[ny32182]

I started handloading about 14 months ago because I wanted to make my own match grade rifle ammo for AR15s. So far I have loaded rifle ammo only.

With the ever increasing cost of all ammo, I am starting to think that loading pistol ammo, even 9mm, may start to make sense from a financial perspective. (I am not looking for great accuracy or anything; most of my pistol shooting is IDPA from stock Glocks). I know that the process has some differences from loading rifle ammo, and I intend to start researching what might work for me.

I have a small stash of brass and will continue to grow it as opportunity allows. Some of it is nickel plated brass from factory Speer 124gr GD +P loads. Is this brass loadable, or should I discard it? Thanks,

[rcmodel]

Yes, it is reloadable.

There is not a great deal of differance between reloading rifle & pistol.

The main differance is, straight wall pistol cases require three different dies.

1. Sizing = just sizes the case.
2. De-priming / belling the case mouth = so the bullets can get started in the case.
3. Seating & Taper Crimping to remove the case mouth bell.

Some folks like to seat and then crimp in seperate operations, requiring a forth die.
But it is not necessary unless you just want to do it that way.

rc

[ny32182]

Thanks RC... Straight walled cases are revolver cases only, is that right? I believe I have read somewhere before that 9mm and other autopistol rounds are considered to be "tapered" cases? Does the basic process you describe work for those?

[Walkalong]

9mm, .40, .45 etc is straight walled enough to require 3 dies..IE. no shoulder, no neck.

.400 Corbon is a necked down .45 cases & .357 Sig is a necked down .40 case, and they can be done with two dies.

[rfwobbly]

9mm, .40, .45 etc is straight walled enough to require 3 dies..IE. no shoulder, no neck.

...as opposed to the Gubner Arrrr-nald, who has big shoulders and a big neck. :D



NY -
After loading rifle, you'll think pistol cartridges are only your warm-up items. It really goes fast. As opposed to rifle, you have to keep slowing yourself down to keep safety in check.

[ny32182]

So, what about dies/other equipment recommendations? I see there are "lube free" die sets for pistol? Do these work? Skipping the lubing and removing of the lube would make for a nice time saver.

[jcwit]

I normally do not lube 45's, 9's, ect.
Carbide pistol dies do not require lubing in straight wall cases.
I also cast my own bullets and use my own lube. There is usually a Very slight amount of bullet lube left on the case, makes for easier operation of the press.

[Thingster]

Do not not buy carbide dies for a pistol cartridge.

When i started loading .45 acp I was considering buying standard dies and saving $15. Instead I bit the bullet and went for it.

Trust me; carbide dies are worth every cent over standard dies.

[jfh]

"Do not NOT BUY carbide dies for a pistol cartridge."
(emphasis added).

That statement bears repeating.

You don't detail the gear you are currently using--but if you have been doing the rifle workflow on a single stage, it's probably worth it to get a separate turret press running once you figure it out. Likewise, a dispenser--with an adjustable charge bar, IMO, is a worthy investment.

Jim H.

[ny32182]

I have been using a Redding T7 turret; it has enough stations for dies for two calibers. I will get started on pistol with this press as well, and just run batches of 100 or so; I rarely shoot more than that in a session anyway.

I hand measure each charge as well right now, and this is rather tedious. I would like to invest in a powder thrower of some sort one day.

So, any set of carbine dies is good? My rifle dies are Hornadys; not sure if they make an appropriate set of pistol dies.

What about a case gauge? I use an LE Wilson go/no go gauge to check my rifle rounds.

[Thingster]

Carbide dies are carbide dies, another manufacturer makes nitrided dies, which are equivalent.

Deal is, not having to handle and lube those itty bitty cases will easily double your production, even on a single stage.

It takes me about 2 minutes to run a rifle round on a rockchucker once I get into it from a once fired case to ready to go again.

On the same press I can basically run one pistol round a minute, and that's with the extra sizing step.

[jfh]

I suspected that, given your 'match grade' comment, you were hand measuring. The mind set for building such rifle ammo is arguably enough different from those of us who shoot handguns that you might find 'production' mentality a bit unnerving--FWIW. Once you sort out your favorite load for economical practice, you'll want to replicate that many, many times, as opposed to the "individual build" I see in match ammo builders.

You can do fine with the Redding; I happen to be a Lee (Cast Turret) fan, but that's really irrelevant.

AFAIK, all mfr's dies are "good"--so buy Hornady's--but somebody should be along with more brand experience than I have to offer a better opinion.

Personally, I think I would pick up a cheaper dispenser now, like the Lee PPM bench-mount. It's quirky, and there is a bit of a drill for getting it running, but it would serve you for both types of loading at this point.

You can use your pistol barrel for a "MAX cart" gauge--but personally, I have Wilsons sitting next to my presses.

Jim H.

[ny32182]

Well, "match grade" may be a relative term here... I just wanted as much consistency as I could get with regular type components. I am not any sort of handloading expert and am not buying out Sinclair products or anything. Just looking to make good accurate ammo with match bullets for my ARs, for the cost of loaded plinking ammo, is what got me started handloading. It was a combination of looking for more accuracy, and looking for economy on those rounds.

With handgun, my motivation would be almost entirely economical. I am 100% satisfied with the performance of WWB in my 9mm's, for instance... the cost savings is the entire motivation with plinking handgun ammo. I would eventually be willing to make some concessions for that once I have a good load nailed down.

[smokey262]

After doing bottlenecked rifle cartridge reloading you will be delighted how quickly loading 9mm will be. With your turret press, the appropriate dies, and a press mounted powder measure it will allow you to make hundreds of rounds at one sitting rather than making 50 or 100 well crafted loads in one and a half nights after supper.

Do spend some time researching Glocks and reloads, especially if you are going to load non-jacketed bullets

[bullseye308]

With handgun, my motivation would be almost entirely economical. I am 100% satisfied with the performance of WWB in my 9mm's, for instance... the cost savings is the entire motivation with plinking handgun ammo.

In most places it is availability, not cost savings. I just like to take care of myself and have what I want when I want it and not depend on wallymart to have it in stock.

[Whitman31]

I'm fairly new to reloading handgun rounds. I found I had trouble when trying to seat and crimp in the same opp. I switched my process to include the extra step. Having loaded about 1000 rounds now without issue, I think I have a grip on what I did wrong and could switch back a 3 step process. It's definitely a different game than reloading rifle rounds, but easy enough to figure out. Good Luck...

[ny32182]

Does the LE Wilson gauge check for proper size as well as length?

I guess this works a little differently with a handgun round that headspaces on the case mouth rather than a rifle round where shoulder setback is what is important.

[Historian]

With a handgun, you can just take the barrel off and use your chamber as a sizing gauge. When I first started loading handgun (.40), I took several deprimed cases and practiced with my seating/crimping die. It took about ten tries but finally got it set up to where I get the optimum OAL and just a touch of taper on the crimp. I shoot an S&W auto and have not had a FTFeed or jam since I started shooting my own loads. Good luck and good shooting.

Historian

[ny32182]

For my Forster original case trimmer: it looks like I already have the right collet. What size pilot do I need for 9mm luger (the part that goes into the case mouth and keeps it stable/round while cutting)?

They have one that is ".355-356 diameter", and one that is ".358 diameter". I imagine I need the first one, but just want to be 100% sure.

[SSN Vet]

I had only loaded rifle and straight walled rimmed revolver cartridges untill a month ago.

Somehow I had it in my mind that auto-loader cartridges were going to be more difficult and require more care.... especially taper walled cases.

I set up a turret with 9 mm dies and carefully dialed everything in and am banging out ammo. fast and furious....

No big deal at all, once you've developed the knowledge base and skills, they transfer readilly.

[dmazur]

Does the LE Wilson gauge check for proper size as well as length?


From how they act, they provide a "dummy chamber". For rimmed cartridges like .44 Mag, there is a recess for the rim and the base of the cartridge should be flush with the gauge. For rimless cartridges like .45 ACP, there is a chamber shoulder at the correct distance for headspacing on the case mouth and the base of the cartridge should be flush with the gauge.

I believe the gauge can also be used for a maximum COAL check, but many load to a shorter dimension, so this isn't necessarily useful for all loads. For .45 ACP with 230gr FMJ, if you have the bullet protruding past the end of the gauge you also have magazine and chambering problems.

As far as sizing goes, I generally can't insert fired brass into the gauge, so I'd say it provides some kind of check on resizing operations.

[zxcvbob]

I never trim any pistol brass except .30 Carbine (for me, it's a pistol :) ) If you use carbide dies, you don't need any case lube (except .30 Carbine again.) A little mink oil on your fingertips as you handle your 9mm brass, so some of it transfers to the brass occasionally, will make resizing them a lot easier because of that taper. But it's not necessary.

Lee dies are good. Most of their presses seem a little flimsy to me, but I haven't seen their new cast steel presses yet.

I've been loading all my own ammo except .22LR and .30-06 for a couple of years, and it's satisfying to shoot ammo that I made myself (especially with my own cast bullets.) And I don't have to worry about all the stores being out of 9mm or .38 Special or whatever. I have dies and stuff for the .30-06, I just also still have lots of milsurp ammo.

Good luck finding primers!

[ny32182]

A couple more questions (and thanks for the info guys):

1) I presume you do eventually have to trim the brass. With rifle you do this after sizing since the sizing step is what makes the brass "grow". With pistol, part of the sizing step is "flaring" the case mouth to accept a bullet, right? If you size and then trim, are you cutting off the "flare", and then be unable to get a bullet in? Do you have to size, trim, then size again?

2) Checking for proper resize in the gauge: Once again, I check rifle brass size usually after sizing/trimming, but before loading. If you check the size of the pistol brass after sizing, but before seating/crimping, you still have a "flare" in the case mouth, correct? With a round that headspaces on the case mouth, does this "flare" affect the way it sits in the gauge? Is it best to just check the size of the loaded rounds, after the taper crimp, since that is the size they are going to be when they are chambered?

[zxcvbob]

Resizing and flaring are separate steps with straight-walled (or tapered) cases. You can trim before or after flaring; whatever works best with your particular trimming setup.

[jfh]

About trimming pistol brass:

1. These cases tend to shrink, not grow--and I know of very few who bother to trim their brass, ever.

I haven't trimmed .45ACP or 10mm for years. I might do that were I to seek a consistent, super-accurate load--but in 9mm, I'd have to own a Sig 210 to do that.

I did spend some time trimming up some of my 38/357 brass this winter, to get a set of 100 for some fine-tuned recipes. Even there, the need was minimal, and that was with single-headstamp brass of varying usage.

It is NOT correct to say that flaring the case mouth is part of sizing. Sizing (and decapping) is done at the #1 die. Flaring (and powder drop, usually) is done at the #2 die.

In the 38/357 example above, I trimmed after I had done a resizing and decapping run--but as I indicated, I consider trimming to be largely superfluous.

As for MAX cart gauge fit--a flared case will not fit properly in such a gauge, period. I have used a max cart gauge to check sized cartridges on occasion--but that really doesn't do anything, either.

So, use the MAX cart gauge for finished rounds.

Jim H.

[ny32182]

Ah... I think I see now. Thanks again.

[Mags]

No you can't use nickel brass for reloading you have to give it to me. Lol ,nah nickel is just plain pretty to me you can use it.

[1SOW]

No need to trim 9mm, .40 or .45ACP