pointing bullets


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taliv
March 9, 2009, 04:25 PM
ok... there's a pricey piece of gear in the latest sinclair catalog (which is worse than crack for me) that is for 'pointing' bullet tips and then trimming the meplats.

it makes quite a claim: that extensive research has shown that this tool improves the BC so much that these bullets shoot .75 to 1.5 MOA flatter at 1000 yrds (that's quite a lot!)


has anyone used this tool?
read any articles or heard about this extensive research?

here's a link to the product's page http://www.whiddengunworks.net/pointingdie.html

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Howard Roark
March 9, 2009, 08:43 PM
Well, it's kind of like the old Anschutz ads: Shoot an Anschutz, or get beaten by one.

There has been substantial testing done down here in Georgia at various ranges and I can tell you that pointing bullets is the way of the future. John Whidden (National LR Champion) perfected a pointing system and Jim Hardy (1000 yard record holder) have paved the way of the future of LR bullets.

The results are true, you get about a minute more from a pointed bullet vs non-pointed.

We can't read well down here in Ga so we have to rely on real world testing to see for ourselves.

Don't believe me, believe Sierra. (http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com/2008/12/22/sierra-introduces-new-308-155gr-palma-bullet/) This is a sorry attempt to point bullets by the way. Them taking on the pointing process is a direct result of an AMU shooters recommendation. A chosen few has been shooting brown box Sierra test bullets for test since last year.

moooose102
March 9, 2009, 10:21 PM
i know that i know nothing about 1000 yard shooting, but why not just shoot pointed bullets like the hornady a-max? or some other polymer tipped bullet (if one is better than the other)?

The Deer Hunter
March 9, 2009, 10:40 PM
Well, I don't know what you wouldn't want them pointy. :confused:

:neener:

taliv
March 9, 2009, 10:47 PM
moose, that's not a bad question.


thx for the info Howard. I guess i'll have to start saving up then...

Horsemany
March 9, 2009, 10:48 PM
I saw the bullet pointer in the Sinclair catalogue too. I assumed it changed the bullet prifile. I don't see how you could point a hollow point bullet which most target bullets are. The hollow cavity is deep so I don't see how it could be done. I think it reduces the ogive making them more like Berger VLD's or Hornady Amax's. Extremely high b.c.'s.

Eb1
March 9, 2009, 10:49 PM
moose, it isn't a bad question, but bullets like the Sierra MatchKing being a hollow point has less drag than the A-Max from my understanding.

Double Naught Spy
March 9, 2009, 10:57 PM
moose, that's not a bad question.

Right. Why buy bullets that you have to fix when you can buy already pointy bullets?

moose, it isn't a bad question, but bullets like the Sierra MatchKing being a hollow point has less drag than the A-Max from my understanding.

So hollowpoints have less drag. Does that not mean that they have a lower BC?

Eb1
March 9, 2009, 11:01 PM
I am learning myself, but from what I have read the hollow point in Sierra MK bullets help give a higher BC.

They come pretty pointy, but when you use your seating die (like me, I want to load, but don't have a comp die) you might flatten the nose of the bullet some.


I am not a scientist, and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn last night.

Horsemany
March 9, 2009, 11:02 PM
That's been a source of discussion for years. Many believe a hollow point forms an area of low pressure in front as it flies through the air. They believe this forms a more perfect meplat than any man made object. That's the whole idea behind hollow point target bullets but I'm not sure I'm sold. I've never shot an Amax that didn't shoot better than the equivalent Matchking.

Eb1
March 9, 2009, 11:05 PM
I have had the complete 180 on A-Max verses MatchKing. I shoot better, and my rifle shoot better with MatchKings than A-Max bullets from my experiences.

I for one believe in the hollow point theory. I think that hollow pointed projectiles shoot better. Be it in pistol or in rifle.

Horsemany
March 9, 2009, 11:10 PM
Not trying to start a war MK's vs Amax's but I think the difference in performance may have more to do with other qualities than just hollowpoint vs non. The meplats on MK's are never the same. The are not nearly as consistent in weight or length than Amax's either. That doesn't mean MK's can't be more accurate for some guns/loads as your experience proves.

MinnMooney
March 9, 2009, 11:26 PM
from Original poster - Taliv -
these bullets shoot .75 to 1.5 MOA flatter at 1000 yrds (that's quite a lot!)

Take a .308 target/tactical rifle shooting 168gr Sierra Match King HPBT bullets at 2900 fps. If it's "zero'd" at 100 yds. (most common for tactical) it will drop approx 34-35 MOA st 1000 yds. A diff of .75 - 1.5 MOA less is pretty small. According to my ballistic program, 1000 yds is 34.2 MOA of drop. It's 33.5 MOA at 990 yds. Your range finder had better be accurate or that 3/4 MOA means nothing.

It doesn't take much in the B.C. rating to make quite a difference in down-range trajectory. From 0.465 to 0.480 could make 1-2 MOA difference at 1000 yds.

That tool is designed to make bullets even more consistent rather than more drag resistant - even though it achieves both.

Eb1
March 9, 2009, 11:28 PM
Not trying to start a war MK's vs Amax's but I think the difference in performance may have more to do with other qualities than just hollowpoint vs non. The meplats on MK's are never the same. The are not nearly as consistent in weight or length than Amax's either. That doesn't mean MK's can't be more accurate for some guns/loads as your experience proves.

I totally agree. That is why I mentioned my exp. and my gun. Definitely.

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