[280PLUS]

yesterdays (10/5/03) New York Times front page.

the caption is : Street Equipment. An undercover officer has outfitted his Walther PPK with a metal coat hanger to hold it in place in his pants.

sorry about the quality of the pic

how many glaringly obvious things do you, as an educated gun owner, see in this picture.

do you think the police were wise in showing this to the general public on the front page of the new york times?

which means a criminal or two may also see it and learn a new method of concealment, among other things?

i'm not going to say what i see yet, i want to see if anyone else picks up on it, or am i just losing my mind.

i'll point out one thing you cant see in the pic, the serial # on that gun is clearly visible on the slide.

next,,,

m

[BamBam]

Was this actually in the Times....and on the front page?

Wrong on so many levels.

[El Tejon]

280, been around a loooong time. Around here started with the Blackstone Rangers and BGD.

When I was in LE, saw a fax or two about "how to spot bangers" and I believe the Jamacians were doing this. Don't know if they stole it from the Chicago gangs or what. Maybe the copper is Undercover Brother and does not want his "cover blown" so he does this silly thing to blend in.

This is jackleg carry, plain and simple. Dangerous to the carrier. Which, if the thugs are doing it, does not concern me in the least.:D Coppers SHOULD know better.

[PeteyPete]

http://graphics7.nytimes.com/images/2003/10/05/nyregion/05guns.xlarge.jpg

[SARGE700]

I like how the hanger is in the barrel!:eek:

[Tamara]

how many glaringly obvious things do you, as an educated gun owner, see in this picture.

Well, for starters, he's trusting his life to a stainless Interarms PPK... :uhoh:

;) :p

[280PLUS]

tamara,,,

:p

[semf]

I read about the redneck version in Guns & Ammo a couple years ago. It's made with a shoestring. The article was called 2 cent holster

[Mr. Bombastic]

Please help guys, I don't really understand the picture. Does the hanger act like a pocket clip? :confused:

[El Tejon]

Bomb, fershizzle, dizzle.

[mattd]

That barrel has to be all screwed up now, and so what if criminals will learn something?

[George Hill]

The cops learned this from the badguys.

It's called a "Jamacan Holster".

[Black Snowman]

Don't worry folks, the coat hanger has a silver "Tactical" coating ;)

[RTFM]

Tam, he might be a good candidate to add to you local SD.
We recently found out that they can't shot, just as add this guy to the roster and he can expand their catalog of dumb.

Sure would love to see him try to shoot that wit' da' hanga' still in.

RTFM

[jsalcedo]

What happens when the bullet hits the hanger?

I guess it would be time for a new holster...

[Standing Wolf]

Can't afford a holster?

[22x9]

5.. 8.. 3.. 4.. 7.. 9.. 1..

That SN sounds familiar....

Hey!! That's my PPK!! They said it was stuck in the evidence locker, awaiting a property decision and couldn't be removed.

Just kidding.. never been to NY. Hopefully never will.

:D :D

[Quartus]

The article was called 2 cent holster


Yeah, that figures. goes with a 2 cent brain.


Bombastic, you got it. I guess they assume that it will work correctly, or they have no idea of what would happen if the coat hanger is still in the barrel when they fire the weapon. Probably both. If it's a real 'ganger, we can hope they find out the hard way.

[Tamara]

What happens when the bullet hits the hanger?

The hanger stays in your trousers when you pull the gat out. It's a sorta-kinda variation on a holster idea used by the OSS back in dubya dubya two. You don't want to be caught by the gendarmes after having ditched your piece and then have them ask why there's a holster still on your belt, so various easily-ditchable IWB rigs like this were favored...

[280PLUS]

what if the hanger is shaped so that it stays in the barrel when the gun is pulled and fired???

notice the muzzle is pointing in a downward direction yet the "holster" is not sliding out of the barrel.

my bet is we're looking at a devastating piece of urban style shrapnel that could easily decapitate you if it gets you in the throat or face,,,eg.

i'm guessing, of course, but i think as long as the obstruction in the barrel doesnt cause a complete blockage, it will be expelled as opposed to the barrel exploding.

i won't be trying it to prove it however, thats for sure

you'll notice that, providing all goes well, it will exit the barrel with no injury to the shooter?

think about that twisted, tumbling piece of wire contacting you ANYWHERE at high velocity

this photo accompanied an article about nypd guys that buy guns from the bad guys undercover, they've lost at least 2 officers in the process

i say the caption could be :

"try to shoot me during a gun buy bust and THIS is what you've got waiting for you."

the general public hasn't got a clue but the gang bangers know exactly what it is and what it means.

just IMHO of course

i thought one of our techies would jump right on it, but maybe i've just talked to one too many vietnam nam vets.

with all due respect to each and every one of them,,,

:what:

[BluesBear]

notice the muzzle is pointing in a downward direction yet the "holster" is not sliding out of the barrel.

Notice the trigger finger, safely out of the trigger guard, pressing the "holster" against the frame. It has to or else you wouldn't be able to get it in your pants. You put them on as a unit since reholstering is near impossible.

[Tamara]

my bet is we're looking at a devastating piece of urban style shrapnel that could easily decapitate you if it gets you in the throat or face,,,eg.

No, we are looking at a "Jamaican" holster. Ask a cop about it.

i'm guessing, of course, but i think as long as the obstruction in the barrel doesnt cause a complete blockage, it will be expelled as opposed to the barrel exploding.

I think one would get a quick obstructed-bore test of the PPK if that thing were left in the tube. As far as worries about decapitation, I don't think a .380 has the wheaties to launch a 500+ grain projectile quite that vigorously, although I wouldn't want to try to catch it in my teeth or anything...

[Ol' Badger]

Wonder if it comes in Carbon Fiber?

:neener: :evil: :neener:

[280PLUS]

i see the finger,,,

but i still say what if???

will it be expelled or will the gun explode??

somewhere out there someone has to have pulled the trigger on a handgun with this "holster" still in it, whether accidentally or otherwise

i'm wondering if anybody here has heard of this happening and what the results were.

now, mind you, i'm not getting on the police,,,, undercover gun buying, they got big, brass,,,well,,, so i got nothing to say about their tactics

i just wonder that in a world chock full of uneducated gun owners whether it was a good idea to show this method to the masses, cause you just know some moron somewhere is gonna think its cool that would have never thought of it otherwise

and then if they pull the trigger with the thing still in there???

i know i've never seen anything like that before, but i'm only part city boy,,,

and all i can say is i wouldnt want to get shot with it that way either, yowch,,,

now wheres my that tin foil hat i had,,,those helicopters are out there again,,,

:)

[Orthonym]

Why can't we buy generously-cut trousers with large pockets made of stout fabric (the pockets) anymore? Is this one of the pernicious persistent effects of the WWII cloth rationing? Look at old movies; up until 1942 or so men wore suits roomy enough to conceal a full-size revolver in a pocket. Of course I have absolutely no sympathy for guys who wear their pants too tight, be they from Jamaica or elsewhere.

[280PLUS]

relaxed fit "our toughest work jeans",,,but i only carry a j frame,,,

i get them from cabelas

fyi

i recently bought some levis, thinking they were like they used to be,,,they were designer crap,,,:barf:

took em back,,,

:D

[BluesBear]

... will it be expelled or will the gun explode??

It will be expelled.

Yes it IS just that simple.

Accuracy of the deflected bullet will most likely be terrible but even the lowly .380 exits the barrel of a Walther PPK at over 850fps with over 175ft/lb of energy.

IF you folded the hanger back over itself enough times so that it would fit tightly into the bore you would still need a hammer to force it in. For the barrel to explode it would have to be semi airtight AND the pressure created by the moving bullet would have to be more than the barrel could withstand.

Either way, doing so would defeat the entire purpose of the contraption.

[280PLUS]

wouldn't you say?

i was thinking it was the pressure created between the fired round and an airtight plug that caused the barrel to rupture but didn't have that established as fact,,,so as long as some pressure can escape the barrel will not rupture,,,thanx m

i have a feeling the round would probably shatter as well as some of the hanger wire, it would be messy, no doubt,,,