Update on the GSG 1911.


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Demitrios
March 11, 2009, 12:11 PM
I just gave American Tactical Imports a call and got an update on their GSG 1911. They have not released their pistol anywhere else in the world yet, which means we'll be getting some of the first ones, stateside. Their planned release date is late November/early December of this year, the pistol will be coming with 1 magazine and a 2 yr warranty. They've designed it to be fully interchangeable with other 1911 parts, specifically grips, safeties, back straps and magazines. The specs are as follows:

Model: 1911
Caliber: .22lr
Capacity: 10+1
Barrel Length: 5"
Action: SA
Front Sight: Fixed
Rear Sight:
Overall Length: 8.5"
Weight: Approximately 39.5 oz
Grips: Plastic Panel
Material: Steel Slide - Steel Frame
Finish: Blued
Grooves: Rear 6
Extractor: External

The estimated MSRP for this pistol will be approximately $350. Keep in mind this is ONLY an update, so changes may still be made. This information is directly from American Tactical's marketing department.

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D-Day
March 13, 2009, 10:58 AM
This is a very enticing .22. I'd like to own one. Would be amazing for drills and training, using a full size, same model handgun of the type you carry; but without the price of ammo.

XCastleX
March 13, 2009, 11:07 AM
i'd like one as well. i agree with d-day that it would be a great way to stay framilliar with a full size 1911 without emptying your wallet.

any chance you have a picture of it?

XCastleX
March 13, 2009, 11:08 AM
quick google search found one for me

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/1927/gsg1911ck8.jpg

highorder
March 13, 2009, 11:20 AM
That picture makes me think the frame is two-piece die cast.

I suppose that's ok, considering the application. If these are cheap enough, I may have to have one.

Maelstrom
March 13, 2009, 11:24 AM
Sounds like a plan.

It's a tough call, though, when you consider you can get, say, a Kimber .22 slide for less. Bear in mind that the slide can be shipped right to your door and you don't have to deal with transfer and shipping fees.

HisSoldier
March 13, 2009, 11:33 AM
Yes, assuming the feel and trigger can be brought up to good target 1911 standards, and that rear sight can be replaced with an adjustable type. I shoot in my shop into a trap, but limit the neighborhood noise impact to .22 LR, this would give me my favorite shooting platform in my shop.

nwilliams
March 13, 2009, 02:12 PM
If it proves to be as reliable as my GSG-5 as been then I will be picking one up for sure, especially if it sells for around $350!

mljdeckard
March 13, 2009, 02:17 PM
Hmmm. I already have a Ciener conversion for my Kimber, and I've been seriously considering building a dedicated frame for it. I'm not seeing a clear advantage from this one, although I am glad to see someone making an economical 1911 .22.

Crunker1337
March 13, 2009, 04:06 PM
Hey, this looks pretty nifty! Keep us updated.

Jason_G
March 14, 2009, 09:28 AM
That picture makes me think the frame is two-piece die cast.
Looks that way to me also.

Jason

robctwo
March 14, 2009, 09:37 AM
So far I like my Ciener, but with the SA Black Stainless frame and the updated ignition parts it's a $1,500 .22. That looks good for folks who don't have an extra 1911 frame or are new to the 1911.

Demitrios
April 1, 2009, 04:07 PM
Another update my friends and I'll try and answer all your questions in order. First off, this is aimed at Highorder and Jason G, it is not a two piece die cast, in fact it is modeled after a Colt 1911 (not the GI series) and is 80% interchangeable with other 1911's. What this means is that you can't swap out only the slide, guide rod, barrel or spring with a .45 and expect them to work. In other words, don't expect to put a recoil spring from a .45 into this gun and expect it to work (I know this sounds insulting to your intelligence since it's common sense but they told me this in order to cover their own butts). HOWEVER it is FULLY interchangeable if you swap out ALL of the parts I mentioned above. In other words you could say this gun is backwards compatible and turn it into a .45 from a .22. Put simply this gun is meant to be able to convert to a .38 super, .40 S&W (I believe, I did not ask) and .45. As such if you wanted to swap out the trigger, mainspring housing or tweak it in any way at all to bring it up to "target 1911 standards" then you can do that as freely as you would any other 1911. I saw a comment before that a Kimber conversion would cost less (I usually see prices floating around $300 give or take $30). Keep in mind though that if you buy this pistol for $350 you can convert it to a .45 for around $200, instead of buying a decent pistol for $600, or more, and converting it for $300. Also this gun and its parts are measured in american standard (inches) not in metric. If anyone else has any more questions I'll be more than happy to look into their R&D some more and see what I can find out for you guys.

Jason_G
April 1, 2009, 07:55 PM
Hmmm. I'd have to personally inspect one inside and out before I trusted that frame for handling a caliber swap. And what about the ejector?

Jason

Demitrios
April 1, 2009, 10:29 PM
I can understand wanting to inspect any pistol before buying it. I'm not sure about the ejector, but I'd imagine the extractor would be external (I'll find out later) and with a caliber swap would be. . . well whatever you'd like it to be.

Dan Crocker
April 1, 2009, 11:39 PM
I wish someone would make a .22 pistol that had a mag with more than 10 rds. :-(

xx7grant7x
April 2, 2009, 03:36 AM
I've got a gsg-5 "pistol" that takes 22 round mags......

kanook
April 2, 2009, 09:25 AM
ruger charger with a promag 50 round drum

Dan Crocker
April 3, 2009, 12:38 AM
Yeah OK guys...I mean a pistol that has the mag in the grip! :-)

vikz
April 3, 2009, 02:37 AM
I want one since i saw that pics some time last year..

2RCO
April 3, 2009, 02:47 AM
I'll be buying one at $350!

TG13
April 3, 2009, 03:02 AM
in the picture, you can see that the frame is actually a two piece cast frame.. if you look at the front of the trigger guard, you can see the countersunk hole for a Philips head screw.. it appears to be made in a similar fashion to the GSG 5 rifle.. which has a cast aluminum alloy frame that is also two piece fastened together with countersunk screws..

i highly doubt that this .22 1911-style pistol has very much to do with an actual 1911..

it's more of a converted airsoft, than a new designed .22 1911.. IMO..

it would be better to buy a RIA Tactical, and a Kimber .22 conversion.. again, IMO..

Demitrios
April 3, 2009, 05:07 AM
TG13, that's all well and good but keep a few things in mind, this picture came out quite a few months ago, meaning that whatever's in the pic is only for marketing purposes. Also, as I've said prior, the claim that it's modeled after modern day Colt's (not the GI models). But again don't take my word for it , go take a look for yourself when they come out. Also, I'm a fan of RIA's, I'm getting a 1911A1 very soon (to the tune of $320:D) so I'll support your decision for the conversion kit. But the bottom line is what they claim shouldn't be swept aside so easily, at least not until you get your hands on one and see for yourself.

highorder
April 4, 2009, 02:00 PM
Also, as I've said prior, the claim that it's modeled after modern day Colt's (not the GI models).

Great. That says nothing of it's construction. It's either a 2 piece die casting, or its not. We shall see. Like I said before, at the MSRP, it doesn't really matter.

Hostile Amish
April 4, 2009, 02:27 PM
It doesn't look like it's a very high quality build. I would buy it for around $320.

Demitrios
April 9, 2009, 04:41 PM
highorder it is a one piece cast.

Eightball
April 9, 2009, 07:02 PM
I don't see a role this could fill that my Kimber's .22 conversion does not. And I would be wary about buying it in order to convert it to a larger calibre, due to the differences in stresses involved.

TomT321
April 17, 2009, 04:41 PM
Ever since I first saw this a picture of this gun, I have been waiting for further word on it. I am on a "wait" list, but have not heard much since the first few posts on the GSG 1911. ANyone got an update?

Thanks
TomT321:confused:

Jason_G
April 17, 2009, 05:05 PM
So far I'm thinking it would be wiser to invest in a Marvel kit if you already own a 1911.

Jason

Demitrios
September 9, 2009, 02:11 PM
OK guys, it's been a while but I've just called ATI and they are still waiting on the GSG 1911 to be approved by the ATF and come stateside to them, which should be very soon. They're sale date is estimated to be December of this year (us Jersey boys looking to buy one better put in for our Pistol Purchase Permits now) and the price is now looking to be $360. In another month or two they'll be testing out the 1911's themselves and have a review for them. Good luck and happy shooting boys.

Rex B
September 9, 2009, 05:38 PM
great idea, don't know why none of the other companies are doing this already - except maybe Kimber.

I bought a Ciener Target kit, then bought a bare 1911 frame and built it up with good parts, beavertail etc. I have a nice gun with about $350 invested.

shooter1
September 9, 2009, 08:56 PM
I have a Ceiner conversion for 1911s and an Adavantage Arms conversion for Glocks. One of the advantages to this type of conversion is to have the same feel, operation, and trigger as the centerfire version. Using the centerfire lower for both configurations gives you that. For $300, a Ruger or Browning .22 pistol is light years ahead of a 1911 look-alike that is die cast from who knows what alloy and bolted together. IF, it is approved for import, I predict a lot of "Buyer's Remorse" in the making here!
str1
str1

Demitrios
September 9, 2009, 09:43 PM
All in all it's for the shooters to decide. However you said bolted together, which I assume you mean it's frame is two pieces, but marketing and sales told me otherwise. Plus it's meant to be retrofitted to .45 using whatever slide assembly you choose, so I would imagine (I'm NOT saying this is fact) that it will have a strong enough frame. I have all the specs posted on this post so feel free to look a little more. You'll know what GSG is trying to sell you soon enough and from what I understand not one bad thing has been said about any of their other clones.

DasFriek
September 9, 2009, 10:01 PM
OK i dont see putting this down before it even hits the market,the GSG-5 has been well accepted and liked.
I know lots of people who buy the Walther P22 or the Sig Skeeter and have BIG buyers remorse.Most those people bought them as they looked like a real gun,unlike the space fazers you see alot now in the .22 market.
Also the Armscor frames are cast the same as this also.
IF ITS RELIABLE it would be a big seller imo.
I prefer whole guns over kits as 1.5 guns isnt as good as 2 guns,in most cases anyhow.
Only time will tell and once its here and doesnt work then you can bash it good.

SaMx
September 9, 2009, 10:13 PM
I vaguely remember reading something from an ATI rep somewhere that the gun in the OP is not a working prototype, just a mock-up, and that the actual frame is not two piece.

I can't find it now, so don't hold me to it, but I think I heard something to that effect.

EdLaver
September 9, 2009, 10:29 PM
yup I have to have one of these :)

shooter1
September 10, 2009, 12:42 PM
I vaguely remember reading something from an ATI rep somewhere that the gun in the OP is not a working prototype, just a mock-up, and that the actual frame is not two piece.

I can't find it now, so don't hold me to it, but I think I heard something to that effect.
Wonder why they would have to make a mock-up? Seems as if there are plenty of 1911 lowers, both cast and forged that might be more representative of the finished product. If indeed the finished product is not two piece. The picture with the two piece lower has got to be negative press to anyone who's ever been in the same zip code with a real 1911. I suspect if this product comes to market, and the picture is representative of the finished product, a few will be sold to the unaware because it "Kinda resembles a 1911". At this point, I think it is dangerous to assume the lower can be used as a 1911 platform. I'll reserve final judgment until such a time as the pistol becomes available. I would welcome a safe, low cost & functional, 1911 style .22. Hope this is it!
str1

Tully M. Pick
September 10, 2009, 01:53 PM
I know lots of people who buy the Walther P22 or the Sig Skeeter and have BIG buyers remorse.Most those people bought them as they looked like a real gun,unlike the space fazers you see alot now in the .22 market.
I bought a Sig P220 SAO .22lr and sent off for the .45 conversion. The Sig was available for $400 a few months ago, but I see that they jacked the prices on them. Phew. $489 now.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/28/products_id/56477

Still, it's heck of a nice .22 conversion. Only one I've ever shot that didn't require a lot of tinkering to get to work the right way. There's a gent that makes replacement guide rods, springs, and mag plugs so you can fit 15 rounds of .22 in the mags, too.

https://www.collectors-society-slabs.com/shoppingcart/categories/Sig-Upgrade-Parts-%2AORDER/

The .45 conversion is great, came with night sights and a mag.

9mmepiphany
September 10, 2009, 02:14 PM
it's modeled after modern day Colt's

...so are airsoft models of the 1911

as a matter of fact, at first the picture looked like an airsoft

trigga
September 20, 2009, 06:12 PM
very sexy indeed, i'll wait for the reviews on this... wonder what kind of metal they used? hopefully not same as gsg rifles.

Crow1108
September 21, 2009, 10:54 AM
Sounds like a plan.

It's a tough call, though, when you consider you can get, say, a Kimber .22 slide for less. Bear in mind that the slide can be shipped right to your door and you don't have to deal with transfer and shipping fees.

That's what I was thinking. As a stand-alone gun, it's a cool idea, but for those of us with 1911's that we already own and carry, a conversion kit might be a wiser purchase. It's cheaper, it can be ordered through normal means, and it allows you to practice trigger pull with your existing platform.

Don't take this as me knocking this product. If I were in the market for a .22 pistol to plink around with and didn't already own a 1911, I'd be all over this.

Demitrios
October 22, 2009, 02:10 PM
OK, I've done a little more calling around, had a few more questions, a few which could not be answered and a few more that could.

The GSG 1911 will NOT be able to use any .22's except high velocity.
The magazines themselves will be aluminum and crafted by GSG themselves.
The action will work like the Cierners and Kimbers, not like the Marvel where the lower half of the slide is the action while the top half of the slide remains solid.
Surprisingly unlike conversions the slide will remain locked open upon firing the last round as well it utilizes a magazine safety (they intend for this gun to be California legal). Another surprise is that the slide itself is steel and not aluminum.
Since the extractor is external and the frame is supposed to be able to be converted I asked if an internal extractor was included, however the gun smith who developed it was out, more on that to come.
Three pistols have been made and one has been shipped to the U.S. for approval with the BATF and then the DOJ.
The ETA of this pistol is estimated to be around late December which is around the time test firing and reviews will be forthcoming.
It will be making an appearance at the SHOT show next year.

DanielW
October 23, 2009, 07:31 AM
This is good for someone who doesn't have a 1911 yet. For 1911 owners a conversion is a much better value.

gotime242
October 23, 2009, 08:13 AM
i hope a supressor is an options!

wally
October 23, 2009, 10:02 AM
The GSG 1911 will NOT be able to use any .22's except high velocity.

Conversions usually have the same problem, which is why I don't have one.

I think the Chiappa 1911-22 would be a better bet: http://www.1911-22.com/

Gunblast review: http://www.gunblast.com/Chiappa1911-22.htm

In the Gunblast review it worked very well with the cheap Federal bulk pack from Walmart.

Chiappa's web site says spare mags will be $20 which is competitive with other 10 round .22 pistol mags, whereas the conversions usually want ~$35 for spares, another reason I don't have one.

--wally.

shooter1
October 23, 2009, 10:39 AM
My Ceiner unit for 1911s runs fine with the Federal Bulk ammo.
str1

coppermouse
October 23, 2009, 02:12 PM
I would not get one of those airsoft like piece of junk guns, I have and recommend a 22 conversion for a real 1911

Demitrios
October 23, 2009, 02:28 PM
Well someone's an elitist. Apparently you don't read topics before posting either. If you did you would know that it's not an airsoft at all but a 1911 chambered in .22lr. But hey you must know a REAL 1911 when you see one so could you reccomend a REAL .22 conversion kit to go on a REAL 1911?

highorder
October 23, 2009, 03:24 PM
Easy on the hostility there, Demitrios.

By "real" 1911, he was referring to a centerfire, Browning link-actuated handgun.

You are either really excited about this product, or shilling for the product.

To be fair, you're incorrect when you say, "it's...a 1911 chambered in .22lr."

It will most likely be a straight blow-back .22lr, which operates differently than a true 1911. For what they are likely to charge, a conversion kit will be a more economical choice for those that already own 1911 pistols. If this is indeed caliber convertable to centerfire, it might be the a great way to get new shooters into the sport.

But hey, if the product is good, and the price is right people will buy. Either way, if you like it you can buy and enjoy one. Nevermind what anyone else has to say.

DAVIDSDIVAD
October 23, 2009, 03:40 PM
I agree with highorder, Demetrius.

Why are you so aggressively defending a gun you've never even been in the same room with?

Demitrios
October 23, 2009, 03:53 PM
I'm not defending anything so much challenging someone who throws a comment out there that doesn't benefit anyone, like it's law. Granted I am excited about taking a look at this thing it's not exactly like I own stock in GSG. I understand what you're saying about me being incorrect with my definition, but by that same rationale is there any 1911 that's a TRUE 1911 anymore? Most have scallops on the side behind the trigger, almost none use a spur hamer anymore, many have a beavertail grip safety, etc. And keep in mind in 1931 Browning designed a .22 conversion for his 1911, which means the 1911 that shot .22's pre-dates many other rounds that the 1911 fires. Keep in mind, I'm only nit-picking here, please do not take this as me trying to start an argument, I only want to show my, and other, sides to this picture and I've no aggresive feelings while typing this.

highorder
October 23, 2009, 03:58 PM
I understand what you're saying about me being incorrect with my definition, but by that same rationale is there any 1911 that's a TRUE 1911 anymore? Most have scallops on the side behind the trigger, almost none use a spur hamer anymore, many have a beavertail grip safety, etc. And keep in mind in 1931 Browning designed a .22 conversion for his 1911, which means the 1911 that shot .22's pre-dates many other rounds that the 1911 fires.

I understand that's all nit-picking.

I (as you know) was referring to the firearm community's acceptable definition of the 1911 clone.

I am merely suggesting that you don't get too excited before the product hits the market.

How dissapointed would you be if they turn out to be total crap?

shooter1
October 23, 2009, 08:20 PM
Got to agree that there has to be a hidden agenda here. I have never seen anyone hawk a product so aggressively sight unseen, to total strangers.
I fail to get excited by internet hype. If, and when, the product comes to market, we'll learn the true nature of the beast.
str1

f4t9r
October 23, 2009, 08:45 PM
Demitrios thanks for all the info. I will look into one of these models

Demitrios
October 24, 2009, 03:26 AM
Alright, basically I decided to start this thread simply because it's a pretty unique thing, a 1911 built for the .22 lr (the Chiappa hadn't come out when I started this thread). Yes I am excited to see this pistol come out and I thought that others might be excited as well so I decided to do a little work and keep people updated. Because one person posts an ignorant comment and I decide to call him out on it now I've got people thinking I have a hidden agenda. Alright, two things, you are all right and I am completely wrong. I concede that my comments were out of line, completely unwarranted and I've misused this forum the last few posts of mine. The other thing is can I get a moderator to shut this thread down? I've done enough posting and updating and if anyone else is interested they can get whatever other info they want themselves.

XavierBreath
October 24, 2009, 07:31 AM
Closed at the OP request.

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