, but I found the grip was still too large for me. (Blame that on my small hands, not the gun though.)

Tirod
February 24, 2009, 03:36 PM
Don't forget the :p:D at the end of the message.

I'm thinking the OP is trying to be humorous. After all, it's the owners' description, not Glock. So much for truth in advertising.

The adoption of a shorter .45 cartridge to fit the hands of average shooters is admirable. It has succeeded. It implies no imperfection to the original Glock design.

Now, stuffing a .40 in a 9mm barrel with few other changes, well, that's been discussed a lot, but it is what it is. Most other makers have learned it requires a redesign, like it or not. It works if factory instructions are followed: NO LEAD PROJECTILES.

In that regard, Glocks and .45's are equilivalent: FMJ only. Glock has the advantage of course, works like a revolver, shoots like a Hollywood prop, and can't rust up nearly as much . . . :p:D

Dorkfish
February 24, 2009, 05:22 PM
It may be good for Glock to have both in the field. After all, some hands simply can't grasp the G30, but the G30SF has just enough removed that it's managable. Same goes for the other SF models.

Now if we can just convince them to make a carbine.....:banghead:

krs
February 24, 2009, 06:19 PM
Exactly. Which means it's not "shorter" top to bottom - it's slimmer. And it also means that the question is not flawed - it accomplishes precisely what the GAP round was supposed to accomplish - a grip with a smaller total girth or circumference. The question and conclusion are valid.

No, but fairly nice try. In your original post you used the term "slim GUN" not "slim" or "short front to back grip" or any other reference to the girth of only the grip.

The G21SF is not a "slim gun"; it is the same width as the G21 and both are less slim than any of the 45GAP caliber pistols. The G37, G38, and G39 (45GAP) are 1.18" wide to the G21 and G21SF's 1.27" wide, so you can see that the justification of the 45GAP exists in those nine thousandth's of an inch.

It may be that the next model to appear will be a 45GAP version of the .45 acp G36 "slimline" with an overall width of less than that single stack pistol's 1.13".

Shall we hope so, Dr. Winslow?

krs
February 24, 2009, 06:29 PM
I hear in a couple of years Glock will offer a new, improved "Dura-Frame" constructed of aluminum alloy. Another brilliant Austrian innovation

If they do that it will no doubt bring some unhappiness to the world on the part of whoever it is that is currently making aftermarket Glock frames in both an aluminum alloy and stainless steel.

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