Problems with a Sig P232


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iscareliberalsandlikeit
March 3, 2009, 08:58 PM
Hi all, this will be my first post ever on any forum. I recently bought my wife a SIG P232 after a little diliberation on a (ha) Smith and Wesson PPK. It was definitely a informed decision. Using everything I could gather on the internet/range/local shops the SIG was excellent choice. We were very happy with our purchase untill we got the thing to the range. A round would stick on the feed ramp about every other shot. We were firing Winchester white box 95gr flat nose FMJ. It seemed if I racked the slide back and "assisted" the slide forward the round would then chamber. I'm not wealthy enough to use premuim ammunition for the breaking in point of the gun. Not the highest quality, I understand this, I tried blazer brass and remington FMJ round nose also. The Remington seemed to be the best but still jammed at least one or twice a magazine. I probably have about 150rds through this gun. The feed ramp seems a tiny bit rougher than I'm used to. I thought of maybe very, very lightly rubbing the frame part of the feed ramp down with some FLITZ and cotton buffing cloth on a dowl rod. Anyone with similar problems? Any suggestions?

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Frandy
March 3, 2009, 09:25 PM
Welcome to the board. I'm sorry that you're having trouble with the 232. Frankly, this shouldn't be happening. I've owned 232s and quite a few other Sigs and I've never experienced any problems to speak of.

And, it isn't the ammunition.

I assume the 232 is somewhat clean and lightly lubricated.

How many magazines did you get with it? If more than one, do these problems happen with all the mags?

Are you certain that the magazine is seated completely when you fire it. No insult intended. Just asking.

Did you buy this 232 new? If so, get Sig to fix this problem.

If the gun was bought used, do you know who you bought it from? Was it represented as trouble-free?

Shouldn't be happening.

Starcheck55
March 4, 2009, 06:07 AM
recoil spring might need some breaking in. I'd rack the slide a few hundred times and see where that gets you. Good luck and keep us updated.

johnnylaw53
March 4, 2009, 07:09 AM
This is the reason i gave up on semi-auto for small carry weapons. we went to auto's back in the 80's first one was a beretta then later they issued us sigs both great weapons i began looking for a small auto as off duty but after many went back to a j-frame for my off duty-back up needs. Just seem in my life the small auto's no matter how well they are made seem to give some problems.

be safe

2nd 41
March 4, 2009, 07:42 AM
Frandy has the right questions. First call SigSauer and explain what's going on.
If you did not buy the 232 NIB that will explain why it was for sale.

I have a 230 & a 232. Both are flawless. Good luck with yours.

usp9
March 4, 2009, 09:29 AM
A couple suggestions for your consideration;

First, are you sure your grip isn't causing some misfeeds? The P232 requires a firm grip to allow the blowback operated slide to function at full force.

If by chance a firm grip solves the problem, you may want to invest in the excellent Hogue rubber grips for this pistol. They allow for a much more comfortable experience and reduce felt recoil as well as offer a firmer grip.

If it's a new gun, the springs are in fine shape. If used, then you may want to order a new recoil spring. Wolff sells a pack of three different weights.

The P232 rails likes to be lubed, especially the lighter alloy models. One of the light gun greases work well IMHO, and reduce wear on the softer alloy frame.

The fact of life is that your Sig may not work well with a particular brand of ammo. I too have had feed problems with truncated cone Winchester rounds, but no trouble with other rounds in the P232. I usually shoot Remington or Aquila for practice and without any misfeeds to my recollection.

I take this is a new gun...did you clean and lube it before going to the range for the first time?

If you have a used gun, make sure you clean the magazines too. Blowback guns are dirtier than others and require some extra effort in cleaning, especially with certain dirtier ammo.

mr.trooper
March 4, 2009, 04:19 PM
I had a P232, and the take down detent broke. the takedown lever would work loose from recoil, and i would have to re-seat it after every mag or it would start jamming.

sweet gun though.

iscareliberalsandlikeit
March 4, 2009, 04:42 PM
This would be a new gun. I purchased it from a sportsmans warehouse, 9mm kurtz (.380) in blued steel frame and slide with the stainless barrel in August of 2008 when I came back from deployment. It came with two factory magazines with the standard plastic floorplates, both equally malfunction. I'm a nut about cleaning my guns. I probably overclean them but a near complete breakdown allows me to look for possible part stress/failures. (If you asked my wife she'll tell you if I can't be shooting, playing with them is the next best thing. Could be true...) The malfuncion happens equally between my wife and I. Our diffrent grip strengths don't seem to affect the frequency of the jam, and the magazine seating I'm 99% sure isn't the issue. I used to have a russian makarov with a similar mag release that I would have to double check was completely seated lest it only fire once. I guess I have a choice - try to break it in with a couple hundred more rounds or send it back to SIG. I've never sent a firearm throught the mail, makes me nervous...1hour later...I spoke with SIG. Execellent custiomer service, they will have a pre-paid box to my house within a week. Gunsmithing repair times are running three weeks right now. I'm shocked it was that easy. This would be my first SIG purchase and the first time I've ever had a problem with a firearm new from the factory. Everything I've heard about the company pointed to their quality but I guess even the best make a lemon now and again. I'm a bit peeved about the whole thing, this was supposted to be my wife's carry gun, though after the problems, she bought herself a Ruger SP101. (I'm so proud.) There shouldn't be a need to send it back to the factory under any circumstance. I guess there are worse tradegies in life. (current ammunition prices) I'll keep everybody posted on developments. Thank you everyone for your replies!

Jed Carter
March 4, 2009, 04:46 PM
I have a SIG P232, and my tiny wife has similar trouble with it, but I do not. It is caused by a week grip and not having her elbow locked, not a misfunction of the firearm (usually). She has her own pistol, a Beretta Jetfire in .25 auto, and it is even worse at "catching" the spent case. What (usually) happens is the recoil causes the gun to jump (muzzel rise) excessively at a very high speed, fast enough to catch the spent case in the slide as it is ejected. A good stance, firm hold (not death grip) and a locked elbow should solve the problem.

PS: Stainless steel needs to be properly lubricated, as it is softer and more abrasive than other types of gun metals.

iscareliberalsandlikeit
March 4, 2009, 05:38 PM
The jam isn't a stovepipe jam but rather a hangup on the feed ramp. Failure for the round to completely make it into the chamber.

Winston_Smith
March 4, 2009, 07:14 PM
I bought one of these for my wife as well. We use WWB FMJ and have not had any problems. My only gripe about is how difficult it is to cycle the slide.

2nd 41
March 5, 2009, 07:39 AM
My only gripe about is how difficult it is to cycle the slide.

Racking the 232 is a problem. My 230 is a smooth racker....the 232 is brutal. I'm thinking of calling Sig to recommend a different recoil spring

usp9
March 5, 2009, 08:03 AM
My only gripe about is how difficult it is to cycle the slide.


Do you cock the trigger first? Doing that helps.

Pilot
March 5, 2009, 09:44 AM
I think the above poster means cocking the hammer first. And yes this will make it easier to rack the slide.

usp9
March 5, 2009, 12:23 PM
I think the above poster means cocking the hammer first. And yes this will make it easier to rack the slide.

I was just testing you.:rolleyes:


You passed. ;)



Trigger, hammer, double consonant, ends in "er"...I was close. God help me, growing old is Hell.:banghead:


Thanks Pilot. :D

2nd 41
March 5, 2009, 09:40 PM
I think the above poster means cocking the hammer first. And yes this will make it easier to rack the slide.
__________________

Still brutal. 5 star hard as heck to rack with hammer down. 4.5 stars hard as heck with hammer back. The slide serrations are light...very hard to grasp.

Pilot
March 5, 2009, 09:44 PM
Trigger, hammer, double consonant, ends in "er"...I was close. God help me, growing old is Hell.


Thanks Pilot.


Hey, anyone that can put up with the traffic around Fairfax still has to be very sharp. :D

osteodoc08
March 6, 2009, 03:16 PM
Wife has a P230 that has been a joy to own. I suggest letting SIG fix it and then enjoy the heck out of it. Don't get rid of it.

I will sometimes get teased about bringing the "girly" gun to the range (by my buddies) but it is a joy to shoot and is very accurate. She always comments on it when she sees it in the movies, etc.

The slide on hers is like butta, esp with some Wilson combat grease and a drop or two of remoil.

MadMercS55
March 6, 2009, 05:12 PM
I own 2 P232's and my wife has one as well. One of mine is a newer half german/half-U.S. made with removable front sight. It feeds everything I've put through it so far, 200rnds total mix of JHP and FMJ. My older one and my wife's are all German made/proofed. They HATE any form of JHP ammo. They run 100% with any type of round nose FMJ though. Haven't tried the cone shaped FMJ yet. My wife has somewhere over 2k through hers and the slide is darn near as smooth operating as my beretta 92 is. I believe these weapons are VERY tightly put together and often just won't work with certain types of ammunition. My U.S. P232 is noticeably looser and may be why it runs better with a wide selection of ammo.

jocko
March 6, 2009, 07:20 PM
How about a good polishing job on the feed ramp. Even though they look good a dremel and some flitz will put a mirror shine on that ramp, that is better than factory. Then lube it up with grease on the rails and just sit there and rack the slide about 500 times as fast as u can. This helps alot, without the bang and expense. They should shoot anything that goes n the pipe to. Good gun, just needs alittle TLC on ur part, and indeed as one poster stated, u could be limping that gun. Easy test is to let another good shooter try it, If he has no issues, then you know it is shooter error. If he has issues, and you have the ramp well polished, then indeed give sig a call and see what they say... I know some hat eto break a gunin,but sometime sit is necessary with semi, ANY SEMI TO.

TT
March 6, 2009, 08:26 PM
MadMercS55: One of mine is a newer half german/half-U.S. made with removable front sight...

I recently saw a P232 with a separate front post- these are partially built in the US?

usp9
March 6, 2009, 11:52 PM
I didn't think any P232 was made in the U.S. :confused:

TT
March 9, 2009, 01:49 PM
I e-mailed SIG and received a reply saying that P232s are manufactured in Germany. If anyone has different information please feel free to share.

MadMercS55
March 9, 2009, 02:04 PM
I contacted SIG when I purchased mine and was informed, the frame is made in Germany with the slide being made in Exeter. My weapon is also marked similar. No German indicators on the slide at all, only the frame. Mine also lacks the proof marks of the older P232 models. My slide finish is also nitron compared to the older blued weapons. From information I've read at other forums, I believe SIG intends to make the P232 all U.S. made sometime in the future.

usp9
March 9, 2009, 02:56 PM
I own 2 P232's and my wife has one as well. One of mine is a newer half german/half-U.S. made with removable front sight.

MadMercS55,
Are you able to post a picture of your newer P232 with the removable front sight? Are the slide serrations also different than your other pistol? What is the date code of the new one? I'd be very interested in seeing that pistol...I'm a huge P232 fan. Thanks.

MadMercS55
March 9, 2009, 03:48 PM
I attached 3 pics, my photo skills are totally lacking but hopefully they capture the differences in slide serrations and front sights. The new front sight is held in place by a small roll pin and when removed, the sight slides right out. I'd like a front night sight but the factory doesn't offer such yet. The older P232 is completely German made and proofed, slide and frame serial numbered. The newest one has serial number on the frame only, and German indicators on the frame only. From reading I understand my newest one is supposedly a transition model leading up to the possibility of an all-american production P232. Supposedly they want to relocate the mag catch as well in future production. Not sure if that version will ever surface though with the advent of their newest 1911-ish .380 incarnation.

metallic
March 9, 2009, 03:50 PM
The jam isn't a stovepipe jam but rather a hangup on the feed ramp. Failure for the round to completely make it into the chamber.

Maybe an extractor problem?

TT
March 9, 2009, 03:51 PM
MadMercS55: My weapon is also marked similar.

I suspected as much from your previous post. Iíll bet the person who answered my e-mail didnít have the full story. I've noticed that P232 picture on the website doesn't show the new front sight either. The new black sight is easier to see compared to the old silver integral sight (for me).

usp9
March 9, 2009, 04:12 PM
MadMercS55,
Thanks, the pics were great.

iscareliberalsandlikeit
September 7, 2009, 02:33 AM
Sent it back to SIG. Got it back a few weeks later. Polished feed ramp and replaced slide lock lever? I don't recall it having a slide lock but OK...I'll update when I get it out to the range.

nyresq
September 7, 2009, 08:55 PM
My agency rcently authorized the 232 for off duty carry. We have had trouble with almost every one the guys have purchased untill they get 400-600 rounds through them. When they are brand new the slides are very rough and the machine marks are very pronounced on the slide rails and we think this is causing the slide to slow down along with a not so polished feed ramp and hood.

We (the field office firearms instructors/armorers) have come to the point that when the guys purchse them, we are telling them to put 500 rounds through them before they come to qualify with them We are also telling them to shoot them very wet for the first 100 rounds, then thoroughly clean and lube as normal for the next 400.
Since we started telling them this we haven had one failure to feed or any other type of malfunction on the range with the 232.

Put a few hundred rounds through it before you condemm it to hell... most likely you will be surprised how much better it shoots and cycles when you hit that 500 round mark.

iscareliberalsandlikeit
September 13, 2009, 11:56 PM
.....<<< six weeks later >>> :) The factory replaced the slide lock lever and (big shocker!) polished the feed ramp. They claimed to have fired 50 Prvi FMJ's through it with no malfunctions. I've yet to take it to the range but I'll soon see and be posting my results.

Lonestar49
September 15, 2009, 04:55 PM
...

Having owned one for a year (then sold it) as I found out they get dirty, real quick, and just like you, using FMJ 95gr ammo, I would get jams, be them stove pipe or FTFChamber,

1. IF the gun was not well lubricated and clean. It would start to jam each mag, each load, after the 230 round fired mark, and complete cleaning was needed, and no jams until the same aprox round count (due to the dirty blow back action)

2. Feed ramp must be checked and cleaned before firing and one can use Flitz Gun Polish on the feed ramp, it will help a lot with proper, full, chambering, once you start getting up and near the 200 - 230 round mark.

3. KEY: make sure that you have the long "return spring" on Correctly..

Ref: << small end/larger end >>

3a. smaller diameter end goes on first, leaving larger diameter end to flush up against the end of the slide.

4. Same deal with dirty mags (round count) as the first 1/3 of the interior walls and follower get "real dirty with spent powder and need cleaning.

I found that using a product called EEZOX, both cleaned the mags interior walls and spring, and gave them a bonded coating, making metal to metal contact slippery, helped "considerably" and got my gun to go the distance of 230 - 250 max rounds before it got just too dirty and a feed jam would start to occur..

Directions on cans and use very little as this stuff goes a long ways.. used right.. Less IS more, believe me.

Get all this in order, and as mentioned, the 232 is not forgiving of a weak grip or limpwristing, especially as they get more dirty with use..

Round count is your friend, keep an ongoing count so you'll know when its getting near, as you don't want to be at 200 rounds and then "really need the gun for a HD/SD situation..

I trusted my gun after I got it all together, but sold it for a SA EMP SAO 1911 9mm, 9+1, and have never looked back.. fyi

Luck,


Ls

Ps.. Because they like to run wet, rails and guides, all the time, the oil gets mixed with the spent gun powder and when it "cools down", it turns into a sticky goo, which is part of the price of owning/operating a blow-back-action gun and why you must clean it thoroughly, at the "round count" you will make note of, by keeping a count in-between total cleanings.

Slip Shooter
September 16, 2009, 12:14 AM
I have a Sig 232 also, and am plagued by the problem of not hanging up on the feed ramp but, hitting it mid-center and pushing the bullet deeper into the case on each round chambered. It always feeds the round properly into the chamber with any ammunition I have tried. The thing is utterly reliable but, the bullet set back is an issue I have to live with. I have had visible high pressure signs on fired brass. Setback seems to have been considerable. I have measured the over all length of the magazine fed rounds and bullet set back is between 5 to20 thousandths of an inch on the first chambering. I now never feed a round from the magazine into the chamber except when actually firing the weapon. My +1 round is always hand chambered.

The only solution to bullet set back is to use Premium Factory Ammunition with a cannelure at the base of the bullet. Example: 90 gr. Federal Personal Defense Hydra-Shok HPs.

I feel Bullet setback is a major issue with all factory issued Sig 232s.

Measure those rounds that are hanging up on the feed ramp and I am sure you will see bullet setback . Setback will be progressive as you continue to rechamber the same round from the magazine.

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