How do you guys feel about this?


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Chr8189
February 27, 2009, 01:48 PM
I'm hoping in this forum their is a wide variety of members. Including people against my question and for it, law enforcement officer, military personnel, average joe's, lawyers, doctors, any one.

I live in the South Florida area, I am 19 years old, and just recently discharged from the Military due to a medical diagnosis. (only one year active)

Me, my dad, and brother love guns, we have a good amount of toys. Some haven't even been shot yet unfortunately.

I don't want anybody to depend their answer on short military experience though, but my age.

When I was based in Texas, and Active Military member can obtain a CCW, but in florida you must wait till your 21.

One thing I like to do more than shoot, is MUD on my Honda 500. Out there in the Everglades, people have been robbed, killed and rapped. Some people i ride with don't even know it. Usually I try to stay with a big group of riders, but sometimes not so lucky, sometimes one other bike with me, sometimes no one. I do a lot of night riding, from 6pm-4am sometimes.

Well out there, me and my girlfriend, and sometimes my sister, we double up on my bike, and I usually pack my own Glock 21 full-size in my utility box securely encased, and not readily accessible. But sometimes when I seep approaching suspicious bikes and people, ill throw it in my waste till they pass.

Now just from watching the news and court TV you hear all of the sad stories of young/old couples getting murdered and the female even getting rapped in front of the boyfriend.

When I'm out there, by Florida Law I can have a firearm in my personal conveyance, and as long as it is not readily accessible, I should be OKAY.

But I'm always worried that sometimes the game warden, or FHP will stop me and arrest me and cease everything, and although I know I am a good person, love my country and respect everyone that will show me respect, the Law Enforcement might drastically treat this offense as very criminal (reasonable) and all the above. Even though we have thugs all over the place with a firearm, when they get caught, get a slap on the wrist, and continue their life, my record is important to me unlike some of them.

To me the bigger picture is until I am 21, when I am out there alone, I need to be packing, because if that day ever comes where I am wishing I had a gun, only for protection. If my life get's cut in a fourth, because the 19 year old thug shot the 19 year old unarmed man on a four wheeler, that is going to be a bigger loss to me. If my girlfriend or my sister suffers such a grusome crime because I couldn't protect them , i dont know how i can live on.

The sad part is the fact I even have to worry about a matter like this, but I do.

So the question is.....Do you feel I should pack?, or do you feel I should risk it, and if I am that scared, just don't go out there, don't do something you love to do because those darn thugs who control our lifestyle in fear.

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Jorg Nysgerrig
February 27, 2009, 01:54 PM
The High Road doesn't condone illegal activity and as no one here is going to recommend you break the law.

My thoughts are that is an activity is so dangerous that I wouldn't consider doing it it unarmed, I would avoid it altogether. If the chance of you being a victim of violent crime while enjoying your hobby is so high in that location, you may wish to consider a new hobby or another locale.

jimmyraythomason
February 27, 2009, 01:55 PM
delete.

kingpin008
February 27, 2009, 01:57 PM
As Jorg said, we don't condone nor recommend illegal activities here. If you're not of age to CCW, then don't CCW. Do some research on what you can carry (OC spray, blades, collapsible batons, etc) and go from there.

Duke of Doubt
February 27, 2009, 02:00 PM
Chr8189: "So the question is.....Do you feel I should pack?, or do you feel I should risk it, and if I am that scared, just don't go out there, don't do something you love to do because those darn thugs who control our lifestyle in fear."

Oh, for Pete's sake.

You love to arm yourself against retarded thugs?

Okay, let's scale it otherwise. I've yet to meet a "darn thug" who "controlled" my lifestyle. Heck; I'D like, one day, to "control" my lifestyle.

Kid tries to rob you? Beat him stupid. It doesn't take a hero.

Krazeehorse
February 27, 2009, 02:04 PM
What about open carry or a rifle in a scabbard?

lesterg3
February 27, 2009, 02:05 PM
Obey the law, grow up, quit watching TV, go back to school.

erict
February 27, 2009, 02:13 PM
Try to go with larger groups or see what is legal to carry like knives or possibly a rifle. If you still feel unsafe, wait til you're old enough to carry legally.

woad_yurt
February 27, 2009, 02:15 PM
Is a cap and ball revolver legal?

lonegunman
February 27, 2009, 02:18 PM
Don't break the law. Getting arrested for illegally carrying a gun will make getting a permit pretty much impossible in the future. As socialism invades every aspect of life in America, they will probably make it impossible for life to own guns as well.

Carry what you can carry legally, use your common sense when encountering groups of people. The best way to get out of trouble is to avoid trouble to start with.

Chr8189
February 27, 2009, 02:20 PM
securely Incased and not readily accessible is not illegal, my question is more do u think it is unsafe for a 19 year old to have a gun in his possession. PERIOD. Im not asking if i should break the law, although it seems that was the question. I don't want to be a hero, and if I were to stop riding that would mean I am in fear of enjoying something I pay taxes for. Law Enfrocement is very scarce out there. I am in school 5 days a week thanks to my GI bill, I am growing up. The law is written securely Incased and not readily accessible in your conveyance. I have a lock box on the back.

I appreciate your advice so far, I wanted it to be straight forward.

erict
February 27, 2009, 02:38 PM
my question is more do u think it is unsafe for a 19 year old to have a gun in his possession. PERIOD.

That would depend on the 19 year old. I've met plenty of 19 year olds that I would feel comfortable around with firearms. I've also met plenty of 40 year olds that I wouldn't want to be around with a firearm. Age doesn't factor in this case really. The law says you can't carry a readily accesible handgun on your person so you have no choice but to obey that law.

Stirling XD
February 27, 2009, 02:48 PM
If you are afraid to go someplace without a gun, then you probably shouldn't go there with a gun. If you spend much time on this forum, as well as many other concealed carry forums, you will see that your first defense is to avoid trouble altogether.

Keep in mind that being armed does not guarantee your safety or survival. It simply levels the playing field. You could be out numbered or someone could still get the drop on you gun or not. Obey the law, think things through carefully and stay safe.

deaconkharma
February 27, 2009, 02:51 PM
my question is more do u think it is unsafe for a 19 year old to have a gun in his possession. PERIOD.
there are some western states that have laws that allow persons younger than 18 to possess handguns. Montana allows 14 year olds to posses a handgun.
The answer like above is nope Perfectly safe depending on the person, just like anything else in this world it is the INDIVIDUAL.

On the CCW question, adults have to make adult decisions with adult consequences (and usually they're pretty big). Do what you will, only YOU can decide for YOU. Plenty of people here on this board have been saying "concealed is concealed". They deal with those consequences on their own as well.
There is other non-government controlled land to ride on where possession and open carry is perfectly legal though...

Carlos Cabeza
February 27, 2009, 02:52 PM
You said law enforcement was scarce yet in the OP you said you might see a game warden ?????

Your question is one that must be answered through your own judgement. No advice will allow you to have your freedoms without some liability for your actions.

It is perfectly safe for a 19 yr old to have a firearm as long as you aren't playing with it, brandishing it, in a secure holster if carrying it, finger outside of the trigger guard until ready to shoot, etc. The only thing unsafe if unsafe behavior. Don't fall into the machismo trap.

possum
February 27, 2009, 02:55 PM
If you are afraid to go someplace without a gun, then you probably shouldn't go there with a gun.
exactly.

500cc's vs. .45acp

TexasRifleman
February 27, 2009, 02:55 PM
So the question is.....Do you feel I should pack?, or do you feel I should risk it, and if I am that scared, just don't go out there, don't do something you love to do because those darn thugs who control our lifestyle in fear.

What about long guns? Looked into the laws around rifles or shotguns?

Generally lower age requirements but I don't know about Florida laws on open carry of long guns.

Might be something to consider.

hso
February 27, 2009, 02:56 PM
my question is more do u think it is unsafe for a 19 year old to have a gun in his possession. PERIOD.

Your answer will be, "It depends upon the individual."

Stirling XD's advice is about as sound as it comes.

hso
February 27, 2009, 02:56 PM
my question is more do u think it is unsafe for a 19 year old to have a gun in his possession. PERIOD.

Your answer will be, "It depends upon the individual."

Stirling XD's advice is about as sound as it comes.

Chr8189
February 27, 2009, 05:44 PM
Yes, when I saw Law Enforcement is scarce, I mean once you leave your trailer into the glades their is no Law Enforcement. The only LEO's you might see is on the way to your trailer.

Hungry Seagull
February 27, 2009, 05:54 PM
Pick another place to mud on your ATV. And stay with Friends or a group that is friendly. Maybe you have friends over 21 and legal.

DONT do anything that will risk your chance to get 21 free and clear of any trouble.

Fear of LEO's is indicating to me that maybe you know that you are young for Florida and need to look into other LEGAL alternatives.

Maybe Texas will take you at 18 and over, I dont know. As far as Im concerned yer over 18, served active duty until discharged and moving up in life.

Like the mods say, dont do anything illegal.

jpatterson
February 27, 2009, 06:03 PM
I hate to say it too, but you probably should steer clear of places like that then. Shame there's no open carry in Florida. That seems to be the one way for us youngin's to carry legally.

I'd just stick with what you were doing, except not tucking it when you see people. Maybe unlocking the case and having it in plain reach, and then relocking when you feel safe(r). There isn't really any good option for you though it seems. I feel your pain brother, I'm in the same boat at twenty.

Good luck and stay safe.

Big Bill
February 27, 2009, 06:11 PM
Florida Gun Law

RV/Car Carry Without A Permit/License

790.25 Lawful Ownership, Possession, and Use of Firearms and Other Weapons

(5) POSSESSION IN PRIVATE CONVEYANCE.--Notwithstanding subsection (2), it is lawful and is not a violation of s. 790.01 for a person 18 years of age or older to possess a concealed firearm or other weapon for self-defense or other lawful purpose within the interior of a private conveyance, without a license, if the firearm or other weapon is securely encased or is otherwise not readily accessible for immediate use.

Nothing herein contained prohibits the carrying of a legal firearm other than a handgun anywhere in a private conveyance when such firearm is being carried for a lawful use. Nothing herein contained shall be construed to authorize the carrying of a concealed firearm or other weapon on the person.

This subsection shall be liberally construed in favor of the lawful use, ownership, and possession of firearms and other weapons, including lawful self-defense as provided in s. 776.012.

http://www.handgunlaw.us/

http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/florida.pdf

Here are the 2008 Florida Statutes

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0790/titl0790.htm&StatuteYear=2008&Title=%2D%3E2008%2D%3EChapter%20790

Hungry Seagull
February 27, 2009, 06:15 PM
The word "Firearm" I feel means specifically ANYTHING OTHER than a HANDGUN.

You can probably pack a 10 foot long barret III rifle model weapon (no such weapon, being mildy sarcastic) on your back if you wanted to.

moooose102
February 27, 2009, 06:33 PM
my advice to you is stay the heck out of that situation! either go with a decent sized group, or stay home. besides, in the everglades, mudding at night, you are going to run into 2 bad things, either someone looking for trouble, or a hungry animal (gator or puma) that wants to eat. neither seem like something i would want to encounter if i had the choice. find some dependable riding buddies, and go have fun. back in the day, when i rode (dirt bikes), we always kept tabs on the rest of the group. not that there was anything out there to worry us, but accidents do happen. and if you are seriously hurt 30 miles from nowhere (remember, back then there was no such thing as cell phones or gps's, or emergency locator beacons), somebody had to ride to get help. if it is a broken leg, that is one thing, but if you are bleeding profusely, that is a whole different thing. it shouldn't be to much of a task to find some good riding freinds, and they will enrich your life as well. it is a win-win proposition.

heron
February 28, 2009, 12:22 AM
Gun or not, if you know an area is frequented by thugs, DON'T GO THERE!

David E
February 28, 2009, 12:50 AM
One thing I like to do more than shoot, is MUD on my Honda 500. Out there in the Everglades, people have been robbed, killed and rapped.

If someone started 'rapping' on me, I just might have to shoot him !!! I think that's entirely justifiable !

:D :D :D :D

.

KarenTOC
February 28, 2009, 09:20 AM
Either the area is extremely dangerous or your imagination is in hyperdrive. If the former, don't go there. If the latter, you're not yet mature enough to carry a gun.

Either way, don't do anything illegal. Two years without concealed carry rights is better than the rest of your life without concealed carry rights.

model67a
February 28, 2009, 11:48 AM
I am in Indiana and no one of any age can have a loaded weapon on a 4 wheeler. Probably because a lot of people use the vehicle for hunting and would be cruising for game. It is a shame that you cannot get your permit. Not too long ago a young person could serve in the armed forces but wasn't allowed to vote. That was changed. Now we need to work on this. If an 18 year old can serve in the armed forces he should be eligble for a permit. He has been instructed on firearms which probably a lot of 21 year olds who are eligble for a permit and get them are inept on the operation and handling of the firearm, even if they have taken the abbreviated firearms course required by their state. Those DI's have a way of instructing that you remember. LOL contact you state lawmakers. stay safe

statelineblues
February 28, 2009, 12:22 PM
I've never lived in FL, so I can't say what the laws allow there...but I agree with the comments about being more selective about where and when you ride, and with whom.

You might consider this as well - the next time you're out there and meet an LEO or game warden, stop and talk to him/her for a couple of minutes. Ask about trail conditions, traffic, weather, - anything like that. Let them know the general area you'll be riding in - it shows you have nothing to hide.

And remember, if you do get into trouble, these are the people who will be coming to save your butt!

Chr8189
March 1, 2009, 10:43 PM
KarenTOC: I'm sorry i'll admit i really don't understand your quote, but the United States military already determined I was capable to operate a firearm, although I didn't make marksman, I sleped with a firearm for weeks, not to mention Special Ops training, I didn't do much shooting, but I did run for miles at a 7 minutes pace in boots with a weighted M-16 above my head, couldn't get it dirty, or wet. Although the Federal Law declares me a Vet, I don't call nor consider myself one, I don't deserve the title, and I have chosen to not collect the benefits. I just want the point to be, I feel i qualify to carry , I do respect the law, I have read statutes on this, and a Deputy Friend of mine advised me I should get a "Polish Tantant"? and collapse it in the back of my ATV box, and that would not be illegal, but I don't want to go that big.

Anyways, a lot of the advice on here was very helpful, I just wanted input on how people felt. Although I don't understand how the difference of residence...TX vs. FL where (TX will license me and Fl wont) is also a difference in my mental capabilities. hard to understand. I guess in Texas I am a different person. LOL.

Well My final decision is to carry a small kel-tec inside my CONVEYANCE, Securely Encased, and not readily accessible. But, I will have to keep an eye out, and be ready

I'm not saying their is a lot crime out there, but there is a lot fear. People have been killed for accidently crossing someone invisible property line. I don't want to be on the wrong side of the barrel of someone with no consideration. I wont be a hero, I wont kill over property, but I sure as hell will defend over my life and anyone else.

Yes, I should MUD somewhere else, but a lot of this land is safe, and fun, it's just the ride from the trailer thru some camps is a little dangerous, I sure do love the everglades. Most people know that anyone on an Air boat, fishing boat, buggy, anything out there has some sort of firearm, because they feel their is a small risk, just because I am not 21, does not mean that I shouldn't have a right to ante up with every one else.

Also in FL we are aloud to hunt of ATV's.

Officers'Wife
March 1, 2009, 11:04 PM
My Gramps had a scabbard made for his Garand that he attached to his ATV which he rode in over three counties. He raised some eyebrows and in two cases was reported but never had any legal problems. I would check with an attorney on the legality in FL but such a thing might be an option for you.

Selena

~Eug~2nd1st
March 1, 2009, 11:05 PM
Btw... "Thank You" for your part in serving our country. No matter how much or how little, how young or how old.

woad_yurt
March 2, 2009, 12:16 AM
Don't carry illegally. You could possibly crash, knock your head or something and then wake up with charges against you. Things happen.

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