Looking for advice on a suppressor for .22lr...


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ZombiesAhead
February 25, 2009, 10:06 PM
I am fairly sure I am ready to purchase a suppressor for my .22lr firearms. I understand all the legal implications and the purchasing process. I will be purchasing through a trust.

I have used a friend's SWR Spectre extensively on my CZ-75 Kadet Kit (threaded) and a Ruger 10/22. I really like this suppressor but it may be more expensive than what I need. I figure I can get into the SWR for about $600 including tax, etc. but I'd like to save some money if possible. I do not need the .22lr full-auto capability that the Spectre is rated for. This will be used on my 10/22 and CZ Kadet Kit-equipped CZ-75 SP-01. I plan to only suppress .22lr firearms.

Can anyone recommend a good suppressor for me? These are my criteria:

1. Durability/Serviceability/Construction (I'd like to be able to take it apart to clean/service)
2. Price
3. Noise Reduction (when shot dry)
4. Availability
5. Weight

Is the SWR a good choice or can I save some money with another product? Some have suggested the TAC 65 or Gemtech Outback...

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Javelin
February 25, 2009, 10:12 PM
My advice is not to cheap out on your suppressor. You buy once and you cry once. That is the cheapest way to do it in the NFA world.

And with that said you will seriously enjoy the SWR Spectre.

:)

ZombiesAhead
February 25, 2009, 10:21 PM
Javelin - Thanks for the advice. I know the Spectre is a great product but it is rated for .22lr full-auto, .17HMR, and 5.7x28 (I believe). These are capabilities I just don't need. The Tac-65 is several hundred dollars cheaper and can still be taken apart.

Suppressors seems so simple. Is a $250 suppressor really going to be that much worse than a $400+ suppressor? I am kind of light on cash but I believe a .22lr suppressor will allow me to practice much more and keep me from using up too much expensive center-fire ammunition.

DoubleTapDrew
February 26, 2009, 01:31 AM
I'm happy with the TROS md-22, but I haven't shot a lot of them so I don't know how it compares side by side to others. I just know the bolt clacking on a 10/22 (with a bolt buffer) is louder than the report and you can hear the round smack the target. POI shift is negligible and accuracy is the same as without the can on (sometimes a little better but that may be the "me factor").

ZombiesAhead
February 26, 2009, 03:46 AM
Well seeing as no one has objected, I'm leaning towards the Tactical Innovations TAC-65. It is aluminum and rated for .22lr. It can be disassembled and sells for about $250. Silencer Test's chart shows it as not the quietest .22lr suppressor (compared to Spectre and Outback) but it seem pretty good.

Anyone have experience with the TAC-65? Is it decently quiet?

PTK
February 26, 2009, 04:35 AM
Anyone have experience with the TAC-65? Is it decently quiet?

I have a Tac-63 that's been upgraded with -65 baffles. It's good.

Here's a video of it on my Buckmark.

Link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPj-WjXusiw&feature=channel_page)

Animal Mother
February 26, 2009, 08:25 AM
I know you are looking for a silencer, but have you seen what you can accomplish by just using some subsonic ammo? I picked up a few boxes to try out on my .22 pistols and rifles and its amazing how quiet the Aguila and Colibri subsonic ammo is even without a suppressor. I have air rifles that are louder. Just find a quiet brand that will feed and cycle the action and you'll save that $200 tax stamp to Uncle Sugar.

I love the class three stuff, but its probably cheaper to stock up on subsonic ammo, unless you shoot a LOT.

ZombiesAhead
February 26, 2009, 08:34 AM
Animal Mother - I have seen what I can accomplish by using subsonic ammunition and I have to say; I don't think it's very much. I regularly shoot CCI Subsonic and I still find it quite loud out of both pistol and rifle. I now only shoot CCI CB Longs unsuppressed and we screw on the Spectre when we shoot CCI Subsonic. Right now, I am left with the options of either shooting CB Longs (annoying, expensive, don't cycle) or purchasing a suppressor. Please stay on topic thx k?

erict
February 26, 2009, 10:11 AM
I have an Outback II on the way. I've used my Mark II with my buddies cans and he has a Tac-65 and the Outback II. I can't tell by ear which one is the quietest but the Outback II is a little smaller and lighter so I went with it.

I can shoot high velocity and subsonic through my pistol with no difference in sound. The high velocity will still crack from a rifle barrel but it's further down range so it's still not loud to the shooter but you have to shoot the subsonic in the rifle to achieve the same level of silence as the pistol.

Ranb
February 26, 2009, 10:17 AM
It is amazing how much less noisey subsonic ammo is when shot through a silencer. There is no other way to make a gun hearing safe than to use a silencer.

Ranb

Izaak Walton
February 26, 2009, 10:31 AM
I would like to recommend that you only use a can on what itís rated for.
You probably know this but for safetyís sake donít put a 22lr can on a .223.
It will work, at least once. Then you get another one.

Flame Red
February 26, 2009, 10:36 AM
I got a AAC Pilot and have been most happy with it. I use it on a S&W M41 with a custom threaded SS barrel. Squirrels are decimated.

I wanted one for years and glad I acted pre-Obomination.

1. Durability/Serviceability/Construction - the can itself is alumnum, but the threads are SS
2. Price - I paid more than MSRP as I the dealer had it in stock and I did not have to wait on a Form3. I think it was like $400.
3. Noise Reduction (when shot dry) - I don't shoot it wet - too messy!
4. Availability - Go to a dealer that has it in stock, else you might be spending 3 months waiting for a form3.
5. Weight - Really light - Since the M41 I have is heavy, one cannot tell any shift in weight distribution with it on or off.

freakshow10mm
February 26, 2009, 10:58 AM
If you can wait a month or so to purchase, my .22 suppressor will be available for the market. Retail price is $125 shipped to your SOT.

Zak Smith
February 26, 2009, 01:17 PM
My company makes two .22LR suppressors, which weigh 3.2 and 4.1 oz. There are lots of good options out there.

freakshow10mm
February 26, 2009, 01:22 PM
I've heard good things about your .22 cans.

DoubleTapDrew
February 27, 2009, 12:25 AM
I think the TROS is 4oz, it's aluminum with SS threads (you DONT want aluminum threads, cross threading it would be a nightmare).
I wouldn't be overly concerned with which one is quietest. All .22lr suppressors are quiet and the db levels vary with things like elevation, weather conditions, gun used, ammo, etc.
It is amazing how much less noisey subsonic ammo is when shot through a silencer.
Especially if you are using a rifle. With a rifle you get the crack on supersonic ammo, although in short pistols (like a P22) even regular velocity ammo is usually subsonic for me.
If you can wait a month or so to purchase, my .22 suppressor will be available for the market. Retail price is $125 shipped to your SOT.
Sounds like someone is looking to corner the market! That's by far the cheapest I've seen for a can. Is there a spec sheet for it online somewhere?
for safetyís sake donít put a 22lr can on a .223.
That wouldn't be pretty! :uhoh: You can usually go down in caliber though. YHM said shooting .223 through their .308 can is only 2db louder than their .223 can (although the can is 2" longer). I'm sure you can shoot 9mm through a .45 can. But yeah, don't put a pistol or rimfire can on something with rifle pressures.

Javelin
February 27, 2009, 01:09 AM
Here is my SBR'd GSG-5 with SWR Spectre Suppressor. It is a great combination. Would recommend to anyone who wants to shoot .22LR with less noise than an air rifle.

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6681/neweditedgsg2.jpg

freakshow10mm
February 27, 2009, 01:20 AM
Specs are listed on my site. 5.5" long, 1" diameter, 3 ounces is what we come up with so far. Final weight might vary a bit. All my suppressors are monolithic baffle stacks. Disassembles for cleaning. We are going to test it with running a few mags of .223 Remington at full auto and see how it holds up. Should be available March 31. Hopefully sooner.

I'm going to have a "raffle" type deal where you can sign up and enter to win a .22 suppressor of mine for free. Just pay the transfer tax and your SOT's transfer fee. Probably going to do it once a month. Announcement will be on my site sometime in March.

mongo4567
February 27, 2009, 09:39 AM
I have a YHM Mite and I love it. It is very inexpensive, small, works wells, and it disassembles so that you can clean it.

ZombiesAhead
February 27, 2009, 08:10 PM
Seems like everyone loves whatever suppressor they have. If anyone has more input on the Tactical Innovations TAC-65, please post. I think this is what I'm going for because of price and availability. I'm still a little worried it won't be quite enough.

I still really like the SWR Spectre that I've used many times but it's TWICE as expensive ($500) as the TAC-65 and only offers a bit more suppression plus support for calibers I have no interest in (5.7, .17HMR) right now.

MatthewVanitas
February 27, 2009, 08:20 PM
Seems like everyone loves whatever suppressor they have. If anyone has more input on the Tactical Innovations TAC-65, please post. I think this is what I'm going for because of price and availability. I'm still a little worried it won't be quite enough.

I still really like the SWR Spectre that I've used many times but it's TWICE as expensive ($500) as the TAC-65 and only offers a bit more suppression plus support for calibers I have no interest in (5.7, .17HMR) right now.

I haven't compared the two models, but one way to look at it: I'd rather pay $200 tax on a $500 suppressor than a $250 suppressor. Further, you might not want/need a 5.7/.17 capability now, but it'd bite if you decide you want it in the future and have to go out and buy another suppressor all over again.

mongo4567
February 28, 2009, 01:20 AM
Seems like everyone loves whatever suppressor they have. If anyone has more input on the Tactical Innovations TAC-65, please post. I think this is what I'm going for because of price and availability. I'm still a little worried it won't be quite enough.



The Mite is about a half inch shorter (5.3") than the TAC-65, about an ounce lighter (2.9oz), and the same price ($250).

husbandofaromanian
February 28, 2009, 12:36 PM
I have a Tac-65 and I am very happy with it. I have never shot through another brand silencer, so I don't know the differences. I use a single shot Contender g2 pistol with a 10.5" barrel & my shots are VERY quiet. It sounds like you rapped an empty can of Campbells chick soup. I am about to try it with a tennis racket grip over it (what-a-grip) to see if the tin can sounds softens up a bit.

I have shot it out in the sticks where you can here a twig break 50 yards away. Even in these conditions, it is very quiete and hearing safe (I shoot with my 2 children).

I just bought a Gemtech .223 can but I am waiting for it to get warmer before I try it out.

I try not to let the playground insults between some of the silencer manufacturers to interfere with my enjoyment of this hobby!:scrutiny:

freakshow10mm
February 28, 2009, 12:39 PM
You think it's bad on the forums, you should get into the NFA culture as a professional. It's even worse behind the scenes.

Prince Yamato
February 28, 2009, 01:36 PM
Freakshow, I know nothing about you personally, so please don't take any of this as an insult; I am really curious as to your .22 suppressor design. You have a suppressor that can be easily disassembled and it sells for under $200. That intrigues the heck out of me. Are there videos of it in operation? If this thing works as promised, you are going to be loved by the 2A community at large... and probably bashed by all the other manufacturers on Silencer Talk. :) You are a pioneer in many ways; you're making NFA items affordable to the average Joe.

Conqueror
February 28, 2009, 01:52 PM
1) Good choice on .22 for a first suppressor (I assume). They are an absolute hoot and cheap to acquire and feed.

2) Before you pick a brand/model, there are a couple questions you need to answer. They are:

A) Do I want a can that can be disassembled by the user?
.22LR is basically THE dirtiest, nastiest round produced for modern weapons. Whatever silencer you choose, it will eventually fill up with lead and carbon deposits which are extremely hard. There are only two reliable ways of removing this accumulation: bead blasting the internal components, or soaking the components/entire can in a solution of 50/50 peroxide and white vinegar for several days. Bead blasting requires a can where you can remove the baffles for cleaning. Soaking is easier with a take-down can, but you can soak the whole silencer if you get a sealed unit. Don't believe the manufacturers who say you can "clean" their .22 silencers by soaking in kroil or whatever; they are lying.

B) Do I want stainless steel, titanium, or aluminum construction?
This is where things get tricky: aluminum silencers can't really be soaked in the peroxide/vinegar dip, because it will gradually dissolve the aluminum. Anodized aluminum components can be soaked, but eventually they acquire nicks and scratches through the ano, where the solution will start to pit the base metal. Thus, the safer thing to do with aluminum components is bead-blast them for cleaning, which can only be done with take-down silencers. Therefore, if you get an aluminum silencer, I strongly recommend a take-down can and buying a small bead blasting cabinet. Otherwise, if you buy a sealed aluminum unit, you have to send them back to the manufacturer every 10-15,000 rounds for a $75-100 cleaning. Stainless, on the other hand, is totally impervious to the Dip and can be soaked for weeks with abandon. Takedown vs. Sealed doesn't matter as much with stainless, since you can soak the whole can en bloc. It's easier with a takedown can though. Titanium is hard to find, only a few companies make all-Ti silencers. I group them with stainless since they are also impervious to the Dip.

Being that stainless is easier to clean, and takedown is easier to clean, I tend to recommend stainless takedown cans like the SWR Spectre and the AAC Element.

3) The only real advantage to aluminum is weight - if you have a light gun like a P22, a stainless can may feel front-heavy. However, the AAC Element was designed to conquer this, and is only 1oz heavier than an equivalent aluminum can. You should still consider aluminum cans if you want a light package. Also, titanium cans are very light.

4) Below are the five categories, I will try to list some good available silencers to consider in each category, in approximate order of quality/desireability:
Aluminum sealed - SWR Warlock, AAC Aviator, AAC Pilot, Gemtech Outback II, Tactical Solutions Cascade
Aluminum takedown - AAC Prodigy (New Core ONLY, old core is loud), Tactical Innovations Tac-65 and Stratus, YHM Mite
Stainless sealed - HTG Universal II
Stainless takedown - SWR Spectre, AAC Element, Tactical Innovations Quest, YHM Mite SS
Titanium - TBAC L or S model, Gemtech Seahunter

5) I would STRONGLY recommend hitting www.silencerresearch.com and signing up for a membership. It costs $30 but could save you from making a $500+ mistake. And, good timing - they are releasing their 2009 .22LR silencer shootout results this month, and they tested over 30 popular models for sound reduction.

6) Check out www.major-malfunction.com when you're ready to buy. He's pretty much the most popular NFA dealer in the country right now - for a good reason. He provides phenomenal customer service and bargain-basement pricing. I bought my 5.56 can from him and will be back.

freakshow10mm
February 28, 2009, 03:11 PM
Freakshow, I know nothing about you personally, so please don't take any of this as an insult; I am really curious as to your .22 suppressor design. You have a suppressor that can be easily disassembled and it sells for under $200. That intrigues the heck out of me. Are there videos of it in operation? If this thing works as promised, you are going to be loved by the 2A community at large... and probably bashed by all the other manufacturers on Silencer Talk. You are a pioneer in many ways; you're making NFA items affordable to the average Joe.
No videos yet. We are still in the testing stage. When we get a final design ready for production, we will have pics and videos on the website.

I think more people would be interested in suppressors or other NFA weapons if the prices were lower. Some of the more common complaints why people aren't buying suppressors are price and wait time. If I can make and sell suppressors at a lower price that might make more people buy. When I lived in WI and owned a few suppressors as an average guy, I had a hard time swallowing $400-600 for a suppressor, $100 transfer fee, and then $200 tax on top of that. That is a lot of money.

Now as an SOT, I take the final price into consideration. My $125 suppressor plus $200 transfer tax will run $325 (free shipping). Now you have to shop around for a transfer dealer on the cheap, hopefully $50. If you can get a .22 suppressor in your hands for under $400 including the can, transfer, and tax, that is good deal. After all, ammo prices are going up too.;)

freakshow10mm
February 28, 2009, 03:15 PM
I've also heard great things about Major Malfunction. Haven't used his services at all but probably the first place online I'd check for an in stock suppressor. He's like the Bud's Gun Shop of the suppressor world. Bunch of stuff for great prices.

Prince Yamato
February 28, 2009, 06:10 PM
I've also heard great things about Major Malfunction. Haven't used his services at all but probably the first place online I'd check for an in stock suppressor. He's like the Bud's Gun Shop of the suppressor world. Bunch of stuff for great prices.

Major Malfunction operates a business model similar to yours. He wants to make NFA ownership available to the "common folk". From what I gather off of his answering machine, NFA sales are not his primary source of income (isn't he a doctor of some sort?), so he can probably take small financial hits here and there with his items.

Conqueror
March 1, 2009, 06:24 PM
IIRC he's in medical sales. I don't think he's a physician.

ZombiesAhead
March 3, 2009, 09:13 AM
Great advice especially from Conqueror. I know I want a take-down model. I think right now it is between the SWR Spectre (which I have shot and really like) and the TAC-65 (which I have never shot but would save me quite a bit of coin). Now I just need to get some OTD quotes from dealers. I know Major Malfunction is reputable but I've heard that if I buy locally from someone who has it in stock that they often waive the transfer fee...not sure though...

BlacklabelOP
March 3, 2009, 09:29 AM
I bought a stainless mite from yhm because I plan to have it in a trust and keeping it for a very very long time. Plus it is just about as bulletbroof as .22 suppressors get.

not as quite as some but reasonable priced.

freakshow10mm
March 3, 2009, 11:27 AM
ZombiesAhead, that's usually the way it works. Same for guns. If you buy the gun in stock you pay their price. If you get it transferred in you pay a transfer fee.

Brian Williams
March 3, 2009, 01:08 PM
Hey, Freakshow, what about making a suppressor that is egg shaped in cross section or with a bore centerline that is offset like the old Maxim for a Colt Woodsman 1st series so we can use the sights.

freakshow10mm
March 3, 2009, 02:58 PM
I could probably handle that as a one off custom job. I don't know about production though. Most guys just use a smaller diameter with a more aggressive baffle design to keep weight down.

Conqueror
March 3, 2009, 10:42 PM
I know Major Malfunction is reputable but I've heard that if I buy locally from someone who has it in stock that they often waive the transfer fee...not sure though...
That is true, but M3's prices are often so much lower that the savings pay for the transfer fee and more! You should definitely get quotes from him for anything you want to buy.

I mentioned www.silencerresearch.com earlier; their 2009 .22LR shootout was just released. 33 popular .22LR silencers were tested. You really should pay the subscription fee, it is money very well spent. It may profoundly change your ideas on what to buy.

RonE
March 3, 2009, 11:08 PM
This guy makes some pretty nice and effective suppressors. I especially like his integrally suppressed rifles and pistols.
http://www.shootersdepot.com/

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