[Rxxdoc]

The only .223 ammo I can find is made by wolf. I have heard lots of bad things about this ammo. Squibs, double powder and the like. I don't reload so I don't care about the brass.

I know Wolf ammo is dirty, but has the quality control improved or should I still be leary of the stuff.

I have a Sig 556 and do not want to void the warranty. Would using Wolf ammo void my warranty?

Dumb questions, but they have been on my mind, and I don't want to hurt my sig.

Thanks.

[natescout]

I run wolf .223 ammo thought my ARs, haven't had any malfunctions or failure to fire(YET) :). But i keep my rifles clean and well lubed . it is little dirty, if you don't mind cleaning your gun a little extra, it shouldn't be a problem

[45B@cav]

+1 with natescout.

[Deer Hunter]

I run it through my Del-ton and my Saiga.

Its good stuff.

[gvnwst]

I use a LOT of wolf in my AR, it is fine. Most of the stories you hear are from people shooting improperly built guns, and ones they don't take care of.

[RyanM]

Squibs and double powder? Sounds like some people have been making stuff up just for the sake of pooh-poohing a brand they don't like.

The main problem with regular Tula and Ulyanovsk Wolf is that it's usually not very accurate at all, and it causes some guns to jam.

Two reasons for the jamming. One, steel doesn't seal against the chamber as well as brass, causing a ton of fouling to accumulate (which a lot of people superstitiously blamed on the laquer, causing Wolf to switch to polymer, which seems to rust much easier than the old laquer). Two, earlier Wolf .223 was incredibly underpowered, something like 62 gr at 2700 fps from a 20" barrel, so it would barely cycle the action of many guns. The low chamber pressure of those loads may have also contributed to chamber fouling.

Stick to newer Wolf and clean your chamber thoroughly before shooting brass-cased ammo, and you'll be fine.

[briansmithwins]

I've run thru 2k of Wolf with no problems.

It's dirty, inaccurate, dirty, and underpowered. Did I mention it's dirty?

That said, I keep soem Wolf around. If the rifle will function with Wolf, it'll work with any ammo.

BSW

[dat2]

I wonder if the low chamber pressure was because the steel didn't expand out to the chamber like brass as well as the fouling?

[nalioth]

THe problem is:

The internet amplifies "bad news".

One story from 10 years ago on a BBS that is negative will still be referenced when people today ask about that subject.

It is human nature to love the 'bad news' and ignore the "good news".

Wolf has been imported here for years, if it were as unsafe as is "commonly known [on the interwebs]", I don't think that would be the case.

[maskedman504]

How could you put double the amount of powder into a cartridge?

[Rxxdoc]

"How could you put double the amount of powder into a cartridge?"

Yep, I did say "Dumb" questions. LOL.

[Mikee Loxxer]

First off any reloader will tell you that you can't double charge a .223 case (there isn't enough room).

Second if you want to know what violates your rifle's warranty you should read it. A copy of the warranty should have came with the rifle.

[mljdeckard]

I use Russian ammo in Russian guns.

[Avenger29]

I run Wolf ammo in my AR no problem.

The cost savings easily cover the replacement cost of an extractor every so often.

Keep your rifle well lubed (with any ammo) and don't use Wolf for serious use. The polymer coated Wolf is fine. It's the old lacquer coated wolf that caused problems.

[W L Johnson]

Bushmaster even said Wolf was ok in a list of good ammo to use that came with my two bushmasters. But they didn't say if they meant wolf gold (brass) or wolf steel. :confused:

[Deer Hunter]

Wolf Gold is repackaged Serbian stuff.

[aka108]

Not a thing wrong with it. Run it thru a Saiga and a Howa 1500. No dirtier than most other stuff.

[wyk]

Yeah, I think Wolf works ok like any other brands in a Saiga. ARs I am not too sure.

[WNTFW]

I think the real problem with it is I can't reload it. (Steel Case).

At least it is easy to separate out from the brass.

[W L Johnson]

Wolf Gold is repackaged Serbian stuff.

I've heard it's good stuff.

[cal74]

I've been shooting Wolf in my Winchester Featherweight for years and have never had a problem. Either the 55g SP or FMJ shoot very well in it.

It saddens me that I have several boxes with a 3.00-3.50 price tag on them :(

[Deer Hunter]

Not saying the serbian stuff is bad. It's my main hunting load in all calibers except 7.62x54R.

[WardenWolf]

The very earliest Wolf was poor quality. That was only the first couple batches, though. Everything since has been some of the best inexpensive ammo on the market. Most of it may not be match grade, but it's up there with most commercial ammo types. Their customer service is reportedly very good, too.

Hilariously enough, someone ran an accuracy test on match-grade .22LR bullets. The Wolf ammo came out on top.

[Avenger29]

Wolf Gold and Wolf Match .22 ammunition is NOT the same stuff as the steel cased ammunition from Russia. It only shares the name.

[rcmodel]

How long do you think Wolf would or could stay in business in the U.S.A. if they were in the habit of selling ammo that blows up guns?

There is a line of lawyers behind every tree in their front yard, just waiting for something like that to happen so they can sue them.

I don't care for, or shoot Wolf steel-case ammo, because I reload, and I want brass Boxer primed cases.

But I certainly wouldn't be afraid to shoot it if I wanted too.

rc

[benzy2]

How long do you think Wolf would or could stay in business in the U.S.A. if they were in the habit of selling ammo that blows up guns?

There is a line of lawyers behind every tree in their front yard, just waiting for something like that to happen so they can sue them.

I don't care for, or shoot Wolf steel-case ammo, because I reload, and I want brass Boxer primed cases.

But I certainly wouldn't be afraid to shoot it if I wanted too.

rc

Beat me to it by 20 minutes. Ignoring the performance and how good or bad it shoots there is no way it could continue to be sold in the US if it was dangerous. This country is so litigation happy that if a safety problem existed it would certainly be the end of any ammo manufacturer, or at least their US sales. It is safe to use, though it may be bottom barrel performance wise.

[sernv99]

if this brand of ammo is inaccurate, why even bother using it? I mean, don't you want to actually hit something with your rifle? or are you more into the "spray and pray" fun type of shooting? Buying a $1500 rifle and running inaccurate ammo through it really defeats the purpose of the rifle to begin with.

[benzy2]

I shoot my AR a lot at 25 yards and less in rapid fire. 1/2 MOA is the same to me as 4 MOA. Why pay more for a difference I wouldn't see. It isn't my paper punching round or hunting round but for blasting/up close work it does more than fine.

[maskedman504]

if this brand of ammo is inaccurate, why even bother using it? I mean, don't you want to actually hit something with your rifle? or are you more into the "spray and pray" fun type of shooting? Buying a $1500 rifle and running inaccurate ammo through it really defeats the purpose of the rifle to begin with.

Ammo is not inaccurate. It can be made with a varying degree quality control, specifically in regards to the load. The higher the quality control, the higher the consistency of the ammunition.

Are we shooting water melons at 500 yards here or paper targets at 100? :o

[Avenger29]

if this brand of ammo is inaccurate, why even bother using it? I mean, don't you want to actually hit something with your rifle? or are you more into the "spray and pray" fun type of shooting? Buying a $1500 rifle and running inaccurate ammo through it really defeats the purpose of the rifle to begin with.

The Wolf ammunition is more than enough accurate for training purposes (i.e., going to a class, practice, plinking). Uses that do not require stellar accuracy. We are not talking about shooting for groups from the bench. If you are using Wolf steel case and trying for the best groups...you FAIL. Not all "rapid fire" is "spray and pray" either.

[Deer Hunter]

If I took a single round of Wolf .223, then stuck it in a cloning machine and made 5 more PERFECTLY IDENTICAL rounds of Wolf .223, the gun would be the breaking point, accuracy wise.

Accuracy is about consistancy.

Wolf shoots just fine in my AR and AK, and I average 4-6 MOA from either rifle with the ammo. My AR and AK both shoot better than that, but I cannot.

[sernv99]

what's the extractor lifespan when using the Wolf steel vs good ole' brass cased?

[MD_Willington]

My Saiga eats it just like the JSC & HSM reloads I have

[WardenWolf]

what's the extractor lifespan when using the Wolf steel vs good ole' brass cased?

Same as with brass, as long as you don't shoot steel then shoot brass afterwards without using a chamber brush. Don't mix ammo types between cleanings and you'll be fine.

[ndh87]

Wolf is fine, run it, dont worry about it. Just have to do a little extra cleaning

[RyanM]

if this brand of ammo is inaccurate, why even bother using it? I mean, don't you want to actually hit something with your rifle? or are you more into the "spray and pray" fun type of shooting? Buying a $1500 rifle and running inaccurate ammo through it really defeats the purpose of the rifle to begin with.

"Inaccurate" in this case means 5" groups at 100 yards. That's still plenty for cheap practice, and most people I see at the range are hard pressed to keep all their shots on a 2 foot wide target at 50 yards, no matter what they're shooting.

[41magsnub]

My RRA AR likes wolf .223 just fine up to about 200 rds. At about 200 rds every round will stick in the chamber until I hit it with a spray of CLP and a chamber brush. I can tell when it is coming when the fired brass er.. steel.. starts getting a heavy residue on it. Then it is good for another 200 or so. Never had that problem with any brass cased ammo.

As an aside, it was fun when I had to do this at a company shooting event. I was banging the butt on the ground to get the bolt free so I could make sure it was not a live round before I popped the case out with a cleaning rod. Some new shooters were horrified!

[-v-]

Extractor wear out with the steel cases is also a myth. Wolf steel is fairly soft, and if it wears out your extractor, it means that the extractor's manufacturer did not properly harden the part or use sub-standard components. Wear is about equal to brass cased ammo.

[Avenger29]

Extractor wear out with the steel cases is also a myth. Wolf steel is fairly soft, and if it wears out your extractor, it means that the extractor's manufacturer did not properly harden the part or use sub-standard components. Wear is about equal to brass cased ammo.

And the extractor is an inexpensive and easy to replace part that you should be checking as part of preventive maintenance anyway.

[jrtayloriv]

I use wolf ammo all the time when practicing. My rifle has not turned into jello.

[BlackHand1917]

I like Wolf Ammo a lot. These days I can't afford super-high quality ammo. Wolf is "good enough" for practice with AR's. Sometimes I think that some people dislike Wolf and the other Russian brands due to ethnic antipathy left over from the Cold War. There are people out there who simply hate Russians. I certainly don't accuse all the Wolf critics of this, but some. A local indoor commercial pistol range near me prohibits Wolf Ammo citing that it is unsafe, but I am pretty sure that they do this so they can sell people their own, more expensive ammo.

[maskedman504]

I like Wolf Ammo a lot. These days I can't afford super-high quality ammo. Wolf is "good enough" for practice with AR's. Sometimes I think that some people dislike Wolf and the other Russian brands due to ethnic antipathy left over from the Cold War. There are people out there who simply hate Russians. I certainly don't accuse all the Wolf critics of this, but some. A local indoor commercial pistol range near me prohibits Wolf Ammo citing that it is unsafe, but I am pretty sure that they do this so they can sell people their own, more expensive ammo.

Actually an interesting observation; I have had similar ones. I have noticed that alot of Wolf detractors refer to AK's and SKS' as 'commie guns' and list a coverall of negative design features that is about equal if you added every individual models flaw into one group and applied it to every rifle. Something along the line of "those silly ruskie guns aren't chrome lined, come from stamped parts, use low grade steel in poor manufacturing facilities. Most of the barrels are pinned and you can hardly rely on the sights..." blah blah blah. After that they will tell me why the end all, be all of semi-auto rifles is anything off the Garand platform. :eek: