Sig P220: Can It Take It?


PDA






Confederate
March 21, 2009, 02:13 AM
I have a S&W 645 that I love. It chambers anything I can stuff into the magazine and the steel frame makes it one tough hombre. My father, however, has a Sig P220 .45 that I despise. It pinches my thumb when I engage the hammer drop and when it's empty, it just goes clunk and it's hard on my finger.

My question, though, is, can the Sig P220 shoot +P loadings or should I get some standard loads for it? If I do go the standard route, has there been any difference in reliability or stopping power between JHP ammo and full ball (185 grain). I realize that neither is likely to expand, but I've heard that JHPs sometimes chamber better and offer better accuracy. My view is that ball ammo is ALWAYS bad, whether it's 9mm or .45.

Does anyone know?

If you enjoyed reading about "Sig P220: Can It Take It?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
chris in va
March 21, 2009, 02:17 AM
It will take +p fine. BTW 'full ball' is typically 230 grain.

and when it's empty, it just goes clunk and it's hard on my finger.

What do you mean exactly?

Confederate
March 21, 2009, 02:33 AM
I was thinking about getting some 185 gr. jacketed ball ammo or some JHP. The former is just round nosed stuff, nothing great.

http://georgia-arms.com/productimages/g45ac_med.jpg

As for the "clunk" when I pull the trigger, it's difficult to describe. It just shoots through my finger—a stiff jolt. Firing it doesn't have that problem since the loaded cartridges blunt the sensation. It's just too uncomfortable to dry fire.

BTW, do I have to change the spring on the Sig?

Thanks.

Tom Fury
March 21, 2009, 05:51 AM
4566? 4516? plentiful and fairly cheap on Gunbroker...
Satisfied with the Smiths: Cheers, TF
4506
CQB (PC4563)
4516
4513

RedAlert
March 21, 2009, 08:30 AM
You ask about the Sig holding up. During the gun trials for the US Army's replacing the .45, the Sig held up under 10s of thousands of rounds during durability testing. I don't remember the reason the Baretta was chosen, but I believe it was on cost basis not weapon reliability.

Ralph

Confederate
March 21, 2009, 02:23 PM
The Berettas are more appealing to me than the Sigs, but I have to admit I was disappointed with their early problems and Beretta's response to it. While working for the Navy, I talked to the acquisition manager of small arms for the Navy. He became angry just talking about how Beretta and the military tried to sweep everything under the rug. He talked about how they broke the guns down after 5,000 rounds and submitted them to all sorts of tests. Never at any point could they predict when any given gun was going to fail. No hairline fractures, no visible clues of failure—it just happened. He adamantly denied using machine gun or other ammo unsuitable for the guns and he came across as someone who knew what he was talking about.

It was a shame, because I loved the Berettas—the way they felt, the way they came apart and everything else. But to this day I don't know how robust the new Berettas are. I understand they fortified a problem area, but I just don't know.

I've heard nothing but good things about the Sig, but wanted to make sure that the frames can take the pounding of +P ammo.

If I understand correctly, it can.

http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/a/a4/SigP220Black.jpg/400px-SigP220Black.jpg

The Lone Haranguer
March 21, 2009, 02:49 PM
A P220 made after about the mid 1990s, with a rounded-tip hammer, green-painted, stranded recoil spring and reinforced frame, is rated for +P ammunition. While it would take an awful lot of this ammunition and I suspect your bank account would give out first, I don't think it would last as long as the Smith, which after all is a big hunk of steel.

I also question the need for +P in a .45 in the first place, but that is just me. :)

Retro
March 21, 2009, 03:24 PM
Yes, recoil spring painted green is rated for + P. Go look for traces of green paint on your dad's P220. If you have any doubts, you can always call up Sigarms and give them the serial and they will tell you. But either way, you should always change out the recoil spring for a new +P rated one after 2000 rounds or so. R

chris in va
March 22, 2009, 12:06 AM
Interesting. I just checked the spring on my 1995 220, the spring isn't green. So I can't fire +P in mine?

mtlucas0311
March 22, 2009, 12:26 AM
You mentioned that you thought ball ammo is always bad; I may disagree with that in the case of a .45. If your talking "stopping power" in regards to self defense, 230 grains of ball ammo is more than capable of dropping someone like a bad habit. I would agree that a round specifically developed for self defense (ie: hollow point) is better, but does it really matter if you get hit by a car at 60 as opposed to a truck at 60? I think that may be the point The Lone Haranguer is making.

Retro
March 22, 2009, 01:59 PM
If it is not green, then you need to get a green +P recoil spring. Call up Sig and ask them. But don't fire +P through it for now. And even if it is a green spring, it's been 14 years since it was made, and that spring would needed to be changed out anyways.

9mmepiphany
March 22, 2009, 03:24 PM
It pinches my thumb when I engage the hammer drop and when it's empty, it just goes clunk and it's hard on my finger.

i'm still a bit confused about this. can i assume that you're properly using the decocker to drop the hammer? which part is pinching your thumb? on a later post, you reference the trigger "jolting" your finger...but once the trigger has released the hammer there is no connecting to transmit force...am i missing something here?

an alloy framed 220 will have more recoil than a 645. a more comparable comparison would be the 645 vs. 220ST...very soft shooting indeed

Confederate
March 24, 2009, 12:49 AM
i'm still a bit confused about this. can i assume that you're properly using the decocker to drop the hammer? which part is pinching your thumb?
The part of my thumb that slips behind the decocker when I push down on it. It goes down, releases and goes back up catching a part of the fleshy part of my thumb. Hurts like hell. I have to concentrate on hitting only the edge.

My preference is for my S&W 645, which is one of the nicest guns I've ever owned. Beautiful, great balance, outstanding sights, tremendous strength and amazing reliability. The Sig feels like a toy in comparison.

9mmepiphany
March 24, 2009, 02:45 AM
My preference is for my S&W 645, which is one of the nicest guns I've ever owned. Beautiful, great balance, outstanding sights, tremendous strength and amazing reliability. The Sig feels like a toy in comparison.

i have liked every 645 i've ever shot...about 5...and have even given away 2 as gifts to folks who've done work for me, but i find their triggers "mushy". if you get a chance, you really owe it to yourself to try the 220ST...much nicer trigger

The part of my thumb that slips behind the decocker when I push down on it. It goes down, releases and goes back up catching a part of the fleshy part of my thumb

i've never had that happen to me. i never noticed that there was room between the de-cocker and the frame, i usually just press it down until the hammer falls and then let go and let it spring back up on it's own

MK11
March 24, 2009, 11:55 AM
If it's your father's Sig, what are you worried about? Why shoot it at all?

The P220 isn't as known for durability as 9mm Sigs but a reasonable amount of +P is fine. And if it's a 220ST, it will go as long as your 645.

skeeter_08
March 24, 2009, 01:33 PM
http://www.gunsprings.com/SemiAuto/SigArmsNF.html#Sig220

See attached link to Wolff Gunsprings for Sig P220 - skeeter_08

paul45
March 24, 2009, 02:02 PM
My personal believe is that the OP should question why he thinks he needs .45ACP in +P.

If you enjoyed reading about "Sig P220: Can It Take It?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!