"Printing" -- why care?

[ArmedBear]

I'm not trying to make a particular point. I'm just curious to hear various points of view.

I know some states have laws about "printing" but where I live, I can legally open-carry a holstered pistol downtown, so there aren't any legal reasons to avoid "printing" at all costs. Of course, I also understand that there are good reasons not to advertise that you're carrying in populated places, including politeness, tactics, etc.

However, barring extreme cases, I'd think that most concerns about "printing" assume that someone is looking closely. Maybe I'm wrong about that.

So...

How important is it to avoid "printing", to you, with a concealed handgun?

Why is it or isn't it?

Other thoughts?

[Mr_Rogers]

Laws have strange consequences.

In our state open carry is legal but licensed conceal carry must be just that, totally concealed, no printing.

Also, because of some (arguably improper) local restrictions in some cities you need a concealed permit to legally open carry - go figure.

[ArmedBear]

In our state open carry is legal but licensed conceal carry must be just that, totally concealed, no printing.

Wait... So (assuming you're licensed and following all other laws) if you pull your IWB holster out of your pants and hang it outside, from your belt, it's legal, but if you stuff it inside your waistband, you're breaking the law if someone thinks they can tell you have a gun in there?

Wow.

[Japle]

Printing isn't an issue at all, unless you're packing a big gun under a tight shirt. It would take something really extreme to get "made".

Last year, I carried a 4" M-29 under a Hawaiian shirt for a couple of weeks. I'm 5'9" tall and weigh 155 lbs, so the gun stuck out a mile. It looked like I had half a large steel grapefruit stuck to my side. The double speedloader pouch was almost as bad.

No one noticed a thing.

The fact is, people are too wrapped up in their own lives to pay any attention to you. No one's looking for guns. They don't expect to see guns. It doesn't occur to them that you might be packing.

Don't worry about it.

[Hungry Seagull]

We are not allowed to print in Arkansas. It's not a concealed weapon at that point in time.

So I use a Smartcarry for light summer wear and it's really deep concealed. Now if I could get some of that brass to print for the ladies.... :neener:

[ArmedBear]

How is the "printing" rule enforced, exactly?

I mean we all can guess that a Model 29 stuffed under a tight wifebeater would be "printing". But what about Japle, above?

[Hawk]

Texas does not have open carry and is obsessive about printing.

However, as a practical matter, it is Texas and many people don't care, probably notice and simply don't bleed from the ears like they might elsewhere (I used to live in NY and MD - can you tell?)

I even wonder about open carry - there's a restaurant I frequent where a largish fellow, 5' 20", I would guess, routinely wears what I've come to call a "BBQ gun" in full regalia. Nobody has ever questioned him though there's no, zip, nada, LEO indications anywhere - I think they simply assume him to be a Texas Ranger and go about munching their black-eyed peas.

Makes me wonder if those of us less suited to the rangers could simply invest in a thousand dollars worth of hand tooled leather, a couple of thousand worth of boots, a hat with an endangered species commemorative leather band and a 3,500.00 1911 and carry openly with impunity. The ability of folks to jump to a "gotta be a LEO" assumption seems boundless, if the accessories are right.

[CDW4ME]

I don't want to print; I'm legally carrying, but I'd rather avoid any negative attention. Like someone notices and the police are contacted to see if I have a permit, could cause a scene, might inconvience me.

[ScareyH22A]

I bet anyone can walk around in tactical 5.11 BDU's with black boots and carry a sidearm around and carry on with your business and no one would say anything. They'd probably glance over a couple of times and assume that you're a LEO.

[dairycreek]

How important is it to avoid "printing", to you, with a concealed handgun?

To me avoiding "anything" that lets others know that I am carrying concealed is of paramount importance. To go to the trouble to achieve an effective concealed carry and then give it all away by allowing printing (which is totally avoidable with just a little care) lacks both care and intelligence. To me it is very, very important that printing be avoided at all times.:confused:

[Mainsail]

I’ve never heard of it being a problem here in Washington. I was once read the riot act about concealed carry; a well rehearsed one at that, from a police officer. He went on and on about how concealed means concealed and even pointed to the word ‘concealed’ on my CPL. I then pointed out that I was not carrying a concealed pistol; that I was carrying it openly, and short circuited his lecture.

[waterhouse]

How important is it to avoid "printing", to you, with a concealed handgun?

I don't even really think about it. If we could open carry here I would.

[Rockwell1]

How important is it to avoid "printing", to you, with a concealed handgun?

Why is it or isn't it?

The only reason I could think of to worry about it would be it looks like you're trying to hide it and failing I could see some one thinking you're a criminal because of that.

But that IS pure speculation

[Iansstud]

I’ve never heard of it being a problem here in Washington. I was once read the riot act about concealed carry; a well rehearsed one at that, from a police officer. He went on and on about how concealed means concealed and even pointed to the word ‘concealed’ on my CPL. I then pointed out that I was not carrying a concealed pistol; that I was carrying it openly, and short circuited his lecture.


I have heard that the POlice are not fans of Open carry here in Wa, Yes o/c is legal here but still, I was just wondering about printing myself... I dont want to draw attn to myself but if it happens it happens...

[ArmedBear]

A couple of trainers who were cops for many years told our class that, while it's no big deal in rural or wilderness areas here, they didn't believe open carry is a good idea in urban areas.

Their reason was that, should you actually find yourself in a store, bank or restaurant that's being robbed, you will be the first target if shooting starts. If the robbers don't know you have a gun, you have a tremendous tactical advantage.

[CWL]

Just for sake of argument, the proper term is "concealed carry". Printing obviously removes "concealed" from this right.

Personally don't care whether or not you print since I'm not going try and rob you or break into your car or home, but if anyone is acting suspiciously , at least I'll be forewarned.

[Mainsail]

I have heard that the POlice are not fans of Open carry here in Wa...

They're not a fan of it anywhere. Printing is not illegal in WA, don't let them tell you otherwise.

[ArmedBear]

What I don't understand about what you write about WA is this:

If cops think "printing" is a bad idea (and many do, for what I see as some legitimate reasons), why don't they just say that?

"Sir, I'm not sure if you know this, but I could tell you were carrying a gun from a block away. From my experience, that could put you in danger. You don't know where my back-up gun is, and there's a good reason for that. We recommend more careful concealment, because it provides you with much more effective self-defense -- and it keeps you from being bothered by cops like me, too."

That wouldn't be a rude or bad thing to tell someone, whether or not he fully agrees with the cop.

[RDF]

I wonder if printing is really a concern of the general population. How many of them really do recognize that what "is printed" is actually a firearm? With so many folks with belt holsters for cell phones and PDAs I suspect the printing might be mistaken for one of them.

Expert witnesses, like LEOs, know the difference and I suspect would be the first to recognize the issue. Other CCL holders would fall into this category as well.

[CapnMac]

Hawkcome to call a "BBQ gun" in full regalia. Nobody has ever questioned him though there's no, zip, nada, LEO indications anywhere
Could it be he owns the joint? Business owners have had that right for some time; the new castle doctrine really reinforces it.

[Hawk]

Could it be he owns the joint? Business owners have had that right for some time; the new castle doctrine really reinforces it.

Anything's possible but he was just eating lunch with the rest of us with what appeared like family and left when he was done.

Guy could have gotten work as a Texas Ranger poster boy though.

Next time I see him I'm going to ask where he got the spiffy leather.

[Dark Skies]

What does 'printing' mean? I'm a foreigner.

EDIT: Oh wait. I get it now.

[highorder]

Printing isn't an issue at all, unless you're packing a big gun under a tight shirt. It would take something really extreme to get "made".

I put a North Face shell over my Sig P6 in an OWB holster the other day.

It printed so bad you could tell what model Sig it was thru my jacket. :D

[minutemen1776]

a largish fellow, 5' 20", I would guess

Five feet, 20 inches? That's funny. That's 6' 8" for those who weren't paying attention. :)

[ArmedBear]

Could it be he owns the joint? Business owners have had that right for some time; the new castle doctrine really reinforces it.


I'm amazed at how wildly different gun laws can be in different states.

This right has been specifically written into the law in California for a long time -- I think it's been there since the laws were made that limited open and concealed carry in populated areas. Hell, I think that it was even legal in DC (with extreme limits on the guns that a business owner could legally obtain, of course).

I guess it surprises me that it was EVER illegal in Texas for a business owner to carry in his/her own business.

I wonder where each state gets all the different ideas for what exactly is and isn't legal.

[CajunBass]

I never think about it. Open carry is legal here, and I practice it about half the time anyway. If someone happens to "make me" more power to them. From my experience, nobody really seems to give a hoot.

[searcher451]

Concealed carry means concealed carry. if you are printing, as in clearly printing, you are not concealed and could well be in violation of state law.

[Gryffydd]

Just for sake of argument, the proper term is "concealed carry". Printing obviously removes "concealed" from this right.

Not necessarily. It's a gradient. Printing could be anything from a very slight bulge that could easily be a cell phone, to the M29 under a tight wife beater mentioned above. At what level of printing do you decide it's no longer concealed? Or better yet, at which combination of a particular level of printing and an observer with a given level of observation is it no longer concealed? One level of printing may go unnoticed by everyone but a cop or a career criminal, while another is obvious to everyone around you.

Personally I'm not terribly concerned if my 1911 pokes a bump in my shirt when I bend over, or if someone sees the bottom of my holster when I grab something off the top shelf at the supermarket. Sure, absolute concealment is possible, but it can be difficult to get absolute concealment and still pass a Tueller drill.

[Mr.510]

I don't worry much about printing. I try not to because I want to maintain the element of surprise, but I don't sweat it. I'd rather print a little on occasion and have a really fast draw than be totally concealed and have a slower draw. When you need a gun you need it right now. I know I've printed quite badly from time to time and apparently nobody noticed. Living and carrying concealed in both Bellevue and Seattle for many years even the cops never seemed to notice, or maybe they just didn't care? I can't imagine that being the case here in Pugetropolis, especially the way I look.... Honestly, I look like an outlaw biker to a lot of people. :evil: Cops and security people usually look me over really good but nobody has ever said anything to me about my gun(s), even when I was printing in a mall that's posted "no guns". (For the record, those signs do not carry the force of law in WA). I've carried daily since 1990 and have spent a lot of time out in public. I guess nobody notices anything. :D

[MadMikeH]

I suppose printing can be some what of a comfort. On a recent flight from the west coast to the midwest I was seated several rows behind what I "assume" was a sky marshal or LEO. He was in an aisle seat and the guy next to him had to frequent the bathroom several times during the flight. Every time the guy stood up, the bottom of the holster peaked out and the glock was clearly visible. Made the flight a little more tolerable.

[camsdaddy]

I worried alot more about printing untill I got my blackberry. I have found that it prints more than my pistol. I do prefer to remain as concealed as possible so that the element of suprise remains.

[Snarlingiron]

Texas does not have open carry and is obsessive about printing.

I'm not sure where this comes from. The code in Texas regarding "printing" is so nebulously written as to be pretty much unenforcible.

GC §411.171.(3) "Concealed handgun" means a handgun, the presence of
which is not openly discernible to the ordinary observation of a reasonable
person.

Openly, ordinary, reasonable...all meaningless.

PC §46.035.(a) A license holder commits an offense if the license
holder carries a handgun on or about the license holder's person
under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code,
and intentionally fails to conceal the handgun.

INTENTIONALLY fails to conceal. Again so broad all one needs to prove is that the "printing", or even open display (shirt blew up) is unintentional.

I have been carrying for a long time and have many friends that carry as well as many friends and acquaintances in Law Enforcement, and I have never heard of anyone being tagged for "printing" in Texas. I'm quite sure it happens, but if you look at the number of concealed carry permits (314,574) in Texas, I'm betting the charges for failure to conceal are a fraction of a percent.

If you really look at the way the law is written for Texas all they are doing is telling you that you can not open carry except under specific circumstances.

When I first started carrying, it kind of bothered me. Now I never think about it. Have I been "made"? Probably. Do I care? Not in the least.

[Hawk]

^--- the obsessive part comes from CHL instructors. At least they haven't broken ranks yet but I've only been through one renewal so far.

As I noted, I also find it's largely theoretical. Nobody seems to care. The one time I believe I was noticed resulted in nothing more menacing than the Hooters associate bumping up against where the offending article was supposedly concealed. Repeatedly. And on every return visit thereafter, even when well concealed.

And given that I have a granddaughter the age of said associate, it's a given that it was just some "CHL kidding around". Can't say as I was the slightest bit troubled by the attention though.

Oh yeah, and a bank officer once pointed out that my "slip was showing".

I haven't tried the "Ranger Poster Boy" open carry yet but I don't have the build for it.

[ArmedBear]

INTENTIONALLY fails to conceal. Again so broad all one needs to prove is that the "printing", or even open display (shirt blew up) is unintentional.


Case law can mean a lot (in California, it has really limited the scope of some anti-gun laws). I don't know about the case law.

There might not be any. If nobody is ever charged with a "gray area" violation, then there isn't any.

As the law is written, though, it certainly sounds like what the authors intend to prohibit is someone sticking a gun under a tight t-shirt so it's clearly visible, on purpose, so he can use it to threaten other people.

Most states have laws that prohibit using a firearm to threaten another person except when that other person is committing, or intends to commit, a felony, or an assault, or some specific crime or crimes, with details varying from state to state.

However, carrying a gun that's intentionally "printing" could be a way to circumvent that law. "I never pointed the gun at my neighbor," wouldn't be a valid defense if someone was clearly threatening his neighbor by "printing."

I believe that, in Idaho, it is specifically illegal to return to the scene of an argument with an openly-carried firearm, even when holstered. The purpose of the law is the same: to make it illegal to use a firearm in a way that a reasonable person would consider to be an intentional threat. Normally, it would be perfectly legal to open carry in almost any situation or place, Idaho law and the state Constitution.

[kanook]

I find thst printing is alot easier to read then cursive.

[wyocarp]

I don't care if I print, or if the whole gun shows. Tactically, I don't care about since I feel open carry would prevent more issues from even starting.

[Eightball]

I care because I don't want people bugging me about it. I'm out and about to conduct my own freakin' business, not get continual questions of "What's that? Why do you need a.....a....GUN!!!", etc.

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

I really don't worry about it. I used to fret about it, but now I don't. I now have neither a legal nor psychological impediment to printing. Legally, if it's concealed, it's concealed. Just because it prints doesn't mean it's not "concealed". Psychologically, I care a little, but very very little. When my smartcarry band is hiked up past the top of my jeans in the rear, I have to wonder whether people take pity on the poor man who has to wear depends at such a young age. :p

[Glockman17366]

In Pennsylvania, it's not illegal to print. We're also an open carry state.
I prefer to carry concealed just because I don't want the attention (I'm pretty reserved unless I'm drinking...but then I'm not packing).
Anyway, I'll wear a vest over the gun (normally a Glock 19 if I'm carrying OWB), but if the gun is flashed now and then, I don't get excited.

[DAVIDSDIVAD]

Case law can mean a lot (in California, it has really limited the scope of some anti-gun laws). I don't know about the case law.

There might not be any. If nobody is ever charged with a "gray area" violation, then there isn't any.

As the law is written, though, it certainly sounds like what the authors intend to prohibit is someone sticking a gun under a tight t-shirt so it's clearly visible, on purpose, so he can use it to threaten other people.

Most states have laws that prohibit using a firearm to threaten another person except when that other person is committing, or intends to commit, a felony, or an assault, or some specific crime or crimes, with details varying from state to state.

However, carrying a gun that's intentionally "printing" could be a way to circumvent that law. "I never pointed the gun at my neighbor," wouldn't be a valid defense if someone was clearly threatening his neighbor by "printing."

I believe that, in Idaho, it is specifically illegal to return to the scene of an argument with an openly-carried firearm, even when holstered. The purpose of the law is the same: to make it illegal to use a firearm in a way that a reasonable person would consider to be an intentional threat. Normally, it would be perfectly legal to open carry in almost any situation or place, Idaho law and the state Constitution.

I don't think that's the reason either.
Here's why:
If a Texan walking up to his car in an empty parking lot, and there's a group of meanies hanging out around it, Texans are allowed to unholster the gun (not draw) and hold it chest heightm pointing somewhere safe all the while.
According to my CHL instructor, this is perfectly legal as long as you don't point the gun at anyone or anything( just keeping the gun flat against the chest, finger off the scary switch.)



EDIT:

I just thought about it, and that has nothing to do with preventing someone from threatening their neighbor with printing.

You might be right :)

[wyocarp]

I care because I don't want people bugging me about it. I'm out and about to conduct my own freakin' business, not get continual questions of "What's that? Why do you need a.....a....GUN!!!", etc.

I've NEVER been asked either of those questions and in fact I've never been asked anything while open carrying, not to mention "continual questions".

[bensdad]

I don't really care about it. If I print, I print. My wife oc's pretty often. Here in MN, we can carry either way. The only place I'm careful is in church. I make sure I don't print there.

[BlackHand1917]

"Printing" is such a vauge, elusive concept that legally defining it would be nearly impossible. Does any visable bulge constitute "printing?" Or is it an actual defined outline of a pistol. I don't worry about printing at all.

[usp9]

I don't worry about it. I use quality holsters, cover my pistols as best I can, and then get on with life. I've been doing it long enough that I've come to realize I'm not being personally scutinized by anyone who cares one way or the other.

[Snarlingiron]

Nice thread ArmedBear. Good discussion.

It's very nice to see a real discussion rather than "870's rule, Mossberg sucks", or "Which uber tactical Glockimberfield should I buy?"

[Deanimator]

"Printing" is a legal nullity in Ohio, which is an open carry state.

I take reasonable efforts to conceal, but I don't get ridiculous about it. I regularly have to expose my firearm in order to disarm and rearm when entering prohibited zones such as Post Offices and restaurants with liquor licenses.

The bottom line is, I don't worry about it at all.

[Revolver Ocelot]

when someone that isn't framiliar with firearms/carrying sees printing through a shirt i doubt they realize its a gun

[DAVIDSDIVAD]

Yeah, I've carried inside the house when there's company over, and I am probably printing as much as humanly possible.
Nobody ever notices.

Scared the crap out of my uncle when he lifted my shirt to give me a pink belly slap once, ahahah.

"WHAT THE HELL IS THAT!!"


That brings up "contact" printing, I guess you'd call it; when someone doesn't know you're carrying and inadvertently touches your roscoe.
My best friend and I were horsing around once and he playfully jabbed me in the stomach, nailing my 1911's hammer. He knows that I carry, so he apologized and rubbed his knuckles.

[Gunfighter123]

To me avoiding "anything" that lets others know that I am carrying concealed is of paramount importance. To go to the trouble to achieve an effective concealed carry and then give it all away by allowing printing (which is totally avoidable with just a little care) lacks both care and intelligence. To me it is very, very important that printing be avoided at all times.


I fully agree with the above.

[Gryffydd]

To go to the trouble to achieve an effective concealed carry and then give it all away by allowing printing (which is totally avoidable with just a little care) lacks both care and intelligence.
Yes, it is totally avoidable when you carry a .32 Mouse Gun buried away somewhere giving you a 2-3 second draw time. I'd rather trade off a tiny bit of concealment for a real gun that I can get to quickly. My 5" 1911 carried OWB has never gotten me unwanted attention. To me carrying an ineffective weapon in an ineffective manner shows a lack of both care and intelligence. I'm making the assumption that when you say "effective concealed carry" you're talking about effectively concealing, not being able to effectively utilize your weapon...

To me it is very, very important that printing be avoided at all times.
That's very nice. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion. What I'd like to know is WHY? What's going to happen to you if 1 person out of 100 even notices an odd shape and only 1 out of 100 of those people even consider it might be a gun? How is that worth the trade offs in effectiveness?

[ArmedBear]

To me carrying an ineffective weapon in an ineffective manner shows a lack of both care and intelligence.


There are times and places where it's necessary, and might be better than any real alternative. So I won't say it shows a lack of care and intelligence.

However, in general, I have to say I agree that it's ineffective to carry an ineffective weapon that's virtually inaccessible to its owner. There's a balance to be struck, and total concealment under all imaginable circumstances probably requires one to take measures that make the gun far less useful for defense.

[Gryffydd]

There are times and places where it's necessary, and might be better than any real alternative. So I won't say it shows a lack of care and intelligence.

I won't disagree with that. There is definitely a time and a place for deep cover concealment. I just couldn't resist the urge to play with dairycreek's words.

[Drail]

Printing can be very bad if you are observed by an anti gun cop. You'll know it when you meet one.

[Wayne02]

Put me on the side of those who don't care if they "print" (however that is defined). I obsessed about it for the first two weeks when first starting out many years ago but have never given it a second thought since then. I take reasonable precautions to conceal the weapon, but if the shirt gets pulled up and the gun temporarily exposed on occasion, oh well that's life.

In addition, I think many folks give the general public (including most criminals) far too much credit for being able to spot people who carry, be it through manner of dress, holster methods (waistpack) etc. All one needs to do is perform some people watching/observation to see that the vast majority of the population is amazingly oblivious to what goes on around them.

[SomeDude]

Wayne and Japle hit the nail on head. The general public is completely oblivious to what is going on around them. I'm 6'4'' 210 pounds and people would walk right into me if I didn't move. They're too busy talking on those moronic Bluetooths, yammering like mindless idiots. You think they're gonna notice the butt end of my pistol poking my shirt?

[AKElroy]

I am a Texas CHL holder & the law here defines a weapon as concealed if it avoids detection from casual observation. I carry a G27 in my front pocket, and IT PRINTS. 10 years, and I have never had a comment or a 2nd look. People do not pay attention. LEO's may notice, but in Texas, they ARE NOT casual observers. Covered is good enough, friends.

[Deanimator]

Printing can be very bad if you are observed by an anti gun cop. You'll know it when you meet one.
Maybe where you live.

I don't know what you think he's going to do in Ohio. This is an open carry state. I don't have to conceal AT ALL. If a cop here wants to violate my rights because I LAWFULLY carry, I'll gladly accomodate him with a formal complaint and a civil rights suit. He'll know ME. I'll be the guy standing in front of his house wearing a big grin as the Sheriff takes his furniture to auction off to satisfy the judgement I get against him (I'm UTTERLY opposed to settlements in such cases.).

[mgregg85]

The only people likely to notice "printing" would be criminals and cops because they are the only ones who would bother to look for such things. Other people will see the bump or outline and probably assume that its a cell phone or something like that.

Now you want to worry about "printing" because you don't want any undue attention or harrassment from the police and you really don't want a criminal to know that you have a gun.

[sohcgt2]

I agree with Japle, I am certain that most people are clueless about what goes on around them. If you painted an m-14 in candy stripes guys would ask you for a haircut rather than be concerned about you standing on a corner with an m-14. The only ones that will recognize the "print" are those under the age of 10, not BGs and not LEOs, but little kids will catch you every time.

[kmbrman]

Here in Texas the law in the concealed carry book also covers the subject of accidental exposure of a handgun. If somehow you are shopping say and reach too high up and accidentally expose your firearm ,because your shirt hiked up,the law says this is not a crime or an offence. Also if you leave your gun in plain view in an auto, but an officer who looks through your window cannot readily make out that it is a firearm you are OK. If it can be readily observed as being a firearm though, you are toast, and may lose you liscense!

[Diggers]

I really think printing is a non issue.

People have been sticking stuff to their belts now for well over a decade. Phones pagers sunglass cases.....what ever.

If someone happens to notice a bulge at the waste band of a person they don't even think about it, its totally normal these days. The last thing they would thing is gun.

Printing is a concept of a time gone by.

[Mike the Wolf]

Lots of people wear things under their shirts for various reasons. Some people wear an undershirt, some people wear a back brace (or an insulin pump, chemo pump, or any of various other common medical devices), some people let their shirt hang over their cellphone pouch (that's a big one). People put so many things on their belts these days that most people will assume it's a cellphone, a Leatherman, or something OTHER than a gun. Unless you're trying to conceal a full size Super Redhawk .454, you're probably not going to have a problem. With a little creative work, you could probably even conceal it. There's too many distractions in today's life for people to be thinking about things like that, and too many other possibilities that are much more common.

[catspa]

In WA since 1994, as I understand it, the holder of a valid CPL can carry concealed or openly. It's hard for me to imagine that if those are both legal, anything in between is going to present a legal problem with anyone except a badge-heavy cop looking for a hassle. We have a few of those, but not many, most cops here don't care unless you show some criminal intent, then they care quite a bit. Also, I haven't seen any case law that invented the offense of carrying "half-concealed". Perhaps justice4all can correct me if there is some.

I have .38sp and .357's that I can carry in a holster, in my pockets, down a boot, tucked around me here or there, and it kinda depends on where I'm going and how big a hurry I'm in which one I take and where I put it. I agree with Mr.510, accessability is more important to me than hiding it 100%. In addition, holding the sidearm in place while I hike, hunt, climb, or crawl is a big deal to me, as I tend to be, ahh... physically active, and having it fall off of me is undesirable, to say the least.

As far as friends fooling around with me and finding it, I don't think much of playfighting/faking a punch/wrestling around/slap-flapping, and my friends know it. I think it's kid stuff. If I'm with somebody who likes to do that, I tell them one time, politely, that I take it seriously. If they persist, I grab a body part and cause them some pain. Not a huge amount, just warning pain. I haven't had a need to go farther, at least with anyone I want to be around. But those who know me well, know that I carry, so it's not a surprise to them.

I live out in the sticks by choice, and guns are more accepted here. In my daily activities, probly almost half the people I see are armed in some manner, or their mother or brother is. Nothing special about me, I'm just another one. If anything, I'll be asked, "Whatcha packin' today? Is it that blued .38 you showed me before?" I can understand how it might be different in an urban or suburban setting, with more people milling around. Still, as has been mentioned, most people there don't notice squat outside their bubble.

Parker

[chuckusaret]

casual observation

Here in Florida if you print most people would guess it was a colostomy bag. I use to carry a KelTec in a leather case on my belt similar to a sunglass case but a bit larger.No one ever made a comment no did I get any looks by a LEO

[MedWheeler]

Though I've been out of LE since 1991, I still get mistaken for a cop a lot, even when there is no reason (other than that) to think I have a firearm on me. I take some solace in that. If I were to inadvertently print, or otherwise make my weapon's presence known, that's likely what anyone would think. The area in which I live has a lot of LEOs, firefighters, and EMS-ers living in it (I work in EMS now.)

[Mainsail]

Here in Florida if you print most people would guess it was a colostomy bag.

OK, that's funny.

[Japle]

Quote:
"Here in Florida if you print most people would guess it was a colostomy bag."

OK, that's funny.


Last winter my wife and I took our grandson to the "Medieval Knights" show in Kissimmee, FL. When you walk in the door, they want to take a photo so they can try to sell it to you later. The photographer's assistant was taking everyone's jacket; I guess they thought the pics would look better. I wasn't about to take off my jacket and reveal the Glock 19 on my belt.
The kid got pretty insistant. Finally, I asked him if he knew what a colostomy bag looked like. His eyes got big and he just barely kept himself from taking a step back.
When I saw the pic later, my grandson had a big grin on his face and my wife was looking at the ceiling.

[ScareyH22A]

I just received my Raven kydex IWB holster for my Kahr PM9 and it's too concealed! I can't get a grip on the handle to pull the pistol out! Darn, and I've been waiting 45 days for this. Maybe I'm trying not to print too much.

[jaholder1971]

In Kansas, concealed is concealed. Printing is what Josten's does to yearbooks at their Topeka plant.

It's a nonissue around here.