[cleetus03]

I know a Taurus aint no S&W, and that much of their appeal derives from their low price. My local GUN shop has a NIB Taurus M85ul in stainless, for $315.

This snub nose is to serve as a CCW, and for the price I could care less when the finish goes FUBAR from inevitable CCW use & abuse. The revolver feels good in my hand, is extremely light, and looks almost identical to the S&W 637 which is priced at $425

So Now the question to all on THR. For all those who have or know firsthand info on this model, are there any real reliability issues to be concerned with? I know all guns no matter the brand will ultimately break, have issues, etc as the threshold of rounds fired diminish its service life.

With that said, what if any attributes to this revolver make it such a scorned upon tool ? And do these attributes plague just this particular brand or all revolvers in general?

I am assuming with much hope that the bashing comes from people with a similar revolver made from a perceived elite Brandname, who quiver at the thought of a cheaper version being just as capable. Jealousy & animosity would then arise in the form of misinformation, to justify their more expensive yet similar platform. At least this is what I am assuming & am hoping for facts to persuade my opinion otherwise.

Appreciate any help or info yall can give me!

p.s. here's a picture of the exact Taurus 85UL I want to buy, as well as Taurus's product description of it.

http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/4341/85ul.jpg
"Ultra-fast. Ultra-reliable. Ultra-lightweight. It's no wonder the 85s are our most popular family. We pack them with a combination of customer-requested features and pair them with the .38 Special +P ammo - making them powerful, easy to carry - and lightning-quick to use."
http://www.taurususa.com/products/product-details.cfm?id=324&category=Revolver#

[Floppy_D]

It's my everyday carry. Minute of pie plate at 7 yds (in a hurry), 1.10 lbs loaded, sits well in an Uncle Mike's #4, front right pocket in cargo shorts. I wanna say I'm at 800-1000 rounds with mine, it's more fun then I thought it would be. The only gripe I've heard is about the firing pin breaking with excessive dry fire. I picked up some nice snap caps for dry fire work, and haven't had any problems. I dry fire it lots, too. The SA trigger is nice, and after 1000 dryfires, the DA trigger smoothed out nicely. My groups with it are much better than they were when I started; the short sight radius takes some getting used to.

Overall, I'd buy one again in a heartbeat.

[Virginian]

All of the abuse stems from the brand name. I have a 605. If I was worried about a few ounces I sure wouldn't weigh what I do.

P.S. - I have run thru upwards of 50 centerfire handguns. The only three centerfire DA revolvers I have left are two Tauruses, a 605 and a 431, and my Grandaddy's Colt Police Positive. No semi autos left a-tall.

[Thingster]

Before you buy one, there's an issue I've seen on 3 seperate Taurus revolvers in the last month or so.

Open the cylinder and then close it so the frame latch doesn't lock the cylinder- have it between two notches.

Try to squeeze the trigger without having to index the cylinder to lock. It should cycle just fine, but like i said, i've ran across a couple that just won't let you squeeze the trigger unless you manually turn the cylinder to lock.

[General Geoff]

Buy it and run a few hundred rounds through it; that's the only way to know for sure whether it'll be reliable for you. I've heard of many Tauruses requiring work out of the box to function properly; I've also heard of many that functioned flawlessly without any work. This is the uncertainty you must deal with, in this price range. I'd say you're 95% likely to get a fine, perfectly functioning revolver. But there is that 5% chance you'll need to get some work done on it for it to work properly.

[ArmedBear]

Taurus or Korth, I'd shoot it before I trusted a new gun.:)

Also, I wouldn't dry-fire any gun repeatedly without snap caps. It might be necessary, and even if it's not, it's not going to hurt anything.

[KevininPa]

Here is my post in General Handgun :

Taurus 605 on order.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Traded in two locker queens for a new blued 605 for the wife. She learned how to shoot revolvers when she was 12, and just can't abide by a semi. That snubbie cloverleafed for me at 10-12 yards with .38s, and didn't do bad with .357s. I was absolutely amazed! The only thing I didn't like was the skimpy boot grip. That's been replaced with a Pachmayr Compac. Since it did so well, I ordered a stainless version for myself. Already have a Hogue MonoGrip for that when it arrives. I want to see which grip is better. I could try the one gun with both but that would take away the fun for my wife and I!"

I went through 100 .38s and 50 .357s in this revolver to wring it out for my wife. Longterm use may vary, but I'm thrilled with it so far.

I was pleasantly surprised with my first Taurus. My only suggestion is to step up to the 605 if it is affordable. That way you can do .357s if you want. I'm paying $359 for my stainless. Blued goes for $325 to $340 here in my local area. Pay attention to my grip advice. BTW, here in my area, the 85 SS version goes for $310 to $325. Food for thought.

[sagebrushjim]

Carry Gun 80% of the time... Very reliable and easy to conceal... Approx 2300 rounds thru this one with no problems at all ... Lightweight and easy to care for ...:)

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q120/sagebrushjim/Home%20Guns/100_9355.jpg

[Fat Boy]

Buy it and run a few hundred rounds through it; that's the only way to know for sure whether it'll be reliable for you

+1


Frankly, this whole "Taurus is bad" issue kind of bothers me. I don't think we live in a time when guns or any other tools are manufactured to the high tolerances that once applied, when craftsmen seemed to care about their product, and people bought tools, appliances, etc to last a lifetime or two, and could reasonably expect that to be the case. So whether it is a Taurus, Glock, S&W, whatever; don't be surprised if any gun fails, sooner or later.

On the other hand, when a given product is less expensive than a similar product from another maker, there is a reason why; maybe the QC isn't as stringent, materials are less costly and perhaps less resilient, etc. etc.

Bottom line for me; buy what you want, but realize the potential issues that could be in place as a result of buying less expensively- keep the gun clean, properly maintained, don't abuse it, and so forth.

Just my .02, YMMV

[hardluk1]

I have 2 85 series revolvers and love them both only problem ever and i caused it was i loosend the ejection rod while cleaning and did not retighten and it would not revolve for me. Tightend up and worked fine ,that was 2 years ago . These guns are far from new and been shoot alot. and am waiting for one of there 13 oz guns now.

[MCgunner]

Mine will put 5 rounds into 3" at 25 yards, about as good as I've ever fired ANY snub. I can ring a 14" gong at 100 yards with it from Creedmore, used to play with that for fun. I'd hit it 2 or 3 out of five once I got the hold over down. I had a sight dovetailed into mine with an elevation wire (ala Elmer Keith) and it also helps with my light practice loads since they hit lower than my +P carry load. I've carried it, not every day, but a lot for the last 12 years, pocket carry in a sweaty south Texas pocket and fishing the bay a lot with it. I don't think the finish is that bad, considering. It goes bang every time and it has a VERY smooth, light DA trigger. (11 lbs, bone stock)

Yeah, I like it. I trust it with my security. I'd put the gun through the check out (a sticky in this forum), check function, check timing, if it looks good, have no fear. If it's a little rough DA, have the dealer pop the side plate off and see if it's full of packing grease. That happens.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=43447&d=1155431302

[KevininPa]

I'm surprised you didn't get rid of those bootgrips. Ever check on those slings on that Spartan? Couple thousand rounds through my 12 with'em. Things are good. Sorry for the hijack.

[Glockman17366]

I carried an 85 Multi-Alloy (aluminum frame/titanium barrel shroud and cylinder) for 10 years as my primary SD firearm. This gun has a spurred hammer.
There was a problem with light strikes when I first bought the gun, but that was fixed by Taurus quite quickly. The gun has been 100% reliable since.
I still have it, but now carry a Taurus 851 (titanium) solely due to it's shrouded hammer which results in an easier draw and less wear on the trouser pockets.
I do recommend putting 200-300 rounds through any gun before you depend on it for self defense carry.

In defense of S&W...Taurus makes great revolvers, but I doubt they ever become collectables like some Colts or S&W revolvers. As a tool for self defense, they're great and a hell of a value.

[MCgunner]

I'm surprised you didn't get rid of those bootgrips. Ever check on those slings on that Spartan? Couple thousand rounds through my 12 with'em. Things are good. Sorry for the hijack.

I like the grip, fits in the pocket well and feels good in my hand. Can't get my pinky on it, but even +P ain't that hard to control. If it were a .357, I'd want a Hogue on it, but it is rather mild to shoot with .38s. A bigger grip would necessitate IWB. I'd rather pocket carry.

Nah, still using a slip over sling on the Spartan. I don't really need a sling unless I'm duck hunting and I don't often duck hunt with it, rather use one of my 12s. I already had a sling made up for my 12 SxS with a slip over on the barrel end and a QD swivel on the butt, so I use that and installed a QD stud on the butt of the Spartan. Works fine even if it'd look better with a stud on the front. I'm glad to hear yours is working out for you. I might drill and tap it someday.

[3446]

Lurk here more then post, but Taurus bashing is a sore spot with me. I carry my 605ss daily. I trust my and my families saftey with it. I think most of the bad reputation is unfounded and spread by people who don't have first hand experience with a Taurus. They are good guns and a great value. I highly recommend Taurus.

[Jim K]

RANT mode on.

NO, repeat NO, gun should require service out of the box. NO, repeat NO, gun (except a pure target gun) should require a "break in" to be functional and reliable.

Rant mode off.

Taurus quality has improved in recent years, but they still have the same problem, spotty quality control. Most of their guns work fine and have given years of reliable service. But I have seen a few that gave nothing but trouble even after repeated trips back to Taurus. They were eventually traded off (buyers of low-end used guns take note) or stuck away.

Taurus customer service has also been spotty. Most customers get good service, a few get poor service and even discourtesy.

Jim

[MCgunner]

Jim, if you don't understand how to inspect a revolver before you purchase it, I suggest you read the sticky on revolver inspection. You can weed out 99.9 percent of problems with a revolver by just looking it over if you know what to look for. I wouldn't buy a new or used any brand revolver without checking it out and I've refused Smiths, Tauri, other brands on inspection. I'll never order one sight unseen.

I bought a fantastic M66 Taurus for 200 bucks at a gun show used. I found an older 3" M66 at another show. It had a terrible loose cylinder and was out of time. I talked the guy down to 180 on it figuring I could send it off to Taurus if I couldn't figure it out. Well, turns out, it had the wrong screw in the wrong side plate hole. They got the long one that supposed to go in the front hole that bares on the cylinder crane out of place. Rearranged the side plate screws and it was in perfect time and tight as a drum. ROFLMAO! I'm sure someone was cussing Taurus and probably has posted somewhere on how their gun went out of time with no reason and they got rid of it. :rolleyes: If it'd been a Smith, oh, but it's understandable considering its age and round count. :rolleyes: But, that goes with the territory with Taurus. It's normal just to assume it's the crappy gun and not the moron owner. They read too many BBS bashes. The good thing is, I can find bargains on a used Taurus that don't exist on Smiths. A comparable M19 3" Smith and Wesson? Nope, not on MY income! The Taurus is just as accurate as was my 4" M19 and as is my 4" HB M10, not quite the trigger on it, but usable, not bad. The newer actions have much better triggers. My newer 4" 66 is as good as my old M10 Smith.

Now that the first Taurus bash has been posted, I guess there's no way for this thread to go than strait down hill as always. :rolleyes:

[Jim K]

Hi, MCgunner,

Hmmm. Not bragging, but I am willing to bet at least a cup of coffee that I know as much about inspecting and repairing revolvers as most folks on here.

Much of what I wrote does in fact come from examining new Taurus revolvers both at the store where I worked as a gunsmith and at other stores. The point is not whether a customer buying a new revolver can tell a good one from a bad one before buying, the point is that HE SHOULDN'T HAVE TO.

And if you are so confident of Taurus quality, why would you so carefully inspect a Taurus revolver in the first place? So, in spite of your protest, you really are agreeing with me.

I am aware that any factory can turn out a lemon. But I am also aware that Taurus seems to have more than S&W or Ruger (Colt, of course, no longer makes the type of revolver we are discussing.)

The Taurus design is OK, and in some respects better than S&W. And I will say again that a good Taurus is as good for practical purposes as an S&W or Ruger and less costly. But I will also say again that I have seen some Taurus products that were sloppily made and what I would call poor quality. (An example is the new gun I saw recently in which two chambers were out of alignment. The gun would have worked OK, but that is not good quality control.)

Jim

[Shytheed Dumas]

FWIW, I recently bought an 85UL DAO for my daughter's Christmas/21st birthday, and it's been just as reliable as the 642 I bought my wife at the same time.

That little revolver is one of three Taurus's (Tauri?) I've purchased in the past couple of years, and not one of them has failed me yet. Maybe I'm just lucky? Dunno... I never seem to win lotteries or drawings, but so far so good as far as Taurus handguns go.

[MCgunner]

Jim, I inspect Smiths (have found brand new ones out of time or otherwise rejectable), Rugers, all revolvers. I inspect motorcycles at least in as much as I can, cars, etc. I don't buy them sight unseen. I just think it's a wise thing to do to weed out a possible bad one from the factory, no matter the brand. Goes double for used guns from any maker.

It's harder to find problems that might lurk in a bike or a car or an auto pistol, but on a revolver, very many of the possible problems can be detected by a simple pre purchase inspection. I'm lazy, but hell, when there's money involved, I ain't THAT lazy!

So my question is, why would you NOT want to inspect a purchase? I ain't buying a shipping container full. I own three Taurus revolvers, all good, all carefully inspected before purchase and I'll likely have 'em the day I die (which ain't that far off at this point) and pass 'em on to my son-in-law and daughter. I didn't buy 'em for investments, either. They all function just as well as any Smith or Ruger revolver I've owned.

[bodman]

Hi,

I have owned several taurus revolvers, including 851 Ultralite, 651 stainless, 651 blued, 905 steel frame blued, and 851 blued steel frame. Let me just say that I think Taurus revolvers are not bad for the Money. I have had a bad experience with two different models The first was a 851 ultralite 38+p with shrouded hammer. I took it to the range and the cylinder locked up on the fourth shot. I had a rather difficult time getting the cylinder open so I could get it unloaded. I had my dealer send it back under warranty. Four weeks later, I got it back with no explanation as to what was fixed. The factory also put a 3/8's inch long scratch on the right side just under the cylinder. To say I was disappointed is an understatement.

The other model I had bad luck with was a steel frame 905 9mm. On the first range trip, I found it would keyhole all the rounds I fired through it, and I couldn't hit a paper plate target with it at 5 yards. I traded that one off as fast as I could.

Now all I will buy is Smith or Ruger

Bodman

[jumbo72]

i got one today, used, for $302 otd. I'm pretty happy with it so far, won't be able to shoot it for a while, but i look forward to it. My only other wheelgun is a taurus judge which is a freaking blast to shoot!!

[denfoote]

I've had a M85UL since 1998.
It was made in 1997 according to the Taurus web site.
No problems so far. For a while it did seem that the trigger was binding, but a session with some Gunscrubber blasting away with the side plate off and some new oil solved that little irritation!!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v22/denfoote/NewGrips1.jpg

[Virginian]

Some years ago I was going to buy a Smith 686. Took it out of the box, checked it, went to cycle it, and it locked up tight. I mean tight. They sent it back to Smith and they fixed it.
I had a Colt King Cobra. Good gun. I ordered one for a guy, and when we took it out of the box, it was already locked up. We couldn't even open it. Back it went.
The situation in recent years seems to have gotten a lot worse. A guy at the club got a S&W Performance Center 357 with problems (yes- they fixed it).
I don't really know if Taurus has a higher fail rate or not, or maybe it's just that they sell a lot more, and the Smith lover-Taurus haters like to crow about every one.
It does appear to me that all the gun companies have figured out it is cheaper to fix the mistakes that come back to the factory than it is to install a good QC system. I suspect a lot of problem children do not make it back to the factory - somebody out there in the world goes ahead and fixes them. I wish I knew how to change that perspective, but the way guns are selling right now it's not too likely.

[halfded]

Check out the star on the extractor before you buy it. Looks like Taurus redesigned some things some time after 1997, one of them being the star that advances the cylinder. When I bought mine, the star had been machined wrong from the factory and had an unacceptable amount of rotational play as a result. It's currently on it's vacation to Florida, hopefully back soon. The older models seem to have a more sturdy design, cut deeper into the extractor. Here's a pic of the one I had to send back.

http://i625.photobucket.com/albums/tt332/halfdedsphoto/039-1.jpg

Take a look at the notch on the left side of the cylinder, directly across from the "X". And of course, this is a restricted part, so only Taurus can replace it.

And here's a pic of the star from the older revolver, it's not an ultra-lite, just a regular blued "heavyweight" 85. Sorry for the cruddy picture, didn't want to drag out all the bells and whistles for a quick pic.

http://i625.photobucket.com/albums/tt332/halfdedsphoto/005.jpg

[Deus Machina]

I'm a fan of mine--M85UL, blued, 2-1/2" barrel. I got an odd find on that one, I know. I found exactly zero pictures online for bragging, with that barrel length.

Accurate if you can point it right; the short sight radius needs a little work, and small black rear sight on wide black front is tough to use. Get some sight paint. Trust me.

Run 200-300 rounds through it before carrying it. That will tell you if there any problems you need to take care of. And get some snap caps--dry firing it another 500 times makes the DA nice and smooth, if heavy compared to a nice Smith. And yes, dry firing it will cause problems: the firing pin spring mashes and sticks. An easy fix if you're comfortable opening it, but avoid it.

Between the sharp bit of recoil (not unpleasant, just sharp) and my spindly frame, I had to retrain myself so the American Eagles I used to break it in would stop jumping crimp. I couldn't go ten shots without it.

The grips on it are nice in the palm and in the pocket, but swap them out with Hogue Monogrips when you can. They feel like they're made for smaller fingers and they're a quarter to a half-inch longer at the bottom (not to mention they don't fit perfectly at the backstrap; I doubt the stock ones do, either, they just cover it.) but they get your pinky on there and they're the most comfortable grip I've ever felt on a revolver, ever.

[MCgunner]

And of course, this is a restricted part, so only Taurus can replace it.



http://www.e-gunparts.com/productschem.asp?chrMasterModel=2040z85S

[bikerdoc]

Just my .02 from an old man with many guns (wife says 15 is too many) I like my 605. Yes it has a lot of rounds through it, yes some days I CCW it, (best part of getting up is choosing your CCW:D) Other days it could a ruger, smith,or CZ.
No point here just my .02

[cleetus03]

Well, due to the inability to even purchase frikkin ammunition for the 85ul, I decided against buying it today. (Not one damn gun store or wal-mart in a 100 mile vicinity has .38 special)

Who would of thought ammo availability would be the ultimate deciding factor! I appreciate all the help & opinions given, but I ain't gonna purchase a new gun with no accompanying bullets. Since I have several 1000 rds of 9MM in my possession, I'm now in search for a 9mm ccw, out of pure logistical reasons.

Thanks to all who replied to the thread. I found the general consensus to be positive on the 85ul. After reading countless threads on various S&W Air Weight problems, Ive come to the conclusion that no make or model is immune to unforeseen problems stemming from an array of reasons. (quality control, abuse, wear & tear, neglect, pure randomness, etc)

[Hawk]

Interesting.

At least on large local dealer has slapped voluntary limits on ammo sales due strictly to his belief it was costing him firearm sales. People want "a couple boxes to go with that ..." and that's not going to change due to any shortage.

As a result, and perhaps a general loosening happening contributing anyway, he's flush with .38 Spcl and 9mm.

One of the big box retailers took a whole new tack to their constant "sold out of 9mm" status: at least one of the counter drones started telling anyone who cared to listen that 9mm Makarov would work just fine in 9mm not-Makarovs. Silly boy. First time that store had to reverse an ironclad "no returns on ammo" policy sfaik.

9mm and .38Spcl have been roughly as available around here - you may not find refuge in 9mm unless the guy with the 85UL had a pantload of it.

[Jim K]

Hi, McGunner,

I am trying to get you to understand that all gun buyers are not you (or I). You will check everything out because you know how and have fun posting about all the "bad" guns you find.

But the average person, even a LEO, who buys a new gun is not you. He knows little about guns and he will assume that the gun is going to work.

An expert mechanic might check out every part of a new car before he buys it - most folks will get in and drive, and it is the same with a new gun.

So why should the average gun buyer, assuming he has the skill and knowledge, have to check out a dozen guns to get a good one? Why shouldn't all gun makers do their best to make sure that every gun they make is a good one?

I strongly approve of testing any new gun at least 200 rounds (for each magazine if an auto pistol) of the carry ammunition before relying on it.

But I know many people who can't check a gun and don't test fire. Do you really feel, as you seem to, that they deserve to be killed if they depend on a new gun to do what it is made to do?

Jim

[MCgunner]

One should know their weapon if they're relying upon it for self defense. If they know squat about guns and get a bad one, well, that's what the warranty is for, I guess. Don't much matter if it's a bad Taurus or a bad Smith and Wesson. Yes, there are bad Smiths off the production line that get through, I've seen several and I don't examine new guns all THAT often.

Then again I've worked as a motorcycle mechanic and I think people that don't change their own tires are spend thrifts. :D Checking out a revolver is just a LITTLE easier than changing a tire on an Ultra Glide or a GoldWing, though. My fallacy, I guess.

[Eb1]

Not an 85, but its little brother. It is a Taurus 731 UL 32 H&R Magnum. The only time this gun isn't with me is when I am not wearing pants.

http://homepage.mac.com/jeremy16/images/Taurus32HRMagnum.jpg

[Guillermo]

Taurus seems to be a love it or hate it brand. I am ambivilent. Having owned some, 3 I think, I had one that I hated, another that broke constantly, a 3rd was the 85UL which seemed fine. (I bought it for my elderly mother, test fired it...a couple of hundred rounds. After she passed I traded it for a Smith 19 for my 15 yr old daughter).

I might buy another Tauri but it will be after I have all of the pre MIM Smiths and old Colts that I can afford.

[MillCreek]

I have several Taurus revolvers, including an 85 with the bobbed hammer. That one has taken up permanent duty as my bicycling gun. It rides along in the handlebar bag. All of my Taurii have worked 100% right out of the box.

[MCgunner]

Not an 85, but its little brother. It is a Taurus 731 UL 32 H&R Magnum. The only time this gun isn't with me is when I am not wearing pants.

Um, well, what do you carry naked?:D

[Matt-J2]

A bigger gun, of course...

[Jim K]

In one of his books, Melvin M. (Maynard) Johnson laid out a method for GIs to deal with defective guns.

Simply write the manufacturer a letter, stating that the gun failed and the problem should be corrected. The letter will be found on your body and mailed by graves registration personnel.

The same advice can apply to self-defense guns except that the letter should include a copy of the warranty.

Jim

[reloadn]

Ther is nothing wrong with Taurus guns. I have around 500-600 rounds in my 85 and no problems at all. I am sure you could find some bad apples in every brand.

[Landric]

I recently ordered a new Taurus 327 in .327 Federal Magnum from a local dealer. The gun that arrived was such a piece of junk that I cannot believe it ever made it out of the factory. It was out of time, the trigger pull was heavier on some pulls than on others, and the hammer locked up and prevented the gun from firing at least one pull in six. I declined to take the gun and the dealer returned it to his distributor for another one. The second one seems much better, and with the limited shooting I have done with it so far, it seems fine.

I've owned several Tauruses in the past, a 669 (total junk) and a 85CH and 431 (both good). I have a close friend that has a 85UL that is 100% and is his daily carry gun. So, my personal experience with Taurus has been 4 good, 2 bad, 33% negative. That is not a particularly good record for Taurus considering my experience with S&W has been something like 40 good, 1 bad.

I got the 327 because I wanted to try out the new cartridge. The SP101 in 327 is currently unavailable due to problems (Ruger seems to be developing a trend here-SR9, LCP, 327 SP101) and the S&W 327 is something over $700. I didn't want to spend that to try the 327, so I got the Taurus. Charter Arms also makes a 327. Given my recent experience with a Charter Bulldog Pug, I probably should have bought the Charter 327. At least its made in the US and Charter has a good rep for customer service when there is a problem.

[AKElroy]

There was a problem with light strikes when I first bought the gun, but that was fixed by Taurus quite quickly. The gun has been 100% reliable since.

Great gun & a good price; I also had a problem with light strikes on mine & it resolved after a detail strip & lint removal. (Vital on all pocket carry CCW's)