[FireInCairo]

It's +P rated. Is it really that much different from the 158 grain +P they offer in terms of stopping power? Am I just kidding myself thinking this stuff is acceptable to rely upon for personal protection?

[bullseye308]

Why wouldn't it work? Shot placement is everything no matter the caliber. WWB is reliable and dependable, so I would have no worries using it.

Sorry, that sounded harsh, it wasn't meant to. :uhoh: The 158 would brobably be better, but it may recoil harder and have more flash and bang with it. Depends on what you are shooting it out of. The 125 has been around a while too and too many folks like it for a reason.

[mavracer]

I'd prefer 135 SBGDs or 158 LSWCHP but if that's all you can afford and it shoots good in your gun I wouldn't sweat it.
and not trying to be uppety or anything I'd rather a person be able to shoot 200-300 rounds of theur carry ammo for function test and practice than have one box of the good stuff and never practice with it.

[feudalson]

a 38 is a 38 unless your worried about badguys in body armor it should stop any intruder/attacker if you do your part and make it hit

[Katana8869]

I sure hope not. That is the ammo that is in all 4 of my snubbies and my house Taurus 627 right now. ;)

Here's a couple of pics from some water jug testing of one that was fired out of my 2 1/4" SP101. It penetrated 3 one gallon water jugs and expanded to .553. I'd call that more than acceptable.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f201/katana8869/wwb38p6.jpg

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f201/katana8869/wwb38p5.jpg

[Landric]

Shot placement and adequate penetration are both more important than hollow point design. That said, the 125 grain JHP/SJHP at .38 Special +P velocities (especially out of a snub) has always been a maybe yes, maybe no affair when it comes to bullet expansion.

The 158 grain LSWCHP tends to expand more reliably because its softer and doesn't have to have the energy to expand the jacket, just the lead. The more modern designs are manufactured to expand at lower velocities than traditional JHP/SJHP rounds.

There are better bullet designs out there for a snub .38, but if the WWB is what you have, I wouldn't worry about it. Unless, of course, you just want an excuse to change ammo. :)

[FireInCairo]

Thanks for the opinions. I tried some Hydra-Shok and some Gold Dots this weekend, but I can't afford to practice with that stuff. When I came across the WWB at literally 1/3 the price I bought up 400 rounds. I was planning to commit to using it as my practice and protection round, mainly because I want to be able to practice often without killing my wallet.

Thanks for the reassurance. When you search the subject, it's quite often that people dismiss the WWB 125 grain, but it's really just an exercise in splitting hairs between that stuff and the more expensive stuff. Plus, I'm a pretty good shot and I plan to really become better (and I agree that's the most important factor of all).

[S&Wfan]

I agree with Landric . . . shot placement and adequate penetration are most important.

After getting those two things right, any .357 diameter bullet will do the trick I suppose.

BACK TO SHOT PLACEMENT . . .
If you have a fixed sight S&W .38 Spl. revolver, keep in mind that they were traditionally regulated to shoot at "Point Of Aim" with a 158 grain bullet at normal defense speed ballistics. Also, the slower speed 148 grain Wadcutters shoot to P.O.A. too!

Generally, at defensive velocities, HEAVIER bullets shoot HIGHER than P.O.A. due to exiting the barrel SLOWER as the recoil lifts the barrel. Conversely, the lighter bullets shoot LOWER than P.O.A.

Thus, I recommend that you try several different bullet weights from the bench and see where they strike on your target. With adjustable sights, no problem . . . for you can adjust the P.O.A. of any bullet weight you decide upon. But . . . with fixed sights . . . ya better shoot what allows the gun to hit where you want the bullet to go . . . or you won't have the bullet placement.

Hope this helps!

Oh yeah . . . this '64 Model 36 snubbie shoots exactly at P.O.A. with 158gn. LSWC (IMHO the classic .38Spl. load) and with 148 grain flat nose wadcutters. Thus, these two loads are what I shoot in this particular specimen. Needless to say, I have a LOT of confidence in this snubbie . . . all five shots into a 1" black square, standing/unsupported at ten yards.

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/363/363373/folders/277718/2248828Firsttarget.jpg

YOUR RESULTS MAY VARY! Each specimen "likes" different bullets (makes, shapes, and weights), and thus groups better with specific makes/weights/types. Part of the fun is finding out what shoots best in each gun.

[FireInCairo]

I really need to do some research to develop some sort of practice regimen to adhere to. I mean, should I practice at a variety of ranges, or should I just practice at longer range (assuming that if you can hit something far away, closer stuff would be easier). One of the gun ranges I went to only had markers up to 25 feet, so it's hard to tell how far it is beyond that.

[C-grunt]

I have heard on multiple occasions that testings have shown the WWB HPs to be fairly reliable expanders. I think it would work great for you if your gun likes it. I prefer heavier bullets in my guns because I like good penetration. But the lighter weight rounds tend to expand more, so theres always a trade off.

[ArchAngelCD]

As long as the Winchester ammo is accurate in your gun use it. As for practice distances, start at 5-7 yards and when you can hold a tight group move back. I practice with a snub nose revolver out to 25 yards. If you can shoot well at that distance you are fairly well covered.

For practice try this, shoot 5 rounds into a 5" circle in 5 seconds from 5 yards. When (or if) you can reliably do that let me know and I'll give you another to try. (not my drill so I won't take credit) I find that difficult to achieve with a 2" revolver but it's great practice and forces you to concentrate on everything you are doing.

You can find tons of practice drills on the NET that will keep you busy for years so buy a lot of ammo. (or reload like I do)

Welcome to the forum...

[jwr747]

I have heard comments from several of the "nationally known" firearms instructors on their training drills.just about all drill on 7yds.into 1yd. keeping in mind stuff happens beyond 7yds. but most altercations are within arms reach. jwr

[Low Budget Shooter]

Dear F.I.C.,

The conclusion I came to a while back was that our snubbies do not allow the JHP ammo to reach sufficient velocity for reliable expansion. The LHP bullets, on the other hand, especially the Remington, are made of such soft lead that they will expand reliably even at snubbie velocities.

So I bought one box of Remington LSWCHP (FBI load), and shot one cylinder full to make sure all was well. Then I put another five in the gun for carry, and I practice with the cheapest 148gr LWC or 158gr SWC I can find or reload.

Hope that helps!

LBS

[NG VI]

They are the ones with a good bit of exposed lead at the tip aren't they? Should be fine, if you do want to find some of the 135+P Gold Dot short barrel cartridges a seller on Gunbroker named Sellforless has had them for a long time with outstanding prices on 50 round boxes. Only sells them in groups of 250 or 500 though. I bought a 250 pack last spring for $65+ten or so for shipping. Much better than buying them in the 20 round boxes.

[BCRider]

. . . all five shots into a 1" black square, standing/unsupported at ten yards.

I salute your skills and sharp eyesight. My old guy eyes won't let me see well enough to see a 1 inch black square sharp enough.... not to mention that my old guy nerves can't hold the gun steady enough.

My own group at that sort of range is a bit over twice your group size.... on a good day... and assuming de-caf... :D That's some damned nice shooting SW'.

[kmrcstintn]

they were in pops S&W 642 airweight revolver before I did a recent switch for him to Winchester 110gr Silvertips (non +p) cuz he's developing arthritis; they are now in my S&W 642 along with 3 speedloaders and 2 bianchi speed strips that support my little noisemaker ;)

[freakshow10mm]

Would you want to get shot with it?

Then it's plenty for self defense.

[charleym3]

I'd use it if I couldn't come up with a good hollow point.

[LeonCarr]

I chronographed that load in my 4" GP-100 and in my 2.25" SP-101. In the GP it averaged 1075 fps (I believe the factory advertised velocity is 945 fps) and averaged 955 fps from the SP's shorter barrel. IME it would take some pretty stout handloads to equal those velocities. The previously mentioned 135 grain +P Gold Dots average 870 fps from the SP.

The load is also pretty accurate, shooting groups under 2 inches at 50ft out of either gun.

It would suck to be you if you got shot with it :).

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

[logical]

I don't really worry about different ammo not functioning in a revolver once I've run a dozen rounds thru it the way I would an auto....so why not get one box of the best HP ammo you can find, run half of it thru the gun, set half aside for carry or HD and then practice with a similar (bullet weight and velocity) cheap round?

[FireInCairo]

I want to get super comfortable with the same kind of round. I dunno, I tend to agree that I wouldn't want to get shot with one. Plus, I have 5 rounds to actually shoot if I had to. I think I'll be fine. If I can't do the job with that, it's likely no handgun would have done the job.

[pmeisel]

Fire, I practice for hunting as well as for SD, and just for fun too... my routine is a couple cylinders at 25 feet, a couple at 50 feet, a couple at 25 yards, and then 50 yards, 75 yards, and 100 yards if I am at a range that has that.

If I want to do more shooting after that I usually use competition targets at 50 feet -- often competing against my son for score.

I always shoot a few at short range, but I think like you said, if you can score at long range, short range won't be a problem. On the other hand, if your gun/load/proficiency keeps you from reliably being on target at a longer range, shorten up to what you can handle. Keeping a cylinder-full on a paper plate builds confidence that you can kill what you need to.