If an AWB happens, do evilrifle owners assume that they can easily profit?


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Ignition Override
March 4, 2009, 05:06 AM
I doubt that everybody who loses their job or has a real financial problem in the next two years will keep all of their guns, for example an 'extra' SKS, AR, AK, Mini, Cetme etc, to be quite frank. Pardon the distasteful subject, but am trying to evaluate what people are thinking.

My question mainly concerns speculators: are they planning to double or triple etc their money, in the possible scenario of a stricter AWB, when they all offer their extra rifles for sale at about the same time? I've read poster's nutshell descriptions of the previous, and it only concerned evil features, did it not?

Just an idle question, and there must be many unforeseeable factors in play, not just future ammo prices.
This is sort of new to me. I seldom ever used a gun until Oct. '07 (am 53) and never read anything about the subject, except media garbage.

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coloradokevin
March 4, 2009, 05:24 AM
Well, to begin this reply I'll have to acknowledge that this is a very hypothetical issue, as none of us really know what future legislation may be thrust upon us!

Nevertheless, some of the things you are saying do hold water, in some instances. During the 1994-2004 AWB, particularly in the mid to late 90's, I remember how expensive it was to buy an "assault weapon" in pre-ban configuration (perhaps $2,500-3,000 for some AR's, in used condition, in 1990's pricing).

It was certainly apparent that many folks bought up rifles in the months prior to the ban, in hopes of turing a tidy profit off of those items. As such, I could certainly see that happening again!

Of course, it is all a gamble. The big question to be answered is what a future ban (IF one ever occurred) would look like! The first ban was considered a failure by many polititions, on both sides of the fence. Another ban may not allow for the same considerations that the first one did (such as grandfathering weapons, or selling nearly identical weapons with a few cosmetic features removed).

Again, I must reiterate that this is all speculation, as none of us really know what legislation is coming, or what it will look like when it arrives!

U.S.SFC_RET
March 4, 2009, 07:38 AM
I never look to make a profit. I wanted to ability to purchase an AR.

I think that holds true for the majority of us. As always there are those who will want to profit.

Bill2e
March 4, 2009, 07:58 AM
Anyone who bought a gun on the hopes of profiting later buy a gun ban is just as bad as an Anti to me.

They would actually need to have a ban to profit and that makes me sick!

Hope for a gun ban so you can profit make you just as bad a Sara Brady herself.

I have bouhgt things just in case and I hope they all go down in value and are plentifull for years to come for me an fute generations to enjoy.

geojap
March 4, 2009, 08:38 AM
Knowing the gun grabbers, I would prepare for the worst. Now is their opportunity.

I have never bought anything speculatively in excess to resell later, however. Everything I own is for personal use, and I always make sure I have what I need.

To be honest, I would really be worried about the future, when the current generation of children, who are being taught to fear firearms in the public schools, are old enough to vote. The government and liberal academics have tried to brainwash them that firearms are unsafe. That is when an AWB will pass with ease.

moooose102
March 4, 2009, 08:52 AM
i would think that many are "banking" on it!

Zach S
March 4, 2009, 08:57 AM
I'll work a crappy payin full time job and a part time job as well before I go to selling guns. I have a few I might part with, but the EBRs are hear to stay.

Yes, crappy paying full time jobs are out there. A lot of folks wont work them though. Going from $18 an hour to $9 an hour is tough, and an unemployment check isn't going to be much less than that $9/hour paycheck, so I cant bitch too much about them sittin at home and gettin paid.

But to be honest, if I could afford it, I'd buy every AR I saw, just so I could flip them like they used to do in real estate.

Hope for a gun ban so you can profit make you just as bad a Sara Brady herself.
I dont think that many people bought EBRs in hopes of a ban so they could turn some coin, I think they bought knowing a ban was coming, and decided to use that to turn some coin. IMO its no different than investing in a promising company that's just starting up.

As for me, I'm a hoarder. I didnt try to dump any of my pre-ban stuff before the last ban expired. Some of it got traded with the gun it went with (at a loss), but I still have (and use) most of it.

Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
March 4, 2009, 10:06 AM
The answer is yes, many of them do plan to profit, after kicking themselves for not buying up mags and EBRs before 1994.

But there are also many who just want to buy to keep for themselves.

They'll come out smelling like a rose in the event of a "ban", UNLESS the ban includes a ban on transfers.

Atticum
March 4, 2009, 10:38 AM
Hell its your money, I see nothing wrong with taking advantage of a situation. No bodily harm inflicted, just putting bread on the table.

That said I am not in a position to do this, and I would encourage others to disregard exploiting a theoretical second AWB and pursue the far more important tasks of paying debts paid and stockpiling physical cash. If those two things arent a problem then hey - buy some ARs and go for it.

But be pessimistic. We are on what? The third attempt to keep citigroup afloat? The government is pulling every trick out of the hat they have trying to stop a global economic collapse. And the economy is still hemmoraging. We should all be doing some amount of preparation in case those efforts fail, and thats preparation of the cash under the mattress kind, not the black rifle, bomb shelter, "aint no law man gonna take my land" kind.

ArmedBear
March 4, 2009, 10:58 AM
I have never bought any firearm with the intent to resell it.

I've sold some, but that was because I tried 'em and didn't like 'em.:)

Bill2e
March 4, 2009, 11:28 AM
Hell its your money, I see nothing wrong with taking advantage of a situation. No bodily harm inflicted, just putting bread on the table.


I see alot wrong with hoarding supplies in hope that a ban will make them more valuable in the future. I see nothing wrong with buying up AR's & Ammo to make sure you have it (that is a different story)

However, buying with the intentions to profit after a speculated ban is BS! I hope like hell all those people get burned financially.

All they have done is drove the prices up on the rest of us & if there speculation comes true it means we have lost the battle and our children will not enjoy the same freedoms we have today.

Any gun owner buying soley to resell is as bad an anti IMHO.

erict
March 4, 2009, 11:52 AM
I tend to hoard stuff. I do trade stuff alot but I rarely sell stuff because I hate to see the quantity of my things drop.

Hypothetically...... if a ban were to come and I were out of a job and had to sell a few toys off I would sell at the current market value because that's just the way it is.

I don't like someone that just buys things with the sole purpose of profiting but if they want to do that it's their business. I'm not going to tell anyone what they can and can't do with their money and I'm not going to be upset if someone has more money than me to do it either.

deanadell
March 4, 2009, 12:11 PM
It amazes me that some folks that are so pro-gun are at the same time so anti-capitalist

Bill2e
March 4, 2009, 12:15 PM
Well I think we all would do what we have to do to keep our family fed. I'm not try to tell anyone what to do. I love capitalism, I just hope people are not buying & hoping for a gun ban so they could profit.

I would be quite happy if the 33round Glock 17 mag that I paid $40 for were plentiful and selling for $20.00 next year (then i could buy more)

Matrix187
March 4, 2009, 12:20 PM
I want the ability to buy a new big bad black rifle in the next 3-4 years. Don't care about profit.

Atticum
March 4, 2009, 12:35 PM
Bill2e-

Those who would do this are just like any other entrepreneur who opens a store and sells items that they buy wholesale. The store did not make the product, but they had the opportunity to purchase them at a price which they felt they could make profit on.

The possibility of a ban makes this more opportunistic. Opportunistic in that there is the possibility of a large enough profit to make it potentially worthwhile for the individual to add himself as a middleman and use the store as his wholesaler. This is gambling.

If you choose to play the part of consumer instead of supplier, you have several options. 1) Buy now, at inflated prices 2) AWB2 happens - Buy later at superinflated prices 3) No AWB2 - Buy later at similar or reduced prices. If you choose to stockpile now you are making that same bet that the guy who is buying for resale is.

If you look at the housing market as an example, its like buying a house in CA in 2005. You would be buying at the higest prices in history, in the most competitive market we've ever seen. You have to compete with all the house flippers and pay premiums.

If you buy now, and all the "flippers" buy now, and the bubble bursts (no awb) - you all lose.

But I dont think there is any moral decision when it comes to gun purchases and I don't think there is one for home purchases either. Especially for the individual. But there are smart decisions. Perhaps it not fair play for the actual gun retailer to jack up prices 500%, but if people are willing to pay that then it is hard to blame the retailer. The concept of "Just Price" was refuted in in the 14th century.

This is in contrast to food hoarding and similar need-based goods. There are people who buy massive amounts of rice and stockpile it. In the event of a famine, I would consider it extremely immoral for them to sell the rice at superinflated prices.

But we dont need guns and ammo to live.

Wait. What? :uhoh:

...damn, you might be right.

Acera
March 4, 2009, 12:42 PM
I could easily sell my DPMS lowers I purchased for $75 last year if I wanted to make a profit. Profit is not a bad thing, it is what drives a capitalistic society.

I have no problem sharing my love of semi-automatic rifles with others, if I end of making a dollar or two, whey the issue. I don't like selling anything for a loss, so don't expect me to.

I hope for the best, but prepare for the worst.

dbyrne
March 4, 2009, 12:43 PM
Even if you buy a gun solely for resale, that doesn't mean you are "hoping" for a ban. It could be considered a hedge. The ban goes through: at least you make a profit. The ban doesn't go through: maybe you lose some money but you are happy.

Atticum
March 4, 2009, 12:45 PM
dbyrne is dead on.

Funderb
March 4, 2009, 12:45 PM
if an AWB passes, how are these EBR owners going to make profit?
They more than likely wouldn't be able to give or sell these things to anyone, and they'd be stuck with the same ol boring plastic guns..

except if they own aks of any variety....

:neener:

3pairs12
March 4, 2009, 12:45 PM
You know the sad truth is that some out there are hoping for a ban. I have nothing wrong with making a dollar or buying something solely to sell. It is when somebody buys something hoping for a ban thats where I draw the line.

Bill2e
March 4, 2009, 12:50 PM
Damn computer crashed after typing a long winded response, so here we go again:

It amazes me that some folks that are so pro-gun are at the same time so anti-capitalist

I imagine this quote was aimed at me, First and foremost in no way am I against capitalism. Everyone has the right to do what they chose with their money.

I don’t care if you buy 10 AR’s just in case. Good for you, I wish I could.

I think buying them hope for a ban to double or triple your money is wrong. If people do this I hope they lose money when they have to sell them because there is no ban.

Like I said, I am all for capitalism and if a hurricane hit Florida and someone who lives in North Carolina decides to load up a Uhaul truck with generators at their expense, drive them to Florida and sell at a profit. I say great and thank you. You have provided me with a product that I need, but could not find elsewhere and you should be rewarded for your efforts.

On the other hand if that same person buys 10 AR’s @ $1000 each and IS HOPING FOR A GUN BAN so that they can sell for 2K each I hope they lose money. I find that type of thinking to be short sighted and wrong.

Sure they would make 10K in the short term, but lose freedoms that country was built one. That is much different than a gun shop buying all the AK’s they can and selling them today. I understand demand will make prices go up. No problem. People have choices they can buy or not buy.

To root for a ban just so one can profit is not capitalism. It is anti-gun & unethical.

I hope I have illustrated the point I am trying to make.

SHvar
March 4, 2009, 12:52 PM
Im sure there have been tens of thousands bought under the premise to make a profit at the expense of an AWB already, and it will go on.
Just look at the numbers of people who buy loads of popular items, leave them in the original packages, and sell them years later on ebay or craigslist.
Id say a big number of the newest toys that cause stampedes at stores are bought under the idea to profit later on.
The type of person which would do this to profit from an AWB would be the last person I would ever buy from, the lowest scum out there, the neighbor who shakes your hand and sticks a knife in your back with the other.
They are called parasites.

Atticum
March 4, 2009, 12:59 PM
Bill I think I understand you now. Agreed. Gun owners that actively hope for a ban so they can make a profit are awful. Its 4 steps backwards in the fight for 2nd amendment rights.

SHvar I hope thats not the case with inflated AR prices right now. I'd like to think the majority of the increased demand are people who woke up one morning, slapped themselves in the face, and said, "if I ever want one of these now seems like the time to get going."

I encourage you to consider dbyrne's post. Buying an AR as a hedge against the ban is not an ethical standpoint.

CoRoMo
March 4, 2009, 01:02 PM
If an AWB happens, do evilrifle owners assume that they can easily profit?

Yes. I'm sure I could, but I wouldn't sell a single gun if at all possible.

logical
March 4, 2009, 01:15 PM
I don't generally buy anything planning to sell it but it's a little easier to justify a purchase knowing it will likely be worth what I paid or possibly much more in the future. If that situation comes up, I will not lose sleep over charging whatever the market will bear.

3pairs12
March 4, 2009, 01:17 PM
"if I ever want one of these now seems like the time to get going."

I too hope this is the case because I am partially guilty of that. I woke and said if I am going to get another AR I better hurry up. Oh yeah I am also going to need many more mags uncase they are unobtainable in the near futre.

Bill2e
March 4, 2009, 01:32 PM
3pairs, you are no diffent than many who said laet me get this now "just in case"

That is reasonable & prudent.

Like Logical said, it is noce know that current purchases most likely will hold their value.

phoglund
March 4, 2009, 01:33 PM
As for me, if there is another AWB...the last thing I'm going to want to do is sell what I can no longer buy! I guess I perceive another AWB as a step towards needing these guns for the true purpose of the 2nd Amendment.

Zundfolge
March 4, 2009, 02:18 PM
It amazes me that some folks that are so pro-gun are at the same time so anti-capitalist
Thats been one of my complaints about the RKBA community for a long time.


At any rate, buying guns to sell later for profit may fall under the ATF's definition of "doing business" so for those of you doing that, be careful ... would hate to see more kittens stomped.

Duke of Doubt
March 4, 2009, 02:30 PM
During the AWB, I didn't even consider buying a "pre-ban" rifle. Why pay two to three times, even more, for a gun just to have a flash hider, a bayonet lug and a folding stock? Sure I put a folding stock on my SAR-1 when the ban expired, but that development didn't exactly change my life.

Magazines? Tons of AK magazines came in during the ban.

The AWB was a total failure, but all I've heard from pols is "reinstating it," not imposing other, confiscatory laws. It was a stupid law; pointless, ineffective, and a hassle, driving up some prices for some things, that's all. That's why it shouldn't be re-imposed.

I've already "profited" by swapping some autoloaders that had tripled in value for some Colt revolvers which didn't, but which eventually will, too, for other reasons.

Storm
March 4, 2009, 05:01 PM
A lot of this gun ban panic reminds me of a bunch of old women with their wash out on the line looking for signs of rain. First off, it ain't happening so soon, if ever. Second, for those guys buying up things that they worry about not being able to acquire down the road, more power to them, at worst you'll have some very nice guns that in time you would have bought anyway. Hopefully your buying hasn't taken food off the table or put your home into foreclosure. To those buying with an eye towards profit, so be it if you end up taking a loss.

skidooman603
March 4, 2009, 07:43 PM
+1 Storm. Buy or Don't buy. Shut the Hell up. If ya have the $ and want to gamble go for it. If not just enjoy the Guns ya own and Quit bein Chicken Littles.

Art Eatman
March 4, 2009, 09:35 PM
Enuf. Guns & $$$ will be seen differently, but we don't need a bunch of ranting about it.

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